Good Horror Movies

[BlodwynPig]

The ABCs of Death is shit. There are some good segments, but 80% of them are terrible.

None of them are scary and only a few could be classed as horror.

[telephone/tough.guy]

I've been meaning to watch Lake Mungo. Friends have recommended it, and I walk by a poster of it at Uni a lot so someone from there must have had something to do with it.
It was filmed in Ararat, right? Reason enough to give it a shot.

I'd recommend Lake Mungo too. It's not all that terrifying but has a nice creepy atmosphere.

I recently watched Henry, I remember Kermode and Kim Newman touting it as this ahead of its time, interesting horror film. And, well, it's a thoroughly unpleasant film I doubt I'll want to see again any time soon, but it does accomplish some interesting things. For one it's probably one of the most plausible depictions of a serial killer on screen, a subject that I suppose should be thoroughly unpleasant. It also makes some interesting points about audience complicity, and not in a finger wagging, hectoring way like Funny Games (though I like things about that film too).

[Small Man Big Horse]

Has anyone yet mentioned Behind the Mask: The Rise of Leslie Vernon (2006) ? Those who enjoy Cabin In The Woods post meta-slasher horror (with a great turn from Scott Wilson (Hershall) from AMC's The Walking Dead) should seek it out.

Thanks for the recommendation BF, I watched it last night and really enjoyed it. I'd have preferred it if it was slightly twist-ier (

Spoiler alert

I guessed that the camera crew would be part of his big plan fairly early on

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) but it's a lot of fun with some great performances, and it's always nice to see Robert Englund in a straight role too.

[Brundle-Fly]

Thanks for the recommendation BF, I watched it last night and really enjoyed it. I'd have preferred it if it was slightly twist-ier (

Spoiler alert

I guessed that the camera crew would be part of his big plan fairly early on

[close]

) but it's a lot of fun with some great performances, and it's always nice to see Robert Englund in a straight role too.

I agree. It's not perfect but I do relish the notion that

Spoiler alert

the film exists in a universe where Michael Myers, Jason Voorhees and to a lesser plausible extent, Freddy Krueger were actual real serial killers.

[close]

[Thomas]

I strongly disliked Cabin In The Woods. It's not nearly as clever as the films it condescends to.

I don't know if it's trying to be particularly 'clever,'[nb]though I thought it was pretty smart.[/nb] and it certainly doesn't condescend to anything. It was written as very much an affectionate take on the genre. It's full of tropes the writers love.

As Joss Whedon, I think, says, they never set out to subvert the horror genre, but to contribute to it in an interesting way. I think they did that. Enjoyable, funny, full of pause-button-addict details, and 95 minutes long. Perfick.

[Brundle-Fly]

Coffin Rock is an original nasty little psychological thriller from Oz worth a peep.

[Brundle-Fly]

I don't know if it's trying to be particularly 'clever,'[nb]though I thought it was pretty smart.[/nb] and it certainly doesn't condescend to anything. It was written as very much an affectionate take on the genre. It's full of tropes the writers love.

As Joss Whedon, I think, says, they never set out to subvert the horror genre, but to contribute to it in an interesting way. I think they did that. Enjoyable, funny, full of pause-button-addict details, and 95 minutes long. Perfick.

I'm going to have to give this another chance. I drunkenly watched Cabin In The Woods projected onto a wall at a mate's BBQ last summer, sat next to an almighty dicksplash of a man who scoffed all the way through it. Not the greatest environment to appreciate a film.

I do recall hating its pretensions (apart from the last twenty minutes that were  fantastic) I thought it was a poor man's

Spoiler alert

Cube.

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[DukeDeMondo]

The ABCs of Death is shit. There are some good segments, but 80% of them are terrible.

I really liked ABCs of Death. I'd say a good 70, 75% of the things had something interesting going on in them, and most of them I found to be hugely entertaining.

