I'm going to open a record shop

[lazyhour]

Hopefully. Probably. On the South Coast.



How can I make it not shit? What would you look for in a dream record shop? I want to make a place that's actually worth travelling to if you're a record collector, and I'm trying to be thoughful and learn from the mistakes I see other record shops committing.

IDEAS SO FAR:
- Comfy sofa and tea & coffee facilities - sit and listen to records, which I'll gladly play over the speaker system if I don't hate the record
- Turntable and headphones for customers to privately listen to/check records
- Not so much stock that you could never look through it all
- New stuff every week, perhaps only put out on a Saturday to create a fun buzz day when you know new stock's a comin' out
- Records split into genres, but not so deeply that there are a million genre dividers each containing three LPs
- SENSIBLE PRICES that acknowledge eBay and Discogs fucking exist in this universe
- Gradual price reductions for some items that are slow to sell
- Enough space for occasional live performance or DJ events
- Frequently-updated blog/twitter/Facebook account, updated with fun stuff so it's worth following
- Not dusty as shit

Is this a stupid idea because internet/mp3s daddio?

[doppelkorn]

I've mooted this idea and talked to actual record shop owners and the general feedback was

YOU'D HAVE TO BE FUCKING INSANE OR INSANELY RICH TO MAKE THIS WORK.

Not to piss on your chips - maybe you are insanely rich, in which case good on you. I might want to Dragons' Den you for a stake.

[BlodwynPig]

Have a Krautrock section that fills one wall.
Lots of colourful sleeve art on the wall.
Good cataloguing.
Bargain bin with actual bargains in them.

Don't stock Rolling Stones, Beatles, The Who, Oasis.

[lazyhour]

Interesting, doppelkorn. We'd also sell bric-a-brac, vintage stuff and that. In terms of space, the shop'd probably be about a third records, a third bric-a-brac, a third comfy zone.

Old-school record shops are dying, there's no doubt. However, I firmly believe that this is because They Are Arrogantly Doing It Wrong. Interest in and money spent on vinyl is at a real high, yet record shops are struggling? Something up with that.

[Don_Preston]

Consider doing that in Lancaster, devoid of a decent record shop, and I'll become your partner. And then we'll open a record shop...

[lazyhour]

Have a Krautrock section that fills one wall.
Lots of colourful sleeve art on the wall.
Good cataloguing.
Bargain bin with actual bargains in them.

Don't stock Rolling Stones, Beatles, The Who, Oasis.

Massive yes to a bargain bin actually containing bargains. What exactly do you mean by cataloguing? Just sensible use of genre dividers? I don't want to split stuff up too too much, as that can discourage people stumbling across stuff they may not be explicitly looking for. As I said, I don't the shop to be drowning in stock. Instead I want to price things to actually sell, and always have new stock coming in each week. Basically, I'd like someone to come back to the shop 6 months later and find virtually none of the same stock.

[lazyhour]

Said "stock" too many times there, didn't I?

[The Masked Unit]

I've no experience in retail whatsoever and so probably talking shit, but here are a few things I would consider, even if I don't know the answers to them.

1 - Are you going to only sell "serious" music?

Maybe it's worth keeping a small stock of popular titles for the granny that comes in wanting to buy the latest Olly Murs as a Christmas gift. The profit you'll earn from an Olly Murs CD is exactly the same as the profit you'll earn from a trendy band's limited 7" white label.

2 - Creating a nice, non-intimidating environment for everybody.

I'd imagine this is a very difficult balance to get right. I've been part of the inner circle in record shops before - the type of people who become mates with the owner and hang out there practically all day like a sad old drunk with his regular place at the bar. This is great in one way if you get lots of regulars like that who all spend money, but the last thing somebody wants when they come into your shop for the first time is to have to ask the shop keeper about a record in front of a load of chin strokers looking down their nose at them. In one particular shop I can't tell you how many times I've seen people come in for a browse and beat a hasty retreat when they see a load of pally people at the counter talking about the latest whatever. I don't really know how you'd go about managing that.

Is this a stupid idea because internet/mp3s daddio?

Probably, but there must be places out there that are doing well.

Good luck!

