Author Topic: Sonic Mania - a new 2D Sonic game that looks like it will be good  (Read 6925 times)

Re: Sonic Mania - a new 2D Sonic game that looks like it will be good
« Reply #30 on: July 24, 2016, 03:10:02 PM »
The 3D Sonic title also announced... I'm slightly concerned:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gCh9--2xcKk


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Re: Sonic Mania - a new 2D Sonic game that looks like it will be good
« Reply #31 on: July 24, 2016, 04:32:22 PM »
I reckon Sonic CD is like a lot of cult classics, which is to say it's more interesting and unusual and charming than it is actually any good.

It's a game full of imagination but none of it makes any fucking sense. There's no purpose to the time travel aspect. The level design is a mad jumble of random crap with no direction or flow.

I understand why people don't like the game. The truth about Sonic CD is it's a considered, thoughtful and challenging game of exploration. A lot of people don't like that from Sonic, and that's fine, but the game is stunningly well-designed and rich with detail.

First of all, the time travel is one of the methods to achieve the "Good Future" ending - you need to go to the past, find the machine that Robotnik hid somewhere in the level, and destroy it. That's it. If you wish to, you can return to the future to see what you've changed, but you don't have to, it's just for flavour.

The level design is intended - and this is how it's counter-intuitive - to make it difficult for you to attain top speed and sustain it. This is the only way to time travel. So you need to explore the stages to find the correct "line" or exploit that let you go back or forward in time.

Another element of the game that's often ignored is that the "Time Attack" mode, which unlike other games in the series counts your best times as a "global" game time stat, and when this time lowers beneath certain thresholds you unlock extra options in-game.

Again, it's all flavour. You don't have to even do that to get the good ending, you can just gather the "Time Stones" by getting 50 rings then finishing the (easy) bonus stages. But the option is there.

Honestly, it's like my joint favourite, every time I play it I love it more. I look for new areas and secrets. I find the levels rewarding just to walk around in.

But, again, I totally understand why it's disliked.


Re: Sonic Mania - a new 2D Sonic game that looks like it will be good
« Reply #33 on: July 24, 2016, 04:52:59 PM »
First of all, the time travel is one of the methods to achieve the "Good Future" ending - you need to go to the past, find the machine that Robotnik hid somewhere in the level, and destroy it. That's it. If you wish to, you can return to the future to see what you've changed, but you don't have to, it's just for flavour.

I know, I know... but to me that flavour feels more like filler, or excess. In order to accommodate the optional time travel aspect they have to create huge amounts of content (ie remixed versions of levels, different music, different level art etc) that doesn't really amount to anything cohesive. It's just... scattered and confusing. It feels wasteful. There's so much redundancy baked into it.

Strangely, Sonic CD was my first Sonic game. I played the shit out of it as a kid.

Re: Sonic Mania - a new 2D Sonic game that looks like it will be good
« Reply #34 on: July 24, 2016, 07:50:38 PM »
I suppose what could be seen as redundancy, I see as flavour, just a cool thing you don't ever need to see. I can set myself the challenge of getting a Good Future, then making sure I go to said future before exiting the level. It's just cool shit you can do.

Re: Sonic Mania - a new 2D Sonic game that looks like it will be good
« Reply #35 on: July 25, 2016, 11:24:32 PM »
Sonic CD is brilliant because with its sheer number of zone variations, colour palettes and music remixes each playthrough will see you take on a different set of levels; each time a different adventure that you can't predict at the outset. You can't get replayability like that from the other Sonics. I've been a lifelong Sonic fan but only played Sonic CD for the first time with its HD release on Steam a few years ago. It leapfrogged into position as my number one favourite Sonic game.

And Sonic Mania looks like it's capturing that feeling of Sonic CD. I'm a 31 year old man excited about a Sonic game.