Conversely, since we're on anthologies, I watched VHS 2 the other night and was sore disappointed. I loved the first one and was really lookin forward to it. Alas, barring that widely-praised hullabaloo in the God shack, it was utter ballbag. Lazy, boring, repetitive, unimaginative ballbag. I can only assume that they've read too much internet blather concerning the first one, paying particular attention to the ridiculous but often voiced criticisms of the creepier elements, and noting that nobody has much of a bad word to say about the insane concluding segment. Hence, this time, there's nothing remotely comparable to, say, Ti West's segment in VHS, but there is lots and lots and lots of shrieking and exploding and roaring and screaming. Awful, awful stuff.

[Paaaaul]

Conversely, since we're on anthologies, I watched VHS 2 the other night and was sore disappointed. I loved the first one and was really lookin forward to it. Alas, barring that widely-praised hullabaloo in the God shack, it was utter ballbag. Lazy, boring, repetitive, unimaginative ballbag. I can only assume that they've read too much internet blather concerning the first one, paying particular attention to the ridiculous but often voiced criticisms of the creepier elements, and noting that nobody has much of a bad word to say about the insane concluding segment. Hence, this time, there's nothing remotely comparable to, say, Ti West's segment in VHS, but there is lots and lots and lots of shrieking and exploding and roaring and screaming. Awful, awful stuff.

I think the main problem with VHS 2 was that it was produced very quickly in an attempt to capitalise on VHS doing well on VoD and DVD.

[DukeDeMondo]

I think the main problem with VHS 2 was that it was produced very quickly in an attempt to capitalise on VHS doing well on VoD and DVD.

That's true, but it still doesn't explain just how lazy everything was, Safe Haven aside. The alien one was particularly awful. I suspect it's the final segment because folk would walk out (or log out - whatever you do nowadays) if it appeared any earlier. Safe Haven would actually have bled rather nicely over the wraparound bits had they saved it for last, but there's no way anyone could sit through those other three gusts of old fuck back-to-back.

[Johnny Townmouse]

The Woman in Black must have been mentioned, but if not then I nominate it. Very much a mood piece but it gets everything right, and uses slow building creepiness to get under your skin. I never thought I would enjoy a 12 certificate film starring Daniel Radlciffe, but he is actually pretty great in it.

I also enjoyed Ils/Them and the low-budget British film Tony.

[James Christopher]

Just watched Lake Mungo. I liked it; I like found footage / mock doc type films anyway, and this was a bit of a fresh take on the genre. Creepy and original.

Spoiler alert

I had a bit of a problem with the notion that the first section of "supernatural" footage was faked by the photographer. This always throws the entire narrative into question for me. Especially if you're being invited to believe in something supernatural. The closing credits shots - which looked great and should've been really creepy - had no credibility. So a photo that had been faked to have a ghost in it - also just happened to have a real ghost in it as well? Didn't stop it being an enjoyable film that was well worth seeing though.

[close]

[Small Man Big Horse]

I was a huge fan of The Woman with it being probably my favourite film of whatever year it came out (2011?). I really enjoyed May but haven't seen Red as I'd heard bad things. Will look into it, though, as I do really like Lucky Mckee. I even read the novel version of The Woman, co-written by Mckee and Jack Ketchum. It's nowhere near as good as the film but the novella at the end, The Cow, which picks up a year after the conclusion of the film is quite cool. For those who enjoyed The Woman, I'd reiterate my earlier recommendation of new film, Jug Face. It's not up to the same standard and does have flaws but it had a similar tone, as well as sharing cast members and having the same guy (Sean Spillane) doing the soundtrack.

I watched The Woman tonight and enjoyed it a lot, the only problem I had with it was with the father, at times he was chilling but at others his performance felt a little mannered to me. The fact that he reminded me of Will Ferrell didn't help either. But bar that it's a nasty little thing, but oddly pleasurable. Out of interest, what happens in The Cow?

[Moribunderast]

I watched The Woman tonight and enjoyed it a lot, the only problem I had with it was with the father, at times he was chilling but at others his performance felt a little mannered to me. The fact that he reminded me of Will Ferrell didn't help either. But bar that it's a nasty little thing, but oddly pleasurable. Out of interest, what happens in The Cow?

