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Man of Steel (2013)

Started by Nik Drou, July 21, 2012, 10:12:16 PM

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El Unicornio, mang

Yeah, the Avengers was quite fun and I enjoyed it, but it was pretty empty and forgettable. I prefer the drama and emotional gravitas of stuff like the first Reeve Superman. I think the first X-Men film got the tone right too.

CaledonianGonzo

Quote from: Mr SixIt's superficially faithful.

Well - we (more or less) agree, then.  Your assesment of its flaws is spot on, but to me the way a few scenes of violence are spun doesn't contradict the initial thesis that it follows the comic on a page by page basis pretty damn closely.  I'll be honest - glossifying and motion-ramping the violence didn't really ruin the film for me.  I think it was hamstrung from the start by adhering too closely to a narrative tailormade for a different medium.  It was just a little boring.

I'm probably due to give it a rewatch.

Replies From View

Quote from: Mister Six on December 13, 2012, 01:12:02 PM
Superman's overpowered, but you don't solve that problem by weakening him - you solve it by presenting him with bigger and bigger problems to solve.

What are the things that can defeat Superman?  Assuming he can't just wind back time.

At the top of my head, I'm thinking Kryptonite, Super Villains, and needing to be in more than one place at a time.

What else?

Blumf

Filling in his annual tax returns.

CaledonianGonzo


SteveDave

Crinkle cut chips & February.

MuteBanana

Deadlines at the Daily Planet.

Clark gets fired for being crap at his job. Goes on job seekers, becomes bitter at the world and stops putting the cape on. Villains win.

Blumf

These lazy benefit scroungers, they've all got crystalline fortress of solitudes you know!

Mister Six

Quote from: Replies From View on December 13, 2012, 06:00:38 PM
What are the things that can defeat Superman?  Assuming he can't just wind back time.

At the top of my head, I'm thinking Kryptonite, Super Villains, and needing to be in more than one place at a time.

What else?

Magic and psychic control are two popular ones in the comic. Maybe you couldn't get away with magic, though. Superhero films don't like blending genres, generally.

Mister Six

Quote from: Jemble Fred on December 13, 2012, 01:14:58 PM
THing is, I watched The Avengers and really can't remember a single thing about it.

You're in the minority, I think. My friends and I came out of the film babbling about our favourite setpieces. The whole thing was like a 'best bits' compilation that ran to two hours. Off the top of my head, bits people liked:

* Black Widow's intro, with the Russian mob.
* Black Widow tricking Loki.
* Loki's use of the phrase 'mewling quim'.
* Captain America ordering the cop about, the cop not knowing who he is but going along after Cap kills a bunch of baddies (it's in the way they tell 'em, I swear).
* The aircraft carrier flying for the first time, and Cap losing his bet with Nick Fury.
* The SHIELD agent playing Galaxians on his monitor.
* Coulson getting a last hit in on Loki before he dies.
* Hulk walloping the giant fish monster thing.
* Hulk slamming Loki into the ground.
* Hulk suckerpunching Thor.
* Anything with Hulk, basically.

As I say, that's off the top of my head, but those are the scenes that I remember people enthusing about in the office/at the pub afterwards. It's a very shallow film, but they're beautiful shallows.

But I'm getting off track. My point was that Superman should have the lightness of touch of the Marvel films, not the ponderous, mopey darkness of recent DC stuff. Singer's film showed what a bad combination that can be.

Small Man Big Horse

Quote from: Mister Six on December 14, 2012, 01:28:46 AM
You're in the minority, I think. My friends and I came out of the film babbling about our favourite setpieces. The whole thing was like a 'best bits' compilation that ran to two hours.

It's weird, there seems to be a bit of a minor backlash against The Avengers now, despite initial gushing reviews and the ridiculously high box office take. I'm with you though, the first 45 minutes might have a bit slow occasionally, but after that it's filled with joyous ott action and fun dialogue, and it's easily one of my favourite films of the year. And it's been years and years since I've said that about a Hollywood blockbuster.

Claude the Racecar Driving Rockstar Super Sleuth

Also Thor Vs. Iron Man. Avengers is the new benchmark for big blockbuster films as far as I'm concerned.

I'm curious to see this, but I have to agree about Snyder being a dunderhead. I've heard talk that Sucker Punch is actually a grand satire of fanwank videogame style action tripe, but I just can't believe it.

Small Man Big Horse

I really liked Sucker Punch, but it can only be enjoyed on a purely visual level. The minute you start to think about the ideas and themes they've supposedly tried to explore, and how badly they've managed this, is when you realise it's all a bit of a turd of a movie.

Thomas

I bought Sucker Punch a few months ago and settled down to watch it, having heard the occasional good thing about it.