Re: Sonic Mania - a new 2D Sonic game that looks like it will be good
« Reply #36 on: July 26, 2016, 12:15:38 AM »
I embarked on a journey of playing the Sonic games from 1 very recently, and Sonic CD is by far the best of the bunch so far.  So I wouldn't say it's a nostalgia thing - I'd only ever played the old Game Gear games.  Loved it, fun animations, neat idea, great music, enjoyable levels.  Though I did find I needed maps and savestates if I didn't want to be playing it for the next 6 years, and its tendency to throw you into the wrong time travel posts got a tad frustrating.

Anyone remember Tails Adventure for Game Gear?
I have some very pleasant memories of that game. All the little gizmos you unlocked as you progressed, how cool was that eh? First game I remember that used that particular mechanic, allowing you to revisit old levels later on when you have unlocked some extra abilities.
TBH I only remember the little robot thing, adorable little thing.
Anyway, it was a bloody cool game when I was 6 or whatever, certainly the best Game Gear game I played.
« Last Edit: July 26, 2016, 12:36:02 AM by hedgehog90 »

Re: Sonic Mania - a new 2D Sonic game that looks like it will be good
« Reply #37 on: July 26, 2017, 03:43:35 PM »
Tell you what. Tell you what.

I bet the music's shit in this. Bet you fucking anything. Bet it's shite.

Bloody hell I was wrong about this.

Re: Sonic Mania - a new 2D Sonic game that looks like it will be good
« Reply #38 on: August 14, 2017, 11:28:08 PM »
Holy shit. This thing actually seems to be getting pretty good reviews. SUPER SONIC WARRIOR!

Re: Sonic Mania - a new 2D Sonic game that looks like it will be good
« Reply #39 on: August 14, 2017, 11:31:46 PM »
Yeah, fwiw, Metacritic is something like 86, one of the most consistently high scores on the Switch. I was never actually arsed about Sonic but I'm going to get this at midnight and give it a good go.

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Re: Sonic Mania - a new 2D Sonic game that looks like it will be good
« Reply #40 on: August 14, 2017, 11:33:43 PM »
Bah. I have to wait, because the PC version got delayed. I hope they either make tons of sequels to this, or have regular DLC level packs for it.

Re: Sonic Mania - a new 2D Sonic game that looks like it will be good
« Reply #41 on: August 14, 2017, 11:49:22 PM »
Deserves to be GOTY just for that intro animation: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zA9zwpMj_8A

Squeeee!

Re: Sonic Mania - a new 2D Sonic game that looks like it will be good
« Reply #42 on: August 15, 2017, 12:31:07 AM »
It reminds me of Sonic exactly as I remember it.

Re: Sonic Mania - a new 2D Sonic game that looks like it will be good
« Reply #43 on: August 15, 2017, 05:54:29 AM »
This is like the biggest nostalgia hit I've taken in years. Played the first few stages and fallen for it hard. They've absolutely smashed it, all of it, from the physics to the music to the new element designs or entirely new stages. One boss made me do a big ol' lol.

Even the stages cribbed from past games are recreated with total respect. To begin with. Then further in you see they've mixed some stuff around, made it seem familiar only to surprise you, and the second acts are always entirely new things, with new ideas thrown in, and so far they all fit in perfectly.

This is actually the first Switch game I've picked up in a while and man, totally worth it. I mean, if you never played Sonic, or did but didn't like it, this probably wont help, but if you did, oh boy.

Re: Sonic Mania - a new 2D Sonic game that looks like it will be good
« Reply #44 on: August 15, 2017, 08:13:55 AM »
Can't wait to get on this tonight. Waited two decades.

Re: Sonic Mania - a new 2D Sonic game that looks like it will be good
« Reply #45 on: August 15, 2017, 09:48:39 AM »
Not trying to be awkward but I never played or liked Sonic before and I think it's because I don't really know how to play it.

Are you supposed to bomb through the levels as fast as possible or take it slowly and explore all the secrets?

The first means you miss out on loads but it's fun for a couple of seconds until you hit something you couldn't have possibly predicted or reacted to, the second is really frustrating given the slow walking and jumping speed of Sonic and seems antithetical to the character's abilities.

