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March 28, 2024, 09:41:55 AM

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"Naff off you charmless scrote!" - another helping of Porridge

Started by Sydward Lartle, May 02, 2017, 09:39:20 PM

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Sydward Lartle

I've just been watching the original episodes of Porridge again (let's draw a discreet veil over the ill-advised reboot with Kevin Bishop) and I'm stunned at the high level of quality the series maintained from start to finish. It's one of those rare sitcoms where there isn't a genuinely poor or even sub-standard episode, just those that are excellent, and those that are merely very good indeed. It goes without saying that the series was very probably Ronnie Barker's finest solo performance (though Open All Hours runs it a very close second), but the supporting performances are incredible too - Fulton Mackay, Brian Wilde, Richard Beckinsale (wonder how his career would have gone if he'd not died so young?), Ken Jones, Brian Glover, Christopher Biggins, David Jason, Tony Osoba, Sam Kelly, Ronald Lacey, Cyril Shaps, Peter Vaughan, Tony Aitken, David Daker, Patricia Brake - everyone is on absolutely top form.

It also speaks volumes about the overall quality of the series that my favourite moment isn't even an obvious comedy moment - in fact, it's played out to almost total silence. It's in the episode A Test of Character (the penultimate episode from series three, astonishingly late in the day for a solid-gold classic episode) where Fletcher, MacLaren and Warren have devised an elaborate scam to steal the paper containing the answers to an exam Godber is sitting in an attempt at bettering himself. Naturally, the plan goes tits-up (and I won't spoil it for the two or three people who've never seen it), but before that happens, Godber declines their offer of the answers, preferring to pass or fail by his own efforts. This causes Fletcher to give him a lecture about how he could go for a job interview and have all the qualifications in the world, only to be pipped to the post by 'some nerk' who went to the right school, speaks with the right accent and 'ain't never been in no nick' before storming out of the cell in frustration. It's an absolutely stunning bit of acting from Barker, and I'd be quite happy for it to be shown in the retrospectives instead of the usual clips such as "Born free, till somebody caught me" or whatever.

Excellent episodes
Prisoner and Escort (pilot)
New Faces, Old Hands
A Night In
A Day Out
Men Without Women
Just Desserts
Disturbing the Peace
Happy Release
No Peace For the Wicked
No Way Out
(1975 Christmas special)
A Storm in a Teacup
Pardon Me
A Test of Character


Merely very good episodes
The Hustler
Ways and Means
Heartbreak Hotel
The Harder They Fall
Poetic Justice
Rough Justice
The Desperate Hours
(1976 Christmas special)
Final Stretch

The film spin-off also slots nicely into the 'very good' category, although it's more of a time capsule of the late seventies than the 'anytime, anywhere' aesthetic that marked the series - Nilsson and Ian Dury on the radio, the 'do the sloosh' Listerine and National Express adverts, references to the Goodies and Diddy David Hamilton and what have you. By contrast, the follow-on series Going Straight managed a very good first episode (largely because most of it was set on a London-bound train and consisted of a two-hander between MacKay and Fletcher) followed by five distinctly mediocre ones.

"I said a dash, Lotterby!"

the science eel

The Desperate Hours was the title of a Steptoe episode too, which strikes me as a bit odd. It's not a phrase used that often.

Sydward Lartle



Ptolemy Ptarmigan

"Are you wearing a bra or not?"


I guess you meant Patricia Brake.

Sydward Lartle

Fuck's sake, what a bell end. Of course I did.


URRRRGHHHH JOOOEEEEYYYYYY!

Serge

If it weren't for 'Whatever Happened To The Likely Lads?', I'd happily nominate 'Porridge' as my favourite sitcom of all time. As I've mentioned on here before, one of the most astonishing things about it is that Barker is completely unrecognisable as Fletcher - the character has taken him over so completely that there's not a trace of Barker on display. Although I'm glad he stuck with comedy and gave us so much gold over the years, I would love to have seen him do more straight roles, he'd be talked about as one of the greatest actors who ever lived if he had.

