Main Menu

Tip jar

If you like CaB and wish to support it, you can use PayPal or KoFi. Thank you, and I hope you continue to enjoy the site - Neil.

Buy Me a Coffee at ko-fi.com

Support CaB

Recent

Welcome to Cook'd and Bomb'd. Please login or sign up.

March 28, 2024, 04:55:18 PM

Login with username, password and session length

Kill List

Started by CaledonianGonzo, September 02, 2011, 02:32:20 PM

Previous topic - Next topic

Johnny Townmouse

I would assume it was emperor's new clothes, were it not for the fact that people seem to be genuinely unnerved and disturbed by this film - something that is such a visceral and honest reaction that I've become sure I am missing something. Some people find The Shining boring and completely unscary, so I appreciate it can be very subjective.

I'm going to watch it again next week on my new super-duper massive HD TV with surround sound to see if my mind has changed. Perhaps the scene with the woman scrawling on the back of the mirror will seem less laughable.

checkoutgirl

Quote from: clingfilm portent on November 11, 2012, 12:57:25 PM
But the only thing worth pondering about Kill List is what the fuck people think is so special about it.

I don't know what is so special about it, it's a film for fuck sake, it's not going to change your life. If you find out what is so special about it can you let me know so that I can get on with the rest of my life ? Thanks.

I liked the film because when I went to see it, it actually made me feel something other than boredom and mild irritation. I felt dread and unease, in a thrilling way. Unease during the dinner scene, dread as the two guys got further and further into a murky underworld. Top quality acting, nice direction and a very unsettling score made for a very satisfying experience for me. If you think it was unremarkable then very well done to you, you have spotted all the major weaknesses in the film that eluded me. Excellent work my son, I think you deserve a nice cigar and a brandy.

BlodwynPig

Well said, Checkoutgirl, a more reasoned and erudite paragraph I could not hope to write.

(Also removes tongue from your arsefish).

Lord Mandrake

Quote from: BlodwynPig on November 11, 2012, 10:49:44 AM
So off the mark - cuntish film? No, that would be Lock Stock and those type of films. Nasty - some bits, but fitting the characters desperate pent up fury.

Fair enough, its not for you, but don't damn the bugger without watching it all.

BlodwynPig

Was there an edit or comment to that quote?

CaledonianGonzo

I needn't have been so scared after all.

I can see why it splits opinion - a third reel like that is always going to be divisive.  I'm sort of torn.  I certainly don't demand a story that runs from A to B to C and is served up with a deft storytelling cherry on top, but that doesn't stop the way this particular denouement was served up being a bit hamfisted.

Fine, three stars, wouldn't put me off watching Sightseers this time next year when it's on Film 4.

SteveDave

I'm unsure as to why people kept Twooting that it was on Film 4 last night when it's been £2 in every CEX I've been to for the last 6 months.

I didn't like it.

CaledonianGonzo

Then viewing it last night on Film 4 saved me a 'crisp' £2.

BlodwynPig


Mini

When I saw Sightseers Ben Wheatley did a Q&A in which he joked that the end of Kill List wasn't depressing at all because "he wins a hat."

samadriel

Quote from: checkoutgirl on October 30, 2012, 01:47:11 PM
That's the problem with the internet and the modrin wurld, everyone's a fucking critic all of a sudden. If they don't understand every single piece of a film then it's pants and pointless. They don't seem to pause to consider that maybe they are too thick to understand what the film is about (Kill List) or maybe the director didn't want every single detail to be completely explained and more will be revealed in the sequel (Prometheus).

Prometheus didn't have unanswered questions so much as huge disfiguring holes.  The only question burning to be answered was "Why is this film so incoherent?"

Nobody Soup

I watched this, it was horrible and I left the room during the hammer bit. I guess though it was ok, it did unsettle me a lot. It did get a bit daft though and I kinda felt the lack of an explanation to what was happening was because it would have just seemed more daft. I didn't like the end, it seemed more plain nasty and manipulative than disturbing.

BlodwynPig

What films have you been watching all your lives? Hannah Montana?

