Author Topic: [Football] No room for Manchester United players...  (Read 1474 times)

[Football] No room for Manchester United players...
« on: May 10, 2004, 06:07:40 PM »
"No room for Manchester United players in this season's Premiership dream team"

or so says Andy Gray in today's Guardian Sport. apologies for yet another football thread, furthermore for the baiting title. think of this as foreplay before i write a post about the brilliant immigration article in G2.

Quote from: "Andy"
Antti Niemi (Southampton)

Lauren (Arsenal)
Sol Campbell (Arsenal)
John Terry (Chelsea)
Wayne Bridge (Chelsea)

Steven Gerrard (Liverpool)
Frank Lampard (Chelsea)
Patrick Viera (Arsenal)
Robert Pires (Arsenal)

Thierry Henry (Arsenal)
Alan Shearer (Newcastle)

Arsene Wenger (Arsenal)



ok, the list is rightly dominated by Arsenal and Chelsea players, but the lack of United players astounds me. this coming from a boy who in the mid-90s refused to have any United players in his Fantasy Football teams as a matter of principle (i of course, had a stunningly low points score, season after season)

Alan Shearer is a fantastic player, he would've eased into any England side at least up to now. but a Premiership team without Rudd Van Nistelroy up there with Henry looks like the sort of side that my bitter 14 year old self would pick.

i also think O' Shea could give Cole/Bridge a decent run for their money.

thoughts?

[Football] No room for Manchester United players...
« Reply #1 on: May 10, 2004, 06:17:20 PM »
O'Shea has had a dreadful season for United, at least the times I've seen them play. I think United fans themselves would admit that a lot of their players this season have been a bit below-par, but if not for a slip in form round Jan/Feb time, Howard might have made the list in goal. Post-Christmas, the only player of theirs who seemed to really give a fuck (except Keane) seemed to be Ronaldo - the 4-1 defeat to City, I felt sorry for the poor lad that all his effort wasn't matched by the nine other outfield players.

[Football] No room for Manchester United players...
« Reply #2 on: May 10, 2004, 07:17:05 PM »
I wouldn't have one Man United player in my 'Dream XI' this season, nearly every time i've seen them they've been fucking shit.  Tim Howard and Cristiano Ronaldo are probably the only two who've stood out, but Howard wasn't even first choice for a while and Ronaldo isn't the finished article yet and is still a bit of a one-trick pony.

Shearer up front is just laughable though.  He relies too much on winning dodgy free-kicks and is a shadow of the player he once was.  I've even heard one-eyed Geordies slagging him off this season so he must be on the way out.  I might be slightly biased but I'd sooner have Juan Pablo Angel or even (and god forgive me for saying this) Mikael Forsell.

[Football] No room for Manchester United players...
« Reply #3 on: May 10, 2004, 07:41:25 PM »
I'm a United fan and I wouldn't have picked any Utd player in the Fantasy Eleven.  As said, Timmy Howard and Ronnie Ronalde have been the only two who have been half decent.

If Martin Tyler did a Fantasy XI all eleven would be arsenal players, he can't stop creaming himself off to Arsenal and every team that plays Utd.

chand

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[Football] No room for Manchester United players...
« Reply #4 on: May 10, 2004, 08:10:15 PM »
I think Ferdinand would have been in ahead of Terry if it wasn't for the Urinegate thing, he started the season fantastically and in January was the lynchpin in the Prem's tightest defence.

I'd want Scholes in too, personally, but this hasn't been his best season so I could see why he's not in. There seems to be 3 central midfielders in there, but that's nitpicking.

Can't argue with Henry, Pires, Vieira and Campbell, those four players are the backbone of a great team. So yeah, probably the only thing I'd change would be Ruud for Shearer, cos if you're talking partnerships I think Ruud and Henry would complement each other brilliantly, a goalpoacher combined with Henry who provides almost as many as he scores.

But yeah, this has been an odd season for United. I think next season Ronaldo will definitely be in there.

fanny splendid

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[Football] No room for Manchester United players...
« Reply #5 on: May 10, 2004, 08:57:37 PM »
At least we don't have to listen to Wenger's bitching this time around...

;¬)

I agree with most of that team, apart from maybe including Howard and van Nistelrooy. United have been terrible for a lot of this season. In fact, the only thing that is positive about the way we played, was that Arsenal had to have their best season ever, to beat us to the title.

