Batman V Superman

[kittens]

i was really excited for man of steel but when i saw it i thought it was bad. however it introduced me to michael shannon who might be the best man



look at that. fuck me

[Bad Ambassador]

he's been portrayed in many darker stories and interpretations throughout that time.

[Blumf]

Dark

[Kelvin]

I'd seriously love the next reboot of these films of be a Grant Morrison-style mash up of all the maddest stuff they've ever done.

Or Mr Mxyzptlk.

[Tiny Poster]

Another big problem with MoS is the complete lack of wit and ingenuity. How do the mighty Superman and intrepid reporter Lois Lane work out how to defeat the baddies? How do they battle them using their minds? Well, they just listen to the ghost of Jor-El who tells them step-by-step exactly what they need to do.

[popcorn]

Another big problem with MoS is the complete lack of wit and ingenuity. How do the mighty Superman and intrepid reporter Lois Lane work out how to defeat the baddies? How do they battle them using their minds? Well, they just listen to the ghost of Jor-El who tells them step-by-step exactly what they need to do.

If I recall correctly, after punching him through buildings for several hours, Superman finally manages to defeat the baddie by punching him one last time, very hard.

A terrible film.

[Pit-Pat]

I'm sick of this dark and gritty shit. Can't they just cook for each other, play hilarious practical jokes and talk about their relationships on the Justic League space station?

[Johnny Textface]

If I recall correctly, after punching him through buildings for several hours, Superman finally manages to defeat the baddie by punching him one last time, very hard.

Yeah he breaks his neck. Wish he'd done it 40 mins sooner.

[Replies From View]

I'm sick of this dark and gritty shit. Can't they just cook for each other, play hilarious practical jokes and talk about their relationships on the Justic League space station?

They will do in Capeman 1 vs Capeman 2 2:  Home Economics.

[Noodle Lizard]

That trailer does look quite nice.  I think the Batman looks a little goofy, but there are some nice shots and it's nowhere near as trite as most comic book movie trailers seem to be.

[marquis_de_sad]

I just wish he'd made a more fun Superman film. And a shorter one, cos fuck did that drag. I only went twice cos I fancied a lady who wanted to go. I don't think my poor bum has ever forgiven me

That's your own fault for letting her fuck you in the arse.

[Custard]

It was one of those nights :(

[Operty1]

One of the criticisms levelled at Superman Returns was that Superman didn't physically fight anyone. In Man Of Steel they remedied that by having him punch everything...for ages, I'm surprised he didn't punch Lois when he saw her (though he did burn her with heat vision). There was no heroism in Man Of Steel and no heart, there was no bumbling Clark and that's a massive part of the character. There were no spectacular saves like the plane in Superman Returns, no wonder the planet is scared of him, he's a maniac.

[checkoutgirl]

Minutes before, they were knocking each other for miles with absolute ease, yet in the big final moment Supes can't shift Zod an inch

If there was a nerdy, sad, pathetic CommicBookGuy style moan I had about ManofSteel it would be the fight physics. They bash each other to fuck, smashing through buildings and punching each other at 6,000 miles an hour without a scratch. Then he twists his neck and he's dead. It makes no sense at all.

[Johnny Textface]

If there was a nerdy, sad, pathetic CommicBookGuy style moan I had about ManofSteel it would be the fight physics. They bash each other to fuck, smashing through buildings and punching each other at 6,000 miles an hour without a scratch. Then he twists his neck and he's dead. It makes no sense at all.

IMO it was an extremely bad idea to kill Zod anyway.  For starters - it's completely out of character for Supes, but more than that - Zod was pretty underused as a character and now there's no chance of him making an appearance in the DC universe going forward.  He should have flown off.

[Old Nehamkin]

i was really excited for man of steel but when i saw it i thought it was bad. however it introduced me to michael shannon who might be the best man

Here, have you seen Take Shelter? That is a good film about Michael Shannon.

[Blumf]

look at that. fuck me

Proof that James Cagney and Malcolm McDowell got it on.

