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Best Westerns

Started by Yellow Reggae, December 31, 2010, 06:42:59 PM

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Yellow Reggae

So my younger brother is now into cowboys and injuns because of Red Dead Redemption and he's asking me which are the good films to watch. I think he's got the Fistful Of Dollars films and Butch Cassidy. The last western I saw was Unforgiven I think.

I've googled a few lists but I'm interested to hear what the whores like.

Old Nehamkin

All of Leone's westerns are brilliant- Once upon a time in the west is the obvious one, but he should also check out A fistful of dynamite if he hasn't seen it. Really underappreciated film in a similar vein to the good, the bad and the ugly, but funnier. The new version of True grit by the Coens is also excellent, I think that's coming out soon.

Johnny Townmouse

Any and all westerns by Leone

I thought The Assassination of Jesse James was rather fantastic

Tombstone and Unforgiven are interesting and fun


Feralkid

I heartily recommend any of Ford Cavalry films, the original 1950's 3:10 to Yuma, John Ford's Man Who Shot Liberty Valance, The Wild Bunch, The Outlaw Josie Wales.   But again, it depends on what he likes about the genre.   I love, love, love William Wyler's The Big Country - but it's mostly a melodrama set against an epic widescreen Western landscape.   So I'm not sure if it would have the necessary action quotient.   

But yes, Leone's stuff, the smarter John Ford films and probably also John Wayne's last film The Shootist.   

Peru

Trust me - if you want the greatest Western Double-Bill of all time then watch John Ford's Henry Fonda-starring My Darling Clementine (1946) followed by Peter Fonda's The Hired Hand (1971).

This is a perfect double bill - the combination of father and son and the radically different styles of both films complement each other beautifully. Clementine, shot in crisp black-and-white and extremely downbeat and tough for a Western of the time, is a beautiful and moving film with an outstanding performance by Henry Fonda. There are a couple of versions knocking around - try and get your hands on the more downbeat restored version. The film looks absolutely beautiful, the violence hurts - there is a magnificently clumsy shoot-out - and the tone is startlingly ambiguous.

Then on to The Hired Hand, which is hands-down the greatest Western I have ever seen. Peter Fonda directed the film on a tiny budget in the early 70s, and it was lost to audiences for around 30 years before being restored and reissued in the mid-2000s. Two men (Fonda and Warren Oates, whose presence in any film means it is worth watching) ride together until Fonda decides it is time to return home. I'm saying no more about the plot, but the score (by folk musician Bruce Langhorne) and the cinematography (by Vilmos Zsigmond) will leave you in pieces. Fonda developed a technique of using incredibly slow dissolves - often minutes-long at a time - which marinate the viewer in luxurious Western skies and hills for what seems like forever. The ending will knock the breath out of you.

Peter Fonda apparently screened Clementine to the cast of The Hired Hand during the shooting, and going from this fantastic, relatively unusual 1940s Western to this full-blown 1970s revisionist destruction of the rule book is one of the most satisfying filmic experiences I have ever had. You'll be the richer for it.

Famous Mortimer

You could always point your brother in the direction of Alex Cox's "10,000 Ways To Die", which is all about spaghetti westerns and if it's as much fun to read as Cox's other book it should be a blast. Talking of which, I discover he's done a remastered, re-edited version of "Straight To Hell" which is coming out soon.

kaprisky

The Wild Bunch might be my favourite film of all. I don't even own a copy and I feel like I know the film inside out (plot-wise, anyway).

Django and The Big Silence (Il Grande Silenzio) are also iconic.

Quote from: Famous Mortimer on January 01, 2011, 08:23:02 AM
You could always point your brother in the direction of Alex Cox's "10,000 Ways To Die", which is all about spaghetti westerns and if it's as much fun to read as Cox's other book it should be a blast. Talking of which, I discover he's done a remastered, re-edited version of "Straight To Hell" which is coming out soon.

I never got around to picking up either book but a friend and myself did see Cox at a Q&A session for Searchers 2.0, itself a film about westerns and fandom of those films.

Bog Dadley

The Searchers, 3.55pm, today, Channel 5.

madhair60

Quote from: Bog Dadley on January 01, 2011, 11:52:06 AM
The Searchers, 3.55pm, today, Channel 5.

Seconded.  Get it on, drink it in.

Catalogue Trousers

No mention of The Magnificent Seven? Then I'll do it!

Danger Man

Little Big Man (1970)
Soldier Blue (1970)
Bad Company (1972)


That should be enough "Early 1970's films where the cowboys were no longer seen as the good guys" to be going on with.

