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Dizzy: Prince of the Yolkfolk

Started by Jerzy Bondov, December 09, 2011, 05:52:36 PM

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Jerzy Bondov

They send you back for all the coins in that one too!

madhair60

Quote from: Jerzy Bondov on December 12, 2011, 02:03:42 PM
They send you back for all the coins in that one too!

Christ.  I still count completing the item sequence as "winning".  I refuse to go back and try picking up every bit of scenery.

Phil_A

Quote from: Jerzy Bondov on December 12, 2011, 02:03:42 PM
They send you back for all the coins in that one too!

Oh man. As a kid, I must've spent weeks trying to find the last hidden coin. And then I did, and the ending
Spoiler alert
was rubbish.
[close]

Jerzy Bondov

All endings
Spoiler alert
were rubbish
[close]
then, just as they almost always are now. When I was playing Dizzy games the first time, they were just about the only games I had, and it'd be months and months before I'd be allowed another one. I had to finish them, or I'd be forced to go and read a bloody book or go outside or something. I'm sure I wasn't the only one. And yet, all games had shit endings.

Now I'll get to the boring coin hunt in a game and give up because I've got a pile of other games to have a bash at and another one coming in the post in a couple of days. I'm sure I'm not the only one. Fewer people see the endings, and so they are all shit. "Found all the penguins, did you? Well fuck off!"

Replies From View

Quote from: I accept the terms of the on December 09, 2011, 05:56:40 PM
It looks utterly shit. How have they managed to make Dizzy look so shit? Some of the surroundings and other characters look okay, so why does the main part of the game look worse than the ZX Spectrum original?

Also, who the fuck thought that scrolling was necessary?

I was hoping for a two-finger swipe, ala Monkey Island, to switch from this new graphic style to the classic spectrum one.  Unfortunately it doesn't look like they've thought of this.

Spectrum for me, anyway (the correct way to experience Dizzy up until Crystal Kingdom Dizzy which is so appalling on the Spectrum that it has to be viewed on a 16 bit machine - Amiga being my fave for that).  Here's a question:  if you could have Dizzy in any "classic" graphic style, which system would it be for you?

Replies From View

Quote from: Phil_A on December 09, 2011, 06:37:39 PM
Mind you, at least in that one you had multiple lives and an energy bar, not like in Treasure Island where one touch of an enemy/spike/torch = instant game over. Who thought that was a good idea?

I gather that this was a compromise they had to make because of some other bug that had appeared in the game that couldn't be resolved.  Something like respawning outside of the water and the snorkel being left underneath or something.

Replies From View

#36
Quote from: Jerzy Bondov on December 09, 2011, 10:24:24 PM
You could drop the items anywhere, but the bigger the games got, the more likely you were to say 'fuck it' when you realised that you'd left the key you needed on the other side of a mean scary dragon forty screens away.

This is one reason the Spectrum was so brilliant.  A lot of emotional energy had been invested in the game even loading from the tape in the first place - much less likely to give up in a tantrum.  Back past the dragon to that key you would go.

Do you have a most fondly-remembered Dizzy game?  Fantasy World Dizzy, for me.  The first one I encountered as a 9 year old at a friend's house, and we took it in turns but never did complete it.  There was a sense of massive achievement reached by getting past that dragon with the sleeping potion.  One of those obstacles where in order to progress even slightly to the right of the map, you need to get an object on the very furthest left of the map first.  And then all of a sudden the world opens up:  falling down the well and discovering a storekeeper in an upside down world, a hole in your pocket where you drop your inventory... fantastic stuff.

Another thing I really liked - compared to the first two games, more or less every threat in Fantasy World Dizzy takes up one screen and is its own puzzle to be overcome, and it's not so much a matter of constantly trying not to bump into things.  It was the last game created by the Oliver Twins, and after them I did enjoy Magicland Dizzy (first game with an energy bar), and the nice short Dizzy 3.5 which was free on a tape.

Replies From View

Quote from: Sexton Brackets Drugbust on December 10, 2011, 02:40:21 PM
As the greatest game character ever, what is Dizzy's main character trait?