This seems just as annoying and frustrating as I always found Sonic. Every single time I build up some momentum and start -POW- fuckin rings everywhere. Are you supposed to replay levels again and again to learn where the obstacles are?

I like the look and sound of it but I spend too much time at the bottom of the levels, scooping up the last ring or two, pranging off some fuckin spikes.

Re: Sonic Mania - a new 2D Sonic game that looks like it will be good
« Reply #46 on: August 15, 2017, 09:53:51 AM »
You're supposed to play it however's fun for you, and yes, learning the levels helps with speed-runs. Rolling into a ball makes you effectively invincible, so always do that on slopes. The rings system is there to facilitate playing like shit, this is why these games are so popular - you can't die if you have at least one ring so anyone can beat them.

When I go back to the oldies I sometimes bomb through and sometimes explore, searching for extra lives and that. I love these games, I love fucking about with the momentum, I love the expansive levels full of side paths and curiosities. Just great games. I hope Mania fits into that template nicely.

Re: Sonic Mania - a new 2D Sonic game that looks like it will be good
« Reply #47 on: August 15, 2017, 10:08:51 AM »
Glad this has happened that Sega has finally allowed the Sonic game people have actually wanted for 2 decades to be made and it's the best reviewed, hopefully it get's the sales to match.

Re: Sonic Mania - a new 2D Sonic game that looks like it will be good
« Reply #48 on: August 15, 2017, 11:09:38 AM »
Yeah, the levels are just giant play areas. You can bomb it in one direction, try another and find some loops, jump at a different point and find a secret. You're not meant to hoover up every ring or worry about missing a box they've shown you for half a second before it vanished out of view, because there are plenty more where that came from. Sudden stops and spike pits shouldn't really be that common, i.e. spikes you'll often run into the side of rather than fall on, and yeah, every time you explode into rings you've only got to grab a couple and then you can speed off to find some more.

Re: Sonic Mania - a new 2D Sonic game that looks like it will be good
« Reply #49 on: August 15, 2017, 11:13:11 AM »
Cheers, mads.

Edit: and brats.

I played another few levels, quite enjoyed it. I think the thing that gets me is thinking I need to collect every single ring on each level, like they're going towards something, I dunno. Imagine playing Mario and all the coins you've collected fall out of your pocket halfway through the level, watching them spill off screen is devastating, particularly to someone who likes collecting and tidying and perfecting in games, and so on.

I always feel I get a bit lost or blocked off and then have to laboriously make-up my way back up some lift or go backwards/left to find a way back up. It's genuinely disconcerting to go left, I feel like I've been trained to always go right in platformers.

Yeah, strange old game, Sonic. Never got it before and although I'll finish it this, it's as jarring as it ever was for me. I'll persist though, and try to take it on its own terms.

WHY HAVE A FAST CHARACTER AND LOADS OF LOOPS AND SHIT IF YOU KILL ME WITH SOME BADDIE I COULDN'T POSSIBLY REACT TO

Re: Sonic Mania - a new 2D Sonic game that looks like it will be good
« Reply #50 on: August 15, 2017, 12:12:37 PM »
Not trying to be awkward but I never played or liked Sonic before and I think it's because I don't really know how to play it.

Desolation thread.

Re: Sonic Mania - a new 2D Sonic game that looks like it will be good
« Reply #51 on: August 15, 2017, 12:16:02 PM »
I mean, 100 gets you an extra life but otherwise w/e. Easy come easy go. Having one is as much protection as having 150.

Re: Sonic Mania - a new 2D Sonic game that looks like it will be good
« Reply #52 on: August 15, 2017, 02:12:33 PM »
WHY HAVE A FAST CHARACTER AND LOADS OF LOOPS AND SHIT IF YOU KILL ME WITH SOME BADDIE I COULDN'T POSSIBLY REACT TO

That's the thing, the original games don't do this and it's a commonly-levelled criticism that I've never understood. In the Mega Drive titles you simply aren't funneled into enemies - it doesn't happen. There's usually a slope or a high-rise wall to give you a natural speed-bump. If you then choose to hold right, that's on you, the game isn't making you play that way. Save the high speed for future playthroughs.

