Main Menu

Tip jar

If you like CaB and wish to support it, you can use PayPal or KoFi. Thank you, and I hope you continue to enjoy the site - Neil.

Buy Me a Coffee at ko-fi.com

Support CaB

Recent

Welcome to Cook'd and Bomb'd. Please login or sign up.

March 28, 2024, 07:47:52 PM

Login with username, password and session length

Old Doctor Who - Part 3

Started by Ambient Sheep, October 21, 2016, 05:20:01 PM

Previous topic - Next topic

purlieu

Once I've done the books, I'm onto the audios. Although if you include stuff like Jago & Litefoot and UNIT, there are about a thousand of them. I'm incredibly glad some are on Spotify. I was thinking of trying to do them in chronological order, but I quickly decided against it, as trying to organise them would take forever, and would be out of date almost immediately.

daf

I just want to expand my favourite era a bit - so I'm happy to stick with J&L and the Tom Bakers at the moment.

If I still have some shelf space left, I might sprinkle in some 'Companion Chronicles' to cover the first three Doctors, and maybe sample a few of the classics too (Spare Parts?) - I hear Colin is particularly good on audio compared to his rather fraught TV existence.

Malcy

Quote from: daf on December 28, 2016, 03:18:14 PM
Anyone branched out into the Big Finish audios?

Dipped my toe in recently with a couple of Tom Bakers and all 12 of the 'Jago and Litefoot' series boxes - which are tremendous fun!



Corks!



Yeah i've been listening for a few years. I dip into the main range at random. Been enjoying the spin-off boxsets a lot though. As much as i don't really like River Song i enjoyed the first series of her audios. Currently finishing off Churchill Vol 1 and about to listen to UNIT Series 3 with The Silence. Really looking forward to the next release during the year with the regular UNIT cast and Grant, Benton & Yates.

The one thing about the audios is i find they are far to expensive and frequent to keep up with. At most i've listened to a story once. Listening to them with full concentration is an issue as well. I usually play a game which doesn't require to much thinking while an audio is on. Otherwise i can tune out for a minute and just give up. Listened to the first ep of Series 3 of The War Doctor boxset on a short flight recently. Situations like that make it eassier for me to tune in to them.

I have plenty of them saved on my hard drive but it's just finding the time to get to listen to them. I was flying through the Torchwood audios as well but have fallen behind.

The Big Finish website has a few free audios. They have a full story for free until Jan 1st. I'll post it when i find it to download. Few other short ones worth getting as well. One with Colin Bakers Doctor on a phone is good and free but i forget the name.

Spotify also have a load of stories available to listen to as well.

jamiefairlie

I've been devouring the Big Finish stuff for a few years now and find them ideal listening fodder for long walks and hikes. The Tom Baker stuff is my favourite of the actual Doctor series as the actors are top class (Tom, Lalla Ward, Louise Jamieson) but the spinoffs/other series are also great - Gallifrey, Unit, Counter Measures, Survivors, J&L, Blakes 7, Sapphire & Steel, Sherlock Holmes, The Prisoner - they're all really good and engrossing listens.


kidsick5000

Quote from: jamiefairlie on December 30, 2016, 06:44:53 AM
the spinoffs/other series are also great - The Prisoner.

Interesting. Do tell more

Bad Ambassador


Malcy

The Diary Of River Song S2 is worth checking out. The first ep has McCoy, the second is a cracker, the third has Baker and they work brilliantly together & the fourth has both McCoy & Baker.

I've never been a fan of River but she's good in the audios. Probably something to do with being written by people other than Moffat.

Replies From View

Quote from: Malcy on January 08, 2017, 02:14:52 PM
The Diary Of River Song S2 is worth checking out. The first ep has McCoy, the second is a cracker, the third has Baker and they work brilliantly together & the fourth has both McCoy & Baker.

Tom or Colin?

How do they marry all this with the shock that River Song encountered upon meeting David Tennant's Doctor, who was 'too young' for her to reconcile with the Doctor she loved, and who she was upset to find didn't recognise her yet?

Ambient Sheep

You know how, on E4, their continuity has that thing where they pan across a seaside caravan park, with various cheeky and/or bizarre words & phrases appearing as caravan names, signs, graffiti, plane banners, etc.? 

