Glastonbury 2014: not as good as it used to be

[The Always Red Society]

Ultimately the current ticket system does work. They sold all the tickets in 40 minutes last year, the on problem is there about 10 people trying to buy each ticket, people missing out is unavoidable.

[CaledonianGonzo]

You'd take a day off. Or get someone else to queue for you. And, sorry to break this to you, but not everyone can buy tickets online while they're at work either. Most people can't.

You're condemning something that did work, for decades. If it matters enough, you'll queue.

I'm not "condeming" anything, but it isn't 1984 anymore and ticket-buying habits have changed - if the internet isn't a democratic method for ticket allocation then I don't know what is.  As it is tickets go onsale at 9am Sunday morning, which is reasonable compromise, timewise, in terms of proportions of people that would be in work.

Given that nowadys people queue up for a week or so in advance just to get into a Springsteen gig, I think it's fair to say that queues would easily be forming four or five days beforehand.

So it's a choice between taking a day off on a Sunday (if you happen to work at the weekend) or everyone taking up to a week off.

[thepuffpastryhangman]

Sorry, I didn't notice the nu when I posted. Still relevant though.

Maybe - but I'd rather take my chances knowing that there a few minor techniques you can try on the See Tickets page to vaguely increase your chances.

How is that fairer than queuing? It's simply not. Everyone understands queuing, there's nothing to learn, nothing to know, no organisation trying to grab loads of tickets, no mass operations of people all after the maximum number of tickets. 2 per person, max. And queue for them.

[CaledonianGonzo]

Ultimately the current ticket system does work. They sold all the tickets in 40 minutes last year, the on problem is there about 10 people trying to buy each ticket, people missing out is unavoidable.

Yup. 

[CaledonianGonzo]

Sorry, I didn't notice the nu when I posted. Still relevant though.

How is that fairer than queuing? It's simply not. Everyone understands queuing, there's nothing to learn, nothing to know, no organisation trying to grab loads of tickets, no mass operations of people all after the maximum number of tickets. 2 per person, max. And queue for them.

Who organises the queues?  Are people allowed to let people in?  When do queue numbers start getting allocated?  What happens if the queuing process is organised differently in Glasgow compared to Edinburgh?  Who's briefing the security for line management?  Are there roll-calls every three hours or every four hours?  Who's hired the portaloos?

How is that fairer than queuing? It's simply not. Everyone understands queuing, there's nothing to learn, nothing to know, no organisation trying to grab loads of tickets, no mass operations of people all after the maximum number of tickets. 2 per person, max. And queue for them.

I was mainly referring to the fact that most people simply don't read the text on the See Tickets holding page about them not being in a queue. 

[Tiny Poster]

I'm not "condeming" anything, but it isn't 1984 anymore and ticket-buying habits have changed - if the internet isn't a democratic method for ticket allocation then I don't know what is.  As it is tickets go onsale at 9am Sunday morning, which is reasonable compromise, timewise, in terms of proportions of people that would be in work.

Given that nowadys people queue up for a week or so in advance just to get into a Springsteen gig, I think it's fair to say that queues would easily be forming four or five days beforehand.

So it's a choice between taking a day off on a Sunday (if you happen to work at the weekend) or everyone taking up to a week off.

So it would be biased towards people who can afford to take time off, or can afford to pay others to queue for them (how this would work on a two-per-person basis I don't know), towards those who can afford private transport... basically the rich.

[Tiny Poster]

Who organises the queues?  Are people allowed to let people in?  When do queue numbers start getting allocated?  What happens if the queuing process is organised differently in Glasgow compared to Edinburgh?  Who's briefing the security for line management?  Are there roll-calls every three hours or every four hours?  Who's hired the portaloos?

All this should be free too, as part of the "festival spirit".

[thepuffpastryhangman]

3 nu

Yup. 

Clearly it works for you, and the others in your gang, with their high speed connections, credit and debit cards and attempted multiple orders.

But why should an individual lose out because he's not got seven other people trying to get him a ticket too?

Hang on, you've not said queuing isn't fairest, just pointed out a few of the consequences.

To be fair I didn't realise folks queued for the days to see the Boss. Yet didn't you manage to see him at various venues recently? How did that work?

