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National Treasure (Channel 4, Tuesdays 9pm)

Started by Ambient Sheep, September 19, 2016, 07:06:40 AM

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Ambient Sheep

So, that Robbie-Coltrane-plays-fictional-Yewtree-style-celebrity drama, that some of us may already be sick of from all the "Coming Soon" trailers[nb]Does anybody else loathe these unspecific things with a passion?  See also Eden earlier this year, which was especially disappointing when it was finally revealed to be reality bollocks rather than a science-fiction thing.[/nb], is finally going to air this coming Tuesday (20th September) at 9pm on Channel 4, with three more parts to follow weekly in the same timeslot.  (Also on Wednesdays an hour later on 4seven.)

This is a thread to give a heads-up that they're finally bothering to broadcast more than 60 seconds of it, and then to discuss it when it happens.  Or, being CaB, even before it happens.


Bad Ambassador

I can't help but think it would be a bit more believable if they'd cast someone who was a popular entertainer in the 1980s and is more of a serious actor now. Like Les Dennis or Russ Abbot. Not playing themselves, obviously. Or Simon Bates.

MuteBanana

Smart move by Coltrane.

"But officer, how can I be a paedo? I played one on telly."

That Harry Potter set must've been a riot.

Ballad of Ballard Berkley

Quote from: Bad Ambassador on September 19, 2016, 11:46:54 AM
I can't help but think it would be a bit more believable if they'd cast someone who was a popular entertainer in the 1980s and is more of a serious actor now. Like Les Dennis or Russ Abbot. Not playing themselves, obviously. Or Simon Bates.

I know what you mean, but the casting of Coltrane works in its favour. Everyone loves him, so you instinctively want to believe his character is innocent. It's akin to when we first heard the news about Rolf Harris. What? No! Not cuddly Rolf!

I've seen the first two episodes of National Treasure, and it really is like watching a dramatisation of the much-loved Robbie Coltrane being accused of serial sex crimes. It's unsettling in all the right ways.

I had some reservations before I watched it. Would it sensationalise or trivialise the Yewtree/VIP sex scandal? Would it ask us to sympathise with the accused celebrity at the expense of his alleged victims?

Well, it doesn't do any of that. It's an admirably nuanced, thoughtful study of this issue. Despite Coltrane and his fictional family being the protagonists, the victims aren't overlooked in the slightest. Their trauma is an integral facet of the story.

It also covers press intrusion, police mendacity, the power of rich celebrities with access to heavyweight legal teams, and suppressed memory syndrome as a result of sexual and/or psychological abuse.

Plus it makes you think about Rolf's tiny wife.

Shaky


biggytitbo

Now we know why she's so tiny :(

If you're going to get Robbie Coltrane to play a celebrity paedophile it seems almost willfully contrarian[nb]Coltranian?[/nb] to not have him playing Cyril Smith.

Ballad of Ballard Berkley

A comedian of Coltrane's generation would never wear a snazzy golf jumper like that. I'm now doubting the integrity of this entire production.

Another thread on this show was mistakenly started and I squandered a bloody great tag in it.

Mark Steels Stockbroker


Ballad of Ballard Berkley


Mark Steels Stockbroker

I'd prefer it if this was by Guy Jenkin & Andy Hamilton.

Mark Steels Stockbroker

Celebrities have terrible taste in soft furnishings.


Ballad of Ballard Berkley

Great drama, but I still can't get a handle on the sort of comedian Coltrane is supposed to be playing.

I assumed that he and McInnerny were an '80s alternative duo in the Smith & Jones/Hale & Pace vein, but Coltrane's golf jumper blatantly suggested an old-school Tarby vibe. They also alluded to a beloved mainstream sitcom they once starred in, the sort of thing that always crops up on ITV3 in the afternoon.

It's a drama, not a documentary, I'm aware of that. But it bothers me when comedy is presented askew in dramas.

I think this is what we should focus on, rather than the topical, serious, thoughtful themes in National Treasure.

Icehaven

Completely irrelevant, but having a very small, old telly it's struck me how when they show the name of the programme at the ad breaks it's clearly made for one of those massive screens they have nowadays as on mine it's barely legible. Luckily I can just about remember what I'm watching so it's alright.
Anyway agree with what someone said above, sounds like their heyday would have been the late 80s into the 90s, (well Coltrane and McInnerny's actually were I guess) but that 'bit' they did at the awards ceremony at the start was more like something Morecambe and Wise would have done 15/20 years earlier than that.   

biggytitbo

Coltrane was obvious casting, but who else could convincingly play a lovable fat 80s paedophile?

- Mike McShane
- The late Richard Griffiths
- Les Dennis + latex padding
- Brian Blessed
- That bloke who played Churchil in Victory of the Daleks
- Fat bloke from Harry Enfield

Shaky


Uncle TechTip

Toby Jones, David Neilson, that short guy from 15 Storeys High, Gary someone?

Shaky

Quote from: Uncle TechTip on September 21, 2016, 12:58:55 AM
Toby Jones, David Neilson, that short guy from 15 Storeys High, Gary someone?