He reminded me of Will Ferrell too! I liked his performance but the stand-outs in the cast were Pollyanna McIntosh, Lauren Ashley Carter and Angela Bettis for sure. It's an interesting film. I've had arguments with people who thought it was too nasty and actually misognyistic which I don't understand as I thought, if anything, it's a feminist film. Certainly we're not supposed to side with the men! As for The Cow, it's about

Spoiler alert

a man who is kidnapped by the Women a year or so after the film as they live their lives in the wild, like The Woman was before being captures. This man (the Cow) is kept so's they can mate and expand their family. He doesn't particularly enjoy this, however, and his escape attempts result in some pretty grisly means of keeping him tethered.

[close]

As I say, the movie is much better than the book but that little novella was a nice addition to the tale.

I also enjoyed Ils/Them and the low-budget British film Tony.

I've never been able to find a good copy of Ils. That's the film The Strangers was based on, right? I've heard good things.

Got a copy of Noroi: The Curse to watch, possibly today. Apparently it's very scary, according to the internet, so I have high hopes.

Did anyone ever bother watching the US version of A Tale of Two Sisters? It's called The Uninvited. The original is one of my favourite films so I'm extremely weary of a remake. Given that I couldn't get more than 10 minutes into Let Me In (the Let The Right One In remake) I don't like my chances of finding any enjoyment out of it. On the plus side, it stars Elizabeth Banks and Emily Browning so if the film is terrible, I can just put it on mute and look wistfully at the pretty ladies.

[Mini]

I've had arguments with people who thought it was too nasty and actually misognyistic which I don't understand as I thought, if anything, it's a feminist film. Certainly we're not supposed to side with the men!

I took it as an incredibly powerful simultaneous critique of domestic abuse and US foreign policy. Also, with The Woman and Jug Face, Lauren Ashley Carter has carved out a real niche playing

Spoiler alert

women pregnant by members of their own family.

[close]

[Small Man Big Horse]

He reminded me of Will Ferrell too! I liked his performance but the stand-outs in the cast were Pollyanna McIntosh, Lauren Ashley Carter and Angela Bettis for sure. It's an interesting film. I've had arguments with people who thought it was too nasty and actually misognyistic which I don't understand as I thought, if anything, it's a feminist film. Certainly we're not supposed to side with the men! As for The Cow, it's about

Spoiler alert

a man who is kidnapped by the Women a year or so after the film as they live their lives in the wild, like The Woman was before being captures. This man (the Cow) is kept so's they can mate and expand their family. He doesn't particularly enjoy this, however, and his escape attempts result in some pretty grisly means of keeping him tethered.

[close]

As I say, the movie is much better than the book but that little novella was a nice addition to the tale.

Thanks for that, I'll have to try and track it down and buy it on the cheap. I'm surprised to hear that some feel it's misogynistic, how you can root for anyone but the female characters is beyond me, and

Spoiler alert

the ending was suitably cathartic. Sure, if they'd gone for the downbeat 'Dad kills everyone' ending it could be open to such accusations, but even then he was consistently portrayed as a fucked up cunt, so even then I don't think the argument can be made.

[close]

[Moribunderast]

I'm surprised to hear that some feel it's misogynistic, how you can root for anyone but the female characters is beyond me, and

Spoiler alert

the ending was suitably cathartic. Sure, if they'd gone for the downbeat 'Dad kills everyone' ending it could be open to such accusations, but even then he was consistently portrayed as a fucked up cunt, so even then I don't think the argument can be made.

[close]

Yeah, I've been staggered by the arguments. I mean, those arguing that it was misogynistic apparently saw no deeper than "A man is mean to some women in this film!" whereas, if you look at the entire plot, even in just a simplistic manner:

Spoiler alert

The Woman is injured but living free in the wild, doing her own thing. A horrible man captures and binds her. Despite torture and degradation, The Woman remains strong and her strength arguably rubs off on the other women (Carter's character, at least) and then she kills her captors and the Women go off to live by their own rules, free of the horrible men who'd been ruining their lives.