Is it that he is an egg?

It is that he is fucking awesome.

Also it is because he is available at an actual friend's house, whereas Mario and Sonic are on the consoles of people who are nasty to you, or are experienced in Eric Snook's Toyshop with loads of horrible people looking over your shoulder thinking you're showing off, when actually you're not you're just trying it out which is why you're doing so badly.

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#38
Quote from: I accept the terms of the on December 10, 2011, 04:16:27 PM
Also, the modern version hasn't also missed a fucking fundamental game design lesson: The levels in Dizzy were designed around the mechanics of the character on that platform. If you're going to fuck with them you're going to end up with levels that either look or feel wrong unless you redesign them. Twats.

See also:  Crystal Kingdom Dizzy on the Spectrum.  All of a sudden Dizzy spun three times per jump rather than twice, making him appear faster (as if to evoke the then-fashionable Sonic), and he could be controlled as he fell through the air.  He lost that egg-like tumbling, and along with their failure to animate a forward-facing jump (they only bothered with left and right facing animations) suddenly it just didn't feel like Dizzy anymore.

Replies From View

Quote from: MojoJojo on December 11, 2011, 09:26:28 PM
I'd also point out that the price being asked for Dizzy Prince Of The Yolkfolk is at least half, probably a 5th of it's original price. Not sure of the exact detail.

No no, surely not - not unless you're taking inflation into account.  Wasn't it released in a bundle with other games - Dizzy's Eggcellent Adventures or something - because it was such a short game compared to the other Dizzy ones?  Standalone Dizzy games were otherwise about £2.99, until Crystal Kingdom came along and was unfathomably £10.99 or thereabouts.

Anyway that's a lot of posts for me because I only just realised this thread was happening.  I was keen to get the iPhone game but I won't do so now because of your feedback.  Sounds buggy and the updated graphics are what I was dreading.  All that's really needed is a decent spectrum emulator with controls that can cope with pixel-perfect platform action and we'd be sorted.

Jemble Fred

Well it's up to you, of course, but if you're a Dizzy fan I can't see the sense in not giving it a go, as such an important permutation of the franchise. It's worth supporting it to see where it could go from here, whether there could be new Dizzy adventures, and of course whether they will fix some of the gripes already mentioned on this thread next time around. If you just boycott it, there may never be another time around. Although I understand it's proving quite popular anyway

madhair60

Right, stuck on Treasure Island now.  Will persevere.

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#42
Sorry, a double post.

Replies From View

Quote from: Jemble Fred on December 12, 2011, 10:08:37 PM
Well it's up to you, of course, but if you're a Dizzy fan I can't see the sense in not giving it a go, as such an important permutation of the franchise. It's worth supporting it to see where it could go from here, whether there could be new Dizzy adventures, and of course whether they will fix some of the gripes already mentioned on this thread next time around. If you just boycott it, there may never be another time around. Although I understand it's proving quite popular anyway

I did actually buy it after posting that anyway.  Played it and completed it quite quickly.  There were a couple of bugs (for example it took ages
Spoiler alert
to position the cheese in the right place for it to trigger the event of capturing Pogie
[close]
) but other than that I had no problems.  The controls were fine, though it took me a while to appreciate the new ability to hang from platforms.  This new feature means that sometimes a jump is interrupted by a platform that is at head height as you're jumping; you lose your trajectory and end up falling between the platforms you were attempting to jump across.

I think the new graphic style will grow on me, as long as the "feel" is right.  I'd be happy if, as with the original Dizzy games, the graphics and Dizzy's abilities change slightly as the series progresses.  And for newcomers it makes perfect sense that they release Prince of the Yolkfolk first.  It was never my favourite Dizzy game (the world wasn't quite mysterious enough for me - a bit more mundane as a fairytale setting) but it's small, the puzzles are straightforward enough to get people onboard, and the cherries are visible rather than hidden behind scenery.  As the 6th Dizzy game I found it disappointing, but as an introduction to the series it works quite well.

