FTP and Site Management: save me from myself. (Techy, sorry).

[terminallyrelaxed]

Right, firstly sorry about launching a techy 'help me' thread, but its for your own good, arguably. Basically I can't mong because I can't serve the mongs or the xboxlive spreadsheet or anything else until I upload them, obviously, but I can't.
I'm a bit embarrassed about asking for help with such a simple thing like FTP but I don't have much experience with it, or creating web pages in general, I pretty much only fix desktop computer problems as a rule.

Anyway, here's the story: I've had a domain for ages and apart from the email was getting no use from it as I initially could'nt be arsed to get to grips with Dreamweaver MX (it seemed so complcated for the simple stuff I wanted).
So a month or two ago I used JAlbum to upload some personal photos to the webspace, and it worked very well, creating thumbnails and file descriptions etc, and it was all smiles at TR's pad.
So, I've finally got off my arse, or rather sat on it and done something cosntructive, making a (very basic) site in Dreamweaver, and even including the JAlbum stuff a few levels down from the top in my new site structure, and leaving a folder to upload mongs to via ftp. All well and good, tests ok.
I can also connect to the ftp server ok.
Using Dreamweaver I get 'connected ok' and using Fetch (ftp client) I get connected asnd even get a pop up server message from the stp server saying I'm in. I've allowed passive ftp on my firewall.
But I can't get any further; heres the snag. When I let JAlbum construct the site, I hadn't as yet got to grips with FTp at all, and didt have a folder structure up on the server, so essentially if you went to http://myhypotheticalurl.co.uk with no slashes, you wouldnt get a '/home' or '/index' appear in the address bar, you'd just be presented with a basic web page with the two folders that I'd built with JAlbum, thats on the very top level of the site as it stands.
But when I connect with either Dreamweaver or Fetch (or even ftpThingy which I also tried) it always hangs on "getting list" or similar, basically it can't communicate and get any information about whats currently there, so I can't delete it or overwrite it or whatever. In Dreamweaver it tries to retrieve information from"/." because the drectory doesnt even have a name it seems.

Below are the FTP logs for first Dreamweaver, and then Fetch. I've XXX'd out my userame and domain as its personal family photos on there at the mo and I don't want them monged. The Fetch log mentions a prob with 'MACB' which I guess means MacBinary athough in Fetch I've set view and format to Automatic (although there is a MacBinary option) Dreamweaver didnt seem to have problem with it at all.

Dreamweaver

220 ProFTPD 1.2.2rc2 Server (myfiles.eclipse.co.uk) [212.104.129.58]
USER XXXXXXXr@XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX
331 Password required for XXXXXXXXXX@XXXXXXXXXXXXX
PASS
230 User XXXXXXXXX@XXXXXXXXXXXX logged in.
SYST
215 UNIX Type: L8
PWD
257 "/" is current directory.
CWD /_notes
550 /_notes: No such file or directory
MKD XYIZNWSK
550 XYIZNWSK: Permission denied
RMD XYIZNWSK
550 XYIZNWSK: No such file or directory
RMD xyiznwsk
550 xyiznwsk: No such file or directory
PWD
257 "/" is current directory.
TYPE A
200 Type set to A.
PORT 192,168,0,2,231,251
200 PORT command successful.
LIST

Fetch

220 ProFTPD 1.2.2rc2 Server (myfiles.eclipse.co.uk) [212.104.129.58]
USER XXXXXXXXXXX@XXXXXXXXXXXXX
331 Password required for XXXXXXXXXXX@XXXXXXXXXXXXXX
PASS
230 User XXXXXXXXX@XXXXXXXXXXXXXX logged in.
SYST
215 UNIX Type: L8
PWD
257 "/" is current directory.
MACB ENABLE
500 MACB not understood.
PWD
257 "/" is current directory.
PORT 192,168,0,2,30,150
200 PORT command successful.
LIST
425 Can't build data connection: Operation timed out
ftp_list: -30000 (state == GETTING_LIST)
PWD
257 "/" is current directory.
PWD
257 "/" is current directory.
PWD
257 "/" is current directory.
QUIT
send_cmd():con_conn->Putline() returns -3155

Again I'm sorry to launch another pathetic "I can't tie my own shoe laces" thread but I've been banging away at this for hours and getting nowhere, and I'm really itching to have somewhere to upload mongs and Song Du Jours to. I nearly put this in Multimongia as anyone active on there ought to know, but this is the general forum so might as well pop it here for starters, if I've made a booboo then please feel free to cast me aside and never call me mother, or just move the thread.

