We're Nazis on the moon...

[brat-sampson]

Iron Sky  is being released in cinemas next week but only for a single day. It's immediately followed by a stripped down DVD/HD release and the film-makers are none-too chuffed about it...

Personally I'm going to see it with some friends but with mixed views as to how it'll go. Could be a fun time in the right crowd/state of mind (a few beers will probably help) or it could just try too hard and be a bit lame. We shall see. Either way it seems like a bit of a dick move on behalf of the distributors to not give the studio what they expected and give them barely any notice when they don't.

Obviously if I get back next week and the film sucked I'll probably care less.

[Neomod]

They could have cleaned up on a feature packed DVD as the background to the film is extensive.

Foot shooting exercise instead.

[The Region Legion]

Why would they "clean up" on a film no one has heard of that looks like a complete piece of shit?

[Neomod]

A rhetorical question no doubt.

[Mini]

I'll be seeing it and I'm optimistic, based on trailers and stuff Kermode has been saying

[The Region Legion]

A rhetorical question no doubt.

Nope, legitimate question. Terrible CGI, stupid b-movie plot about Nazis in space, no PR or any kind of word of mouth that I've heard of... so how is it they would "clean up" with a special edition DVD/Blu-Ray when the distributor doesn't even have enough faith in it to put it in cinemas for longer than a day?

[Santa's Boyfriend]

no PR or any kind of word of mouth that I've heard of...

If it's not on the side of a bus it doesn't exist.

[kidsick5000]

Could be that the distributors have realised they have a Snakes On A Plane, or Dead Snow on their hands. A film that just doesn't live up to the pitch.

That said, there's been a fair amount of press on this for what seems ages and a lot of people are waiting to see what it's like - albeit casually, not excitedly. To release a vanilla DVD does seem a backward move if extras have already been created.

[Blumf]

Well.... that wasn't too bad. Definitely an 'internet film', with a certain simple view of world politics and all that.

It's biggest flaw I think was a lack of ideas (or even one big, underlying idea). Yes, you have the Nazis on the moon thing, but beyond that is not much to tie the whole film together. Lots of points that could have been expended.

Otherwise silly fun that didn't deserve the shaft the distributors gave it.

[Mini]

I thought it was excellent, especially the political stuff, and the design. It relished in its concept but didn't rely on it, and was clearly crafted with care. Not funny enough though.

[phes]

I went to go and see this in Leeds tonight and was a little surprised to find it sold out. Hadn't realised it was a one day release. They're (HPPH) replaying it a week on Friday at 11pm, apparently.

[brat-sampson]

I really enjoyed it. As I said I was expecting basically a throwaway b-movie with a one-note premise but actually it was much cleverer and funnier than that. A lot of the jokes were based on referencing things, i.e.

Spoiler alert

Dr Strangelove

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,

Spoiler alert

Star Trek

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etc, but even some of those were unexpected

Spoiler alert

The parody of a Downfall

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parody took me a while to even notice, but the rest of the cinema seemed more cued in. I also loved the use of music and the Finland/North Korea cameos.

I was watching it with some german friends too who I think probably got even more out of it. It really worked well as a group cinema experience, where everyone knew roughly what to expect. Certainly deserves a full week showing, and would make for some interesting extras considering the nature of production, but which we'll have to wait for...

[mjwilson]

I thought this was funny enough to sustain it.

Entertainingly enough there was booing in the cinema when the distributors' logo came up.

[Blue Jam]

I saw this last night too, in one of the four cinemas in Scotland showing it. I was surprised when I tried to buy tickets for the first screening only to be told they'd sold out and to check back for a possible second screening, then when I got into that second screening seeing how massive the queue for tickets was. I only heard of the film myself a week ago, but then again I'm not a Star Trek fan and would never have sought out Star Wreck so that's probably why.