I really hope this is a success and they release more.  Treasure Island, Fantasy World and Magicland are the ones.  Not too fussed about Spellbound (too much fucking trampolining and rock-collecting) or Crystal Kingdom (which wanted to be epic but offered nothing new to the franchise).  They should release Dizzy 2, 3 and 4, then some new ones.  Or new ones in between those classic ones.

Does anyone here have a soft spot for Dizzy 1?  I've never been able to connect with it, for some reason.

I accept the terms of the

Yes, but only because of its eerie atmosphere and great little musical stings.

Also, The Green Eye of the Yellow God.

I'll never complete the fucker. Doesn't matter. Don't need to.

I have no interest in playing a Dizzy game on a platform that isn't the Spectrum. The charm comes from it being developed to fit that machine. Powering up the graphics does nothing, and I don't understand how anybody could think it does.

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Quote from: I accept the terms of the on December 12, 2011, 11:18:35 PM
I have no interest in playing a Dizzy game on a platform that isn't the Spectrum. The charm comes from it being developed to fit that machine. Powering up the graphics does nothing, and I don't understand how anybody could think it does.

A lot of people grew up with it on other machines, though.  And certainly by Crystal Kingdom Dizzy it was clear that the Spectrum had been abandoned, and that Dizzy was being made specifically for 16 bit machines.

It's fairly clear to me that the Spectrum is the way to experience Fantasy World Dizzy, as this is the system on which I encountered it as a 9 year old at my best friend's house, at an age when I'd never encountered any other computer games before.  When I was a bit older (maybe 15 years old) I retrospectively discovered the 16 bit version of Fantasy World Dizzy and it was shit.  Whereas I think the original 16 bit versions of Magicland Dizzy and Prince of the Yolkfolk are perfectly within the spirit of the Spectrum originals.  They have the same physics, and in some cases (eg the removal of obstacles like bats going annoyingly back and forth) I think they tidy things up to their advantage.

I accept the terms of the

Crystal Kingdom doesn't count, nothing about it is good.

Tragic tale: I first saw Dizzy through a walkthrough of Magicland Dizzy in a magazine. I thought that it looked brilliant. I had to have a Dizzy game. When the time game to go to WH Smiths and buy one, there was only one on the shelves. Fine. Didn't matter. I just wanted to jump around and have adventures.

Panic Dizzy.

Replies From View

Quote from: I accept the terms of the on December 12, 2011, 11:48:36 PM
Crystal Kingdom doesn't count, nothing about it is good.

Tragic tale: I first saw Dizzy through a walkthrough of Magicland Dizzy in a magazine. I thought that it looked brilliant. I had to have a Dizzy game. When the time game to go to WH Smiths and buy one, there was only one on the shelves. Fine. Didn't matter. I just wanted to jump around and have adventures.

Panic Dizzy.

Ah, bum.  I always thought it was rotten the way they could use the Dizzy name on things like Pac-man clones.  The character should have been reserved for his own adventure games only.

What do you think of Spellbound?

I accept the terms of the

Didn't play it until I was an adult, didn't like it.

I don't really like Treasure Island much. It doesn't feel right.

Replies From View

Quote from: I accept the terms of the on December 12, 2011, 11:52:44 PM
Didn't play it until I was an adult, didn't like it.

I don't really like Treasure Island much. It doesn't feel right.

Same here on both counts.  I encountered Treasure Island Dizzy a little after I had got into Fantasy World as a 9 year old.  It was on a box set or something, and it seemed excitingly advanced, in that you could go underwater, and yet the rotating inventory system and one life meant it felt a lot more primitive and I couldn't quite get into it.  I also didn't like the creatures going back and forth that you'd die from touching.  Fantasy World just seemed a lot more advanced in the way it took puzzles forward rather than featuring creatures that you need to constantly be waiting for every time.  I fondly recall the "redness" of Treasure Island, though.  The treehouse complex and lots of other things are very red compared to Fantasy World and I for some reason liked that.

Spellbound I encountered as an adult, tried it out for nostalgia reasons but the difference in the way it all felt (injuries sustained by falling from a great height, as well as the ugly animations whenever Dizzy was injured or ate anything), just emphasised that I didn't recognise what I was seeing.  I could only take so much of the trampolining and rock collecting before I gave up; so boring.