Clements and Le Frenais really were on a roll in the seventies, weren't they? Between this and WHTTLL, there isn't a duff line, a wasted second, the whole lot is just quality from beginning to end.

My favourite moment of 'Porridge' is in 'No Way Out', when MacKay steps in to stop the carol singers - I can't remember the exact line, but he tells Fletcher to stop doing something when Fletch isn't doing anything at all - the annoyed up-and-down look that Barker does at that moment is brilliant.

If anybody hasn't already seen this Blue Peter documentary on the making of series three, it's well worth a watch. It's odd to see Barker made up as Fletch but speaking with Barker's own voice. And there's a noticeable slip at 3:14, where you can tell that Ronald Lacey's Harris is a last minute rewrite of Ken Jones' Ives (with no disrespect to Lacey, who is great as Harris, and makes him a completely new character.)

Sydward Lartle

This is probably better suited to the Young Ones thread, but the character actor Cyril Shaps, who appears as Jackdaw in one episode (although the character is mentioned more than once, I believe), said the highlight of his acting career was playing alongside Hilary Mason as one of the elderly Russian peasants who lived next door to Rick, Vyv and the gang in the Demolition episode of the Young Ones. He even had that clip played at his funeral.


manticore

Is it true that people in prisons weren't allowed to watch Porridge?

gib

Quote from: Serge on May 02, 2017, 10:22:59 PMAs I've mentioned on here before, one of the most astonishing things about it is that Barker is completely unrecognisable as Fletcher - the character has taken him over so completely that there's not a trace of Barker on display.

had a bit of an epiphany there, what a fine observation

Sydward Lartle

Quote from: manticore on May 02, 2017, 11:38:29 PM
Is it true that people in prisons weren't allowed to watch Porridge?

They were, as a reward for good behaviour.

Glebe

Quote from: manticore on May 02, 2017, 11:38:29 PMIs it true that people in prisons weren't allowed to watch Porridge?

Wasn't there a Porridge doco or something where someone stated it was hugely popular in prisons?

What a cast. Never really thought about it before, but it's funny, you've got David Jason in this and Nick Lyndhurst in Going Straight.

JoeyBananaduck

Quote from: Glebe on May 03, 2017, 05:11:39 AM
Wasn't there a Porridge doco or something where someone stated it was hugely popular in prisons?

There definitely was. Can't remember the name - maybe an episode of Comedy Connections? Either way I remember that info being relayed by Craig Charles.

Ptolemy Ptarmigan

Quote from: JoeyBananaduck on May 03, 2017, 08:16:42 AM
There definitely was. Can't remember the name - maybe an episode of Comedy Connections? Either way I remember that info being relayed by Craig Charles.

Porridge was the subject of the first ever Comedy Connections, but it was narrated by Julia Sawalha and I don't think any talking heads were involved.

Could have been the documentary ex-jailbird Johnny Vaughan[nb]served two years for dealing cocaine, stitched up like a kipper[/nb] presented in the Britain's Best Sitcom series.

Sydward Lartle

John Noakes visits Slade Prison!

Well, Ealing film studios, actually, for the shooting of some film inserts for Porridge. The episode in question is A Storm in a Teacup.

wosl

Yeah, Serge already linked to that.  Good watch.  As he says, it's strange to see Barker all Fletchered-up but speaking in that diffident way he had whenever he wasn't in character.  I'm going to have to trawl through Porridge again at some point; got the boxed-set at the same time I picked up the Good Life one, but while I devoured the latter, I've only picked at the former.  Am I right in remembering that Beckinsale dropped the rather unconvincing Brummie accent after the first series, and reverted to something more like his normal, soft Notts burr after that?

royce coolidge

Ok  I know to some this is pissing on the bible,but I like the film the best,to me the prison seems more realistic,with a sense of danger,gives more time to Grouty,the kitchen scene is one of my all time favourites and,and,and lots more,in my top 10 of comedy films.
Anyone agree,or cast me out as heretic

Sydward Lartle

Quote from: royce coolidge on May 03, 2017, 05:40:12 PM
Ok  I know to some this is pissing on the bible,but I like the film the best,to me the prison seems more realistic

Possibly because large parts of it were filmed in a real prison - HMP Chelmsford, I believe, which was still recovering from fire damage.