I still don't get Gerrard's inclusion. What a waste. Stick Dennis Wise in, instead.

I'll probably regret saying that, though...

chand

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[Football] No room for Manchester United players...
« Reply #6 on: May 10, 2004, 10:59:50 PM »
Howard was great at the start of the season, and will be a fantastic keeper for us, but he got dropped for a while because this is pretty much his first season playing proper football. So, I guess you can't really have a goalkeeper that got dropped in your best XI of the year. And Niemi has been great.

[Football] No room for Manchester United players...
« Reply #7 on: May 10, 2004, 11:09:36 PM »
i'll just add to my first post by saying that, yeah, in the main i agree with Gray...


except for the criminal omission of Van Nistelroy...

[Football] No room for Manchester United players...
« Reply #8 on: May 10, 2004, 11:19:50 PM »
Perhaps someone could tell me what horseface has done in the last couple of months other than (a) getting injured and (b) stinking it up.

Last I noticed Shearer had 22 league goals playing for an fairly, drab mediocre team and Van Nistelrooy had only 19 for Man Utd.

Shearer is well worth his place in the eleven.

[Football] No room for Manchester United players...
« Reply #9 on: May 10, 2004, 11:37:21 PM »
Quote from: "mangoliver"
Perhaps someone could tell me what horseface has done in the last couple of months other than (a) getting injured and (b) stinking it up.


i'm halfway between wanting to wrap myself in my tiny disgusting "bumblebee" shirt of 1993 giggling with joy when i read that, and halfway wanting to say that the season didn't start in March, and that i reckon Van Nistelroy has pipped Shearer in the all-round stakes this season.

[Football] No room for Manchester United players...
« Reply #10 on: May 10, 2004, 11:39:14 PM »
'Teams of the Season' mean fuck all.

The division 3 team of the season contains two Scunthorpe United players, and even my Scunny supporting boss thinks it's a pile of shite.

Third bottom in the entire football league, worst defensive record in the division and they get two names in the divisional team of the year - one midfielder, and one defender who, apart from the stats proving he's shite, it an absolute twat.

Now consider Doncaster Rovers: Second favorites for relegation, we won not only promotion, but also the championship. We boast the best defensive record in the division, the second best goal scoring record, the best goal difference, the best home recors, the best away record, etc., etc., and what's our representation in the team of the year? One midfielder, most of whose goals were penalties.

At the end of the day, what's important is how many players are good, not how many are recognised, and if you keep the faith, there's always the chance that you can spur them on to achieve more next season.

Mildly Diverting

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[Football] No room for Manchester United players...
« Reply #11 on: May 11, 2004, 09:18:03 AM »
Anyone without an interest in English Third Division football should look away now.

Quote from: "Manford Thirty-Sixborough"
Now consider Doncaster Rovers: Second favorites for relegation, we won not only promotion, but also the championship. We boast the best defensive record in the division, the second best goal scoring record, the best goal difference, the best home recors, the best away record, etc., etc., and what's our representation in the team of the year? One midfielder, most of whose goals were penalties.


But, MT-S, Donnie aren't exactly the most interesting team to watch are they? Congrats on winning the championship and all that, but it was hardly 'liquid football' was it? Quite frankly I'm amazed that the Div 3 team of the year didn't comprise the entire Torquay United starting eleven.

[Football] No room for Manchester United players...
« Reply #12 on: May 11, 2004, 09:45:44 AM »
United have been largely dire this season - the game against Chelsea at the weekend was yet another fragmented performance of long ball and midfield dithery.  The only players who I would consider for inclusion in the team of the season are Tim Howard and Paul Scholes.  I've watched countless games this season which you could have entitled The Paul Scholes Show, because he seemed like the only man in red to have fully turned up.  Admittedly he's not been as good as last year, but that's because he was phenomenal last season - I would've named him as Player of the Year without question - yes, above Henry.  But, because he's a little ginger bollocks he doesn't get as many column inches or pundits wanking themselves off as yer Beckhams, yer Henrys or yer van Nistelrooys.