I went in thinking "at worst this could be Snakes On A Plane with a bit more effort put into it, at best it could be surprisingly good, in any case it probably won't be boring", and I found it surprisingly good. I gave up reading the reviews when I got the impression critics were slamming it for not being Citizen Kane and I think they were missing the point a bit. Reading the premise and then going in expecting the film to be anything other than preposterous would be missing the point.

That said to say it's a bit of a leave-your-brain-at-the-cinema-door film would also be unfair, leaving your brain switched on just enough to get the references seems to be the right way to go about it, and spotting the references was fun- everything from Dr. Strangelove to the Ring Cycle (in the names of the warships, and of course the Wagner-inspired soundtrack).

I thought it was funny enough, no complaints from me there. For the budget I thought it looked and sounded great, and really it was just enormous fun. I think it's one to file next to Anchorman and Team America for when you're in the mood to watch one of those kind of films.

[Famous Mortimer]

I thought it was awful. A confusing mess with no idea if it wanted to be a comedy, a satire, a war film, or a steampunk adventure, and ended up being none of them.

I thought the references to Dr. Strangelove and The Great Dictator were ballsy, as it's usually not a good idea to put bits of really good films in your not-so-great film.

I don't think it was preposterous, Blue Jam, I thought it wasn't preposterous enough. For every time they had the publicist dressed up as a leather-clad space general, they had a bit of lame comedy or uninvolving drama. The comparisons to Snakes On A Plane and Dead Snow were very appropriate, I think - all films that had fun premises that managed to have the fun sucked out by the execution (well, I quite liked Snakes On A Plane).

I'm really surprised it's got as many positive reviews as it has from you lot - I really thought it was awful and a case of hype trying to sell a film which didn't deserve it.

[Buelligan]

I thought it was so poor that I stopped watching after about 15 minutes and went off to do something more interesting instead.

[Mini]

The first 15 minutes aren't great, it really picks up as it goes on.

I thought it was awful. A confusing mess with no idea if it wanted to be a comedy, a satire, a war film, or a steampunk adventure, and ended up being none of them.

I think it ended up being all of them.

[Small Man Big Horse]

The first 15 minutes aren't great, it really picks up as it goes on.

Yeah, I've just finished watching it tonight and after about 20 minutes had serious thoughts about turning it off. But then it improves massively, and I found it thoroughly enjoyable.

I think it ended up being all of them.

I'd agree, admittedly I wasn't expecting much due to previously reading FM's comments (as we have very similar tastes in cinema) but found it to be an absolutely ridiculous but entertaining romp which pulled off everything it was trying to do well. Not always subtly, but then that's half the fun.

[Famous Mortimer]

I did a long-ass review of it for the film review site I write for (link below my avatar, I hope), but what I didn't put in that is that I really expected I'd like it - it seemed right up my street.

Edited highlights: I thought the acting from the lead woman, President Palin and the black male model was atrocious; I thought the satire was incredibly heavy-handed, to the point it felt like I was watching the porn parody of "Iron Sky" with the fucking taken out; and there's plot holes you could drive a fleet of trucks through (spoilers ahoy, I suppose).

When Male Model got back to earth and escaped, why didn't he get some makeup, dye his hair and go get his old (presumably quite decent) life back? Why couldn't they recharge the damn phone in the moonbase, rather than have to go all the way back to earth to grab an iPad? Why didn't they use the amazing alien technology they had and win the war in 1945, rather than running away to the dark side of the moon? Why, in an era where the real USA has a black President, did the people who made the film think sending a black guy to the moon would be worth such a major plot point, plus mildly racist billboards plastering the entire country? Why did they mine helium-3 for 70 years and seemingly do nothing at all with it? Why didn't the Nazis wait and see if their brainwashing of the Male Model had taken before entrusting him as one-third of an extremely important mission?

Also, the use of a clip from "The Great Dictator" pissed me off, because it reminded me I could have just watched that, one of the greatest comedies ever, one of the greatest anti-war films ever, touching, brave and wonderful, rather than "Iron Sky", which wanted to be those things but just failed miserably.