[Pepotamo1985]

http://croydonmunicipal.blogspot.co.uk/2013/01/how-hmv-can-save-itself.html

[checkoutgirl]

Turntable and headphones for customers to privately listen to/check records

That and knowledgeable staff and some new stock in every week that the staff can make suggestions and give over a pile of records that you can listen to when you give the staff a genre. The sensible prices suggestion is funny in that not many people are going to demand high prices. You'd probably need to sell tamagochi and ipod coverings with cats on them to make ends meet. A small section with Danny Dyer calendars and ASBO bumper stickers would probably help keep the place afloat.

It's a mad idea considering the Galactus of Amazon that is hoovering the high street clean of any quirky interesting businesses.

Have you considered opening a shop that sells stuff with Miley Cyrus or One Direction on it? Any old crap will do, just paste on a picture of Eddie Styles off that boyband and wait for the cash to roll in.

[lazyhour]

Note: it would be an entirely 2nd-hand shop.

Checkoutgirl - the 'sensible prices' concept is one that surprisingly few record shops get entirely right. So often I've seen something I've quite fancied in a record shop, then stopped myself because I've thought "I bet it's literally half that price on the internet." A visit to Rat Records in Camberwell, however, always results in a purchase. The only difference is that their prices are more sensible.

Masked Unit - I totally agree that creating a friendly, non-intimidating space is crucial. Luckily for me I'm not a sneering arse!

[lazyhour]

the staff can make suggestions and give over a pile of records that you can listen to when you give the staff a genre.

^ This is a lovely idea.

[mook]

incorporate it into run down back street pub.

[dr beat]

Just make sure you've got a good website with mp3 clips of new releases which can be streamed.  Basically like what Piccadilly Records in Manchester do.

Also incorporating beer into the equation somehow.  Pure Groove records in London used to do this, although sadly they shut.

[checkoutgirl]

concept is one that surprisingly few record shops get entirely right. So often I've seen something I've quite fancied in a record shop, then stopped myself because I've thought "I bet it's literally half that price on the internet." A visit to Rat Records in Camberwell, however, always results in a purchase. The only difference is that their prices are more sensible.

Yeah I was being a smart arse. I know what you mean about the prices, the tricky bit is pricing it low enough to sell but not so low you're out on your arse because you can't pay the rent or afford any stock. Amazon being so cheap is a reality that's ended many a nice business. Abbey Discs in Dublin was famous for the knowledgeable staff who knew how to sell and what records to give to who. They were constantly making up bags for DJs and were well loved for the atmosphere and expertise of the staff and had a big loyal customer base. Still closed in 2008. If that place can close then I don't know.

On the plus side that shop was outlasted by a well crusty shop around the corner that sold all sorts of crap. Jumpers, books, calendars, old records and god knows what. It's definitely doable. I don't know what my point was.

[Danger Man]

Hopefully. Probably. On the South Coast.

Fantastic idea.

I still have around 800 cds that I haven't bothered to sell and I'm looking to shift them really soon.

How about £800 for the lot?[nb]This is my first attempt at arab style 'haggling'[/nb]


5....4....3.....2......

[lazyhour]

cds

lol

[Danger Man]

£700?

[El Unicornio, mang]

You're going to struggle a lot if you plan on only selling vinyl records. Also, have lots of events.

[lazyhour]

Do you mean 'only vinyl' as in no CDs?

The shop will probably sell:

Records
Some books
Some comics, both underground and superhero type
Ceramics - 60s vases, Poole plates, stuff like that
Trendy, collectable vintage tat - retro toys, ephemera, vintage ashtrays, etc
Coffee, tea and cake

And I agree that a healthy stream of 'events' is a good idea.

[El Unicornio, mang]

I would definitely stock CDs. They account for about 85% of indie record store sales, plus people are offloading them at such low prices at car boot sales, ebay, etc that you can get shitloads of them for next to nothing then mark them up massively in the store. I have friends who regularly buy second hand CDs for $10 from indie record stores that were probably bought for about 25 cents. There are also some nice limited edition CD box sets/imports which look quite nice on the shelves.

[23 Daves]

If it's a vintage/ bric-a-brac shop as well, try to obtain some reasonably priced vintage record players and gear - Dansettes and the like.  You don't have to play mint or rare records on them, and I'd advise you not to because the stylus is a bit heavy on the record's grooves.  A friend of mine runs a vintage store in North London, doesn't really sell records, but there's nothing like one of them in action to bring in the gawpers.  They make immediate sense to both the hipster retro-kids and the grannies, who "haven't seen one of those working in ages".

