GamerGate is one!

[kittens]

what is games

[Rev]

One thing has always confused me about GamerGate.  I remember a controversy about Driver 3 a good few years back, which did genuinely highlight ethics in game journalism, but I don't remember any threats of rape or murder surrounding that one.  Probably because the development team was assumed to be male - had there been a cumbucket - or 'woman' if you insist - we may have had similar scenes.

[BritishHobo]

Quoted for truth. Notice how people who have been suckered into this nonsense just claim to be too "triggered" to formulate a reasoned response rather than demonstrate how any of it is untrue.

I can't believe I'm doing this again - one year later you think I'd have learned to ignore this kind of absolute shite - but what the fuck are you talking about? People claiming to be triggered whenever Anita Sarkeesian is criticised? You're just combining buzzwords, aren't you, really?

All this shite about Sarkeesian being a scam-artist. On fucking CaB of all places, jesus christ. We're rational, right? We're adults? We don't just repeat the unfounded shit manbabies on reddit spout? People have been calling Anita Sarkeesian a scam artist from the moment her kickstarter finished. People were so desperate for her to be. Even when she updated her backers, reddit and 4chan rang with cries that she'd done a runner with the money. Silence conveniently fell when she actually started releasing the videos, although the bollocks accusation now flies high again because it's been a while since the last one. Despite, again, her posting updates and even announcing recently that the project has been expanded to include an exploration of masculinity in video games.

You know your movement's onto a winner when your Voldemort, your fucking Hitler figure, is someone using basic critical theory. And the ground zero of your explosive expose of the state of the gaming industry is a bitter spiel from a guy about how his ex-girlfriend fucked a load of dudes to get good reviews, even though it turned out that she either A: didn't fuck the dudes or B: didn't get reviews from the dudes or in some cases C: all of the fucking above.

The latest development in the world of GamerGate is that a crowd of these bell-ends colluded at the Hugo Awards to try and stop sci-fi that explored deep and meaningful themes from winning awards... and were roundly trounced not because of an SJW conspiracy but because the majority of other voters saw through their childish shit and couldn't be arsed with it.

Above all else, think about this; if you sympathise with GamerGate, you are on the same side as Milo Yiannopoulos. I mean, just fucking imagine.

There. Happy birthday, disingenuous misogynist cunts pretending to care about something that matters in order to smuggle through your obsession with a load of shit that has never, ever mattered to anyone but yourselves.

[Old Nehamkin]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Sl2Ev3vR6mE

[Hank Venture]

All this shite about Sarkeesian being a scam-artist. On fucking CaB of all places, jesus christ. We're rational, right? We're adults? We don't just repeat the unfounded shit manbabies on reddit spout? People have been calling Anita Sarkeesian a scam artist from the moment her kickstarter finished. People were so desperate for her to be. Even when she updated her backers, reddit and 4chan rang with cries that she'd done a runner with the money. Silence conveniently fell when she actually started releasing the videos, although the bollocks accusation now flies high again because it's been a while since the last one. Despite, again, her posting updates and even announcing recently that the project has been expanded to include an exploration of masculinity in video games.

Disregarding everything else about your post - I know literally nothing about GamerGate as I've said, it's boring and inconsequential - I've no idea why any of this means she's not a scam artist. People paid her to deliver a product, she hasn't delivered when she said she would. It's especially off-putting when it's crowd funded.

*hold on while I do research*

Her project was funded over three fucking years ago. She raised 160000 to do a job that's close to three years overdue.

Why would anyone defend her re: this? It's the end justifying the means - you agree with her so you cut her slack you wouldn't do with, say, Zach Braff had he done the exact same thing. I hate it. If I pay a carpenter to refurbish my house and he's not done after being 2.5 years over due, I'm going down to the police station. People want to be deceived - have the right opinions (be they feminist or religious or whatever) and you'll have money thrown after you, and the people who throw it will defend you to the hilt. Televangelism. Crowdfunding is televangelism for bearded and pale 20-somethings.