[close]

I genuinely don't get how someone can take that sequence of events and think the filmmaker has a negative view of women or relished the pain dealt to them in the film. If anything it makes men look too cartoonishly evil! Maybe I should start a thread on IMDB: "OMG, Lucky McKee is Misandry!"

[James Christopher]

I also rewatched Cabin In The Woods last night. In truth, my main motivation for doing so was to better articulate what I dislike about it. That's the kind of winner I am. But I ended up really enjoying it.

I think what I originally disliked about it, was the suggestion that horror movies are formulaic (the blond bimbo, the jock, the stoner, etc). And the numerous references to The Evil Dead, which seemed to imply that The Evil Dead was an example of such formulaic horror movies, which I do not agree with. In fact, I find lazy digs at the behaviour of characters in horror movies particularly irksome, and the reason I dislike Scream so much. Would any of us retain our ability for rational decision making when being chased by demon zombies?

That said, I was able to let go of these preconceptions and enjoy CITW on it's own terms. I suppose it's pretty much The Truman Show really, which I also like a great deal.

Spoiler alert

The fact it goes one step further, and the oppressors get their comeuppance

[close]

, is very satisfying and amusing.

[Jerzy Bondov]

In fact, I find lazy digs at the behaviour of characters in horror movies particularly irksome, and the reason I dislike Scream so much. Would any of us retain our ability for rational decision making when being chased by demon zombies?

Yes, it drives me LITERALLY insane when people complain about this. Oh, why did they go in the cellar? Why did they antagonise the deformed hillbillies? Why did she go back to the haunted house after having been blinded and there's a maniac running around strangling women? People in real life never do stupid things. I'm going to log off now so that I can go and make the best, most sensible use of my time, as I do every day of my perfect life.

[Famous Mortimer]

So there are no plot holes that pop up in horror films?

I think there are a lot of films that were made in the aftermath of "The Evil Dead" that share enough plot points / devices to be worth taking the mick out of. Go and scan a random week of The Horror Channel and see how many of their films are "group of teenagers goes to bad place X for a party". That guy in Friday the 13th was probably the most famous Harbinger, but it's not like that's the only film where that character pops up. The "Virgin" / "have sex and die" plot models are well known enough for them to have been parodied in "Scream" over a decade ago. The groups of teenagers do have those character types represented in them, sometimes.

I'm a bit surprised that the criticism of "Cabin In The Woods" comes from the perspective of horror films not being formulaic. There are lots of good ones that don't follow formula, but by god are there a lot of films that really stick closely to it. I'd suggest the reason that there are a lot of long-running horror franchises is not that the filmmakers wanted to tell 6 different Jigsaw stories, or 10 different Jason Voorhees stories. There are certainly enough to fuel a film like "Cabin In The Woods", anyway.

I'll try and answer some of James Christopher's points (apologies if I don't get them quite right). The whole thing about CITW is that

Spoiler alert

the characters are forced into behaving stupidly by Bradley Whitford and friends. Left to their own devices, they'd have been fine. The film says "all those times you've shouted at a character in a horror film to stop behaving like an idiot, it wasn't really their fault"

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– if you've never felt that way about any horror film ever, then I can understand why you might not like CITW as much. I don't even think it's a case of "Would any of us retain our ability for rational decision making when being chased by demon zombies?", it's idiocy above and beyond simple panic whose sole purpose is to drive the plot towards the teenager getting slaughtered. There's a reason most horror films are dismissed upon release, and it's not the snooty film reviewers ignoring the genre (I still love loads of them, in case you were wondering – I made it all the way through most of those famous horror franchises).

The more I watch it and ponder it in threads like this, the more I love it.

[phantom_power]

There are obvious mechanical reasons why people need to be split up in horror films. Bad horror films don't bother to find organic ways for this to happen. I think this is what Cabin in the Woods is parodying.