For my part, I picked up a working stacking Elizabethan Astronaut player on ebay for £40.  They're the most inexpensive machines purely because they date from 1969 and have transistor rather than valve amps.  But the mechanism of it still fascinates people, and something as cheap as that could potentially pay for itself in no time.  It also fits with the theme of the store.  You could even consider selling them, but unless you have an electrical engineer regularly on call and can offer guarantees to your customers, it's probably not worth it (though I did visit a record shop in Amsterdam which specialised in both vinyl and old stacking record players, so it has been done before). 

Bargain boxes are a great idea - nothing pulls me into a record store like a bargain box - but consider stocking repro reissues of old vinyl as well as official second-hand stuff.

One of the owners of a record store I go into is also presently complaining that he no longer understands the market because "kids" keep coming into his store and buying oddities, novelty records and stuff he was considering binning.  So put plenty of things like that in your bargain box, if only to bulk it out.  If it looks weird and it's £1 or less, it seems to be in with a fighting chance right now. I'm always amazed when record store owners bin Tiswas spin-off singles, for example - your customers are just as likely to be the kind of people who are interested in all kinds of media besides music, and chances are they'll walk out with something like that even if it is shit (I know I do). 

[lazyhour]

Brilliant advice, Daves.

When I find dusty old record shops in little towns, I always ask what soundtrack/weird/novelty stuff they have, and they are always baffled by the request. They rarely even think to pull this stuff together (especially with 45s) so if they do have anything of that nature, they can't tell me where it is!

[Colin Sanction]

This is how we do record shops in my neck of the woods - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dCabJybt4j4

If you love vinyl, you'll love^* this documentary

_{*Actual love may not apply, terms and conditions apply}

[lazyhour]

Yep, I have watched and do love that documentary! :)

[El Unicornio, mang]

Good documentary. I found it quite bleak as it was shot in my home region (the Status Quo bloke especially) but lots of funny moments.

[Danger Man]

I would definitely stock CDs.

Do you want to buy 800 cds?

$8,000.

[23 Daves]

Brilliant advice, Daves.

When I find dusty old record shops in little towns, I always ask what soundtrack/weird/novelty stuff they have, and they are always baffled by the request. They rarely even think to pull this stuff together (especially with 45s) so if they do have anything of that nature, they can't tell me where it is!

A lot of record stores are owned by people with very clearly defined tastes, I've found.  They expect to natter with their customers about the joys of folk/ prog/ psych/ punk/ soul, but are very sniffy if customers walk in with divergent interests - and as such, they don't understand how their audience has changed.  A lot of vinyl buyers now seem to want eighties records, for example, which I don't think many people have noticed.  The amateur DJs around London always seem to be dropping slick eighties soul and funk tracks and getting a response to them, perhaps because the present generation is removed enough from that era for it to be of serious classical interest to them.  I can only imagine the response they get if they wander into some of the shops I frequent asking for 12" singles by the Mary Jane Girls or Freeez, though.

If you do stock oddities and you're online, be sure to email me your details... I'll definitely be interested. 

[El Unicornio, mang]

Do you want to buy 800 cds?

$8,000.

I threw away all my CDs a few years ago when I moved and realised I had most of them on my computer anyway.

I'll take them!

[lazyhour]

If you do stock oddities and you're online, be sure to email me your details... I'll definitely be interested.

Will do! I seem to recall you bought a Pink Floyd "See Emily Play" 7" off me many years ago on eBay...

I've been dabbling in record selling at London car boot sales for a year or two now, and people always compliment me on the prices I'm charging for good records. They don't seem to want eighties stuff, though. I must be doing something right if I'm getting people to part with the best part of £50 for a handful of records at a car boot sale.

The way I price stuff is really simple - I look at Completed listings on eBay (and sometimes double-check with Discogs) and find a fair average price based on what the record in the same condition actually goes for. I price it up as the average price plus postage minus a quid or so. This way, you'd have to be lucky to buy what I'm selling for less on eBay, especially considering postage costs for LPs. I win because I still get to add in most of the postage cost without having to actually post the things.