So, can anybody help me? All I really want is to delete whats there, so I can start from scratch with the new site I've built.

[JesusAndYourBush]

If I were you I'd go in with a dedicated ftp client such as Cuteftp and tidy it all up, then you'll maybe have more luck with accessing it with those other progs.

[terminallyrelaxed]

I think the only reason I didnt try that before was the form you have to fill in - not the end of the world, but I thought I'd go through the free- and share-ware first. I've already let Captainftp expire and no amount of deleting plists and receipts will sort this. But yes thanks I'll try that, I'm waiting for the download email from Cuteftp now. Fetch is supposed to be pretty good though isnt it?

[terminallyrelaxed]

Good call - got a lot further with Cuteftp. Managed to get a list of whats on the server and managed to delete most of it - JAlbum front page still stubbornly hanging on and can't delete or rename it, but uploading now. Anyway, main thing is we're getting there. Thans for the reccomendation...

[Funky Gibbon]

I have used many ftp clients, and I have found that FTP explorer is by far the best and most stable, at least on my machine. CuteFTP had a tendancy to be unstable, and I like FTP explorer's drag and drop functionality.
http://www.ftpx.com/

Dreamweaver is far more simple than it looks. Macromedia seem to like to scare people when their software first boots up by opening dozens of palletes that you probably don't need all the time. Dreamweaver, like flash almost made me soil myself when I first started it up, but it really isn't too difficult once you start playing with it.

/Edited to add apostrophe goodness.

[Synchronised Cocks]

If you can't get any control over the remote system to delete or make directory and such, then you've probably got your firewall still too high on security.

When you finally get control proper, just use dir to list the contents of the current directory and then use del to delete the files and then rmdir to remove the folders. To see what commands the remote server understands, type in remotehelp after the ftp prompt . Use ftp from a dos window. Just type ftp after the C:\> prompt.

The best way to show how to use ftp is by an example, so here's a session showing lots of use.

Note that a folder cannot be removed unless it is emptied of it's contents first.

------------------------------------------------------------

C:\>ftp
ftp> open 212.104.129.58
220 Server (someserver) [212.104.129.58]
User (212.104.129.58:(none)): yourusername
331 Password required for yourusername.
Password:XXXXXXXX
230 User yourusername logged in.
ftp> pwd
257 "/" is current directory.
ftp> dir
200 PORT command successful
150 Opening ASCII mode data connection for file list
drwxr-xr-x   2 www      www          1024 Feb 22 19:36 ae
drwxr-xr-x   2 www      www          1024 Feb 22 19:58 banners
drwxr-xr-x   2 www      www          1024 Aug  1  2002 images
-rw-r--r--   1 www      www           445 Aug  1  2002 index.html
drwxr-xr-x   2 www      www          1024 Feb 21 17:51 test
226 Transfer complete.
ftp: 314 bytes received in 0.05Seconds 6.28Kbytes/sec.
ftp> cd test
250 CWD command successful.
ftp> dir
200 PORT command successful
150 Opening ASCII mode data connection for file list
-rw-r--r--   1 www      www          4374 Feb 21 17:47 beasts.bmp
-rw-r--r--   1 www      www         53276 Feb 21 17:51 christina.jpg
-rw-r--r--   1 www      www            16 Feb 21 17:32 test.txt
226 Transfer complete.
ftp: 202 bytes received in 0.22Seconds 0.92Kbytes/sec.
ftp> del
Remote file test.txt
250 DELE command successful.
ftp> dir
200 PORT command successful
150 Opening ASCII mode data connection for file list
-rw-r--r--   1 www      www          4374 Feb 21 17:47 beasts.bmp
-rw-r--r--   1 www      www         53276 Feb 21 17:51 christina.jpg
226 Transfer complete.
ftp: 137 bytes received in 0.06Seconds 2.28Kbytes/sec.
ftp> cd ..
250 CWD command successful.
ftp> dir
200 PORT command successful
150 Opening ASCII mode data connection for file list
drwxr-xr-x   2 www      www          1024 Feb 22 19:36 ae
drwxr-xr-x   2 www      www          1024 Feb 22 19:58 banners
drwxr-xr-x   2 www      www          1024 Aug  1  2002 images
-rw-r--r--   1 www      www           445 Aug  1  2002 index.html
drwxr-xr-x   2 www      www          1024 Mar  7 00:48 test
226 Transfer complete.
ftp: 314 bytes received in 0.06Seconds 5.23Kbytes/sec.
ftp> mkd
Directory name example
257 "/example" - Directory successfully created
ftp> dir
200 PORT command successful
150 Opening ASCII mode data connection for file list
drwxr-xr-x   2 www      www          1024 Feb 22 19:36 ae
drwxr-xr-x   2 www      www          1024 Feb 22 19:58 banners
drwxr-xr-x   2 www      www          1024 Mar  7 00:51 example
drwxr-xr-x   2 www      www          1024 Aug  1  2002 images
-rw-r--r--   1 www      www           445 Aug  1  2002 index.html
drwxr-xr-x   2 www      www          1024 Mar  7 00:48 test
226 Transfer complete.
ftp: 378 bytes received in 0.11Seconds 3.44Kbytes/sec.
ftp> cd example
250 CWD command successful.
ftp> dir
200 PORT command successful
150 Opening ASCII mode data connection for file list
226 Transfer complete.
ftp> !