I was watching the Chelsea game in the pub on Saturday, and an Arsenal fan who was sat close by told me that Scholes is "the only player in your team that I wished played for Arsenal."

chand

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[Football] No room for Manchester United players...
« Reply #13 on: May 11, 2004, 12:03:20 PM »
Quote from: "Partridge's Love Child"
United have been largely dire this season - the game against Chelsea at the weekend was yet another fragmented performance of long ball and midfield dithery.  The only players who I would consider for inclusion in the team of the season are Tim Howard and Paul Scholes.  I've watched countless games this season which you could have entitled The Paul Scholes Show, because he seemed like the only man in red to have fully turned up.  Admittedly he's not been as good as last year, but that's because he was phenomenal last season - I would've named him as Player of the Year without question - yes, above Henry.  But, because he's a little ginger bollocks he doesn't get as many column inches or pundits wanking themselves off as yer Beckhams, yer Henrys or yer van Nistelrooys.

I was watching the Chelsea game in the pub on Saturday, and an Arsenal fan who was sat close by told me that Scholes is "the only player in your team that I wished played for Arsenal."


Yeah, Scholes was amazing last season. Everyone talked about selling Beckham as 'losing our best player' but I think most United fans would have been far more upset to lose Scholes, not only because he's a Salford lad who'll play for United til his legs snap off, but also because he's just a class act and can he relied on to chip in with goals in double figures every season for the cause.

As for the Chelsea game, while there wasn't much of the old genius on display (last season it was our performances against the likes of Arsenal, Newcastle, Liverpool and Chelsea that pretty much won us the title), the result could have been a fair bit different if Robert Huth hadn't stopped two decent goalscoring opportunities (one half-chance for Fletcher and one massive one for Ruud from a gorgeous Giggs pass), the clusmy shitehawk.

[Football] No room for Manchester United players...
« Reply #14 on: May 11, 2004, 12:08:38 PM »
speaking of the Chelsea game, i think Scholesy is the luckiest player in England at the minute.

i don't give a fuck what game you've got on in a couple of weeks, or where you're playing, that kid should've been sent off.

the ref knew it (you could see him grab for his cards before remembering where he was and that he'd already booked him), the crowd new it, and Fergy, who substituted the intemperate so-and-so a few minutes later knew it.

i can imagine Dennis Wise being slightly aggreived at that one.

chand

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[Football] No room for Manchester United players...
« Reply #15 on: May 11, 2004, 12:49:40 PM »
I'm not sure how bad-tempered he is, I think he's just dreadful at the art of the slide-tackle.

He would have got booked for it if he hadn't already been done for 'simulation'. But yeah, in any case I've seen straight reds given for less.

Can't imagine Wisey being aggreived, he's the manager of fucking Millwall. Didn't he come on as a player at one point this season and get sent off pretty much staight away, the daft cunt?

[Football] No room for Manchester United players...
« Reply #16 on: May 11, 2004, 01:51:52 PM »
I personally thought the card for "simulation" was harsh - yes, he was looking to go down, but he waited until contact was made (the defender's knee caught the back of his leg).  Whether that's any better I don't know, what I do know is that is the first time I've seen Scholes dive in the box ever.  Hmm, I seem to have talked myself in circles.  Perhaps you're right, maybe he should've been sent off - the tackle was certainly a shocker.  I can't help but be biased - he's my favourite player.

Fletcher's performance on Saturday was another silky display of on-the-ball skills and intricate passing.  Is there no beginning to this lad's talents?  Please, Fergie, sell him before anyone notices how hopeless he is.

chand

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[Football] No room for Manchester United players...
« Reply #17 on: May 11, 2004, 03:02:35 PM »
Well, I didn't think he should have been booked for diving.

As for Fletch, he has his moments, hopefully next season they'll be more frequent.

[Football] No room for Manchester United players...
« Reply #18 on: May 11, 2004, 03:48:04 PM »
I note Alan Smith has been saying how he wouldn't mind playing for Man United, which is a turnaround from the time on Sky when he said the one team he wouldn't play for is "Man U".

As for Scholes, I think most observant fans would agree he's far more important to the team then Beckham was. Plus you often see him in the Oldham Co-op doing his shopping.

Re: [Football] No room for Manchester United players...
« Reply #19 on: May 11, 2004, 04:37:04 PM »
Quote from: "mayer"
Alan Shearer is a fantastic player, he would've eased into any England side at least up to now.


He shouldn't as all he did last time (last 20 times?) he put on an England shirt, or any other shirt for that matter is win free kicks by falling backwards into defenders and hang around pretending he's an old war horse even though he's 33.

