The Neon Demon

[TheFalconMalteser]

That's your posts on here, isn't it?

I think you'll find it's your mum's attempts at looking presentable.

I wasn't expect some sort of From Dusk Til Dawn action packed adventure, but I didn't expect to be so bored.  By a necrophilia, by two hyper attractive girls having a shower.  That's the biggest crime, Nicolas, you've managed to ruin looking at attractive naked women for me!

That said, I do like the way it looks, and sounds, but perhaps that's because I'm a basic bitch.  I genuinely liked Drive but I think it has the same weaknesses and at its heart is actually a pretty shallow unremarkable film. 

I want to hunt out Pusher and the Viking one though.  Perhaps if you just watch them for music video stylishness then you enjoy them on that level?

[Ant Farm Keyboard]

The message in a nutshell: society does terrible things to beautiful girls, like making beautiful girls do terrible things to other beautiful girls.

I have to admit that the fashion industry, shallow and superficial as it is, is a perfect ground for "NWR". It's just that when the director has made his point about it, it has nowhere to go, apart from being satisfied in his own boldness, which makes it very irritating.

[Pissant]

I think if Refn was a drug he'd be a benzodiazepine.  Lulling you all snug and dreamy into unconsciousness before kicking your door down and have you carry out some unspeakably violent acts for almost no reason.  You will wake up as unsatisfied as if someone had just told you a mediocre joke only you weren't really listening because a beautiful woman was dangling her breast out of a nearby window the whole time to the rhythm of a throbbing synth.

[hewantstolurkatad]

Have I posted in this thread already? I don't think so, or maybe I have, who cares I feel like typing.

Saw this and had to endure a Q&A with him afterwards. Thought it was fucking awful and vapid in a way that was clearly intentional but for no purpose whatsoever. I think he thought he had made a film that was bulletproof to criticism in his own head. There's no message, and he's absolutely clueless as to what to do with Dakota Fanning's character in every which way (how to write her, how to shoot her). He had the germ of an idea (quite literally, the whole film supposedly stems from that opening shot) and jumped into making a film before ever realising anything about what to do with it.
One thing he mentioned during the Q&A (with Cliff Martinez) was how he doesn't cut when feels naturally right to him any more and instead lets scenes run on considerably so Cliff Martinez can figure out where to wrap the music up. Absolving yourself of the choice over when to cut a scene is a pretty f*cking huge cop out to me and it explains a hell of a lot of what was wrong with Only God Forgives and this one to me.


He ain't gonna make another film that's remotely good, speaking as a fan of a fair few of his earlier ones.

[TheFalconMalteser]

One thing he mentioned during the Q&A (with Cliff Martinez) was how he doesn't cut when feels naturally right to him any more and instead lets scenes run on considerably so Cliff Martinez can figure out where to wrap the music up. Absolving yourself of the choice over when to cut a scene is a pretty f*cking huge cop out to me and it explains a hell of a lot of what was wrong with Only God Forgives and this one to me.

And exactly why they feel like music videos!

[Van Dammage]

Why do his films have to have some deeper meaning to them though? I feel his work should just be enjoyed visually for the most part and story / message secondary. This isn't aimed at anyone in particular btw, just noticed a few people talking about how shallow it is.

I haven't actually seen it yet so maybe he didn't even deliver on the visuals this time around.

[hewantstolurkatad]

Why do his films have to have some deeper meaning to them though? I feel his work should just be enjoyed visually for the most part and story / message secondary. This isn't aimed at anyone in particular btw, just noticed a few people talking about how shallow it is.

I haven't actually seen it yet so maybe he didn't even deliver on the visuals this time around.

He's trying to straddle a line, I feel. There's a few moments in it that're trippy and really cool, some really neat musical montages, but the fucking plot between them is embarrassing to the point that it's just not worth enduring.
Visually huge chunks of Neon Demon are sterile in a way that evoked absolutely nothing to me, just tedium. Even in his Q&A it really sounded like he was straining to justify any of it beyond "I made it for less money than they were willing to give me".

Part of me thinks a film about the fashion industry that focuses around an extremely young model who takes the scene by storm to the anger of more experienced professionals really needs to be directed by a bit of a pervert who's as into this young model as the world of the film is.




Regarding the soundtrack for this one, taken by itself it's a huge drop from the ones for Drive and Only God Forgives imo. The debt to Zombie is a bit overly apparent.

And exactly why they feel like music videos!

Yep, the one caveat is that this only applies for OGF and the Neon Demon. Drive was mostly edited down when Cliff Martinez came in.

[TheFalconMalteser]

Why do his films have to have some deeper meaning to them though? I feel his work should just be enjoyed visually for the most part and story / message secondary. This isn't aimed at anyone in particular btw, just noticed a few people talking about how shallow it is.

I haven't actually seen it yet so maybe he didn't even deliver on the visuals this time around.

That's a good point, it's fair enough. There's something about Neon Demon which is just... boring (for me).  If it's exciting - in some ways that last Mad Max film is just basic visual entertainment, but I was never bored, and I was interested in the people.

I just seems a bit too pleased with itself. And the

Spoiler alert

necrophilia scene

[close]

is an example.  If there was a self-knowing element maybe it works, but really, I am sure the impact he was looking for was not me looking at the person I was watching it with and rolling my eyes!

[Noodle Lizard]

If you haven't seen it already, check out the documentary on the Refn which his wife shot whilst he was filming Only God Forgives.  Very telling about him, I reckon, to the point where I'm amazed he let it get out - made weirder by the fact his wife was the one making it.  He basically spends the entire duration of shooting[nb](preluded by Alejandro Jodorowksy using tarot cards to tell him he's a hack, and then later to tell his wife to divorce him)[/nb] panicking about everything and not really having a clue what he's actually trying to do with the film.  It all sort of culminates in a "happy ending" where he knocks down all the critics Gervais style and says "job well done", but I dunno.  It's pretty much exactly what I expected of him as a filmmaker - someone firing wildly into the dark and occasionally hitting something.

It's called My Life Directed by Nicolas Winding Refn (for some reason) and it was on Netflix a while ago at least.

[Pissant]

It's called My Life Directed by Nicolas Winding Refn (for some reason) and it was on Netflix a while ago at least.

On Amazon for me.  But yes that was quite a revealing if la-de-da self-indulgent director film.  It displays two sides to him I thought, floundering idiot and worrisome stressball but you do sort of warm to him by the end, if only for the persistence of his self-immolation.

The idea of Jodorowksy giving life-altering tarot to gullible younger directors who admire him over the course of their lifetimes is hilarious. 

[Noodle Lizard]

The idea of Jodorowksy giving life-altering tarot to gullible younger directors who admire him over the course of their lifetimes is hilarious.

Especially since Jodorowsky himself has all but admitted he doesn't really believe in their power, just effective tools for basically giving his own opinions/advice.  This makes the scene where he tells Refn's wife that she should leave him even funnier.

[Bhazor]

Just saw it. Really liked it. Maybe a bit try hard with the wierdness and "See? See? That's symbolism that!" but it was never less than an audiovisual feast. Which is pretty much what I want when I see a Refn's film. Plenty directors out there telling their poxy stories with nice flat shot reverse shot on a little sound stage. But directors willing to actually go through the work of producing proper visuals seem to be a dying breed.

But it had all these predatory lesbians in the cast and none of them were Christina Hendricks? Shameful. I will never ever forgive Refn for not including her in any of the blood showers or rape scenes.

[Wet Blanket]

He wants to be an auteur but, despite being a magnificent stylist, he's no kind of writer. I hope for his next project he's persuaded back towards the mainstream. He would have done a great job of Girl on the Train.