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Rubbish cast... Amazing film

Started by Johnny Townmouse, February 21, 2011, 12:18:45 PM

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Johnny Townmouse

Those films that succeed despite having a god-awful cast. I think there can be exemptions made for those films that have a majority rubbish cast. For me Blue Velvet is a film that succeeds despite its cast, not because of them. Yes, Stockwell and Hopper are marvellous and on top form, but that only make up so much of the film. I like Rossellini on screen, but she is not a terribly good actress. However, Kyle MacLachlan and Laura Dern are possibly two of the worst actors in Hollywood history. For me they suck any enjoyment of the drama from the screen. Despite that, the film manages to succeed, almost as if their hammy performances give the film a surreal charm.

I would also put forward Blade Runner as a film that should not work but does. For me the presence of Ford, Hauer or Young is the kiss of death for a film (yep, can't stand Ford). However, I really do adore this film, and feel that it benefits greatly from Ford's oddly detached inability to act.

Jemble Fred

I saw someone last week mention that the Thor film will be crap because it should have been made 20 years ago, and starred Rutger Hauer. I can't think of anything worse. I find the dear old Guinness-flogger a likeable cove, but he's a hook-nosed, lantern-jawed lizard of a man, he'd be a better Loki than Thor.

Johnny Townmouse

I was sat opposite him in a pub in covent garden a few years ago. At first I thought "oooh! rutger hauer!" and then I quickily changed that to, "oh, rutger haur."

People seem to be creaming themselves over the new Thor trailer, which is confusing because it makes the film look utterly shite, and horribly dated.

Speaking of people who should have been in films - the fact that they never made A Confederacy of Dunces whilst John Candy was alive gives me some heartache.

Small Man Big Horse

Quote from: Johnny Townmouse on February 21, 2011, 12:18:45 PM
I would also put forward Blade Runner as a film that should not work but does. For me the presence of Ford, Hauer or Young is the kiss of death for a film (yep, can't stand Ford). However, I really do adore this film, and feel that it benefits greatly from Ford's oddly detached inability to act.

I'm increasingly noticing how poor Ford is, it's strange as I loved him as a kid due to Star Wars and Indiana Jones, but I was rewatching A New Hope the other week and despite him pulling off the odd decent line, I found him quite flat and a lot less likable than when I was younger.

Ja'moke

Quote from: Johnny Townmouse on February 21, 2011, 12:18:45 PM
However, Kyle MacLachlan and Laura Dern are possibly two of the worst actors in Hollywood history. For me they suck any enjoyment of the drama from the screen.

What?!!! I strongly disagree with that, I think Laura Dern is utterly fantastic. She may be bland in Jurassic fucking Park, but for me she gets a life time pass for her performances in Wild At Heart and Inland Empire, especially the latter in which she is juggling various styles and tones.

I'd argue that Kyle MacLachlan also deserves a life-time pass for Agent Dale Cooper, but to be fair, since Twin Peaks he hasn't done much to rave over.

Lord Mandrake

The cast of the Matrix is quite offputting on paper.

MacLachlan's an oddly wooden and "not there" actor, but presumably that's exactly what Lynch is looking for. The only place it don't work is a blockbuster like Dune.

Doomy Dwyer

I watched 'Seven' (or 'Se7en' if you're some sort of cunt) the other night for the first time since its release back in the nineties. Thoroughly enjoyed it despite the presence of Brad Pitt and Gwinnie Paltrow.
Spoiler alert
It helps that she is decapitated in the end, of course
[close]
. I suppose the fact that Pitt's portraying a shit thick pretty boy shitehawk plays to his strengths. Plus it's got Morgan Freeman doing the first of his many wise, world-weary old men roles, the mighty R Lee Emery and of course
Spoiler alert
Kevin Spacey
[close]
[nb]I'll spoiler this, but if you haven't managed to see it by now, you really should get your arse in gear.[/nb] at his most distainful, which easily outweighs the charisma void caused by the bland beauty of Pitt and Paltrow.

Couldn't agree more about 'Bladerunner' Johnny Townmouse. Ford is such a wooden actor I'm surprised he hasn't made himself into a chest of drawers, what with him being a carpenter prior to becoming an actor in some of the highest grossing blockbusters in movie history. That 'quip' doesn't work on any level at all, but I feel compelled to type it due to some deep seated self loathing I am temporarily experiencing. I would like to apologise for any distress this may have caused.

CaledonianGonzo

Harrison Ford is an awful, shambling mess of an actor in this day and age, but I'll defend his peak period until I'm blue in the face.  In films like Raiders of the Lost Ark and the Empire Strikes Back, he's probably my favourite screen presence ever.  If not the best actor of the time period, then certainly the best movie star.

