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Suicide Squad

Started by Ja'moke, April 25, 2015, 10:37:30 AM

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Blumf

Quote from: The Region Legion on May 05, 2015, 01:26:27 PM
in Arkham Asylum where I am a doctor despite clearly being insane myself, good thing there wasn't any kind of psych evaluation for the staff.


Ignatius_S

Quote from: Claude the Racecar Driving Rockstar Super Sleuth on May 04, 2015, 01:36:30 AM
Has Will Smith's box office appeal taken a real nosedive recently? This seems like a fairly obscure looking picture for him to be playing this fiddle in.

It's far too early to say. What's not mentioned in links that Dr Rock posted was that Smith had a very poor period from the time of Wild Wild West where consecutive films lost money at the box office – although people might think favourably of Ali, especially with Smith being nominated for best actor Oscar, it flopped commercially. That said, the main appeal for the star in such biopics is that

Although After Earth was a flop, it might have broken even from the box office; as it wasn't critically well received that it managed to make so money could be argued to be due to Smith's star appeal. Although Focus could be said to have underperformed, it had a modest budget and made a very healthy profit – personally, I think it was a rather odd comeback film and realistically, it wasn't going to set the box office on fire.

I do recall a few years ago that hacks suggesting that Tom Cruise's career as a star was ending, but he seems to have managed to done not too shabbily since then. The press can be a little keen in writing off someone.

FWIW, I do think that the comparative failure of After Earth was a reason Smith signed on to Suicide Squad and if it had been a smash, he would have been less keen being in an ensemble film. However, as superhero films have been making lots of money, unless something goes horribly wrong, Smith is going to be in a box office hit. Importantly, for me, Deadshot should be – unless they muck it up – a great character that has yet to be portrayed in film and FWIW, the character won't be used again in the Arrow series again for a considerable time at the very least, rather limiting the comparisons that can be made.

Quote from: Ignatius_S on May 05, 2015, 02:10:09 PM
What's not mentioned in links that Dr Rock posted was that Smith had a very poor period from the time of Wild Wild West where consecutive films lost money at the box office

I'm not surprised. I liked 'Fresh Prince' as a child, but I went right off Will Smith when 'Wild Wild West' came along. I disliked the film even before I saw it, because it was promoted in such an aggravating way.

If you went to the cinema during that time, you would be "treated" to the entire Wild Wild West music video, instead of a simple trailer. The full version of the video, which is 4-and-a-half minutes long. I saw it too many times— once was enough, really— and I developed a deep resentment for it.

"Wicky-wa-wa, wicky-wicky-wa-wa..."

A really irritating kiddy-rap, with an expensive, glorifying music video. It was like a big-budget version of PJ & Duncan. Then the film came out, and that was rubbish too.

Quote from: Blumf on May 05, 2015, 01:39:14 PM


Almost a fair point but there's some logic to his character being there. His motivations are clear - he's a scientist, experimenting on people for whom society has no interest in the wellbeing of. It's happened throughout history. He's also a sociopath, quite able to hide his evil nature.

He also doesn't have a stupid, sign-posting name. Dr. Jonathan Crane becomes Scarecrow because of his actions. Harleen Quinzel becomes Harley Quinn because it was basically already her name for no reason. It's like Selina Kyle being called Felina Klaus. Actually no, it's even stupider than that. It's like Selina Kyle being called Katt Woomun.


Thing is, it would be fine in a Schumaker Batman film. If they were going for a middle ground between that cartoonish world and the Nolan films, then it could work, but if anything they're actually trying to make this version darker, which means you can't also have all the silly villains.

Also, trying to introduce them all in one film in which they're technically the good guys really dilutes them as villains for later, doesn't it? I cannot wait to see how badly this all flops.

Quote from: The Region Legion on May 05, 2015, 02:40:42 PM
Harleen Quinzel becomes Harley Quinn because it was basically already her name for no reason. It's like Selina Kyle being called Felina Klaus. Actually no, it's even stupider than that. It's like Selina Kyle being called Katt Woomun.

Well, Harley Quinn is a character from the animated series, who was later added to the comics. The TAS was aimed at kids[nb]yes it was, don't argue[/nb], so it's a bit cheap and petty of you to criticise the character for having a facile name.

