MS-DOS software library (FREE GAMES!)

[Mister Six]

Was this around the face on Mars section? Think I might have had a similar knock off buggy copy, also the proper game came with a fake newspaper full of clues for the game so I don't know how I got so far without the damn thing.

Mine was bugged in one of the mazes, maybe the face on Mars? It was right at the end, when you needed to... do something.  I forget. Brilliant game up to that point, though (even if the mazes were a bag of shite).

[biggytitbo]

All of the maze levels in Lucasarts point and click games are fucking awful.

[Johnny Yesno]

All of the maze levels in Lucasarts point and click games are fucking awful.

Nah, the foresty ones in Monkey Island (I? II? I forget) are great and very atmospheric. LucasArts were doing some much needed innovation such as making sure that Guybrush would always appear on the opposite side of the next screen from the one he left. Seems obvious now but IIRC, this was an issue with Sierra games (and something they actually managed to screw up in MIIV). In fact being able to die was an issue with Sierra games, which LucasArts eschewed in favour of just getting stuck.

[Consignia]

In fact being able to die was an issue with Sierra games, which LucasArts eschewed in favour of just getting stuck.

Yeah, I never really liked any of the Sierra games for that reason. In fact I rarely bother LucasArts adventures before Monkey Island[nb]yes, I know you can die in Monkey Island, but you won't happen upon it by accident.[/nb], when they started to implement the no death mechanic. I know it was possible in Fate of Atlantis, but unless you were on the Fists path or actively searching for a way to die, you could easily avoid it.

[biggytitbo]

The maze like levels in money island aren't as frustrating as the ones in the two Indy games but they're still the worst part of the game. And they were just as irratating when broken sword 2 ripped them off too.

[MojoJojo]

Even in MI 1, the maze was a bit too long and the directions not quite unambiguous enough to make it not-annoying[nb]although I played it on the Amiga with ridiculous loading times - might have been better on PC[/nb]

Can't remember a maze in MI 2.

[Consignia]

Which maze in MI1? Finding the Swordmaster involved

Spoiler alert

following someone to her house

[close]

rather than navigating a maze. The underground maze to LeChuck's ship similarly didn't have much actual mazing,

Spoiler alert

just heading in the direction the Navigator's head pointed in

[close]

. Both weren't as bad as actual long mazes.

[Steven]

Which maze in MI1?

To be honest that one and the jungle one in Zak McKracken weren't very hard, but yeah should have no place in an adventure game.

[biggytitbo]

Somebody's doing a hd remake of Fate of Atlantis http://youtu.be/BbyuyEJ-b9Y

Backgrounds look great, not sure about Indy though.

[Consignia]

There's no real need for it though, is there? Fate of Atlantis is one of my favourite games ever, so I obviously have no interest in any remakes, but the original stands as it is. Remember the charmless Monkey Island HD remakes. I get the same sense from that.

[Steven]

These HD versions usually looks atrocious because they don't have the talent of the original artists, everything looks kind of bland and generic. Though a lot of the work on say the close-ups on MI1 and a lot of Monkey 2 were scanned in from proper drawings and paintings, so could have been re-scanned in HD but I doubt they still had the material sitting around by the time they did the special edition stuff.

People tend to like games as they remembered them, and I doubt the new graphics draw in that many news players. Better off using the effort of redoing an old game for doing a new one.

[biggytitbo]

Yeah a new indy game would be better. There is a fan game using the Last Crusade era graphics that's quite nice.

[Mister Six]

Yeah, I never really liked any of the Sierra games for that reason. In fact I rarely bother LucasArts adventures before Monkey Island[nb]yes, I know you can die in Monkey Island, but you won't happen upon it by accident.[/nb], when they started to implement the no death mechanic. I know it was possible in Fate of Atlantis, but unless you were on the Fists path or actively searching for a way to die, you could easily avoid it.

Maniac Mansion is hard to get killed in, and in Zak McKracken it's even harder. I'd definitely suggest giving the latter two a stab. Last Crusade - I know you can get killed in the punch-ups (especially if you don't have a numeric keypad, because they're a bugger to play) but that's also difficult to kark it in. And I'm pretty sure you can't die in Loom. Basically, go back and play those games (especially Last Crusade and Loom), because you're missing out.

