Author Topic: Final Fantasy 7 - Remake  (Read 78083 times)

Re: Final Fantasy 7 - Remake
« Reply #1080 on: August 18, 2020, 11:31:08 PM »
XII is marmite.  I hated it.  A lot of people I know loved it and said I was just thick for not following the story and reading between the lines and appreciating the subtle facets of the complex characters.

To me it was bland with unlikeable boring characters and a forgettable story
YMMV

Re: Final Fantasy 7 - Remake
« Reply #1081 on: August 18, 2020, 11:44:08 PM »
XII is the only FF I've really enjoyed. Can't remember the story but I fancied Fran.

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Re: Final Fantasy 7 - Remake
« Reply #1082 on: August 18, 2020, 11:59:35 PM »
It sounds to me like FFXII might be set in a similar militarised universe to FF Tactics.  Slight tick in its favour for me 'cause I love those games- they had some of the best cut-scenes out of the whole series.

Re: Final Fantasy 7 - Remake
« Reply #1083 on: August 19, 2020, 12:43:46 AM »
For the first two thirds the cut-scenes that are there are actually really good for Final Fantasy, well localised, much sharper, subtler writing. More morally complex and human villain.

Then suddenly all these weird ghostly god-like things show up with very little introduction or explanation. I felt like I'd missed a huge chunk of story in the middle because I had no idea what what was happening by the end. I mean it's not unusual for them to take a turn towards the higher fantasy stuff in the final act, but it felt so undeveloped here, and all the more jarring in a game that had a much more grounded and believable world.

Although I only played it at original release when I guess I would have been 19, so maybe I was just thick and missed it all somehow.

But there's usually a fairly even balance of story and grinding battles in Final Fantasy games, in this one it's so weighed so much more heavily towards the grind. Even if I did like the battle system I'd still want a lot less of it, because story and characters are the main draw for me when it comes to JRPG's.


Re: Final Fantasy 7 - Remake
« Reply #1084 on: August 19, 2020, 12:52:49 AM »
I think to be fair a lot of my impression was affected by the massive departure from FFX backwards.  Even X was a stepping stone between the style of VII-VIII-IX and the current generation off FF games but happened to have characters and story I loved (and that others hated, in true FF tradition)

But those who wanted "A FFXII that acts as more of a compromise between PS1 and PS2 eras" could do well by giving Lost Odyssey a try.  It's by Sakaguchi and Uematsu after they left Square-Enix, and it shows.

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Re: Final Fantasy 7 - Remake
« Reply #1085 on: August 19, 2020, 07:13:30 AM »
Is FFXII any good?  Had no idea there was another offline FF game on the PS2 at the time other than X and X2: the J-Pop years.  The artwork looks pretty cool, but that auto-attack style sounds a bit Clickery.  I almost never hear anyone talk about it, good or bad.

I think FFXII has ended up being my favourite of all the games. The original director, Yasumi Matsuno, is responsible for some of my favourite games of all time; Final Fantasy Tactics, Vagrant Story, Tactics Ogre, Ogre Battle. Unfortunately he didn't stay to complete the game, but his influence is all over it. In his version one of the other members of the team was the main character (Basch) which would have been a change for the series in having an older character at its centre. The main character (Vaan) is a bit of an add-on, inasmuch as he only seems to be along for the ride, compared to some of the others, who have far more interesting background stories and motives, but that's OK.

I like the battle system and the increasing opportunities to tweak it as the game develops. You have control over all the characters with a kind of AI, so you can walk into a battle with a plan. You can intervene manually during battle or take manual control of one character who takes the lead and gets support from all the others (basically follow the leader), prioritise certain actions (like reviving KO'd members, or making use of enhanced abilities when HP is low). You can change it mid battle, too.

For the first two thirds the cut-scenes that are there are actually really good for Final Fantasy, well localised, much sharper, subtler writing. More morally complex and human villain.

Then suddenly all these weird ghostly god-like things show up with very little introduction or explanation. I felt like I'd missed a huge chunk of story in the middle because I had no idea what what was happening by the end. I mean it's not unusual for them to take a turn towards the higher fantasy stuff in the final act, but it felt so undeveloped here, and all the more jarring in a game that had a much more grounded and believable world.

I think that's an indication of the point where Yasumi Matsuno left the project. The story has the same dynamics and depth as all his previous games, but he is at his best when he is given full reign, and with the departure of Hironobu Sakaguchi and twelve of the people who had been at work on FFXII (to Sakaguchi's new company), he found his vision of the game was getting swamped in the new team dynamic.

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Re: Final Fantasy 7 - Remake
« Reply #1086 on: September 10, 2020, 08:45:38 AM »
I finished this the other day, after getting on discount of course. I guess I'm happy to admit I was actually wrong about it, with my initial cynicism. I really enjoyed it in the end.

Although, there are some small caveats. The thread of Kingdom Hearts bullshit around destiny and stuff feels really at odds with what is otherwise a straightforward story. There's also tons of filler to pad out what was a short segment of the original game. Hojo's lab being a particularly egregious part. It seems this is the somewhat easy section of game to adapt into this style as well, because the world tour, multi-party members aspect doesn't seem to jive well with the liner city bound Midgar.

But otherwise it was pretty great, once I got into the battle system of course. The demo didn't leave a great impression, but it was alright once it got going although I could have done without have to manage blocking and dodging. The town roam section are pretty good and felt very much to be a Yakuza/FF cross over. The characterisation of characters is the best yet after all the complication did to mangle them from the original, and minors from the originals are well fleshed out. The monster design was also pretty spot on as well, being great modern updates of the original designs.

It does feel good to be wrong about this stuff, similar to my inital feelings about THPS 1+2. I'm actually looking forward to seeing where this will go, and as long as they keep the destiny stuff to a minimum I honestly don't mind if it diverges significantly to the original from here or sticks to it.

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Re: Final Fantasy 7 - Remake
« Reply #1087 on: September 10, 2020, 08:49:35 AM »
But those who wanted "A FFXII that acts as more of a compromise between PS1 and PS2 eras" could do well by giving Lost Odyssey a try.  It's by Sakaguchi and Uematsu after they left Square-Enix, and it shows.

Yup.

Re: Final Fantasy 7 - Remake
« Reply #1088 on: September 10, 2020, 09:04:24 AM »
How do you play that now? Never had a 360, I know it'll probably be backwards compatible with a new Xbox, but is it on a digital store?

bgmnts

  • Depressed to the point of poisonous toxicity.
Re: Final Fantasy 7 - Remake
« Reply #1089 on: September 10, 2020, 09:14:49 AM »
I had it in my library of games on xbone sans disc. So I must have bought it from the digital store on that.

Re: Final Fantasy 7 - Remake
« Reply #1090 on: September 10, 2020, 05:55:39 PM »
Yeah I have it on xbone as well, I think it might have been cheap/free at one point