[BritishHobo]

Because it's an ongoing project, which she has been updating people of the progress on. She asked for money to make a series of videos, she received far more than her target, she expanded the project to include far more videos, and has been producing and releasing them ever since. I just don't understand how that makes her a scam artist. There was no deadline set for the end of the series as far as I'm aware; the only complaint you could level at her is that she's undeniably taking a while, but by no stretch of the imagination does that mean she's scammed people.

[Old Nehamkin]

Yeah, I think proper scam artists tend to just take the money and run once they've been given it, rather than actually doing the thing that they said they were going to do over a protracted period of time. I don't think those Nigerian prince email scammers would be half as successful if they started sending their victims a fiver every week until the entire promised sum was paid off.

[wooders1978]

I'm not saying she is a scam artist but "gamer gate" is basically Anita's job so of course it's still rumbling on

[mobias]

The debates don't mean a lot to me because I have no interest in gaming, but the Gamergate side seem to make some fair points to me, and the opposing side seems to contain a lot of identity politics dullards and tiresome killjoys.

This is one of the best articles on Gamergate out there. It makes for a pretty horrible, depressing read and you certainly won't want to side with the gamergate guys after reading it http://www.bostonmagazine.com/news/article/2015/04/28/gamergate/

[brat-sampson]

This (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c6TrKkkVEhs) is hands down the best video I've seen on GamerGate. What it is, what it thinks it is, what it was meant to be and all the rest. It boils down to the fact that GG is at minimum two groups of people. Some have a genuine interest in pursuing ethics in journalism etc while the second decided to boost/ride the movement purely as a way to denigrate and attack women. No other reason. This then meant if GG was attacked for it's numerous undeniable attacks against women, the first camp would get defensive for the obvious reason that they didn't attack anyone and wouldn't want to do so. Now it's more than one thing under one banner, it's more complex, but tbh I'd say if anything the positive quiet side of GG got pretty much everything they wanted at this point, it's just a shame it came at the ongoing cost of the militants taking their pounds of angry flesh.

[chand]

One thing has always confused me about GamerGate.  I remember a controversy about Driver 3 a good few years back, which did genuinely highlight ethics in game journalism, but I don't remember any threats of rape or murder surrounding that one.  Probably because the development team was assumed to be male - had there been a cumbucket - or 'woman' if you insist - we may have had similar scenes.

Yeah, most of Gamergate weren't interested in journalistic ethics until it involved 'Social Justice Warriors'. Some of Gamergate weren't even interested in fucking games (hi Milo!).

The idea that the most corrupt thing in the games industry was a small-time developer of a tiny fucking indie game sleeping with a games journalist in exchange for a good review would have been laughable as hell even if it was actually true. Which it wasn't. There was an absolute shitload of evidence that big publishers were using their money and clout to strongarm gaming websites, and loads of insidious sponsorship shit going down, but Gamergate didn't give a fuck.

[Thursday]

Quoted for truth. Notice how people who have been suckered into this nonsense just claim to be too "triggered" to formulate a reasoned response rather than demonstrate how any of it is untrue.

Weird reading. I was genuinely annoyed, but I thought I was presenting that in a humorous way to acknowledge that I couldn't be bothered to give a reasoned response. Not claiming to be "triggered" or anything like that. I wasn't actually screaming and crying, I promise.

[The Region Legion]

People claiming to be triggered whenever Anita Sarkeesian is criticised? You're just combining buzzwords, aren't you, really?

It's pretty clear what I was referring to. Lets have another look at what Thursday said in response to a post that specifically criticised Sarkeesian.

ARGGGHHHH NO FUCKING HELL NO

And then a further 3 disjointed posts about how all they can do is scream and cry and that they don't have the patience to go over it. So it's fairly clear that what I'm talking about.

Silence conveniently fell when she actually started releasing the videos, although the bollocks accusation now flies high again because it's been a while since the last one. Despite, again, her posting updates and even announcing recently that the project has been expanded to include an exploration of masculinity in video games.