The fact he has scored so many goals this season is that he has had a bamillion-squillion pounds spent on assembling a side that will run around like lunatics in order that he can him knock them in (Although give him his due he can smash a shot in) and he has to play in every game or the Geordies will put their tops back on covering their hideous stomachs that seem to gee the team on so much.

Because they're great aren't they the Newcastle fans? I love the patronising way the London centric media wank on about them because they, get this, sing at matches, and take their tops of.  Brilliant and they're so loyal aren't they?  Oh no, actually It appears they aren't that loyal. Attendances below 10,000 in the first division you say? Booing their own players before they've gone on? Surely not. No no no, they're our own lovely northern stereotypes, look it's snowing and they've all got their heaving tattooed guts out all over the place.

To be fair, if Van deserves to be in the team what about Saha?  He's scored more goals, and half of them were for not-as-fashionable-as-they-used-to-be Fulham.

A team of the season without a single Neville is just ridiculous.  Who's going to look like Hitler in the rain?

Not sure where I'm going with this so I better stop before I start quoting the wrong dates.  I'll be back with my ridiculous facial hair eleven in a bit.

[Football] No room for Manchester United players...
« Reply #20 on: May 11, 2004, 08:13:54 PM »
Just to add some intellectual rigour to this debate.  I agree with Andy Gray.

I fucking hate Man Utd and especially their cocksucker of a manager

Re: [Football] No room for Manchester United players...
« Reply #21 on: May 11, 2004, 09:41:13 PM »
Quote from: "Mediocre Rich"
Brilliant and they're so loyal aren't they?  Oh no, actually It appears they aren't that loyal. Attendances below 10,000 in the first division you say? Booing their own players before they've gone on? Surely not.


Yes, very good point. Remember when they ran Man Utd close to the title in the Keegan years, and as they gradually ballsed it up quite spectacularly the cameras always focused on Geordies weeping uncontrollably. Where were they in the lower division years I wonder?

I love all this about Alan Smith's 'loyalty' to Leeds as well. He loves the club, and wants to rejoin them if they make it back to the Premiership? That's nice of him, let some other poor sods do all the hard work in Div. 1 and then skip back to the club with (no doubt) unreasonably high pay demands, which the club will then try to meet so they can welcome home their 'favourite son,' who sends the club spiraling back into the bankruptcy mire, which they've only just escaped from...*huff*...*puff*...

...and breathe.

chand

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[Football] No room for Manchester United players...
« Reply #22 on: May 11, 2004, 10:21:59 PM »
To be fair to Smith, they do need to sell players and he's probably their single biggest remaining asset. Although he should probably have waited til the end of the season before reminding everyone he was gonna fuck off.

Re: [Football] No room for Manchester United players...
« Reply #23 on: May 11, 2004, 10:49:33 PM »
Quote from: "Mediocre Rich"
The fact he has scored so many goals this season is that he has had a bamillion-squillion pounds spent on assembling a side that will run around like lunatics in order that he can him knock them in


Of course, unlike Van Nistelrooy who has to create chances entirely on his own due to the donkey's like Giggs and Scholes in Man Utd's midfield., while Shearer feasts on chance after chance made by the massive creative powerhouse of Gary Speed and Darren Ambrose.

chand

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[Football] No room for Manchester United players...
« Reply #24 on: May 11, 2004, 10:57:17 PM »
Probably being a bit harsh on the likes of Jenas, Robert and Dyer there.

[Football] No room for Manchester United players...
« Reply #25 on: May 12, 2004, 10:54:47 AM »
The fans thing is a valid point.  My home club is Bradford City, whose matches now are sparcely attended because they're not playing well and have been relegated to Division 2.  Where are all the punters who sang "City 'til I die" when they were in the Premiership?  I can't believe that they're all dead.

However, I was chatting to a fellow the other week about football.  He's a West Ham fan and a little older than me.  He pointed out that when he was a kid, the players were you idols - you loved them, some of them were local boys, and even if they weren't, you felt they wanted to see the club succeed as much as you did.  Now, you hate the players - especially if they can't cut the mustard.  You watch an incompetent, who can't even beat the first man with a corner, who earns more in a week than you'll earn in four years, and you hate him for that.  I don't think I could ever truly hate someone so young to the extent that Beckham was berrated at one stage, but I've caught myself going someway towards that when watching fucking Fletcher.  Now I've realised, I'll try and curb it.