[Tiny Poster]

IMO it was an extremely bad idea to kill Zod anyway.  For starters - it's completely out of character for Supes, but more than that - Zod was pretty underused as a character and now there's no chance of him making an appearance in the DC universe going forward.  He should have flown off.

I think BleedingCool pointed out that all Superman had to do was cover Zod's eyes with his hand to prevent him from heat-beaming that family.

[Custard]

There was also a nice bit of unintentional comedy following that, with Supes letting out an anguished scream at the heavens at what he'd been "forced" to do

Then the next scene, he's back to normal

Christopher Reeve's Supes would just lob people out into space. Cracking necks would've been somewhat of a downer

[Blumf]

Christopher Reeve's Supes would just lob people out into space. Cracking necks would've been somewhat of a downer

Well.... there's a bit of confusion/controversy about that in Superman II (which would also includes Lois killing Ursa)

[MojoJojo]

All this could be cleared up by reading that comic book...what's it called? The Dark Knight Returns? Obviously I'm not going to because I'm not 10 years old. We'll have to wait for the film.

Now I think back to it, the actual reason they fight in The Dark Knight Returns are a bit shit - basically Superman is asked to by the President because ... Batman is being enforcing some order[nb]ok, violently[/nb] after a nuclear attack knocks out the power? And governments are bad.

It sort of worked in the comic but probably a sign of what a nutjob Miller is, and there wasn't actually any irony.

[alcoholic messiah]

Now I think back to it, the actual reason they fight in The Dark Knight Returns are a bit shit - basically Superman is asked to by the President because ... Batman is being enforcing some order after a nuclear attack knocks out the power? And governments are bad.

It was more a case of two opposing philosophies clashing.

The politicians and police didn't like having superheroes gallivanting around the place, as it conspicuously served to undermine their own power, or at least Joe Public's perception of it.

They'll kill us if they can, Bruce. Every year they grow smaller. Every year they hate us more. We must not remind them that giants walk the earth.

Supes became a covert weapon answering to the beck and call of the government, but Bats decided that his duty lay with the people, and not the politicians.

Still talking -- keep talking, Clark... you've always known just what to say. "Yes" -- you always say yes -- to anyone with a badge -- or a flag.

The rest of us learned to cope. The rest of us recognized the danger -- of the endless envy of those not blessed.

We could have changed the world. Now look at us. I've become a political liability, and you, you're a joke.

The resolution to the story is all about

Spoiler alert

Bruce adopting a sustainable solution that falls between the two extremes, one that allows him to continue serving the people without attracting the unwanted attention of the authorities.

[close]

.

[Mister Six]

I continue to think that the complaints about the DC films being too serious stems from a kind of snobbery that persuades us that blockbuster films, and more specifically comic book films, ought to be inherently light and fun, and that a film like this, which seems to take itself more seriously, is therefore either pompous or misjudged.

It's a BLOODY SUPERMAN FILM.

It shouldn't be dark and grey and foreboding when it's got BLOODY SUPERMAN IN IT.

Also Zack Snyder is a fucking idiot whose films genuinely are shit for cunts.

[marquis_de_sad]

My my, that Frank Miller dialogue that alcoholic messiah quoted was shit. I mean, libertarian teenage fanfiction shit. It's nice to have a reminder every now again to stay well away from Miller's embarrassing drivel.

[Kelvin]

It's a BLOODY SUPERMAN FILM.

It shouldn't be dark and grey and foreboding when it's got BLOODY SUPERMAN IN IT.

I fundamentally disagree with that. I believe any character can be done in a whole range of styles and tones. Indeed, throughout his long and varied history, Superman himself has appeared in a variety of darker, bleaker, or more realistic stories. He's been troubled and angst ridden. He's killed. He's even killed Zod before in the comics. When I read people saying a Superman film shouldn't be dark and gritty, what I take from that is that they're own preferred iteration of Superman isn't dark and gritty. Or the version they were brought up on, or see most often in popular culture.