An tSaoi

If he likes Unforgiven he should try The Outlaw Josey Wales.

Shoulders?-Stomach!

The Naked Spur is a top quality classic with an outlaw and a long journey and Janet Leigh and James Stewart.

Howj Begg

I second The Naked Spur.

High Noon, of course.

The Sons of Katie Elder and Rio Bravo are the two best John Wayne films in my opinion, he has great chemistry with Dean Martin in these two films.

Shane is a wonderful film with a great ending. It brings back Sunday Afternoon childhood memories of watching Westerns on Channel 4.

As far as modern films go I second the mentions of Tombstone (Val Kilmer's performance is one of the most charismatic performances on screen) and The Assasination of Jesse James......

SavageHedgehog

Tombstone is one of those times when Hollywood released two films on more or less the same theme at the same time; Wyatt Earp came out shortly afterwards. Personally, I found both films quite dull, but Val Kilmer and Dennis Quaid are both absolutely fantastic as Doc Holliday, with very different approaches, and make the films worth watching.

NoSleep


alcoholic messiah

Quote from: An tSaoi on January 03, 2011, 02:09:16 AM
If he likes Unforgiven he should try The Outlaw Josey Wales.

And also the film that forms a loose trilogy with those two: High Plains Drifter.

A fistfull of dynamite

DUCK YOU SUCKER!!

SavageHedgehog

Quote from: alcoholic messiah on January 03, 2011, 08:23:40 PM
And also the film that forms a loose trilogy with those two: High Plains Drifter.

I tend to think of The Outlaw Josey Wales and Unforgiven as being a loose trilogy with Pale Rider, although High Plains Drifter works as well

alcoholic messiah

Quote from: SavageHedgehog on January 03, 2011, 09:26:21 PM
I tend to think of The Outlaw Josey Wales and Unforgiven as being a loose trilogy with Pale Rider, although High Plains Drifter works as well

Hah. Turns out I was actually thinking of Pale Rider (and not The Outlaw Josey Wales) as being of a similar type to High Plains Drifter and Unforgiven i.e. the two earlier films depict a mysterious stranger coming to town, righting perceived injustices via some expert gunishment, then buggering off again, with the town's status quo now transformed. Although it veers from the path by revealing so much of William Munny's backstory, Unforgiven can be viewed (at a push) as both a continuation and a deconstruction of the other two films.

For me, what prevents The Outlaw Josey Wales from being easily bracketed with those three is that it's not primarily dealing with events in a single community.

Cohaagen

Quote from: Johnny Townmouse on December 31, 2010, 08:52:26 PMTombstone and Unforgiven are interesting and fun

"Interesting and fun" for the former, fair enough, but Unforgiven surely counts as one of the greatest screenplays ever written? It's an absolute, bona fide masterpiece, one of very few scripts that can be read for entertainment and as literature in itself. It at least deserves credit as a piece that succeeds, on it's own terms, as a non-ironic,  in-character deconstruction and demystification of Old West mythology. That the spiral of sleazy, realistic gutter violence springs from a hard-faced prostitute laughing at a cowpoke's small dick makes it all the more sordidly admirable. Plus it also has, along with The Assassination of Jesse James by the Coward Robert Ford, one of the few truly honest depictions of what Western gunfights were really like.

Tombstone is a great film in it's own right - the saloon confrontation between Michael Biehn and Val Kilmer is at least as good as anything in Unforgiven, or any other western for that matter.

That said, this is hard to beat, if only as a record of the 80s crack epidemic:


Ginyard

I really enjoyed 3:10 to Yuma. Bale and Crowe worked great together and I found the whole thing pretty compelling. Its not so far behind Unforgiven in terms of drama, even if it lacks it's shock factor.

Mister Six

Not a film, but the TV show Deadwood remains one of the greatest works of Old West film-making ever. Well shot, well acted and jaw-droppingly well written. It's resolutely brutal and realistic, though - not like yer John Waynes or even many of the grittier Eastwood films - and is very slow-paced at times. Gripping stuff if you let it carry you away though.

Ignatius_S

Some great selections there. As well as The Naked Spur, all of the Mann/Stewart Western collaborations are essential viewing – great films all, which massively influenced the genre.

Ones like Peckinpah are worth watching.

An unusual one, The Shooting is a very interesting film – stars Warren Oates and a young Jack Nicholson co-stars.

Open Range is a recent one and one that I thought was very good. Costner co-stars and directs, but is happy to play second fiddle to Robert Duvall (a friend told me that the latter thought this was one of the best performances he has given as an actor.)