As for the question about Godber, he had a mild Midlands accent all the way through, but it's noticeably stronger in the first series, especially when he says "So this is Colditz" in the first episode 'proper' after the pilot.

By the way, Barker actually says in the interview that only privileged prisoners (those allowed to watch television after 7pm, in other words) were allowed to watch Porridge, so that answers that question.

"If you're a fan of Z Cars, my son, forget it. You'll have to get your kicks from the Wombles of bleedin' Wimbledon."

In another episode, Fletcher defends the Magic Roundabout - "That's given a lot of pleasure to a lot of innocent people, that has. In fact, it's given a pleasure to a lot of guilty people an' all."

purlieu

Quote from: Serge on May 02, 2017, 10:22:59 PMAs I've mentioned on here before, one of the most astonishing things about it is that Barker is completely unrecognisable as Fletcher - the character has taken him over so completely that there's not a trace of Barker on display.
Absolutely. One of the finest sitcom performances ever.

Quote from: Sydward Lartle on May 02, 2017, 09:39:20 PMIt also speaks volumes about the overall quality of the series that my favourite moment isn't even an obvious comedy moment - in fact, it's played out to almost total silence. It's in the episode A Test of Character (the penultimate episode from series three, astonishingly late in the day for a solid-gold classic episode) where Fletcher, MacLaren and Warren have devised an elaborate scam to steal the paper containing the answers to an exam Godber is sitting in an attempt at bettering himself. Naturally, the plan goes tits-up (and I won't spoil it for the two or three people who've never seen it), but before that happens, Godber declines their offer of the answers, preferring to pass or fail by his own efforts. This causes Fletcher to give him a lecture about how he could go for a job interview and have all the qualifications in the world, only to be pipped to the post by 'some nerk' who went to the right school, speaks with the right accent and 'ain't never been in no nick' before storming out of the cell in frustration. It's an absolutely stunning bit of acting from Barker, and I'd be quite happy for it to be shown in the retrospectives instead of the usual clips such as "Born free, till somebody caught me" or whatever.
My favourite scene in the whole show, too. It's one of the things that makes it such a good show: the pathos. It's incredible to think Barker supposedly had the idea of a Carry On-style sitcom, with girls being smuggled over the walls and such. Instead we got one of the most intelligently written, sympathetic, human comedies of all time. I used to enjoy it as a kid, but never quite got the fuss. It was only revisiting it as an adult that I noticed all the wonderful complexities of the characters, the class system, both in and out of the prison. Then it all really sank in. One of my all-time favourite programmes for sure.

wosl

Quote from: Sydward Lartle on May 03, 2017, 05:44:18 PM[Godber] had a mild Midlands accent all the way through, but it's noticeably stronger in the first series, especially when he says "So this is Colditz" in the first episode 'proper' after the pilot.

A bit needless, burdening Beckinsale with that.  Given that he was a perfect fit in every other respect, and that being a Nottingham oik is to all intents and purposes equivalent to being a Birmingham one (it's all the sticks, innit, to a London lag like Fletcher), you'd have thought they'd have have amended the scrips where needed and let him speak with his normal voice. 

Serge

Quote from: royce coolidge on May 03, 2017, 05:40:12 PMOk  I know to some this is pissing on the bible,but I like the film the best,to me the prison seems more realistic,with a sense of danger,gives more time to Grouty,the kitchen scene is one of my all time favourites and,and,and lots more,in my top 10 of comedy films.
Anyone agree,or cast me out as heretic

I'm convinced that it was because of the regularity with which the film used to crop up on TV (as compared with actual repeats of the series itself) that the idea that Grouty appeared in it more often than he actually did was born. He's only in three episodes, and doesn't make his first appearance until the penultimate episode of series two. He is referred to in a few episodes that he doesn't appear in, so that might have been a factor, too.