Also, there's a good dig at Sierra's shitty game design in Monkey Island - you can see it (with awful de-pixelisation emulator effect) here.

[Mister Six]

To be honest that one and the jungle one in Zak McKracken weren't very hard, but yeah should have no place in an adventure game.

The problem with the Zak mazes is that there's far more than just one of them. There's at least four: the Martian pyramid, the Egyptian pyramid, the South American jungle and (IIRC) the Tibet jungle. And maybe more.

[Consignia]

Maniac Mansion is hard to get killed in, and in Zak McKracken it's even harder. I'd definitely suggest giving the latter two a stab. Last Crusade - I know you can get killed in the punch-ups (especially if you don't have a numeric keypad, because they're a bugger to play) but that's also difficult to kark it in.

I've played all of them, except Zak McKracken, and in Last Crusade and Maniac Mansion, I did end up dying quite frequently. I was quite young when I played them though, so the puzzles were quite difficult on the side. You can't die in Loom, but I'm sure that was after Monkey Island.

[MojoJojo]

To be honest that one and the jungle one in Zak McKracken weren't very hard, but yeah should have no place in an adventure game.

I think the main problem was it was basically a simple puzzle which even when you worked it out could be a bit fiddly to do. Also the disk loading on the Amiga meant it was a fairly long dull section even if you did it right. Much less annoying if looking at the instructions or changing screen doesn't take 30-40 seconds.

[Mister Six]

I've played all of them, except Zak McKracken, and in Last Crusade and Maniac Mansion, I did end up dying quite frequently. I was quite young when I played them though, so the puzzles were quite difficult on the side. You can't die in Loom, but I'm sure that was after Monkey Island.

They were both released the same year, so presumably developed consecutively. I just wanted to make sure you knew about it, because it's ace.

[garbed_attic]

I actually enjoy the old Sierra adventures a lot more now than I did when I was a child... I love how earnestly po-faced they are, especially the Police Quest games, which are like something Hank Hill would design. I love that you get chucked out of the game for not putting on your seat-belt.

Also, I reckon King's Quest 6 genuinely holds up well as a fully realised vision... it relies less on stock characters and fantasy clichés than the other games in the series and is really very charming in places. Decent puzzles too.

[Steven]

They were both released the same year, so presumably developed consecutively. I just wanted to make sure you knew about it, because it's ace.

Loom came out before Monkey Island, of course there was the Scumm Bar pirate with the advertisement for it on his jacket. I didn't actually play Loom until a year or so after Monkey Island came out because I never saw it in the shops but got a pirate copy off somebody without the instructions, didn't get very far as I didn't understand the musical note puzzle system, put it away. Came back a year or so later and managed to figure it out and played right through to the end, great game with a superb atmosphere. They were working on a trilogy but it never panned out due to Lucasarts breaking up talent for various other projects, I'm sure a kickstarter campaign would be on the books if the associated talent had the time.

[Phil_A]

The maze like levels in money island aren't as frustrating as the ones in the two Indy games but they're still the worst part of the game. And they were just as irratating when broken sword 2 ripped them off too.

Last Crusade was about 80% mazes, wasn't it? You had the catacombs maze, followed by the Nazi fortress maze, followed by the Zeppelin maze...actually I think that was it. But that's still quite a lot of mazes for such a short game.

It also had possibly the most frustrating and poorly-implemented fighting mechanic ever. Why did they bother? Were they frightened of alienating arcade gamers, even though it was very clearly labelled "The ADVENTURE Game", and a separate Last Crusade arcade game had already been published?

[Steven]

It also had possibly the most frustrating and poorly-implemented fighting mechanic ever. Why did they bother? Were they frightened of alienating arcade gamers, even though it was very clearly labelled "The ADVENTURE Game", and a separate Last Crusade arcade game had already been published?