Oooh, yes - Toby Jones... I'm sure he's a lovely guy but... yeah. Him.

neveragain

Quote from: Ballad of Ballard Berkley on September 20, 2016, 10:41:40 PM
I assumed that he and McInnerny were an '80s alternative duo in the Smith & Jones/Hale & Pace vein, but Coltrane's golf jumper blatantly suggested an old-school Tarby vibe. They also alluded to a beloved mainstream sitcom they once starred in, the sort of thing that always crops up on ITV3 in the afternoon... it bothers me when comedy is presented askew in dramas.

I didn't find the discussions of their comedy (or the little act at the awards show) believable either, but it did seem like they were more of a Morecambe and Wise type duo. Nothing too modern.

Brundle-Fly

Quote from: Ballad of Ballard Berkley on September 20, 2016, 10:41:40 PM
Great drama, but I still can't get a handle on the sort of comedian Coltrane is supposed to be playing.

I assumed that he and McInnerny were an '80s alternative duo in the Smith & Jones/Hale & Pace vein, but Coltrane's golf jumper blatantly suggested an old-school Tarby vibe. They also alluded to a beloved mainstream sitcom they once starred in, the sort of thing that always crops up on ITV3 in the afternoon.

It's a drama, not a documentary, I'm aware of that. But it bothers me when comedy is presented askew in dramas.

I think this is what we should focus on, rather than the topical, serious, thoughtful themes in National Treasure.

There is no point this drama trying to recreate whatever nebulous comedy entertainment field or material, the great, "Paul Finchley" is supposed to represent for all kinds of obvious reasons.

He is just a cypher for a LE figure from the past.   I think everybody gets this Surely?

I'm really intrigued how this is going to pan out.

Ballad of Ballard Berkley

I agree, I just enjoy being needlessly pedantic. Hence why I hopefully made that clear in my previous post. Read the last line again, splendid Brundle fella!

I do think this is by far and away one of the best TV dramas I've seen in ages.

Brundle-Fly

Quote from: Ballad of Ballard Berkley on September 21, 2016, 03:00:55 AM
I agree, I just enjoy being needlessly pedantic. Hence why I hopefully made that clear in my previous post. Read the last line again, splendid Brundle fella!

I do think this is by far and away one of the best TV dramas I've seen in ages.

Let's lather up? Agree x 2

I suspect we will be probably many peas in a pod on this site, regarding the comedy aspect of National Treasure, ...so far.

It is always so difficult to represent great comedy in fiction, as has been discussed elsewhere (and on CaB comedy discussion) forever.

Blah.

But as you remarked in your preamble yesterday, it's "admirably nuanced" and it doesn't seem to take any prisoners either. We are led to believe
Spoiler alert
he is a slime ball but even his angelic wife is depicted at one point as a pious Catholic loon
[close]

As you say, great TV drama we've not seen in awhile . Looks DOP gorgeous too!


My favourite gag, as I'm sure your's surely must have been? 
Spoiler alert
The self satirising C4 line?
[close]

Mark Steels Stockbroker

Quote from: Ballad of Ballard Berkley on September 21, 2016, 03:00:55 AM
I agree, I just enjoy being needlessly pedantic. Hence why I hopefully made that clear in my previous post. Read the last line again, splendid Brundle fella!

I do think this is by far and away one of the best TV dramas I've seen in ages.

I got the impression at times that he was almost a Ronnie Barker character (though too young) whilst McInerney was going for a Vic'n'Bob style duo.

Mark Steels Stockbroker

During his police interrogation it was stated he was born in 1950. That makes him older than the alternative comedy generation, but younger than the real old guard.

Mark Steels Stockbroker

He presents the quiz Smuggle in the afternoon. Does C4 do shows like that?

Shaky

Quote from: Mark Steels Stockbroker on September 21, 2016, 06:26:54 AM
I got the impression at times that he was almost a Ronnie Barker character (though too young) whilst McInerney was going for a Vic'n'Bob style duo.

Barker's son was involved in similar seediness, of course, so maybe a slight nod there.

Quote from: Mark Steels Stockbroker on September 21, 2016, 06:38:44 AM
During his police interrogation it was stated he was born in 1950. That makes him older than the alternative comedy generation, but younger than the real old guard.

I know what you mean, but Coltrane himself was born in 1950 and I'd count him as an alternative comic/comedic actor due to his Comic Strip connections alone.

Icehaven

Actually I'd imagine making him not too like anyone real was a big priority, for obvious legal reasons, which would leave him pretty much having to be a mish mash of recognisable TV personality characteristics without seeming too inspired by anyone in particular.

When are the alternative comedy lot going to get Yewtreed? I assume they're doing everyone in chronological order.

Ballad of Ballard Berkley

Quote from: Brundle-Fly on September 21, 2016, 04:32:20 AM
My favourite gag, as I'm sure your's surely must have been? 
Spoiler alert
The self satirising C4 line?
[close]

Spoiler alert
"Channel fucking 4!"
[close]
? I loved that.