I'm not hating on people who liked it, though. There must be something there for people whose opinions I know and respect, like Small Man Big Horse, to like it. I just really didn't see it.

[Neomod]

Yeah, I've just finished watching it tonight and after about 20 minutes had serious thoughts about turning it off. But then it improves massively, and I found it thoroughly enjoyable.

I'd agree, admittedly I wasn't expecting much due to previously reading FM's comments (as we have very similar tastes in cinema) but found it to be an absolutely ridiculous but entertaining romp which pulled off everything it was trying to do well. Not always subtly, but then that's half the fun.

I actually did turn it off 10 minutes in. I think I'll need to be in a more forgiving (read inebriated) mood before I return to it.

[Mini]

Edited highlights: I thought the acting from the lead woman, President Palin and the black male model was atrocious; I thought the satire was incredibly heavy-handed, to the point it felt like I was watching the porn parody of "Iron Sky" with the fucking taken out; and there's plot holes you could drive a fleet of trucks through (spoilers ahoy, I suppose).

But it was never going to be subtle with nuanced performances and a flawless plot. It's a comedy B-Movie about Nazis on the Moon. It's the cinema equivalent of a pantomime, and like how you can't judge a pantomime as if it were a proper play, you can't judge Iron Sky like it's a serious film.

[Small Man Big Horse]

When Male Model got back to earth and escaped, why didn't he get some makeup, dye his hair and go get his old (presumably quite decent) life back? Why couldn't they recharge the damn phone in the moonbase, rather than have to go all the way back to earth to grab an iPad? Why didn't they use the amazing alien technology they had and win the war in 1945, rather than running away to the dark side of the moon? Why, in an era where the real USA has a black President, did the people who made the film think sending a black guy to the moon would be worth such a major plot point, plus mildly racist billboards plastering the entire country? Why did they mine helium-3 for 70 years and seemingly do nothing at all with it? Why didn't the Nazis wait and see if their brainwashing of the Male Model had taken before entrusting him as one-third of an extremely important mission?

I have to admit most of those questions did pop in to my mind whilst watching it. Washington could have had a DNA test to prove who he was for one thing, and the mildly racist poster made me feel uncomfortable too. And the brainwashing part was silly as well, especially given the extended wink he gave to blondenaziwoman straight after his nazi salute to the Fuhrer. But a lot of other elements worked for me, especially in the second half with the huge space battle, some of the scenes between the world leaders (especially the part when North Korea claims to be responsible for the invasion) and there were enough good lines to keep me entertained. I did think the take on the President was heavy handed at first but started enjoying it after a while due to how incredibly OTT it was, and despite being very Dr Strangelove-esque, the ending made me smile a lot too.

I do think it's a very flawed film in places, but I'd agree with Mini's pantomime analogy, and it was one of those films where I had to switch my brain off to enjoy it, but overall I found it pretty funny and enjoyably silly stuff.

[Famous Mortimer]

I'm sorry, but I don't buy your line of reasoning at all, Mini. It allows makers of "bad" films to get away with not trying - there's no reason why half the cast acted fairly well and the other half acted like they'd heard of acting school, but had never been near one; nor any reason why they seemed to be working with a first script draft.

I didn't expect "subtle with nuanced performances and a flawless plot", but I expected them to take some care in making it. You also seem to have missed the bit where I said I totally expected to like it - I'll match weird film bona fides with anyone on this forum. I remember enjoying "The Dark Backward", about a garbage man in the world's filthiest inner city who starts growing an arm out of the middle of his back and then becomes a standup comedian, with his fellow garbage man playing an accordion on stage with him; one example of many. I know and love strange cinema, but I'm not prepared to give a film a free pass for sucking just because it has a wacky premise.