Another Eastwood one I would strongly recommend (although it's more Southern Gothic set in the Civil War) is The Beguiled – brilliant.

I would certainly say that Westerns directed by Eastwood are a must, but overall, there are far better films out there – I think it was  Patrick McGilligan's biography that very nicely critiqued them.

Quote from: Famous Mortimer on January 01, 2011, 08:23:02 AM
You could always point your brother in the direction of Alex Cox's "10,000 Ways To Die", which is all about spaghetti westerns and if it's as much fun to read as Cox's other book it should be a blast. Talking of which, I discover he's done a remastered, re-edited version of "Straight To Hell" which is coming out soon.
I haven't read it myself, but I bought a copy for a friend and it's a good, very personal viewpoint with some very interesting information. From what I remember my friend said, it's written in a chronological order and he found it better to dip into, rather than reading cover to cover.

The book is based on another book he wrote about 30 years ago and I think is still available as a free PDF on Cox's site. Also, there are PDFs of the booklets he wrote from Moviedrome – well, worth a look as a few very interesting Westerns (e.g. Face to Face) are mentioned.

Quote from: Ginyard on January 03, 2011, 11:25:41 PM
I really enjoyed 3:10 to Yuma. Bale and Crowe worked great together and I found the whole thing pretty compelling. Its not so far behind Unforgiven in terms of drama, even if it lacks it's shock factor.
If you haven't seen it, check out the original – Feralkid is right!
.

Claude the Racecar Driving Rockstar Super Sleuth

I wouldn't say it's a classic, but Seraphim Falls is another recent one that's worth a look. It seems to have been overshadowed by 3:10 to Yuma, which was released not long after it, as I recall. If you've read any reviews of it, you'll no doubt be aware that it takes an odd turn towards the end, though it's hardly detrimental in my opinion. For the most part however it's a grippingly brutal, pared down film - the sort of thing that Walter Hill might have made - with Pierce Brosnan on the run from a vengeful Liam Neeson. There's some lovely location photography, from snowy mountains down to a scorching desert and it's a great film with which to play spot the character actor.

alcoholic messiah

I'm quite fond of The Quick and the Dead. It's out-and-out popcorn fare, but then that's obviously what Sam Raimi and co were aiming for, and there's still an art to executing such a film well.

We're given enough reason to care about the three protagonists, their motivations are clearly established, and we're aware of what's at stake for each of them. There are plenty of memorable and inventive sequences, and the tension is built expertly as the film progresses, before delivering a satisfying climax.

The film also brought together its stars at opportune points in their careers. Sharon Stone was arguably at the peak of her powers (Casino hit the cinemas the same year). Leonardo DiCaprio was still firmly in possession of his baby-faced charm (I've never really found his performances believable since he graduated to playing grown-ups). I've never quite bought Russell Crowe's elevation to leading-man status in Hollywood, but in this (and in L.A. Confidential two years later) he's superb in a supporting capacity. Gene Hackman's great in it too, but then he usually is.

Groodle

How old is your brother? Packinpah's Bring Me the Head of Alfredo Garcia is a sort of modern semi-Western that has a lot going for it. It's about a guy's attempt to collect a bounty on someone who is already dead, he digs up their corpse and carries their head around in a fly-covered sack for much of the film. A fun, nasty movie younger folk might like. Also the only film cut as Peckinpah intended.

I've always felt Peckinpah's Pat Garrett & Billy the Kid and Robert Altman's McCabe & Mrs. Miller were fine, underappreciated movies.

Ignatius_S

Quote from: alcoholic messiah on January 05, 2011, 11:14:27 PM
I'm quite fond of The Quick and the Dead. It's out-and-out popcorn fare, but then that's obviously what Sam Raimi and co were aiming for....
Not according to the screenwriter, who gives a very interesting account of the making in The Guerrilla Film Makers Handbook.

Additionally, according to him, Raimi lacked any noticeable control on the proceedings with Hackman completely dominating, studio interference and the finished result obviously very different to the original vision.

Quote from: Groodle on January 06, 2011, 12:03:31 AM
...I've always felt Peckinpah's Pat Garrett & Billy the Kid and Robert Altman's McCabe & Mrs. Miller were fine, underappreciated movies.
Both very good films and ones that I would say are very highly regarded, particularly Altman's.

Groodle

Quote from: Ignatius_S on January 06, 2011, 01:08:22 AMBoth very good films and ones that I would say are very highly regarded, particularly Altman's.

The reputations of both films have grown with time, I'd say.