Jerzy Bondov

16-bit Fantasy World looked weird. Dizzy had a hat on. I never had any idea that the Spectrum versions existed though, so the way he looks in 16-bit Magicland is 'official' Dizzy to me. I've tried to go back and play them but they don't really sit right with me. Where's the blue skies?

I thought I'd played heaps of Dizzy games, but looking back I actually only had Treasure Island, Fantasy World, Magicland and Fantastic Dizzy of the proper ones, plus Fast Food and Kwik Snax. I think I might have to take a proper run at them all soon, though I can definitely see myself giving up on some of them without my dad coming up to my bedroom in the middle of the night to tell me he's worked out how to get past the big fuck-off rat in the well.

I accept the terms of the

Quote from: Replies From View on December 13, 2011, 12:03:30 AM
It was on a box set or something
Red one with a few of the adventure games and Fast Food?[nb]Fast Food was surprisingly excellent[/nb] That's the last thing I got for my Speccy before I dropped the PSU down the stairs and ended its life forever.

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Quote from: Jerzy Bondov on December 13, 2011, 12:05:28 AM
16-bit Fantasy World looked weird. Dizzy had a hat on. I never had any idea that the Spectrum versions existed though, so the way he looks in 16-bit Magicland is 'official' Dizzy to me. I've tried to go back and play them but they don't really sit right with me. Where's the blue skies?

It's one of those times where wonkiness is what makes it great, and years later the same limitations are what you recall fondly and they give you a nostalgic thrill.  Whether it's black backgrounds or colour-clash, I love it.

It wasn't just the hat that was wrong in 16 bit Fantasy World Dizzy.  All the details were horrible and Dizzy didn't spin at the right speed when he jumped.  Certain things make Dizzy and that was an example when it was messed with too much.

Quote from: Jerzy Bondov on December 13, 2011, 12:05:28 AM
I thought I'd played heaps of Dizzy games, but looking back I actually only had Treasure Island, Fantasy World, Magicland and Fantastic Dizzy of the proper ones, plus Fast Food and Kwik Snax. I think I might have to take a proper run at them all soon, though I can definitely see myself giving up on some of them without my dad coming up to my bedroom in the middle of the night to tell me he's worked out how to get past the big fuck-off rat in the well.

Does Dizzy 1 exist in a 16 bit version?

And what did you think of Fantastic Dizzy?  I encountered it as an adult and felt they were trying to make a "greatest hits" package within one massive game.  But I couldn't really be arsed with it, and Dizzy's sprite was horrible.

Replies From View

Quote from: I accept the terms of the on December 13, 2011, 12:11:26 AM
Red one with a few of the adventure games and Fast Food?[nb]Fast Food was surprisingly excellent[/nb] That's the last thing I got for my Speccy before I dropped the PSU down the stairs and ended its life forever.

Could well have been.  It wasn't mine.  It was two different friends who had Spectrums - the one who had Fantasy World Dizzy, who was my best friend, and another guy, maybe a year later, who wasn't really a massive friend but let me have a couple of goes on his system.  My memory was that he showed me Treasure Island (a very red game with a snorkel) and Magicland (a yellowish game with a shark and two ghosts in it), but I could be wrong.  I think I remembered Treasure Island being in the past tense because of the picture in the stairwell of Fantasy World, but I didn't really know the chronology and at the time the snorkel and being able to go underwater made it really quite intriguing.

I had another friend years later (secondary school age) who had an Atari ST.  I think it was him who showed me Dizzy 3.5, which I liked a lot despite its brevity.  If they never converted that for the ST then he must have had another system as well.

