Four Lions- 5 years on

[Old Nehamkin]

Remember when Four Lions came out, then? It was during that weird few days in between the election happening and Eastenders being interrupted for the announcement that Cameron and Nick "Nick" Clegg had become buddies. For reasons I can't remember I ended up going to see the film on a Tuesday morning in an audience of about 5 people, but it seemed to go down pretty well with them. I thought it was pretty great myself, and I still do. Really good character comedy with a classic Peep Show sort of feel about it. Remember being really excited that Morris was back in the game with something so fresh and undeniably fucking good.

Five years have somehow passed since then, and it now looks like we're on the verge of another weird, confusing post-election period, only this time without a major new Chris Morris project to comfort us. Which is a shame.

What are your thoughts and memories of Four Lions? Will the words "a film by Chris Morris" ever be heard again in our lifetimes, you reckon?

[Mijkediablo]

Brilliant film, I remember years before it was made and Morris was trying to get it commissioned as a TV series. I read about it (the most basic of outlines- "bungling suicide bombers" or words to that effect) and being really worried that he was going to fuck it up. I should've known to trust the man, he hasn't let me down yet. It's beautifully shot, the writing and performances are on point, well researched... It belongs up there with his finest work.

A few years ago, I mentioned the film to a friend of Pakistani ethnicity, and she was shocked I'd even heard of it. She thought it was the sort of film that only people from her cultural background would've seen or heard of. She was less shocked when I told her that I like the music of Nusrat Fateh Ali Khan to be honest. To me, that goes to demonstrate just how well-done and authentic the film is.

Omar actor Riz Ahmed's recorded a brilliant video about immigration here https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xs4ZjEvd-ss (possibly NSFW) Stick with it to the end, it's fucking great.

[Mister Six]

I was hugely impressed by the film when I first saw it - so carefully written, perfectly balancing humour and silliness with very real human drama and consequences. Masterful.

Haven't seen it since, but I'll be screening it in Beijing for some film fans next week, so I'll let you know what people thought of it.

Wasn't just Morris who wrote it, of course - Bain & Armstrong and Simon Blackwell get writing credits. Does anyone know how their efforts were divvied up? I assume, based on their past output, that Bain & Armstrong contributed a lot of the more empathetic and emotional character work, which was always lacking in Morris's other stuff. Nathan Barley, for example, which was his first foray - I believe - into "traditional" narrative comedy, but was very arch and emotionally disconnected. The bits with Omar saying goodbye to his wife in the hospital, for example, I can't imagine Morris putting out, but seems perfectly in line with Bain & Armstrong's work.

[Shoulders?-Stomach!]

5 years may have passed, but just like all Morris' previous work on screen, its relevance and the humour remains undimmed.

[MoonDust]

Mad that it's been 5 years already. Half a decade!

But Shoulders is right; still relevant today, and would probably still be in another 5 years.

I remember going to the cinema to see it and it was one of the very few times I've been to the cinema where the audience's laughter made it difficult to hear the film.

A fucking classic.

I do wonder too if he'll ever make another feature length film. Diverging slightly I wonder if he'll ever venture into literature. He's done radio, TV and film, all of difference varieties. A Morris novel or short story perhaps?

[Thomas]

Diverging slightly I wonder if he'll ever venture into literature. He's done radio, TV and film, all of difference varieties. A Morris novel or short story perhaps?

I think he could do it perfectly well - the Blue Jam monologues[nb]though written with Robert Katz, I understand.[/nb] are great transcribed - but Morris' delivery and rhythm is often integral to, or at least a huge part of, any given piece of hilarity. I'd like to see him onscreen more.

[Sexton Brackets Drugbust]

I think he could do it perfectly well - the Blue Jam monologues[nb]though written with Robert Katz, I understand.[/nb] are great transcribed - but Morris' delivery and rhythm is often integral to, or at least a huge part of, any given piece of hilarity. I'd like to see him onscreen more.

Yeah, he's got something of a penchant for audio cameos in the stuff he directs - Rothko's voice in My Wrongs, Place Narrator in Nathan Barley, News Reporter in Four Lions and Veep - but he has such a commanding presence and funny physicality that while his vocal performances are always a treat, it's a great shame we so rarely see him in front of the camera these days.

[Bhazor]

Honestly I'm not a fan of the film. Not sharp enough to be provocative or silly enough to top Morris' tv/radio work. Or Armstrong and Bain's work even. It also had some pretty poor characterization for the supporting cast, especially Faisal and Julia Davis was almost as wasted as the character she played. It definitely had some fun moments like Barry proving his authenticity by driving his car into a wall at 5 mph or the police apologies at the end "We shot the correct man, but the wrong man exploded".

I do think it would have worked much better as a tv show or sitcom. It just felt to me like it was constricted by the run time.

Have they released any deleted scenes/scripts?

[Petey Pate]

A few years ago, I mentioned the film to a friend of Pakistani ethnicity, and she was shocked I'd even heard of it. She thought it was the sort of film that only people from her cultural background would've seen or heard of.

Four Lions is living proof of the point behind Stewart Lee's 'Anti-Islamic stand up' routine, except that there's nothing explicitly 'anti-Islamic' in the film whatsoever.  A fair amount of the humour depends on knowing more than a little bit about Islam and Asian culture ("they've got women playing stringed instruments!", Ahmed cursing in Urdu, etc)  If the same concept had been in less capable, less well researched hands than Morris it easily could have been a racist disaster.

[Old Nehamkin]

Have they released any deleted scenes/scripts?