As Hank Venture already broadly referenced, and ignoring for now the fact that there was an enormous backlash against her from the start, the things that people are pulling her up on now are as follows:

1) 3 years later, she still hasn't fulfilled the majority of the initial Kickstarter goals. Originally intended as a 5 part series, after the series was funded within 24 hours she added stretch goals. The stretch goals were for the "magical" total of $15,000 and took her up to 10 videos. So far, she's managed 5. She raised $158,922. Where's the money gone?

2) She continues to fundraise, as if $158,922 wasn't enough. In May 2014, Feminist Frequency was granted non-profit status (fucking what?) and in Q4 alone she raised nearly $400,000. WHERE'S THE MONEY GONE?

3) She's a fucking liar and there's a paper trail to prove it. Whether it's her admitting that she's not a fan of video games or the fact that she's a trained telemarketer, it's pretty extraordinary that she's at the position she is and no one ever brings any of this up. Except that it's not that surprising because of course...

4) any kind of criticism of her is MYSOGYNY!

5) Her videos are misleading at best, but always filtered through her own prejudices. A famous example is her description of Hitman: Absolution as being a game that rewards murdering strippers when the game actively discourages it by penalising you for killing anyone other than the target. What kind of "basic critical theory" forces your research to fit your preconcieved notions? A worthless kind, that's what.

There. Happy birthday, disingenuous feminist cunts pretending to care about something that doesn't matter in order to smuggle through your obsession with a load of shit that has never, ever mattered to anyone but yourselves.

Fixed that for you.

[BritishHobo]

When you say 'a famous example is Hitman', you mean 'the ONLY example is Hitman'. Nah, that's unfair. I'm sure there's a couple of others. But (ironically given how people love to accuse Sarkeesian herself of nitpicking), they are literally that, a couple of examples out of the many, many games she covers in her videos.

That's my big problem, really. You guys love to make big sweeping statements about how she's A FILTHY LIAR or A DISGUSTING SCAM ARTIST, these grand proclamations, and then when it comes down the specifics, you've just the same one or two tiny shreds of something dug up from years ago, just a bit of speech here and there. Oh, she said one time that she doesn't really game because of the general atmosphere of the culture. Well, people can never step back from hobbies and later step back in, this means she is officially NOT A GAMER and therefore ALWAYS LYING. Ah, she got some details about one game wrong once, did she? This means she officially LIES ABOUT ALL GAMES.

The scam artist bullshit is what boils my piss the most because, as is happening here, it is an accusation that wilfully ignores reality. Because several of us have pointed out that it's an ongoing project, haven't we Region Legion? We've pointed out that she continues to make and release the videos, that she continues to post updates on Twitter to demonstrate that fact, that she's recently announced further expansion to the project (exploring masculinity in video games as well - I have found your missing money, Region Legion). If she continues to make the videos, and we can all see that she continues to make the videos, where is the scam? You ask 'where did the money go?' and the answer is the same fucking answe, which I will bold as it seems to be something people are keen to just pretend isn't true: SHE IS STILL MAKING THE VIDEOS, SHE NEVER STOPPED MAKING THE VIDEOS.

[BritishHobo]

Anita Sarkeesian's scamming us, she's done a runner with the money like everyone was predicting! If only ten seconds of googling would turn up an article where she outlines the financials and explains how the project has expanded!

Nice note in there pointing out that her original plan was to make five 10-12 minute videos. So far she's put out six videos which clock in at a total of two and a half hours. Which, you know, means so far she has put out more than double the amount of video that she promised, and is continuing to make more. The SCAMMING BITCH!

[The Region Legion]

When you say 'a famous example is Hitman', you mean 'the ONLY example is Hitman'. Nah, that's unfair. I'm sure there's a couple of others. But (ironically given how people love to accuse Sarkeesian herself of nitpicking), they are literally that, a couple of examples out of the many, many games she covers in her videos.

I really don't think I need to point you to YouTube and the piles of videos debunking her videos do I? Not that you're interested because you've already decided what your opinion is, and that's that.

