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[muso] Playing guitar and singing at the same time

Started by Sam, March 26, 2007, 06:39:53 PM

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Sam

Despite having played the guitar for ten years I have only just learned my first song that I can sing too while playing (I can play plenty of songs on the guitar without singing). The song in question is "The Outdoor Type" by the Lemonheads (see thread on SE) which is a brilliant song. It's quite easy to sing and the chords aren't difficult either. Even so, I'm well chuffed.

So what was the first song you could sing and play and how long had you been playing before you could do it?

Pseudopath

"Nothing Else Matters" by Metallica (only because one of my mates at Uni kept banging on about it). There were only about six chords and the arpeggios were pretty simple, so I managed to crack it after playing guitar for 3 months. Didn't learn the intro and solos for another 3 years, though.

The first sing-and-pluck song I actually wanted to learn was "Vincent" by Don McLean, but I think I'd been playing about 18 months at that stage. I found my recording of it on an old C90 the other day and surprised myself at how good it sounded...and then wondered why I'd spent the last 10 years doing boring classical guitar nonsense.

Cack Hen

Urgh, would have been Wonderwall. I say urgh because that rhythm is so firmly lodged in my brain I have to really try to not slip into it.

Detective John Kimble

It might have been Last Kiss by Pearl Jam.  A few years ago now - that's the one that sticks out in my mind.  All Along the Watchtower as well.

chumfatty

I thinking it may have been Redemption Song by Bob Marley, I still play it every now and then , in fact it is the only time I 'perform' at all nowadays, I can't sing very well and it is only Mrs Chumfatty who gets to suffer my terrible voice. But it makes me relaxed.

Kudos on 'Last Kiss' by the way, love that song also, really good cover, other Pearl Jam covers I do are, Hide Your Love Away, Rocking in the Free World and Gimme  Some Truth.

Will I ever sing these personal tributes live? not on your fucking Nelly! far too embarrassed.

CharlieWigwam

Totally Wired by The Fall. I was playing bass and impersonating Mark E Smith so I don't suppose that counts. First song with a guitar and singing was Space Oddity

explodingvinyl

The Outdoor Type is a great song.

I guess the first song that I sung whilst playing the paino propberly was Brick by Ben Folds Five. Not very imaginitive I know, but I was about 16. Or maybe 17.

TotalMink

i have been playing guitar since i was 15 (i am 34) and i still cant sing and play at the same time BAH! Its like juggling on a bike and I just cant do it.  I can fairly well, and can hold a tune when i sing but doing it together? No chance.  Any tips?

explodingvinyl

What is it about singing and playing that you find difficult? What goes first? is it the voice or the guitar? Whichever you have most trouble with, start by doing that, then bring in the less troublesome part slowly and just keep at it.

Toad in the Hole

Bear in mind also that it's very rare for the singer to play any tricky melody line whilst singing - mostly they'll play rhythm, or maybe like Gilmour play lead but only whilst not singing, or whilst mirroring the vocal line.

First thing I played and sang?  Live Forever, I reckon.  Would be about the right era and I've got a hand-written lyrics sheet for it somewhere I transcribed when I was about 15.  Great days.  First thing I played and sang on piano - branching out from classical music oppression - Ben Folds Five, Philosophy.  I can still do a pretty decent version, even though I hardly ever play the piano these days.

And, much as I hate it when people correct me in a slightly superior way, surely Rockin in the Free World is a cover of Pearl Jam covering Neil Young, chumfatty?

chumfatty

Quote from: "afrayn"B

And, much as I hate it when people correct me in a slightly superior way, surely Rockin in the Free World is a cover of Pearl Jam covering Neil Young, chumfatty?

Yes, sorry didn't make that clear, Last Kiss, Hide Your Love Away, Rocking in the Free World and Gimme Some Truth are all songs Pearl Jam have covered from other artists.

ie  J. Frank Wilson and the Cavaliers, The Beatles, Neil Young and John Lennon.

Shoulders?-Stomach!

Quote from: "Cack Hen"Urgh, would have been Wonderwall. I say urgh because that rhythm is so firmly lodged in my brain I have to really try to not slip into it.

Mmm, that one also. I don't really understand Sam not learning to play and sing until 10 years after learning to play the guitar. I would've thought it to be natural that you start trying to do it straight away.

TotalMink

thanks for the advice explodingvinyl.  Seems to be concentration (ie not learning the words well enough) then only focusing on the guitar rather than the singing.  It is probably also being a little scared of sounding like a twat singing but knowing you sound ok on the guitar

Tetsuo: Ironmonger

Quote from: "Shoulders?-Stomach!"I don't really understand Sam not learning to play and sing until 10 years after learning to play the guitar. I would've thought it to be natural that you start trying to do it straight away.
Well it depends how you start playing guitar doesn't it. If he had no inclination to sing and play before, he wouldn't would he,

Make me smile

I have been playing for about 15 years and I find it really hard to play and sing at the same time. As soon as I open my mouth my hands fly off in the wrong direction as though they are wired to my lips.

I taught a friend of mine how to start of playing guitar and then within 3 months he is playing and wailing along like he has been doing it all his life..but then he is one of those monkey-boys who are made of mercury and seem to be able to do everything well. Bastard!!!

explodingvinyl

Quote from: "TotalMink"thanks for the advice explodingvinyl.  Seems to be concentration (ie not learning the words well enough) then only focusing on the guitar rather than the singing.  It is probably also being a little scared of sounding like a twat singing but knowing you sound ok on the guitar
If you can hold a tune, then you're sorted. Post your progress :)

Shoulders?-Stomach!