The later Sonic games have sadly established this GOFASTALLTHETIME ethos that simply isn't present in the vastly superior originals. Go and play Sonic 1's Marble, Spring Yard and Labyrinth zones and tell me what sort of game it is.

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Re: Sonic Mania - a new 2D Sonic game that looks like it will be good
« Reply #53 on: August 15, 2017, 05:42:54 PM »
If you then choose to hold right, that's on you, the game isn't making you play that way.

Mind blown.

My sense of Sonic has always been 'run as fast as you can to the right, and hit jump at intervals'.  If you're running to the right and then stop running to the right, you normally fall through a gap between the pieces of land and hit some spikes, water or die from going off the screen.

There's definitely a knack, is all I'm saying.

Re: Sonic Mania - a new 2D Sonic game that looks like it will be good
« Reply #54 on: August 15, 2017, 05:51:56 PM »
Okay I wish this game saved every act rather than just every zone. I get that this is a good compromise between old school "start the entire game again" thinking, but eh.

Re: Sonic Mania - a new 2D Sonic game that looks like it will be good
« Reply #55 on: August 15, 2017, 08:32:05 PM »
There is what I assume a glitch in which if you go to a signpost and hit it and enter the special stage and then complete the Blue Spheres level then any previous signposts appear again. There are two very close together in Green Hill Zone Act 2 so I ended up spending 2 hours getting all of the gold medallions. I've now completed one of the most difficult challenges in the game (I assume, based on how many people have the Trophy on PS4) and haven't even started Chemical Plant Zone yet. I did end up getting a Time Over as the time going back and forth between sign posts took me to nine minutes.

Always loved Blue Spheres. Glad to see getting the medallions unlocks it as a separate mode just like the days when I'd lock on Sonic 1 onto Sonic & Knuckles as a kid.

A few fun unlockables from the gold medallions.

Re: Sonic Mania - a new 2D Sonic game that looks like it will be good
« Reply #56 on: August 15, 2017, 08:38:28 PM »
I loved shoving random carts into S&K as a kid and playing those levels, but apparently now I'm terrible at them :p

Good hint though. You've still got a lot to look forward to.

Re: Sonic Mania - a new 2D Sonic game that looks like it will be good
« Reply #57 on: August 15, 2017, 08:53:27 PM »
I loved shoving random carts into S&K as a kid and playing those levels, but apparently now I'm terrible at them :p


I had a quick go last night when it unlocked before going to sleep and was terrible. You just need a bit of practice to get back into the habit. If you played the old Blue Spheres then you'll be fine at this as the difficultly isn't quite as hard as the hardest in that game. The hardest levels here are just a matter of trial and error.

If I had a slight criticism it would be to the one level which springs you right onto a blue sphere and you instantly need to turn three times to get to another spring and this happens six or seven times in that level. There'd be no way of getting the silver medallion first time (the gold rightly can take a bit of replaying, particularly one level which leaves you with one blue sphere on a corner and four rings around it).

I'm definitely a bit rusty on the old 2D Sonic. I managed to die on the raising water section on Chemical Planet Zone. It was by crushing rather than drowning so not too embarrassing for a seasoned player.

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Re: Sonic Mania - a new 2D Sonic game that looks like it will be good
« Reply #58 on: August 15, 2017, 10:42:29 PM »
This is like the biggest nostalgia hit I've taken in years. Played the first few stages and fallen for it hard. They've absolutely smashed it, all of it, from the physics to the music to the new element designs or entirely new stages. One boss made me do a big ol' lol.

Chemical Plant Act 2? When I realised what was happening I basically had to pause to applaud. One of the most inventive boss fights since Metal Gear Solid 3 when you think about it.

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Re: Sonic Mania - a new 2D Sonic game that looks like it will be good
« Reply #59 on: August 15, 2017, 10:56:18 PM »
If Sonic Mania doesn't come out on mobile phones for under £3 then it can sod off, of course.