[Noodle Lizard]

God 'Dead Silence' is shit.  No idea how James Wan got any work after this.

[brat-sampson]

Don't forget also the archetypes the jock, the slut, the joker, when they leave town, they don't really feature these qualities. I mean, some do, to greater or lesser extent but they're more all-rounded than you would expect. So the people behind the scenes also run manipulations to drive them towards behaving in ways counter to themselves but more befitting their designated roles.

[Mister Six]

I think what I originally disliked about it, was the suggestion that horror movies are formulaic (the blond bimbo, the jock, the stoner, etc).

No, it's saying that some slasher movies follow predictable tropes, which they do. It's not commenting on 'all horror movies', any more than Scream was commenting on Videodrome or Hellraiser.

Some slasher movies are creative and clever and surprising - a great many more are deeply formulaic. And some of the formulaic ones are brilliant precisely because they're formulaic. But many are just trotting through the motions to satisfy the basic (perceived) desires of the audience, without bothering to come up with anything new. Those are the ones it's mocking (and even then, somewhat affectionately), and they deserve to be mocked.

And the numerous references to The Evil Dead, which seemed to imply that The Evil Dead was an example of such formulaic horror movies, which I do not agree with.

You're reading that into the film. The references to Evil Dead are just nods to a film that the creators like. It really sounds more like you're a huge fan of horror movies, and are overly sensitive to criticism of the genre.  The only people I've encountered who didn't like Cabin in the Woods made the exact same complaints - that it's mocking them their favourite genre, that it's not taking them their passion seriously, etc.

Here's what The Cabin in the Woods is:

* A love-letter to horror movies.
* A gentle pastiche of lazy slasher tropes.
* A commentary on the lack of imagination displayed in hacked-out, big-studio generic horror fare.
* A wry wink at viewer complicity in the enjoyment of watching (fictional) teenagers be terrified and murdered.
* A philosophical, quietly angry swing at governments and similar bodies that commit atrocities on powerless individuals in the name of maintaining a 'safe' status quo for the majority.
* An acknowledgement of the mundane face of conscienceless evil.
* A cute state-of-affairs of world horror from an American POV (J-horror is defanged and outdated, Swedish horror is no longer en vogue).
* A properly tense and occasionally scary horror film with gore, jumps, tension and characters you actually want to root for.
* Really fucking funny.

Here's what it is not:
* Making fun of all horror.
* Making fun of all slasher movies.
* Making fun of you.
* Shit.

It's a massively clever film, and it succeeds on every damn level, clocking in everything needed to acknowledge the horror stuff while still managing to swing a final act that looks and plays out like no other movie I've seen before.

It's great. I love it to pieces.

[billtheburger]

I don't see the parody in Cabin in the Woods
I see a tale of how the elite make their sacrifices to the old Gods and how they've been doing it for a generation.

[leighhart]

has Eden lake been mentioned?
underrated

[Moribunderast]

I really... well, enjoyed isn't the word, but I certainly rated Eden Lake. A really grimey, nasty little film, that.

[billtheburger]

My recent horror recommendations:
The Haunting (1963)
Martin (1976)
Baba Yaga. The Devil Witch (1973)
The Church (1989)
&
I even liked The Conjuring (2013) Don't judge me on that last one though.

[phantom_power]

I don't see the parody in Cabin in the Woods
I see a tale of how the elite make their sacrifices to the old Gods and how they've been doing it for a generation.

That is one reading, and a valid one. Another is that the old gods are the viewer and film makers torture and kill these characters for our entertainment, and if we don't get what we want the way we want it then we stop watching. There is a lot going on in that film

[James Christopher]

Here's what The Cabin in the Woods is:

I largely agree with this now, and was outlining what my initial cynicism about it was, to illustrate how my view on it had changed. Which was admittedly a bit pointless.

It really sounds more like you're a huge fan of horror movies, and are overly sensitive to criticism of the genre.

That's also true to a degree, though your 13 bullet point defence of a film that I wasn't actually attacking suggests a certain sensitivity of your own. But let's not quibble.