The reason I like it so much is that I want to be with the two protagonists at the end, but escape.

CaledonianGonzo

The thought of spending any more time with the protagonists than necessary doesn't appeal, to be honest, even if the main bloke looks oddly like my cousin.

Though I did enjoy it when the angry couple took a break from their furious arguing to do this:



I was also torn right out the film's reality when a bloke my wife went to Uni with turned up as one of the murder victims on the list.

BlodwynPig

That Pic is interesting - it mimics the final scene exactly - hmmmm - was it all a dream?

Tiny Poster

Well thanks for the spoilers!

awesom_o

It had it's moments, but I just found it too bleak. What made it worse was that one scene was filmed quite near my house, and a few others were on my drive to work.
Not really sure why, but it also reminded me of Divvies from Harry Enfield
http://m.youtube.com/#/watch?v=CsVkBfnxQ_g&desktop_uri=%2Fwatch%3Fv%3DCsVkBfnxQ_g&gl=GB

Nobody Soup

Quote from: BlodwynPig on November 12, 2012, 06:51:08 PM
What films have you been watching all your lives? Hannah Montana?

I make no apologies as to be a huge wuss when it comes to graphic violence.

the ending is a bit of like
Spoiler alert
a serbian film
[close]
, which obviously I haven't watched and never, ever will, but I did read the plot on wikipedia and still found horrendously shocking.

BlodwynPig

Quote from: Nobody Soup on November 12, 2012, 09:06:57 PM
I make no apologies as to be a huge wuss when it comes to graphic violence.

the ending is a bit of like
Spoiler alert
a serbian film
[close]
, which obviously I haven't watched and never, ever will, but I did read the plot on wikipedia and still found horrendously shocking.

A hardly think the rape of a baby (haven't seen Serbian Film but I think that is what I read happens) is comparable to the ending of Kill List, which is more like Box of Delights.

Nobody Soup

I think that happens but in the middle or summit, in the end they trick him into
Spoiler alert
raping his son by disguising him as an enemy or something in some manner, which is sort of the same as being tricked into killing your son
[close]

Mini

Even if a similar thing happens in both films I'm not sure that makes them comparable. It's about context isn't it?

DukeDeMondo

#81
POSSIBLE SPOILERS

They're comparable in a few ways. Very similar endings, as has been pointed out. Plus, both are about family men going back to jobs they don't want to really go back to because they feel inadequate as, like, pure, y'know, Men an' that, and also as providers, fathers, this sort of thing. In both cases the men are being manipulated by diabolical puppet master sorts into committing all kinds of atrocities for the good of a greater project, which the protagonist knows nothing about, and which culminates in events of the class discussed above (in a bit too much detail, maybe, outside of the spoiler boxes?). Additionally, both are films about masculinity that pivot upon truly grotesque, perverse depictions of such, and they share an air of swelling, stifling, demented menace that bleeds out from the scenes depicting the "normal life" and finally gives way to sickening violence and gut-punch twistery.

Kill List is undoubtedly the better film, but
Spoiler alert
A Serbian Film
[close]
is far from the picture that a few out-of-context scene descriptions would lead you to believe. Far, far closer in execution and tone to something like Oldboy than something like Grotesque or Captivity or whatever else folk who hadn't seen it were embarrassing themselves by comparing it to shortly before release. One spectacularly loaf-headed article that appeared in the Guardian at the time still has me cringing myself awake every so often.

But then The Guardian's film section is truly abysmal most of the time anyway. Especially where so-called "genre" films are concerned. If you know 89% of your readers are never going to watch the things you're mouthing on about, then not only do you not really have to watch them either, but you can say whatever you want so long as it broadly chimes with what that 89% are likely to have already thought before they ever clicked on the link. Something about "torture porn," something about "how I wish they were being ironic," something about shitty acting. Something about "So bad it's good," something about "tired franchise." That'll do. What film is it? Fuck knows. Something a bit green, looks like. You're not going to watch it, the fuck do you care? Take my word for it.