If you can't afford to take four days off to queue, yes, that's a problem. Are 4 day queues common? (I see Tiny raised this point)

[thepuffpastryhangman]

Who organises the queues?  Are people allowed to let people in?  When do queue numbers start getting allocated?  What happens if the queuing process is organised differently in Glasgow compared to Edinburgh?  Who's briefing the security for line management?  Are there roll-calls every three hours or every four hours?  Who's hired the portaloos?

I was mainly referring to the fact that most people simply don't read the text on the See Tickets holding page about them not being in a queue.

Have you never queued? No one. They just organise their good natured selves. Maybe one person or a couple could oversee it. It's certainly going to be more closely monitored than online ordering.

How's the Boos sort it? You tell me.

[thepuffpastryhangman]

All this should be free too, as part of the "festival spirit".

Same ballpark. But the "festival spirit" would mean everyone getting in.

[CaledonianGonzo]

My sinister gang with their 'debit cards' and 'computers'.

How's the Boos sort it? You tell me.

Someone has to organise all the stuff that I mentioned.  And then you've got to spend days sitting in a rainy / scorching hot carpark.

Getting out of bed half an hour beforehand and hammering F5 for an hour or two is far preferable.

[thepuffpastryhangman]

To be clear, CG, you're not actually saying queuing isn't fairest, just highlighting it's problematic too, right? Or are you saying it's not fundamentally the most equal method to allocate tickets to everyone that wants one?

Getting out of bed half an hour beforehand and hammering F5 for an hour or two is far preferable.

For you, obviously, as it's always worked. Had you endured how ever many straight years of failure, you might think differently?

[ziggy starbucks]

My sinister gang with their 'debit cards' and 'computers'.

the very definition of 'hipsters'

[The Always Red Society]

It's not the most equal though is it? It favours those who live nearest queue points or have access to travel, it favours the most able-bodied,  it favours those with the least time commitments, those that don't have kids.

As it is anybody who can get near a computer for an hour on a Sunday has a pretty much equal chance of getting tickets. Unfortunately if a million people want 120, 000 tickets, some will be unhappy.

[George Oscar Bluth II]

Won't somebody think of the people with dialup connections who try and fail to get tickets every year because os CG and his evil broadband havers :(

[CaledonianGonzo]

To be clear, CG, you're not actually saying queuing isn't fairest, just highlighting it's problematic too, right? Or are you saying it's not fundamentally the most equal method to allocate tickets to everyone that wants one?

With demand as high as it is currently, I honestly don't see much difference in terms of 'fairness' between selling them online and via shops, no - other than the issues with the fairness and organisation of the queues already mentioned. 

For you, obviously, as it's always worked. Had you endured how ever many straight years of failure, you might think differently?

I'm sure I would be cheesed off about it, yes -  but I'd also accept that demand outstrips supply.  After coming a cropper I'd also think that it was encumbent on me to find out how to improve my chances and do some research into the subject to see if there was anything I could do to tip the odds in my favour.

[ziggy starbucks]

to reduce demand, they should make the line-up really terrible.

Like the Krankies headlining Saturday night.

The hipsters would probably then ruin another festival, like the cambridge folk festival. Playing air accordion and boasting about their broadband speed while hepped up on organic Tibetan tofu.

[thepuffpastryhangman]

kin ell 3 nu

It's not the most equal though is it? It favours those who live nearest queue points or have access to travel, it favours the most able-bodied,  it favours those with the least time commitments, those that don't have kids.

It positions the goalposts and gives everyone the same clear sighted view of them. I said it's not perfect, just better.

As it is anybody who can get near a computer for an hour on a Sunday has a pretty much equal chance of getting tickets. Unfortunately if a million people want 120, 000 tickets, some will be unhappy.

Huh? It's not equal if you've got 8 people trying on your behalf and someone else is trying as an individual. The more people you've got trying, the less fair it is.

I did mention my idea to limit folks to so many 'gold events' a year, that'd help a lot. But that's even less likely than queuing being implemented.

[Tiny Poster]

For you, obviously, as it's always worked. Had you endured how ever many straight years of failure, you might think differently?

Aaaahhhhh! There we go... the system is obviously against you.

