Women are gold diggers, 46 people prove it.

[Blue Jam]

23 Daves, that's absolutely spot-on! I was in that situation with my struggling musician ex and got a bit fed up of him asking me about money, always wanting to go to cheaper restaurants, etc- frankly this kind of thing is a pain in the arse and gets in the way of things, plus he reminded me of my dad who was on the dole for over a decade. So yes, I told him to piss off. It's not a matter of men providing for women or vice-versa, it's a matter of equality and independence. Plus independence is sexy, while laziness, greed and a lack of dignity are not.

[Jemble Fred]

Oh, forget it then. I'll be rich in a year or so anyway.

[Blue Jam]

This thread is interesting as I was about to start a new thread about the gold-digger feature in the current issue of Esquire. It includes an amusingly pompous article by Michael Winner, in which he uses lots of phrases like "I phoned my great friend Burt Lancester" and talks about all the women a quarter of his age* he's shagged over the years. It reminded me of an ancient thread on here called "Michael Winner: Cunt Or Cunty Character?" posted around the time those eSure ads first aired, and through the Esquire article he comes across as a funny cunt... anyway, they also printed a list of the world's biggest golddiggers- most of them are women, but they get kudos for including Kevin Federline. Worth a read if you can pinch a copy (I read it while having my hair cut, that's my excuse). I'd not read it in years and found the current issue seems to have been edited by Patrick Bateman.

^{*Gawd, who did that "I'm Michael Winner, and I'm in a restaurant with a woman a quarter of my age" sketch? I seem to remember it being Vic and Bob but that can't be right, surely?}

[SetToStun]

What does it matter what the male partner is earning? Men don't provide for women any more, they're both out at work. With this out of the equation (or at least insignificant) you'd think women would value other things more.

Not necessarily true: if the woman is thinking of buying a house, the man's salary suddenly becomes relevant (in most cases). Same in the event that the woman wants kids and wants to spend plenty of time at home with them. It may not be so much a question of a woman seeking out a rich bloke as a woman wanting to be comfortable in the knowledge that her plans are viable.

[Jemble Fred]

Or, similarly, a man might want to stay at home with any kids and help bring them up while the lady goes out to work.

[SetToStun]

Or, similarly, a man might want to stay at home with any kids and help bring them up while the lady goes out to work.

Of course. A colleague of mine nearly did that as his wife was the higher earner of the two. I was just being old-fashioned (i.e. casually sexist) there.

[Shoulders?-Stomach!]

Not necessarily true: if the woman is thinking of buying a house, the man's salary suddenly becomes relevant (in most cases). Same in the event that the woman wants kids and wants to spend plenty of time at home with them. It may not be so much a question of a woman seeking out a rich bloke as a woman wanting to be comfortable in the knowledge that her plans are viable.

I know all that, I'm just saying that online dating and speed dating put far too much emphasis on wealth and materialism in decision making so they're unlikely to yield useful research info that is newsworthy, especially if it's tested on 46 people...in one American state.

However, when you first meet the first thought isn't "hmm, he could help pay the mortgage" is it? Neither is it "when we have kids he'll be earning enough that I won't have to work". It's the initial meeting of minds and then later possibly faces and bodies. I doubt many women I've gone out with/dated were thinking that far into the future on the first few times we met. There's more immediate things that your brain needs to focus on in order for the date to go well, like picking up body language or knowing where the nearest fire exit is.

[SetToStun]

I know all that, I'm just saying that online dating and speed dating put far too much emphasis on wealth and materialism in decision making so they're unlikely to yield useful research info that is newsworthy, especially if it's tested on 46 people...in one American state.

However, when you first meet the first thought isn't "hmm, he could help pay the mortgage" is it? Neither is it "when we have kids he'll be earning enough that I won't have to work". It's the initial meeting of minds and then later possibly faces and bodies. I doubt many women I've gone out with/dated were thinking that far into the future on the first few times we met. There's more immediate things that your brain needs to focus on in order for the date to go well, like picking up body language or knowing where the nearest fire exit is.

All of that's pretty much given (in most cases, but definitely not all) in younger people, but once you start nudging 30, you find (in my experience, certainly) that people of both sexes start adding the financial stability of potential partners into the mix. I'm an old git now and I know quite a few people who are quite up-front about it. It does get to the point as you get older that you need comfort more than you need thrills - maybe it's down to raging hormones finally calming down or something, but it most definitely is something that becomes more obvious.

Of course, my experiences may be purely because I work in the City and most people here are angling after the most comfortable life they can get (plus we're all getting on a bit now). however, the point stands: men and women of my age really do take account of their putative partners' jobs and incomes. Sorry if that sounds mercenary, but once you start getting on you can't face any more uncertainty than necessary and you really can't put off mortgages and families any longer.