The DVD is still in my room somewhere, hidden out of shame. As Small Man Big Horse says there, it is pretty impressive visually.[nb]one scene with lots of scantily clad ladies fighting clockwork Germans looks as if lifted directly from the mind of a sleeping BNP voter during a wet dream.[/nb]

Claude the Racecar Driving Rockstar Super Sleuth

Quote from: Small Man Big Horse on December 14, 2012, 01:51:29 AM
It's weird, there seems to be a bit of a minor backlash against The Avengers now
Probably led by Dark Knight fans.

Jemble Fred

I didn't say it wasn't enjoyable, just that it was light popcorn-shovelling fare. For that, it was pretty good fun. Man Of Steel looks like it's for grown-ups. No harm in that. And I'm no Dark Knight fan, especially miserablist drudgery like Batman Begins. Treating Superman as something other than an excuse to market fresh action figures is no bad thing.

SavageHedgehog

Quote from: Claude the Racecar Driving Rockstar Super Sleuth on December 14, 2012, 04:24:30 AM
Probably led by Dark Knight fans.

I'd say it was more led by...

Quote from: Small Man Big Horse on December 14, 2012, 01:51:29 AM
gushing reviews and the ridiculously high box office take.

I wasn't a huge fan either meself. I agree Thor was a lot more distinctive

Mister Six

Thor was tremendous. It could've done with maybe another 15 minutes or so to really make the central relationship convince, but the action, the characters, the variations of tone, the genuine belly chuckles - it was a delight.

The Roofdog

Christ, at this rate their film version of the Justice League is going to be like an AA meeting.

Small Man Big Horse

I've always been more of a DC fanboy than a Marvel kid, but I just have a really bad feeling about the JLA film. I hope they don't go all dark and gritty to avoid comparisons to the Avengers, but it seems likely from the rumours I've heard. I'd be happiest with a JLI film from the Giffen/Maguire era, but that's never going to happen.

Replies From View

My anxiety is that eventually things will tip too much the other way, and everything will start becoming like Schumacher's 'Batman & Robin' film.

I say "anxiety" - that's overstating it.  I honestly don't see many Hollywood films and am not fussed that much.  It's just that when I do see one, the less I feel like my brain is being spooned out the better.  That's the general level for me.

SavageHedgehog

Quote from: Replies From View on December 14, 2012, 05:55:32 PM
My anxiety is that eventually things will tip too much the other way, and everything will start becoming like Schumacher's 'Batman & Robin' film.

There's no real sign of that though, is there? I mean even the more self-consiciously light hearted films like The Avengers are a million miles away from Batman and Robin. I think the studios are all very conscious of not making that mistake again. Perhaps a little too much.

The Roofdog

The DC film that was closest in tone to the Avengers and its lead-in films was Green Lantern, and that bombed so badly that I don't think they'll deviate too far from the Nolan template for a while now.

Replies From View

Quote from: SavageHedgehog on December 14, 2012, 05:59:38 PM
I think the studios are all very conscious of not making that mistake again. Perhaps a little too much.

Ah, but might it tip that far though, in due course?  Might people become so wound up about grittiness and darkness that everything turns neon and campy as a natural opposing reaction thing?  Ah.

The Roofdog

Sometimes I wish Roger Moore would come back with an underwater car or some kind of jetpack or a hover-gondola and a Union Jack

SavageHedgehog

Quote from: Replies From View on December 14, 2012, 06:08:19 PM
Ah, but might it tip that far though, in due course?  Might people become so wound up about grittiness and darkness that everything turns neon and campy as a natural opposing reaction thing?  Ah.

My money is on no.

The closest thing to a neon-campfest from recent(ish) years was actually Punisher: War Zone. I quite liked it. I like Neon.

Replies From View


Replies From View

Quote from: The Roofdog on December 14, 2012, 06:10:46 PM
Sometimes I wish Roger Moore would come back with an underwater car or some kind of jetpack or a hover-gondola and a Union Jack

Forget it mate, it's not the eighties.  He'd rather kick you in the face.


It still rankles that Joe's song didn't win that.

Mister Six

Quote from: Replies From View on December 14, 2012, 06:08:19 PM
Ah, but might it tip that far though, in due course?  Might people become so wound up about grittiness and darkness that everything turns neon and campy as a natural opposing reaction thing?  Ah.

Yeah, but it won't come from DC or any major studio. It'll be some low-budget, (at most) $60 million 'indie'/'alternative' flick that catches the public's imagination, and then all the big boys will be on the idea like flies on a dayglo shit. I strongly suspect that DC's movie wing is as fucking clueless as its comics side.

Tiny Poster

Green Lantern tried to do gritty and glo-camp, and it was just bloody boring.

Thor and Captain America sail close to camp, but never tip over into kitsch.