Microsoft(R) Windows 98
  (C)Copyright Microsoft Corp 1981-1999.

C:\WINDOWS>cd ..

C:\>cd myfolder

C:\myfolder>dir

Volume in drive C has no label
Volume Serial Number is xxxx-00x0
Directory of C:\myfolder

.              <DIR>        03-07-04 12:58a .
..             <DIR>        03-07-04 12:58a ..
MELZAR~1 PNG         8,413  01-23-04  9:23a melzarsmaze.png
        1 file(s)          8,413 bytes
        2 dir(s)          121.50 GB free

C:\myfolder>exit
ftp> lcd
Local directory now C:\WINDOWS.
ftp> lcd ..
Local directory now C:\.
ftp> lcd myfolder
Local directory now C:\myfolder.
ftp> bin
200 Type set to I.
ftp> send
Local file melzarsmaze.png
Remote file melzarsmaze.png
200 PORT command successful
150 Opening BINARY mode data connection for melzarsmaze.png
226 Transfer complete.
ftp: 8413 bytes sent in 11.48Seconds 0.73Kbytes/sec.
ftp> dir
200 PORT command successful
150 Opening ASCII mode data connection for file list
-rw-r--r--   1 www      www          8413 Mar  7 01:16 melzarsmaze.png
226 Transfer complete.
ftp: 72 bytes received in 2.86Seconds 0.03Kbytes/sec.
ftp> cd ..
250 CWD command successful.
ftp> dir
200 PORT command successful
150 Opening ASCII mode data connection for file list
drwxr-xr-x   2 www      www          1024 Feb 22 19:36 ae
drwxr-xr-x   2 www      www          1024 Feb 22 19:58 banners
drwxr-xr-x   2 www      www          1024 Mar  7 01:16 example
drwxr-xr-x   2 www      www          1024 Aug  1  2002 images
-rw-r--r--   1 www      www           445 Aug  1  2002 index.html
drwxr-xr-x   2 www      www          1024 Mar  7 00:48 test
226 Transfer complete.
ftp: 378 bytes received in 0.11Seconds 3.44Kbytes/sec.
ftp> rmdir
Directory name example
550 example: Directory not empty
ftp> cd example
250 CWD command successful.
ftp> dir
200 PORT command successful
150 Opening ASCII mode data connection for file list
-rw-r--r--   1 www      www          8413 Mar  7 01:16 melzarsmaze.png
226 Transfer complete.
ftp: 72 bytes received in 0.00Seconds 72000.00Kbytes/sec.
ftp> del melzarsmaze.png
250 DELE command successful.
ftp> dir
200 PORT command successful
150 Opening ASCII mode data connection for file list
226 Transfer complete.
ftp> cd ..
250 CWD command successful.
ftp> dir
200 PORT command successful
150 Opening ASCII mode data connection for file list
drwxr-xr-x   2 www      www          1024 Feb 22 19:36 ae
drwxr-xr-x   2 www      www          1024 Feb 22 19:58 banners
drwxr-xr-x   2 www      www          1024 Mar  7 01:23 example
drwxr-xr-x   2 www      www          1024 Aug  1  2002 images
-rw-r--r--   1 www      www           445 Aug  1  2002 index.html
drwxr-xr-x   2 www      www          1024 Mar  7 00:48 test
226 Transfer complete.
ftp: 378 bytes received in 0.22Seconds 1.72Kbytes/sec.
ftp> rmdir example
250 XRMD command successful.
ftp> dir
200 PORT command successful
150 Opening ASCII mode data connection for file list
drwxr-xr-x   2 www      www          1024 Feb 22 19:36 ae
drwxr-xr-x   2 www      www          1024 Feb 22 19:58 banners
drwxr-xr-x   2 www      www          1024 Aug  1  2002 images
-rw-r--r--   1 www      www           445 Aug  1  2002 index.html
drwxr-xr-x   2 www      www          1024 Mar  7 00:48 test
226 Transfer complete.
ftp: 314 bytes received in 0.16Seconds 1.96Kbytes/sec.
ftp> close
221 Goodbye.
ftp> quit