To work from your analogy, there are good pantomimes and bad ones. Even if you're only comparing it to other pantos (that cost $7 million to make and have Udo Kier in them), it was still bad.

[Mini]

But bad films fail to achieve what they set out to; bad comedies are unfunny, bad action films are boring... If you think Iron Sky wasn't funny then that's a valid criticism. But when I think about films which don't try, the makers of which don't care, I think of industrial, bland, done-to-death pieces of Hollywood soullessness. Iron Sky on the other hand was made by people who clearly did care, and they tried hard. It's just that what they tried to make was something very silly indeed. The acting isn't bad, the acting is exactly in tune with the film's tone.

[Famous Mortimer]

The acting isn't bad, the acting is exactly in tune with the film's tone.

I'm struggling to get my point across, it would seem. If the bad acting was in keeping with the film's tone, why did some of the cast act well and some of them act badly? If there was a tone, surely they'd all be aiming for the same sort of performance?

Okay, then. For "bad", read "cult" or whatever word you like. Your argument was "you shouldn't expect a nuanced script or good performances from this sort of film" whereas my reply to that, boiled down, is "why not?" I then mentioned a film with an absolutely insane central premise that had a clever script and decent performances; I could have mentioned any of dozens of others. The sort of attitude displayed in your post and hundreds of film blogs round the internet is the same one that allows makers of films like this to get as far as the central premise of the film then stop trying. I appreciate we're not going to get any further in this debate, but when you said "it's about Nazis on the moon" as if just saying that was enough to insulate it from any criticism, well, it's an attitude I absolutely disagree with.

For an upcoming film which has an absolute batshit central premise but looks great, "The FP". Badass street gangs solve their turf disputes by playing Dance Dance Revolution. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ojQrhqW4hX0

[Mini]

I can't stand films that rely solely on their high-concept, I'm saying that Iron Sky delivers past that, and is made by people who genuinely care about it. Its messiness is charming, because of the love they clearly felt for the film. If those inconsistencies were in a Hollywood film then it wouldn't work because it would feel soulless, but in a film as lovingly crafted as Iron Sky those rough-around-the-edges bits are what make the film what it is.

[Santa's Boyfriend]

Saw it this evening on Blu-ray.  I have to say, the production values are really extraordinary!  I was really quite shocked at how nice the film looks.  In terms of the plot etc, it was a lot of fun.  Never took itself seriously, but had plenty of satire and

Spoiler alert

a very surprisingly downbeat ending

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.  There are a lot of jokes in there for those in the know, perhaps the most obvious being the Downfall parody, but I also loved the touch of

Spoiler alert

the president's election posters being exactly the same as Hitler's

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.  A very enjoyable movie, certainly not one to worry about minor plot holes and things.

[dr beat]

^My feelings exactly - I thought the production values were very good indeed regardless of the circumstances behind the films' making.  CGI etc worked fine for me.  I really liked how they pulled in so many more references than the 'Nazis on the moon' idea initially suggests, and that the film goes off in a very different direction in the end, going more down a kind of Dr Strangelove/Team America: World Police route - when we saw it the

Spoiler alert

'Is there anyone who hasn't been arming their spaceships?'

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line got a big and deserved laugh. 

I think the Finnish perspective on things really came through and was interesting to see.  I'm rapidly getting bored of the whole 'mash-up film' genre but this is a lesson in how to pull it off. 

[Santa's Boyfriend]

There's no question in my mind that this is already a cult classic.  In fact I think I've been spoiled for cult classics in the last few months.  On Monday I saw The Raid, on Tuesday I saw Iron Sky - both movies by new directors, both feeling very fresh and both pretty awesome.  Before that there was Troll Hunter and Rare Exports...

Apparently Abraham Lincoln Vampire Hunter is nowhere near as fun as the trailer makes it look, and Prometheus was extraordinarily poor.  If they're now able to make Iron Sky on the tenth of the budget of Prometheus, surely the future of cinema is small scale big ideas?