Lucasarts had a small team so I'm guessing the particular 'puzzle' guys were busy with other projects so mazes and that kind of shite were thrown in to fill out the game. Also Lucasarts put out some great original titles but due to Lucas owning the license for some big brands like Star Wars and Indy the team would be constantly pushed to develop games using those pretty much limiting their imaginations, I'm sure they'd have things like two small teams simultaneously developing an Indy adventure game and a fighting game and eventually merge both projects due to reasons of time and finance or just try to merge both ideas out of some base need to serve every taste.

Eventually Lucasarts just turned into the Star Wars franchise brigade and all hope was lost.

[Johnny Yesno]

To be honest that one and the jungle one in Zak McKracken weren't very hard, but yeah should have no place in an adventure game.

I disagree. The atmos in the forest is wonderful.

These HD versions usually looks atrocious because they don't have the talent of the original artists, everything looks kind of bland and generic. Though a lot of the work on say the close-ups on MI1 and a lot of Monkey 2 were scanned in from proper drawings and paintings, so could have been re-scanned in HD but I doubt they still had the material sitting around by the time they did the special edition stuff.

People tend to like games as they remembered them, and I doubt the new graphics draw in that many news players. Better off using the effort of redoing an old game for doing a new one.

Well, that's why they gave you the option of switching easily between the two on the updated version. I was torn between them because I liked the new graphics but I preferred the old control system.

[biggytitbo]

What's this, a film version of It Came From The Desert? http://youtu.be/c-J6GMLtpq8

[lazarou]

Eh, it's been done. Sort of.

[Replies From View]

I actually enjoy the old Sierra adventures a lot more now than I did when I was a child... I love how earnestly po-faced they are, especially the Police Quest games, which are like something Hank Hill would design. I love that you get chucked out of the game for not putting on your seat-belt.

Also, I reckon King's Quest 6 genuinely holds up well as a fully realised vision... it relies less on stock characters and fantasy clichés than the other games in the series and is really very charming in places. Decent puzzles too.

King's Quest III was on my parents' first computer when I was a kid - a second hand amstrad of some kind that also had Lemmings, Prince of Persia, PGA Tour Golf and Windows 3.0.  A full 16 colours that machine had.

Anyway King's Quest III needed a book to complete, which we didn't have.  It didn't even inform the player that it needed this book or the book existed (it allowed you to continue thinking you could just play the game with knowledge and intuition), but crucial things like spells had to be very precisely typed or it would be game over.  You couldn't guess them.  Fine to have copy protection in games but have that at the start, surely, not integral to completion of the game when you're already part way through.

[Steven]

Fnarr, X-Files related detective based point `n' click adventure game? Yes please - Darkside Detective.

[biggytitbo]

That looks nice but its a bit too pixelated isn't it? More so than ms dos games anyway.

[Steven]

It's a stylistic choice I imagine, retro 8-bit graphics have been back in for years since mobile Apps became popular, though obviously the simpleness means it's quicker and easier to churn out graphics and therefore the art team doesn't need to be so big for these smaller startup games companies. Though there is something to be said of minimalism, being pixally frugal as it were can mean doing game art can be a lot more accessible and therefore non-artists doing other bits of the game can moonlight doing this other aspect to save on pay - obviously like in days of yore.

[biggytitbo]

Oh yeah I get that, they just look even more pixelated than the things they're homaging. I really loved the art style of the blackwell games so im generally a fan of that look.

[Steven]

Well yeah it's obviously an artistic choice, hence the characters having no faces etc. Though I tend to think the art styles around the Monkey Island 2/Day Of The Tentacle/Sam & Max era were the best, Ron Gilbert's Thimbleweed Park has ultra retro pretty rubbish Zak McKracken looking graphics but I'm stoked for it as it looks like it has that humour and logic from the early Lucasfilm games. I backed Tim Schaffer's Broken Age game but haven't played it yet due to 2nd part not being out, don't like the art style at all and the finished game is constantly being delayed from his endless ambition - the crux of the problem with Kickstarter.

At least I think Ron Gilbert's minimalism, going back to SCUMM etc, he'll get something up to standard out on a schedule even if it looks dated.