Quote from: "Tetsuo: Ironmonger"
Quote from: "Shoulders?-Stomach!"I don't really understand Sam not learning to play and sing until 10 years after learning to play the guitar. I would've thought it to be natural that you start trying to do it straight away.
Well it depends how you start playing guitar doesn't it. If he had no inclination to sing and play before, he wouldn't would he,

It's not that- I've always seen learning to play songs you know and singing alone to the tune you're playing as integral to most peoples beginnings learning to play the guitar. People sing along to their favourite songs anyway, so singing along to a tune you're playing on the guitar should be no different.
Plus it helps reinforce that you're playing correctly.

Spiteface

Quote from: "Cack Hen"Urgh, would have been Wonderwall. I say urgh because that rhythm is so firmly lodged in my brain I have to really try to not slip into it.

It might Live Forever for me.  It was the first song I knew that chords to (I was a huge fan back then, and still like them to an extent now).

I can remember feeling really smug when I found I could play "Street Spirit" and sing it at the same time.

Tetsuo: Ironmonger

Quote from: "Shoulders?-Stomach!"It's not that- I've always seen learning to play songs you know and singing alone to the tune you're playing as integral to most peoples beginnings learning to play the guitar. People sing along to their favourite songs anyway, so singing along to a tune you're playing on the guitar should be no different.
But for whatever reason, it was clearly different for Sam wasn't it. Isn't that pretty much where this argument ends? Sam approached the guitar in a certain way that meant he played guitar loads, and sang none.

Quote from: "Shoulders?-Stomach!"Plus it helps reinforce that you're playing correctly.
Why's that?

Sam

I will soon have a recording of me playing and singing The Outdoor Type!

session9

I didn't start with all that acousticy strummy stuff, mainly because I didn't have an acoustic guitar and the younger me thought it was a waste of time when I could be playing METAL!!!! I didn't sing (or even speak much beyond the occasional murmur) for ages, and just shredded out some fast soulless solos and chugalug drop-D power chord stuff. I learned to coordinate with songs like "Jesus Christ Pose" and "Master of Puppets". Maybe I've got some type of musical Asperger's or something. I still find learning the more sedate material a challenge, because it seems I lose concentration without a lot of riffs to get my teeth into. It's not like I feel the music, it's more like that technique of learning attack waves in a shoot-em-up so well that you don't have to think about what's coming next. I'd probably still rather be learning overblown barock stuff like Symphony X, but I'd be a bit embarassed to do so nowadays.

Shoulders?-Stomach!

QuoteBut for whatever reason, it was clearly different for Sam wasn't it. Isn't that pretty much where this argument ends? Sam approached the guitar in a certain way that meant he played guitar loads, and sang none.

Some people like me are trying to generate a debate. That's why this is a discussion topic and not a blog. I've come at learning to play from a different angle than Sam. I can understand taking a technique-based approach, but to do that so narrowly and to not even try or have the inclination to sing along to one piece of music as it's played just baffles me.

QuotePlus it helps reinforce that you're playing correctly.

Why's that?

The ensemble sounds impressive. I found it useful as self-encouragement and motivation to know what I was playing accompanied a voice to a level similar to that I was trying to mimic.

I don't think trying to reduce it down to 'He just did it differently, OK?' is very helpful. I'm not having a go at him at all, I'm just trying to provoke a discussion so I can try to understand.

Tetsuo: Ironmonger

Quote from: "Shoulders?-Stomach!"
QuoteBut for whatever reason, it was clearly different for Sam wasn't it. Isn't that pretty much where this argument ends? Sam approached the guitar in a certain way that meant he played guitar loads, and sang none.

Some people like me are trying to generate a debate. That's why this is a discussion topic and not a blog. I've come at learning to play from a different angle than Sam. I can understand taking a technique-based approach, but to do that so narrowly and to not even try or have the inclination to sing along to one piece of music as it's played just baffles me.
Why does it baffle you? Is the idea of such a narrow technique-based approach (if that's how Sam learned, speak up Sam!) that incomprehensible? And I'm not trying to destroy that debate, similarly to the way you say you don't understand Sam's approach, I'm saying I don't understand why you don't understand it. I'm not trying to patronise you, I just genuinely don't see why such an approach to guitar playing should baffle you.

Quote from: "Shoulders?-Stomach!"
QuotePlus it helps reinforce that you're playing correctly.

Why's that?

The ensemble sounds impressive. I found it useful as self-encouragement and motivation to know what I was playing accompanied a voice to a level similar to that I was trying to mimic.
If you want to sing and play then that's fair enough, I don't know why you can't believe Sam might not have wanted to sing before though.

Quote from: "Shoulders?-Stomach!"
I don't think trying to reduce it down to 'He just did it differently, OK?' is very helpful. I'm not having a go at him at all, I'm just trying to provoke a discussion so I can try to understand.
I know you're not having a go at him, I just feel that you're complicating understanding here. Without Sam having told us why he's only just started singing and playing together anyway (insecurity? focus on guitar? not enjoying singing?), I just don't understand why it would take such a discussion to comprehend that might be the case. Can't you see that playing and singing are two mutually exclusive exercises? Are you surprised when singers admit to not being able to play the guitar at the same time?

Shoulders?-Stomach!

QuoteCan't you see that playing and singing are two mutually exclusive exercises? Are you surprised when singers admit to not being able to play the guitar at the same time?

No, and yes. That's why I've responded like this.

Tetsuo: Ironmonger

If you're going to be sarcastic then why bother? I wasn't being arsey.

Shoulders?-Stomach!