Which is fine. I totally understand that everyone has their own preferences or ideas of what Superman - or any character - should be. But if we only allow ourselves one tone or approach to these characters, we'd never have had interpretations of Batman as diverse as 60's Batman and Nolan's Batman. Or Bond films as different as Roger Moore's and Daniel Craig's. Great character's survive by being flexible and open to different interpretations, that try new things and find new relevance.

Again, I don't think Man of Steel is a great film. It's a film with huge problems. But I honestly don't think the problems are anything to do with the tone of the film, or even the significant changes to his character. A better script, with the same tone and visual style, would be a brilliant film, regardless of whether it matched my expectations of how Superman should behave, or what his film should be like.   

[Pit-Pat]

When I read people saying a Superman film shouldn't be dark and gritty, what I take from that is that they're own preferred iteration of Superman isn't dark and gritty. Or the version they were brought up on, or see most often in popular culture.

I agree with you to some degree, and I would more so if it felt like dark/gritty was a genuine artistic choice that had been considered for its own reasons, but in Man of Steel it feels like it's nothing more than an attempt to emulate The Dark Knight and a vague sense that comic book films need to be gritty and dark to be taken seriously, which has now been proven wrong.

I agree that there are a million interpretations of each character, but Man of Steel feels less like an interpretation than an attempt to bend and break Superman until he fits through a door marked 'Grimdark Batman'.

[Kane Jones]

A lighter tone doesn't always work.  The bit in Thor 2 where he gets on the Tube is the single unfunniest and most embarrassing moment in any comic book adaptation ever. I almost ate the cushion I was hiding behind. Awful.

[Ant Farm Keyboard]

Yeah, I agree that there's no need for Superman to be always depicted with the lighter tone of the 70s-80s films.
The problem is that they're now Dark Knighting every superhero in the DC Comics canon, as if dark-and-gritty was the new one-size-fits-all solution. Putting Snyder in charge, while the guy is the epitome of looks over substance, is a major mistake.

[Custard]

Just wanna chime in to agree with a previous poster that the new(ish) Batman animated film Assault On Arkham is pretty great, and a lorra fun.

If Batman vs Superman is even a quarter as enjoyable as that, I will be pleasantly surprised

Then I watched Batman and Superman: Public Enemies. That wasn't quite as good, but they got the two heroes right, and it was enjoyable watching them tag team a constant barrage of enemies. Again, it was just FUN. And Supes didn't need to snap any necks. He punched them all right up in the face

[Kelvin]

Just wanna chime in to agree with a previous poster that the new(ish) Batman animated film Assault On Arkham is pretty great, and a lorra fun.

If Batman vs Superman is even a quarter as enjoyable as that, I will be pleasantly surprised

Then I watched Batman and Superman: Public Enemies. That wasn't quite as good, but they got the two heroes right, and it was enjoyable watching them tag team a constant barrage of enemies. Again, it was just FUN. And Supes didn't need to snap any necks. He punched them all right up in the face

I've got all those DC animations. If you want a recommendation, and you don't have it already, get this:

http://www.amazon.co.uk/Superman-Animated-Triple-Pack-DVD/dp/B00BWU1EHA/ref=pd_sim_d_h__4?ie=UTF8&refRID=1GQN1D7HFEQWRBJ2EDMH

It has a bunch of feature length episodes of the Superman TV series, but more importantly, a very good animated version of "All Star Superman", the incredibly good Grant Morrison comic. The're another 5 pack of Superman films, as well, but I don't think they're as good. The Batman 5 pack is very good, though. And has animated versions of Batman: Year One, and Under The Red Hood, plus the theatrical release of Mask of The Phantasm, all of which are really strong.

http://www.amazon.co.uk/Batman-Animated-Box-Set-DVD/dp/B007V3OT1U/ref=pd_bxgy_d_h__img_y

Finally, The Flash Point Paradox is darker than a lot of the other, but lots of fun, with some lovely animation, and best of all, the two Dark Knight Returns adaptions (part 1 and part 2) are essential buys for any Batman fan.