There's a handful of deleted scenes on the DVD. The script is available in PDF form here. I've had a quick flick through and there seems to be at least a couple of snippets that aren't in the final film.

[Neville Chamberlain]

I went to see this at the Nottingham Broadway with koeman. We met up outside a shop called "Whore" or something, which seemed appropriate. Anyway, it was the screening followed by a Q&A session with Riz Ahmed, Chris Morris, Jesse Armstrong and Sam Bain. My main memories were of some bloke asking a rambling and staggeringly pretentious question involving Joseph Conrad, which Chris Morris openly admitted to not understanding much to the poor chap's mortification, and also an exchange between Chris Morris and either Jesse Armstrong or Sam Bain in which Armstrong/Bain said they initially considered having Halford's as the target of the terrorist attack, to which Morris, laughing loudly, replied: "What have Halford's ever done to upset you? Sell you a bad valve?!?" (or words to that effect!). I also stood next Jesse Armstrong at the urinal and brushed against Chris Morris' leather-patched elbow.

As for the film itself, I can't say it's stuck with me in the way that Morris' best work has (I've watched it twice now!), although it is chock full of blink-and-you've-missed-them funny lines. Maybe I should watch it again...

[Blinder Data]

Think I've seen it 3 times: once in the cinema in the UK (good reception), once in the cinema in France (OK reception considering much of the translated dialogue lost its uniqueness) and once on DVD.

I think it's great and - probably in the minority here - prefer it to some of Morris' non-narrative work like Brasseye which often feels quite harsh and charmless in comparison. I agree the Julia Davis character didn't quite work (perhaps the wrong actress?) and it might have worked better as a TV series, but the interplay between the characters, hilarious moments and undercutting sadness marks it out as one of the best British comedy films of the last 20 years imo.

Every scene is just so well thought through. I haven't spoken about it with people who grew up in the Muslim/Pakistani community in the UK, but I've heard good things - one example being the police breaking down the main character's fundamental cousin's door, which reflects the wrong-headed persecution of religious muslims and not the disaffected seemingly 'Westernised' ones. The astonishing amount of research he put into the film really shows.

A sweet, funny and thought-provoking film about Islamism. Whatever else you think about it, that's a pretty amazing achievement.

[TheFalconMalteser]

I think overall it's good - and most importantly funny - but there are some concerns about how sympathetic it is for the main character.  Everyone else is a cartoon character but the nature of having a hero, and some the plot, suggests that he's basically a good lad.

[monolith]

I think overall it's good - and most importantly funny - but there are some concerns about how sympathetic it is for the main character.  Everyone else is a cartoon character but the nature of having a hero, and some the plot, suggests that he's basically a good lad.

I didn't see him as a good lad, but he was shown as a human with both good points and bad points.

There are probably a lot of people who under different circumstances wouldn't end up doing horrendous things and I think the lead character was a good example of this. Some people are irredeemable psychopaths but not all evil deeds are carried out by irredeemable psychopaths.

[Mister Six]

Yes, exactly. Omar's complexity is what makes him such an interesting character and contributes so much to the film's depth. Also, he's consciously written as a response to the 24-style depictions of jihadists as cold, calculating psychopaths who want to murder every white person they see.

(Also, "protagonist" is not the same as "hero".)

[curiousbritishtelly]

I was unemployed at the time (don't worry, I'd just got a huge payout) and laughed like a man with a screw loose at the cinema.

It was a fairly late night showing and not many people in there, but the people who were laughing the loudest (yes, louder than me and my gob) were an Asian family. It was at that point I realised it wasn't going to get misconstrued by the media.

[thugler]

Weirdly, I've also noticed the response from my right wing, white, old parents was also very positive. It got some criticism in the press for being 'sick' or whatever, but once people see it they invariably seem to get it and not feel it's too sympathetic/too uncritical.

They're probably laughing at different things sometimes though I suppose.

[RenegadeScrew]

I wrote a big long post last night then my internet crashed and so I actually watched it again last night as I couldn't watch ye ole youtube or anything.

I think it's his finest hour (and a half).  Or maybe it's just his most complete thing.  Or something.  I wrote something better last night.  Or maybe there was just more words.

The screening Q&As and lecturey/interview things on Youtube with Morris are all worth a watch as well.  The research he put in was ridiculous.

[AtomicRust]

I think he could do it perfectly well - the Blue Jam monologues[nb]though written with Robert Katz, I understand.[/nb] are great transcribed - but Morris' delivery and rhythm is often integral to, or at least a huge part of, any given piece of hilarity. I'd like to see him onscreen more.

I would give a lot and more to get some more Blue Jam-esque material out of Morris. I'm not below holding him at gunpoint and making him belt out a few brand spankin' new monologues on top of some Aphex Twin.

Definitely hope we see more screen time from him in the future!

[Petey Pate]

Life imitates art.

http://www.vocativ.com/news/260563/this-isis-loyalist-wants-to-use-birds-as-suicide-bombers/

[thenoise]

I also stood next Jesse Armstrong at the urinal

Did e hav a bigg willee

[zomgmouse]

Haven't seen it since it came out but it would have been my first Chris Morris thing. I liked it a lot.
My dad thought it was stupid.

[Sexton Brackets Drugbust]

Haven't seen it since it came out but it would have been my first Chris Morris thing. I liked it a lot.
My dad thought it was stupid.

Are we still talking about big willies?

[zomgmouse]

Are we still talking about big willies?

Yeah, my dad thought Chris Morris' big willy was stupid. What does he know?