C:\WINDOWS>exit

------------------------------------------------------------

[/color]
hope that helps in some way.

[terminallyrelaxed]

Thanks Gibbon and Cocks, all good stuff. Yes, I had tried to mount the ftp server on my desktop as this is part of the 'connect to server' functionality in OS X but it didnt work. Also, I know exactly what you mean about Dreamweaver. I'd used it briefly years ago, so knew it wasnt impossible but those palettes etc are a nightmare.
Cuteftp seems to be doing it for me now. Dreamweaver is still having troubleuploading itslef, but this is due to some confusion; Cuteftp hadnt managed to delete everything, theres a couple of empty folders subbornly hanging on but I've managed to drag them all into one and rename them, and I managed to overwrite the index.html file so the JAlbum front page is gone - however due to all this moving and renaming on the fly I've gone and muddled thing up a bit in my head, and although I've fixed all the links and am uploading agin, I don't I'll be winning any website prizes...
Still, I now have the basic folders to upload to, and simple pages I ca now spend happy hours updating and mucking around with, adding content and stupid first-website gimmicks (not really on the last one).
Tomorrow in TR's crash course in web technology; "making a web photo album" in Dreamweaver, uploading iCal to the web.

I've just realised I spent all week staring at a screen scratching my head and blurting out UNIX commands as if they were swahili, and now I've spent Saturday doing not much else. Its funny how the people who run up mountains on the weekend seem more rested on Monday. Hmmmm....

[fanny splendid]

I use Transmit for ftp-ing in OSX. You might want to have a look, it's very easy to use.

have you tried Gallery for creating an online photo album? Splattermac and Abbie weren't able to get it working, but I managed it okay on my site, and managed to integrate it into an existing online shop to generate new product pages dynamically without me having to rewrite loads of pages of html.

[terminallyrelaxed]

Hi Fanny I was hoping for your input on this.
Yes Gallery was my first choice to build my initial site, but the set-up looked unnecessarily hard at least for Macs, (its supposed to be child's play with XP) if I remember rightly it involved mucking around in Terminal - not that I'm totally against or afraid of that, but it seemed a lot of hassle when there were simpler options out there like JAlbum which was piss-easy.
It was only supposed to be a stemporary thing until I pulled my finger out and got to grips with Dreamweaver, so I wanted a no-brainer. However, if I don't like the Dreamweaver online photo album options I may well look at gallery again - I assume I can have it several layers down from the top level of my website?
Sorry, I would show off my pics and how JAlbum does it, but I've deleted them now and since re-uploading half my links are broken, so I'll have to re-do it this afternoon.
I also don't think JAlbum was at fault yesterday, it was the ftp client being crap and Dreamweaver probably not being set up properly by me that caused it, anyway Cuteftp did very well, and I managed to overwrite anything it couldnt delete by duplicating file names.
Transmit does get good press, basically I tried to download quite a few ftp clients and progs that do ftp clienting from versiontracker yesterday - quite a lot of the downloads didnt work, including Transmit - a mirroring problem I think, which is why I even tried the Beta-stage "ftpThingy" as its one of the few I could actually download.

Can't wait to get this sorted, and then I can start on Phtotshop and mong to heart's content...