Sydward Lartle

I've had the displeasure of seeing Richard Littlejohn in real life (shudder) and I can tell you the fucker looks exactly like a slightly younger, fatter version of genial Harry Grout. Which, I guess, means Littlejohn looks more like the character Peter Vaughan played in Straw Dogs, minus the bushy beard.

I would have lamped the cunt but it would have meant being thrown out of a show I'd waited quite a long time to see, had paid £70 for and probably ending up in prison. Not worth the aggro. Sorry to have let you all down.

JoeyBananaduck

A Night In is by far my favourite episode of what as Sydward has pointed out was a pretty flawless series altogether. One of the few half hours of television that never gets old for me. So perfectly pitched and for my money Barker and Beckinsale's finest performances.

Here's a confession: I've never watched Going Straight. More or less everyone I've spoken to considers it vastly inferior and I love Porridge so much I almost think 'well, why taint it'. What do you folks think, does it have enough redeeming qualities to make it worth a watch or am I doing right by skipping it?

Ignatius_S

Quote from: JoeyBananaduck on May 04, 2017, 02:11:02 PM...Here's a confession: I've never watched Going Straight. More or less everyone I've spoken to considers it vastly inferior and I love Porridge so much I almost think 'well, why taint it'. What do you folks think, does it have enough redeeming qualities to make it worth a watch or am I doing right by skipping it?

Watch it. I put it off watching it because of its reputation and was kicking myself afterwards.

Porridge is definitely superior, but I feel one reason Going Straight's reputation has suffered is that it wasn't available on home media or repeated for years. As a result, it faded from memory and people assumed that it wasn't very good because it wasn't shown.

The biggest flaw (IMO) is that they tried to cram too much into one series and there were enough situations to provide plots for at least two series. Also, I feel some may have an issue with – I don't think this is too much of a spoiler, but will spoiler it in case you want to go in blind –
Spoiler alert
watching Fletch is less comforting than in Porridge. In Going Straight, he's struggling on the outside; there's one scene with Ingrid in particular, which I think particularly highlights this. In prison he has status, outside he doesn't and something I found interesting is the dynamic between him and Ingrid/Lenny has shifted.
[close]

FWIW, one discussion about the series here, I intended to watch a couple of episode to refresh my memory, but enjoyed it so much, watched the entire series in couple of sitting.

As mentioned above, Barker's performance as Fletch is extraordinary and it doesn't change in Going Straight.

Glebe

Quote from: Sydward Lartle on May 04, 2017, 10:04:00 AMI've had the displeasure of seeing Richard Littlejohn in real life (shudder)

My deepest sympathies.

dr beat

Quote from: Glebe on May 03, 2017, 05:11:39 AM
Wasn't there a Porridge doco or something where someone stated it was hugely popular in prisons?
].

One of the Sitcom Club podcasts (hi fellas) mentions that Barker, in character as Fletch, subsequently narrated an audio guide given to new prisoners on what to expect of life inside a HMP.

Glebe

Quote from: dr beat on May 04, 2017, 03:44:03 PMOne of the Sitcom Club podcasts (hi fellas) mentions that Barker, in character as Fletch, subsequently narrated an audio guide given to new prisoners on what to expect of life inside a HMP.

Crikey, that's well weird!


Sydward Lartle

For what it's worth, both Kubrick's A Clockwork Orange and Porridge took 'technical advice' from Jonathan Marshall, a former jailbird who wrote a paperback called How to Survive in the Nick.

royce coolidge

Quote from: dr beat on May 04, 2017, 03:44:03 PM
One of the Sitcom Club podcasts (hi fellas) mentions that Barker, in character as Fletch, subsequently narrated an audio guide given to new prisoners on what to expect of life inside a HMP.
Well its better than Tommy Vance.