Both ticketing systems have their pros & cons (though online is obviously preferable in 2013) but you want the one you think will favour you personally, even if it is fairer for everyone else.

[thepuffpastryhangman]

I'm sure I would be cheesed off about it, yes -  but I'd also accept that demand outstrips supply.  After coming a cropper I'd also think that it was encumbent on me to find out how to improve my chances and do some research into the subject to see if there was anything I could do to tip the odds in my favour.

Please don't take this personally, ha, but that's exactly the kind of sharp elbowed behaviour 'we' discourage in other areas as it favours the rugged individualists among us. it's basically a Tory philosophy, no?

Aaaahhhhh! There we go... the system is obviously against you.

Don't be daft Tiny. I've never applied for a ticket. Climbed over innit.

[thepuffpastryhangman]

to reduce demand, they should make the line-up really terrible.

Hey man, don't you like, know? You some kinda square? It aint about the bands man, it aint about the bands ok.

[Tiny Poster]

Don't be daft Tiny. I've never applied for a ticket. Climbed over innit.

So, you love bootlegging and all other kinds of theft now?

[CaledonianGonzo]

Huh? It's not equal if you've got 8 people trying on your behalf and someone else is trying as an individual. The more people you've got trying, the less fair it is.

Well - they've improved that this year by reducing the numbers of tickets that individuals buy.

But, again, if you do some research and networking you improve your chances.  There are quite a few Glastonbury forums where you can pal up with people and try to help each other out. 

At the moment it's simply a system that favours people who come prepared over the people who log into See Tickets at 9.30am still expecting it to be a doddle.

[CaledonianGonzo]

Please don't take this personally, ha, but that's exactly the kind of sharp elbowed behaviour 'we' discourage in other areas as it favours the rugged individualists among us.

Wait a minute - am I an every-man-for-himself rightwinger or part of a comradely ticket-buying cooperative?  I'm confused now.

[thepuffpastryhangman]

So, you love bootlegging and all other kinds of theft now?

As I went walking I saw a sign there
And on the sign it said "No Trespassing."
But on the other side it didn't say nothing,
That side was made for you and me.

Come on Tiny, hop over.

And no. Whenever I was there the event had always sold out. So climbing over deprived no one (connected to Glastonbury) of potential income. In fact, given the amount I spent, almost exclusively on right-on stalls and food outlets, you'd be hard-pushed to assess my contributions as anything other than positive.

[thepuffpastryhangman]

Wait a minute - am I an every-man-for-himself rightwinger or part of a comradely ticket-buying cooperative?  I'm confused now.

Just saying the techniques you describe favour those who're aware of them.

[George Oscar Bluth II]

I like pphm's belief that tickets for events are some sort of human right or something.

[CaledonianGonzo]

Just saying the techniques you describe favour those who're aware of them.

I can't argue with that.  That's techniques for you.

[Johnny Townmouse]

Yeah, there is no good system for Glastonbury tickets, but I do think they could do more to show that they are trying to limit non-paying people who are part of acts entourage and extended crew. I've worked the backstage area before and it was utterly ridiculous how many people were there because they were the brother of the drummer in Shed 7 or whatever.

As I have always been skint I have only ever been the two extremes of Glastonbury - either I jumped the fence, or I was a litter picker/stall worker.

[Beagle 2]

Just saying the techniques you describe favour those who're aware of them.

Yeah, only people who don't realise you need a ticket should be able to apply for tickets, and only if they can demonstrate that they've never heard of Billy Bragg and they don't own a tent.

There's no other way of doing it, it's this or a lottery. In some ways I'd prefer a lottery just so I could have a lie in, but I've never failed to get a ticket this way anyway. And it's fairer that people who love it enough to get a little bit organised have a slightly better chance.

Yeah, there is no good system for Glastonbury tickets, but I do think they could do more to show that they are trying to limit non-paying people who are part of acts entourage and extended crew. I've worked the backstage area before and it was utterly ridiculous how many people were there because they were the brother of the drummer in Shed 7 or whatever.

This is definitely true though. My sister performed last year, and presuming she is again I could probably blag a performer pass without much hassle for next year (judging, as you say, by the no-marks who I encountered backstage).