Besides, it's no worse a name than "Batman" or "Superman", which both sound like something a particularly unimaginative five-year-old would come up with.

#65
Quote from: Default to the negative on May 05, 2015, 02:58:49 PM
Well, Harley Quinn is a character from the animated series, who was later added to the comics. The TAS was aimed at kids[nb]yes it was, don't argue[/nb], so it's a bit cheap and petty of you to criticise the character for having a facile name.

Not really. It's just a stupid name that, like I said, works if it's set in a cartoon world but when its put in the Man Of Steel universe of washed out colours, rain and sadness, just sounds obviously stupid.

QuoteBesides, it's no worse a name than "Batman" or "Superman", which both sound like something a particularly unimaginative five-year-old would come up with.

Well Batman is exactly what he is - a bat man. Superman has yet to be referred to as such in the film series, but again is just an easy shorthand, exactly the kind of thing that newspapers would call someone doing that kind of thing, and the name would just stick wouldn't it?

What possible reason does Harleen Quinzell have to go by a psudonym when her secret identity isn't a secret? Just bollocks really.

Also, Will Smith as Deadshot completely passed me by. The whole thing can fuck off now. Ben Affleck as Batman with Will Smith as a major villain? This is Batman & Robin levels of shit casting.

Blumf

The name complaint isn't really worth it (especially in a world where Catwoman was portrayed by Eartha Kitt). Who cares about 'Harleen Quinzell'? The character's backstory makes enough (comic book) sense.

I think there's something in the point about her not being a good fit for live action, grimdark stuff, particularly if you're thinking of the original TV toon version of Harley. A different take could work maybe, but they'd have to get the character exactly right, very tough. The fact that they're going for some Courtney Love/Tank Girl mess along with the other Hot Topic rejects does not bode well.




Mango Chimes

Quote from: The Region Legion on May 05, 2015, 03:07:01 PMWhat possible reason does Harleen Quinzell have to go by a psudonym when her secret identity isn't a secret? Just bollocks really.

Because it's fun! Fun fun fun fun fun.

I'm not really arguing with you, of course, because you're right it doesn't really fit a boring colour-sapped bore-o-verse.

I'd argue neither does Superman concealing his identity by popping on some specs.  Nor a billionaire dressing up as a bat to fight crime.  Both of them wearing capes.

Custard

I've always told myself Superman is so super, that he can change his face when he becomes Clark Kent. Even though he clearly hasn't

BUT THAT WHAT I TELL MYSELF

Tiny Poster


Custard

That looks much better!

Let's not forget btw, that Will Smith turned down the lead in Django Unchained

But this, THIS, he's in

BRen

Why has there been zero attempt to bring the Riddler back since Batman Forever? Surely a more intriguing prospect than doing the Joker again? Always preferred the Riddler to the Joker anyway, thought Carrey was actually pretty good in Forever.

The Duck Man

Just got the Harley Quinn name thing, guys.

Urinal Cake

Quote from: The Region Legion on May 05, 2015, 02:40:42 PM
He also doesn't have a stupid, sign-posting name. Dr. Jonathan Crane becomes Scarecrow because of his actions. Harleen Quinzel becomes Harley Quinn because it was basically already her name for no reason. It's like Selina Kyle being called Felina Klaus. Actually no, it's even stupider than that. It's like Selina Kyle being called Katt Woomun.
Harleen is a psychology grad or something at Arkham while interviewing the Joker, he  makes the silly pun it turns their relationship from professional to personal. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gd_Puz9ngRE

TAS the best show.

MuteBanana

Quote from: BRen on May 05, 2015, 09:15:04 PM
Why has there been zero attempt to bring the Riddler back since Batman Forever? Surely a more intriguing prospect than doing the Joker again? Always preferred the Riddler to the Joker anyway, thought Carrey was actually pretty good in Forever.

In the Batman vs Superman trailer theres a bit of graffiti which looks like the Riddlers ? symbol.