That's my big problem, really. You guys love to make big sweeping statements about how she's A FILTHY LIAR or A DISGUSTING SCAM ARTIST, these grand proclamations, and then when it comes down the specifics, you've just the same one or two tiny shreds of something dug up from years ago, just a bit of speech here and there. Oh, she said one time that she doesn't really game because of the general atmosphere of the culture. Well, people can never step back from hobbies and later step back in, this means she is officially NOT A GAMER and therefore ALWAYS LYING. Ah, she got some details about one game wrong once, did she? This means she officially LIES ABOUT ALL GAMES.

So no interest at all in the fact that she took a telemarketing course? Yeah, lets ignore that one, because it's inconvenient.

Because several of us have pointed out that it's an ongoing project, haven't we Region Legion?

Saying it's an ongoing project is such a fucking cop-out. Just fucking make the videos and move onto the next thing. Why does she get special dispensation to just endlessly fundraise and never actually produce anything?

We've pointed out that she continues to make and release the videos

Except she doesn't and - newsflash - any financial requirements of making videos were spend when the first video came out. She doesn't need to continue to purchase cameras, video editing software, computers etc (ignoring that her videos are identical after the Kickstarter to how they were before, so at best she might have purchased some lighting?). Is she paying someone to edit them for her? Well fair do's. What's she paying them?

that she continues to post updates on Twitter

Doesn't cost money to post to Twitter.

that she's recently announced further expansion to the project (exploring masculinity in video games as well - I have found your missing money, Region Legion).

Except you haven't because by her own admission, each video "costs" $1500 - this is based on her stretch goal of adding a video for every $1500 extra. So we're still way behind, and she's added nearly half a million in 2014 alone to that slush fund. Also, announcing expansion but not delivering videos means that there's still no forward motion.

SHE IS STILL MAKING THE VIDEOS, SHE NEVER STOPPED MAKING THE VIDEOS.

Since the Kickstarter, she has uploaded 12 videos. Except that only 6 of them are under the "Tropes vs Women" banner. Lets be generous and add the videos that are new approaches to her initial format - that's 2 more. So it's 8 in 3 years. One video - 30 minutes maximum, the most recent ones much less - every 4.5 months. That is an astonishing lack of effort being made, and people who aren't completely suckered into this bullshit can smell it, and don't appreciate it.

Don't get me wrong, I'd find her fucking annoying even if she was working hard on her projects, because the project itself is asinine, but it doesn't help. It particularly doesn't help when people like you have an intentional blind spot about it. Wilful ignorance. Fucking stop it.

[The Region Legion]

Anita Sarkeesian's scamming us, she's done a runner with the money like everyone was predicting! If only ten seconds of googling would turn up an article where she outlines the financials and explains how the project has expanded!

I actually linked to something similar detailing her fundraising in 2014. Got any info on where that half a million went? Or indeed where the half million she probably made this year, if not more, is going?

[Old Nehamkin]

Anita Sarkeesian wants us all to believe that she's a fan of video games, but did you know that if you look at her Bebo page from 2004 there's a post where she says that Mario is a cunt? Look it up.

[madhair60]

Quite a lot of the anti-Sarkeesian stuff in this thread has been long-disproven.  I'd link to the big RationalWiki page with all the sourced takedowns of common GG arguments, but it wouldn't be read, so...

I don't really like Sarkeesian, and particularly lately I feel as though she's been grasping for relevance with some very odd comments and tweets.  I don't think she should be raped or anything though.  I've been steadfast on that one.

[The Region Legion]

I don't think she should be raped or anything though.  I've been steadfast on that one.

Whereas I feel that she should be gang-raped by a pack of n**gers so I guess we're just going to have to agree to disagree.

THIS IS SATIRE.

[marquis_de_sad]

4) any kind of criticism of her is MYSOGYNY!

Not all criticisms of her are misogynist, but your criticisms are — as usual — mental.

[madhair60]

Whereas I feel that she should be gang-raped by a pack of n**gers so I guess we're just going to have to agree to disagree.

THIS IS SATIRE.

I got that, I wasn't attributing that to you man.  Just trying to say I think there is absolutely room for criticism of her without being lumped in with harrassers.

[Dr Rock]

Quite a lot of the anti-Sarkeesian stuff in this thread has been long-disproven.  I'd link to the big RationalWiki page with all the sourced takedowns of common GG arguments, but it wouldn't be read, so...