Bizarrely, losing seems to make me even more rabid and obsessed.  I'm going to get "Scholes" tattooed on my arse.  Lucky I can save a letter etc.

Re: [Football] No room for Manchester United players...
« Reply #26 on: May 12, 2004, 01:06:16 PM »
Quote from: "mangoliver"
Of course, unlike Van Nistelrooy who has to create chances entirely on his own due to the donkey's like Giggs and Scholes in Man Utd's midfield., while Shearer feasts on chance after chance made by the massive creative powerhouse of Gary Speed and Darren Ambrose.


Exactly!

Shearer is a funny one.  Throughout his carreer I've gone through phases of loving him (Southampton) hating him (Blackburn - not signing for Man U), loving him (Euro96) hating him (Newcastle - not signing for Man U), hating him a bit more (Being shit for England after his Injury), loving him (Because he kept banging them in the premiership despite being an old git, especially the game against Chelsea where he made Lebouef look like an utter twat) and hating him again (Realising that he wasn't quite as old as he would have you believe and picking Owen instead of him in my Dream Team this year costing me 1st place.  Bah).

The whole losing thing is interesting PLC, last season a friend of mine mentioned that it would be better if we were shit again because then it wouldn't matter so much.  The trouble (because the you must remember the lot of the Man Utd fan is a hard one) is that the more you win the more a disaster it is if you lose.  For instance, this season, when alls said and done, is a disaster. And we're finishing 3rd and get to play in an FA cup final.  In truth every season since 99 has been marred by not winning the European Cup again.

But then the best bit about supporting a team is building the side isn't it?  To quote Clive Tylsley "That night in Barcelona" seemed to me to be the culmination of my entire footballing childhood.  Like losing your virginity (with David May as the unfortunate image atop the vinegar stroke) after 15 years of foreplay.  2000 and 2001 were the after shocks, and in 2003 we were wiping our cocks on the curtain.  Now we're left walking out the door sheepishly doing up our trousers not knowing when the next shag is going to come along (and secretly knowing it'll never be quite as exciting).

Vermschneid Mehearties

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[Football] No room for Manchester United players...
« Reply #27 on: May 12, 2004, 02:22:06 PM »
I can't believe the amount of NUFC baiting on here. We've had mildly disappointing season given recent form (though still better than 97-2000), and winning only 2 away games is pathetic. Also at fault are Robert and Viana, who whinge constantly about other people, and yet are the lazyest, erratic sods I've seen since Asprilla and Ginola.

BUT- We have only been able to field Woodgate, Dyer, Bellamy, Jenas and Shearer on the same field 5 times this season. That's going to affect any team. Like for example Arsenal at the Arse-end of last season where they missed Campbell and Viera so much, it lost them the title.

AND-Ameobi has matured into a good striker, and there's more to come. We have a young squad, who are going to evolved into a top 5 team for a decade or so. Shearer despite some bitterness from whores on here, is still scoring...more than any other person except Henry. He's a striker, on goals alone he beats the horse and then shits on his mane.

SO- Back off and leave us alone. Yes, we may have the dodgiest, most unreliable bunch of young cock-happy englishers in the league, but at least they're young, talented and english, wheras Arsenal, Chelsea and MUFC rely too much on foreigners, and as a result, they are creating a problem for the Premiership, akin to that of the SPL. They race off into the distance collecting the money and the glory whilst everyone else fights on scraps, and has little bargaining power or influence. It can also be argued that the likes of Scholes who hasn't played well for his country for 6 years and STILL gets picked ahead of superior, in-form players damage our international scene too.

So lay-off eh...there's bigger fish to fry.

fanny splendid

  • Chaos Reigns
[Football] No room for Manchester United players...
« Reply #28 on: May 12, 2004, 02:48:30 PM »
Quote from: "Vermschneid Mehearties"
AND-Ameobi has matured into a good striker, and there's more to come...


Exactly, there may not be much of him now, but come the start of next season, there'll be pseudopods all over the pitch..

Vermschneid Mehearties

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[Football] No room for Manchester United players...
« Reply #29 on: May 12, 2004, 02:58:05 PM »
Guh. My dad calls him Ameoba.

Dare me to mention your spaghetti haired slimy twat.

*:D*