Jerzy Bondov

Quote from: Replies From View on December 13, 2011, 12:23:02 AMDoes Dizzy 1 exist in a 16 bit version?
Apparently not. I thought I saw an advert for it on a card from one of the other games, but that was probably a cruel tease for Atari ST owners. Like screenshots that looked amazing on the backs of boxes and said underneath 'Amiga gameplay shown', but in the other direction.
Quote from: Replies From View on December 13, 2011, 12:23:02 AMAnd what did you think of Fantastic Dizzy?  I encountered it as an adult and felt they were trying to make a "greatest hits" package within one massive game.  But I couldn't really be arsed with it, and Dizzy's sprite was horrible.
You're right about the 'greatest hits' aspect of it. I just had a look at its map and it appears I've muddled its underwater section up with that of Treasure Island. It's okay. I didn't like it at the time because it's got loads of spiders and snails and birds and all sorts of shit that you have to constantly dodge to get anywhere, and little minigames that feel quite out of place and cost you lives if you cock them up, which I did. Also it scrolls, though only horizontally. They put in a day/night cycle and weather, which is quite a nice touch. If a new Dizzy came out and was along the lines of Fantastic, I wouldn't grumble too much.

Jerzy Bondov

I just had a go on Magicland after God knows how long, and amazingly I can still stroll across the moat on the shark's fin as if it was nothing. Some things you don't forget.

Jemble Fred

Quote from: Replies From View on December 13, 2011, 12:23:02 AM
Does Dizzy 1 exist in a 16 bit version?

That's the only full Speccy game which never got remade, unless perhaps there's a fan version for PC.

When the games were being made my brother worked for Crash so I was jammy enough to play some of them at weird demo stages – especially Spellbound. I don't think Spellbound's boring at all, it just slightly jumps the shark toward the end perhaps when you have to build the kite.

Personal favourite would have to be Magicland, no question.

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Quote from: Jemble Fred on December 13, 2011, 12:39:47 AM
When the games were being made my brother worked for Crash so I was jammy enough to play some of them at weird demo stages – especially Spellbound. I don't think Spellbound's boring at all, it just slightly jumps the shark toward the end perhaps when you have to build the kite.

That's cool!  I remember encountering the free cut-down versions of Dizzy games that appeared on the covers of Crash magazines.  I don't know how many were done but I do recall ones for Dizzy 1 and 2, which had physical barriers preventing exploration of the full maps, and all the objects being in different places so that within the reduced space you could still complete certain puzzles.

I just think the pit puzzle of Spellbound gets old fast.  Too much repetition once I've already figured out what to do.  Many people consider Spellbound to be the best, though.  I probably just came to it too late.

Replies From View

Quote from: Jerzy Bondov on December 13, 2011, 12:39:29 AM
I just had a go on Magicland after God knows how long, and amazingly I can still stroll across the moat on the shark's fin as if it was nothing. Some things you don't forget.

The shark was a bit easier on the 16 bit versions, because it travelled at walking speed and you just had to land on it, keep walking and you'd get flipped towards the door as it turned around.  On the 8 bit versions, you had to keep jumping and timing was more critical.

To the right of the ghosts that you defeat with the power pill, those lily pads on the 8 bit versions were more horrible, as well.  They sank really fast and you'd drown unless you moved fast.  The 16 bit conversions dispensed with that difficulty.  And the bats which take energy off (which I may have said earlier).

madhair60

My first Dizzy experience, if memory serves, was my friend's vast Speccy collection - he had Dizzy 1 (which he could beat in a trice, astonishingly) as well as various spin-offs like Bubble Dizzy and Dizzy Down the Rapids.  I also remember him having something called Mine Cart Dizzy, but according to World of Spectrum that doesn't actually exist.  It may be that I'm muddling it with the similar minigame in Fantastic Dizzy, but I distinctly recall the boxart.

Speaking of Fantastic, I believe that was the next one I came across, on a friend's PC.  I remember finding it fascinating, but far too sprawling and hard.  Didn't beat it until years later, the Mega Drive version on an emulator with save states.  I can't imagine getting anywhere near finishing it without them, it was bloody cruel at times.  Actually, now that  I think about it, I may have played the NES version beforehand.

The first one I managed to beat was the PC port of Yolkfolk, funnily enough.  It's only about thirty screens, and the puzzles are quite logical compared with the others.  The only hard part is getting over the river initially, and that's a cakewalk now.

Treasure Island, on the other hand, is proving quite the cunt.