[aaaaaaaaaargh!]

All of that's pretty much given (in most cases, but definitely not all) in younger people, but once you start nudging 30, you find (in my experience, certainly) that people of both sexes start adding the financial stability of potential partners into the mix. I'm an old git now and I know quite a few people who are quite up-front about it. It does get to the point as you get older that you need comfort more than you need thrills - maybe it's down to raging hormones finally calming down or something, but it most definitely is something that becomes more obvious.

Of course, my experiences may be purely because I work in the City and most people here are angling after the most comfortable life they can get (plus we're all getting on a bit now). however, the point stands: men and women of my age really do take account of their putative partners' jobs and incomes. Sorry if that sounds mercenary, but once you start getting on you can't face any more uncertainty than necessary and you really can't put off mortgages and families any longer.

Due to my terminal immaturity and need for constant thrills I'm chasing after younger girls at the moment.  I work in City and will be nudging 30 soon too.  My financial stability is such that I wouldn't turn down anyone on financial grounds (unless they had a loan shark chasing after them), I could support another person fairly easily.

I hate being single

[Analrapist]

My financial stability is such that I wouldn't turn down anyone on financial grounds (unless they had a loan shark chasing after them), I could support another person fairly easily.

I'm willing to give homosexuality a go if you are, aaaaaaaaaargh!...

[SetToStun]

Due to my terminal immaturity and need for constant thrills I'm chasing after younger girls at the moment.  I work in City and will be nudging 30 soon too.  My financial stability is such that I wouldn't turn down anyone on financial grounds (unless they had a loan shark chasing after them), I could support another person fairly easily.

I hate being single

Not wishing to pry too much, are you EC4, 3 or 2?

[aaaaaaaaaargh!]

EC4.  I don't work in a very nice building though!

[SetToStun]

EC4.  I don't work in a very nice building though!

Imposter! The real City is in EC3. Everyone knows this ;-)

PS: My current building isn't much either, I'm afraid.

[aaaaaaaaaargh!]

If I crane my neck I can see the Bank of England if that sweetens it ;o)

I must admit, I haven't tried speed dating (or dating whilst on speed for that matter).  Maybe I should

[Captain Crunch]

Sorry but a lot of this just reeks of bad manners.  I'm not talking about classic gold digging, girls chasing footballers or whatever, let them get on with it but for 'normal' people, when on earth did it become acceptable to ask another person about their salary?!  At best that's just gauche and at worst it's downright rude.

[Jemble Fred]

I suppose it's just like any other variable when you meet someone with a view to kissing/penetration/life-sharing – if somebody's genuinely not bothered by it, then good luck to them. Personally, one whiff of a financial inquiry (at least on any of the first ten dates) and my respect and interest would plummet.

Tip there for the ladies – ask to see my bank balance and you're rid of me for good.

[Freddie]

I'm no gold digger, I'd rather make my own cash.

[rudi]

I'm no gold digger, I'd rather make my own cash.

That's highly illegal, isn't it?

[Blue Jam]

It's not just about income, I know a few relationships that have been strained because one partner's just crap with money. A friend had his confidence severely knocked by an ex who put him down all the time because he found it impossible to save money- he was earning a good salary but would spend any cash he had almost immediately. She wasn't supporting him there, and he could always afford to take her out for meals and buy her presents, it was mostly a maturity issue- now he's older and wiser and needs to save for things like cars and mortgages he's a bit more sensible with money.

I had a flatmate who earned around £40K but I was surprised when he started getting very stressed out one time and eventually asked me if the cheque for his bankloan had arrived- I couldn't believe he had taken out a £15K loan or that he had no savings whatsoever. He spent all his money on things like expensive holidays, gadgets and designer clothes.

They both remind me of that little greetings card joke: "A man will spend £20 on a £10 item he needs, a woman will spend £10 on a £20 item she doesn't need." Maybe there's some truth in it- a lot of men just don't seem to know much about budgeting or being economical in any way. My flatmate used to spend £30 getting a taxi home alone if he fancied leaving a gig early, rather than waiting a bit and sharing a cab, or getting a night bus for £1. He'd buy all his clothes at full price and never waited for sales- all little things which add up. He seemed to think that being able to afford things justified buying them, even if they were totally unecessary. One of the reasons I moved out was because the electricity and phone bills were astronomical- they were in his name, we had a bad deal on the phone and internet package which he couldn't be arsed to change, and he used to leave all the aforementioned gadgets on standby, refusing to believe me when I said that actually does make a difference to the electricity bill. I was amazed to find that living on my own has actually turned out to be cheaper.