I'd read it, I'm open-minded and reasonably curious.

[Thursday]

I unfollowed her shortly after she complained about the Rise Kujikawa E3 badges... as if a girl in a dancing game wearing dancing clothes is the grossest ever example of objectification. I mean she's not very good, very disingenuous with some of her arguments. But scam artist pfft.

[Funcrusher]

No one who is saying that Anita Sarkeesian is scamming people is saying she has done a runner, so proving that she hasn't done a runner doesn't refute those criticisms. As Hank says, she is behaving like a cowboy builder who takes your money, banks it and then goes off and does other jobs to get more money, rather than doing what they've been paid for. Her videos are her talking head plus gameplay footage, some of which she has taken from elsewhere without credit. They really don't take years on end to produce.

She was all excited about the project to begin with, but now she's bored with it and wants to do (and get paid for) TED talks and other profile raising stuff, so Tropes Versus Women, which was so all important to her, takes a back seat, because she's already got, and probably spent the money. She has only done four out of the twelve she was supposed to do. I notice that her wiki page no longer contains the list of proposed and as yet unfilmed episodes, which I'm certain it used to.

[Eis Nein]

What I've read doesn't indicate that it's a hate group.

Christ, every thread, even here, has pricks spouting this.

Gamergate is a cultural war campaign spawned from the anti-semitic misogynist loser vat of /pol/ on 4chan. Not /v/, the games bit of the loser vat. Anyone who equivocates on this is a prick who is prepared to fight that fight, whether they realise it or not.

I really don't think I need to point you to YouTube and the piles of videos debunking her videos do I? Not that you're interested because you've already decided what your opinion is, and that's that.

So no interest at all in the fact that she took a telemarketing course? Yeah, lets ignore that one, because it's inconvenient.

Saying it's an ongoing project is such a fucking cop-out. Just fucking make the videos and move onto the next thing. Why does she get special dispensation to just endlessly fundraise and never actually produce anything?

Except she doesn't and - newsflash - any financial requirements of making videos were spend when the first video came out. She doesn't need to continue to purchase cameras, video editing software, computers etc (ignoring that her videos are identical after the Kickstarter to how they were before, so at best she might have purchased some lighting?). Is she paying someone to edit them for her? Well fair do's. What's she paying them?

Doesn't cost money to post to Twitter.

Except you haven't because by her own admission, each video "costs" $1500 - this is based on her stretch goal of adding a video for every $1500 extra. So we're still way behind, and she's added nearly half a million in 2014 alone to that slush fund. Also, announcing expansion but not delivering videos means that there's still no forward motion.

Since the Kickstarter, she has uploaded 12 videos. Except that only 6 of them are under the "Tropes vs Women" banner. Lets be generous and add the videos that are new approaches to her initial format - that's 2 more. So it's 8 in 3 years. One video - 30 minutes maximum, the most recent ones much less - every 4.5 months. That is an astonishing lack of effort being made, and people who aren't completely suckered into this bullshit can smell it, and don't appreciate it.

Don't get me wrong, I'd find her fucking annoying even if she was working hard on her projects, because the project itself is asinine, but it doesn't help. It particularly doesn't help when people like you have an intentional blind spot about it. Wilful ignorance. Fucking stop it.

"And such small portions!"

[madhair60]

Here's the list.  RationalWiki, so prepare for Smug.  There's a link to the Sarkeesian claims refuting page on there too.

[Mango Chimes]

I think her videos are shit.  I didn't pay for them, and I don't watch them, so I don't give a fuck.  Why people who also didn't pay for them nor need to watch them get so lunatic angry and obsessive about her, I do not know.

I'm more upset that Jack Whitehall has a movie out.

[Funcrusher]

Here's the list.  RationalWiki, so prepare for Smug.  There's a link to the Sarkeesian claims refuting page on there too.

It would probably take me about two minutes to find a rebuttal of the rebuttal, followed by a counter rebuttal and so on. Both sides think they're right, who knew?

[Hollow]

This is so depressing, I think I'll stick to playing the games and not giving a solitary shit about this nonsense.