Custard

I think another factor in Will Smith's career decline is his attempts to force-feed his talentless kids into people's faces

Jaden Smith's roles have already dried up, with only a rumoured sequel to his Karate Kid and a part in a TV show on the horizon, and Willow Smith's pop career bombed

Might not have helped that she looks like her dad in a lady wig, mind

http://media.salon.com/2014/05/willow_smith.jpg

Its not their fault, obviously, but their parents handing them careers (or attempting to) has seemed to rub people up the wrong way, which can't have helped

Ignatius_S

Not sure about why people think Quinn might not work in the Suicide Squad – the character has been part of the comic book series for a few years now; she and Deadshot are the biggest fan favourites.

Quote from: MuteBanana on May 05, 2015, 10:36:29 AM
So with no build up to the 'squad' this reminds me of those GI Joe films. Just a bunch of characters thrown together....

That's rather the point of the series!

When the modern version of the Suicide Squad launched under John Ostrander, it was essentially a supervillain version of The Dirty Dozen, forced to perform off the book, black operations for the government and storylines were influenced by the global situation.

The characters don't want to be there and how well they work together varies. Due to the nature of the squad, line-up has been fluid because characters get killed so much. One of the reasons that the series under Ostrander was so exciting because he was taking lower tier characters, readers got to look at them differently but knew that anyone might die. There was a recent article looking at this, if people are interested:¬ http://www.denofgeek.us/books-comics/suicide-squad/233847/the-many-deaths-of-the-suicide-squad. The second one that's mentioned was one that I'll always remember and when
Spoiler alert
Rick Flag Jr
[close]
was killed, it really showed that no one was safe.

Quote from: MuteBanana on May 05, 2015, 10:36:29 AM...Are any of them getting films of their own after this? I imagine Leto will regardless of how well this film does.

If they remain true to the spirit of the series, then spin-off films will be limited due to characters being killed off. However, as mentioned above, lower tier characters are usually used by for the series and it's debatable how many would work in their own film; or rather in the type of superhero films being made currently.

Quote from: Shameless Custard on May 06, 2015, 01:33:07 PM
I think another factor in Will Smith's career decline...

Mmm, as mentioned above, it's a little early to say that.


mjwilson

Quote from: checkoutgirl on May 05, 2015, 11:53:53 AM
And bloody Wonder Woman. Who's going to bother going to see Wonder Woman?

I would. I mean, unless it's getting terrible reviews or something.


Quote from: Urinal Cake on May 05, 2015, 09:39:57 PM
Harleen is a psychology grad or something at Arkham while interviewing the Joker, he  makes the silly pun it turns their relationship from professional to personal. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gd_Puz9ngRE

God that's dreadful. Why does everyone bang on about TAS?

"Now don't you go writing a tell-all book! Now please hang around all these supercriminals who will eat you for breakfast, my words." *leaves for 3 months*

"No please, continue to wander around the Asylum even though you've demonstrated massively unprofessional behaviour in front of everyone".

It's Schumacher territory.



VegaLA


MuteBanana

Those pants. For God's sake.

Kelvin

This will probably be taken down within the hour, but just in case, here's some set footage showing Leto's Joker in action with Harley, seemingly before she became Harley Quinn. No audio, but it really looks like he's got the movement and physicality of the Joker spot on. In fact, the whole clip really reminds me of Joker from the Dark Knight Returns; that same kind of ego, vanity and showmanship; Joker as rock star. Even the car seems like something that Joker would have. And of course, Hamill's animated Joker had those qualities in spades, as well.

Potential spoilers obviously. 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FNIb42-mgx8

Custard

Least it confirms the tattoos were just for that promo shot

Looks good though. He has the slivery quality from the comic down

Kelvin

Quote from: Shameless Custard on May 18, 2015, 07:03:11 PM
Least it confirms the tattoos were just for that promo shot

Sadly, it doesn't necessarily confirm that, as it's likely this is a flashback, if Harley's dressed like a normal person. I actually think that the Tattoos (bar "damaged") work for a rockstar version of the Joker, though. He's frequently been written as an egotistical showman, so it makes sense that he'd see himself as the ultimate celebrity, covered in his own pop art iconography and Harley his biggest fan. I absolutely love the way he moves in that clip. It's so seedy and slippery.

Tiny Poster

Ah I see, he's like a stock slimy action movie baddie but with green hair


phantom_power

Seeing those pictures made me realise that Gillian Jacobs would have been a great Harley

kitsofan34

The tattoos seem to still be there in some pictures, actually. The Joker's number plate is "HA HA HA". I'm not making that up, look...