Cerys

From what I remember of The Mosquito Coast, he played a blinder.

Johnny Townmouse

Quote from: Ja'moke on February 21, 2011, 01:49:50 PM
What?!!! I strongly disagree with that, I think Laura Dern is utterly fantastic. She may be bland in Jurassic fucking Park, but for me she gets a life time pass for her performances in Wild At Heart and Inland Empire, especially the latter in which she is juggling various styles and tones.

I'd argue that Kyle MacLachlan also deserves a life-time pass for Agent Dale Cooper, but to be fair, since Twin Peaks he hasn't done much to rave over.

For me she is second only to Patricia Arquette in terms of awfulness. Arquette's performance in The Secret Agent is one of the abominable performances of all time. I think Dern does a great turn in Inland Empire, but I'm less convinced by her in Wild at Heart. I find her acting similar to Laura Linney - it's not wooden, but I just don't buy it.

MacLachlan's impression of a detective being freaked out in a 1950s B-movie is spot-on, and works wonderfully for Twin Peaks. But by the lords of xanadu, he is a fucking atrocious actor. His CV entirely represents his awfulness.

On the subject of Arquette (well, I brought her up anyway), her presence in True Romance is second in shittiness only to Slater, whom I cannot stand. I didn't nominate that film in this thread because I think it is a bad film with a 50/50 dogshit/genius cast. Yes, THAT scene is great, if only it took place in a different film.

non capisco

Quote from: Johnny Townmouse on February 21, 2011, 12:35:56 PM
Speaking of people who should have been in films - the fact that they never made A Confederacy of Dunces whilst John Candy was alive gives me some heartache.

Or when Philip Seymour Hoffman was younger.

Shoulders?-Stomach!

I like Ford, particularly young Ford but boy, his performance in Blade Runner may as well not even exist. It's not necessarily his fault. Ridley Scott seems determined not to actually develop a single character in that entire film (which I quite like, still).

A lot of Christopher Nolan's films squander a great cast by being so completely plot-led the characters barely get a look-in.

non capisco

Quote from: CaledonianGonzo on February 21, 2011, 02:16:49 PM
Harrison Ford is an awful, shambling mess of an actor in this day and age, but I'll defend his peak period until I'm blue in the face.  In films like Raiders of the Lost Ark and the Empire Strikes Back, he's probably my favourite screen presence ever.  If not the best actor of the time period, then certainly the best movie star.

Raiders Of The Lost Ark is still my favourite film ever and Ford is perfect in it. The bit where he's getting pissed up with that monkey after he thinks Marion has been blown up and his subsequent bleary death wish meeting with Belloq is something I could happily watch on repeat for hours. I don't know if this was a fluke or not, to be honest he's a bit rubbish even in the other inferior Indiana Jones films. Harrison Ford being a ropey actor is something I've always suspected even as a kid but it's something it takes you a long while to admit if you love Indy and Han Solo as much as most boys who were pre-pubescent in the 80s and rightly considered those two characters the acme of cool. That stupid earring he wears is probably what did for him.

An tSaoi

Quote from: Shoulders?-Stomach! on February 22, 2011, 12:54:08 AM
Ridley Scott seems determined not to actually develop a single character in that entire film (which I quite like, still).

Roy Batty develops surely?
Spoiler alert
He goes from being a killer to saving Deckard's life at the end.
[close]
It's a basic transformation, but it's there.

Shoulders?-Stomach!

That's more or less in the screenplay though. And I really really rate Rutger Hauer in that period- he doesn't get enough screentime in that film. Such a complex and intriguing performance and seemingly about 10 minutes to perform in. A shame.


Phil_A

I think in his younger days, Ford got by on a huge amount of charisma. He may've not've been the greatest actor of his generation, but he brought so much charm to his roles that you didn't notice. Whereas these days, it's like he can't even be bothered to be charming any more. I get the impression he's basically going through the motions as his career gradually winds down to retirement.


Shoulders?-Stomach!

His facial expressions in fight scenes are superb. I think the b-movie qualities of Indiana Jones are in large part to do with his incredibly cartoon-like variety of yelps and grimaces.

CaledonianGonzo

Quote from: Phil_A on February 22, 2011, 02:33:51 AM
I think in his younger days, Ford got by on a huge amount of charisma. He may've not've been the greatest actor of his generation, but he brought so much charm to his roles that you didn't notice.

Undoubtedly - it's the difference between a movie star and a character actor.  You'd say the same for something like Sean Connery in peak period James Bond.