(A very similar problem I have with some of Charlie Brooker's Wipe/Burn stuff, but that's another thread.)

Noodle Lizard

'A Serbian Film' isn't actually a bad film by any means.  People describe it as if it's a pseudo-snuff film or something along the lines of the August Underground flicks, and it's not.  From a visual standpoint, I'd argue that it actually looks a lot better than a lot of Hollywood horror/gore films (fake dongs aside).

I don't actually know if I'd say 'Kill List' is "undoubtedly" the better film either.  I mean, it probably is, but there are certain things I prefer about 'A Serbian Film'.

DukeDeMondo

Quote from: Noodle Lizard on November 13, 2012, 04:29:30 AM
From a visual standpoint, I'd argue that it actually looks a lot better than a lot of Hollywood horror/gore films (fake dongs aside).

Agreed, definitely. And I'm not even sure how much of a horror film it is, regardless of All That Horror. If it is, it's a horror film in the way that Irreversible, or, again, Oldboy, or Twentynine Palms is a horror film.

Noodle Lizard

Quote from: DukeDeMondo on November 13, 2012, 04:52:00 AM
Agreed, definitely. And I'm not even sure how much of a horror film it is, regardless of All That Horror. If it is, it's a horror film in the way that Irreversible, or, again, Oldboy, or Twentynine Palms is a horror film.

It's hard to categorise films like these.  I tend to just call them "extreme", but then I always feel like this guy:


DukeDeMondo

Quote from: Noodle Lizard on November 13, 2012, 04:59:25 AM
It's hard to categorise films like these.  I tend to just call them "extreme", but then I always feel like this guy:

Ha! Fantastic.

I mean "awesome."


Johnny Townmouse

Not that anyone cares (nor should you) but I gave this film another go last night. I thought that perhaps watching it on my laptop screen may not have been quite so effective as on a big TV with aurround sound, in the dark.

I was partially right. There are some huge problems with this film, but it did manage to get under my skin and I did feel a growing feeling of dread as it progressed. In many ways that doesn't make sense, because on second watch I am constantly aware of the rather underwhelming pay-off, and the fact that most of the hanging threads never get pulled. You would imagine that the knowledge of the end would completely negate any sense of suspense, but there was something about the tone that worked better on rewatching.

I still struggle with the Alan Clarke style realism, and the use of an iffy digital camera which makes it hard to really immerse myself into the story. The ending again looked ridiculous to me (although there is one yelp from the boy that, in context, is genuinely unpleasant), and I find the whole third act to be a weird combination of high-concept action and surreal realism that really puts me off. It is so Hot Fuzz that I just find myself sighing.

However, it is quite a brave film, and it hard to know how they could have finished it without becoming caught up in properly unsatisfying, neat plot conclusions. So, for instance, perhaps these culty types were people who were affected by the Kiev fuck-up, or the protagonist was brainwashed by the military and is just carrying out things on their behalf, or the friend has engineered the entire situation, or the protagonist himself is controlling everthing without him realising (something that is alluded to). Any kind of resolution was always going to be a let-down and I can see why Wheatley went a different route. In many ways it is an exercise in restrained tension building and the creation of a narrative through mood, tone and lots of foreshadowing, and I was impressed by the scene near the beginning when the family are playfighting:



I think I also watched it originally after a huge amount of hype in the mainstream press, and my expectations were unreasonably astronomic. If I had watched this with no fan-fare at a Frightfest all-nighter I think I would have been extremely impressed.

It's a film with too many problems to make me recommend it, but a second watch definitely changed my mind about it, and I found myself genuinely unnerved by some of its content. I would urge those who really dislike it to give it another go.

Noodle Lizard

Quote from: Johnny Townmouse on November 13, 2012, 12:33:41 PMIt is so Hot Fuzz that I just find myself sighing.

In fairness, that is exactly what came to my mind once the naked fire ritual thing got going.

BlodwynPig

Sigh.

You have to admit the sound elements for the final act are great - like a Ben Frost album.

Nobody Soup

what is the song at the end by the way? and who did the score, I forgot to mention that I really did like the music.