The other day whilst watching it, I burst out laughing very loudly indeed, and had to explain to my puzzled viewing companion why a small plane trailing a banner reading:

Spoiler alert
        TOM'S PUTTING IT IN NOW       
[close]

was so damn funny.

I know it's a well-worn story, but even so I was rather surprised to see it being publicly acknowledged, let alone popping up on E4, who don't even do anything Who-related...


Malcy

Quote from: Replies From View on January 08, 2017, 02:34:09 PM
Tom or Colin?

How do they marry all this with the shock that River Song encountered upon meeting David Tennant's Doctor, who was 'too young' for her to reconcile with the Doctor she loved, and who she was upset to find didn't recognise her yet?

I think in the library 2-parter she had met Tennant a few times so was surprised he didn't recognise her.

In these,
Spoiler alert
She doesn't meet McGann's incarnation in the flesh so he doesn't really know who she is. There is a time anomaly due to the colliding of the TARDIS & a ship travelling through the vortex that River is on which causes memory loss and confusion although McCoy gets her confused with Bernice Summerfield. With Colin Baker she has to wipe his memory more for his own sake at something which happens in the story rather than to upset the timeline of him knowing her early. I haven't listened to ep 4 yet so don't know how it's going to pan out with McCoy & Baker encountering her again.
[close]

I would assume that she might meet either Davison and/or Tom Baker if there is a third series. I'd hope that they would maybe hold off on that for a while and give her a series without a Doctor as good as the encounters are. Haven't listened to the other McGann boxset she is in yet so no idea how that works.

kidsick5000

Quote from: Malcy on January 08, 2017, 03:33:04 PM
I think in the library 2-parter she had met Tennant a few times so was surprised he didn't recognise her.

In these,
Spoiler alert
She doesn't meet McGann's incarnation in the flesh so he doesn't really know who she is. There is a time anomaly due to the colliding of the TARDIS & a ship travelling through the vortex that River is on which causes memory loss and confusion although McCoy gets her confused with Bernice Summerfield. With Colin Baker she has to wipe his memory more for his own sake at something which happens in the story rather than to upset the timeline of him knowing her early. I haven't listened to ep 4 yet so don't know how it's going to pan out with McCoy & Baker encountering her again.
[close]

I would assume that she might meet either Davison and/or Tom Baker if there is a third series. I'd hope that they would maybe hold off on that for a while and give her a series without a Doctor as good as the encounters are. Haven't listened to the other McGann boxset she is in yet so no idea how that works.

Sounds like that could get repetitive like drugging BA's burger.

In the Library is her only encounter with Tennant's doc. Unless he had the memory burger too

Malcy

Quote from: kidsick5000 on January 08, 2017, 04:04:02 PM
Sounds like that could get repetitive like drugging BA's burger.

In the Library is her only encounter with Tennant's doc. Unless he had the memory burger too

I'm sure River, or possibly Moffat said they had met up before Tennant went to the Ood Sphere.

Replies From View

I like the idea that Tennant's Doctor spent a bit more time with River.  Anything to give their relationship more weight than we ultimately got on flipping screen.

I was so irritated when 'Let's Kill Hitler' showed us that River Song was younger than the actress Alex Kingston (having regenerated from a woman only in her 20s) and all this promised depth behind her love for the Doctor was reduced to "Coorr blimey guv he's a nice bit of male totty eh!  Has a cute bottom doesn't he!"

If you've got someone who's able to regenerate, you've got a character who could be potentially hundreds of years old, making it far more acceptable for the Doctor to connect with her on a romantic level.  Between the terrified child in the alleyway (Day of the Moon) and the woman who called herself 'Mels', there could have been additional unseen regenerations, making River Song wise and ancient, and also giving us the possibility of some future stories where the Doctor meets younger River when she's still his assassin.  But Moffat chose not to leave this open.



Just.... argh.  So much wasted potential, as always.

Replies From View

Whoops; sorry.  I obviously forgot I wasn't in the current New Who thread.

The Giggling Bean

Did anyone buy the fully animated "Power Of The Daleks" last year? The Blu Ray steelbook came out last week including a colourised version of the story (which was frowned upon by the original animators). The story actually looks pretty nice in colour (although Black and White will always be the default version). They also fixed an error on the original DVD release of Ben and Polly wearing the wrong clothes in one scene (ironically enough being told to change into some normal clothes). However they fixed one but caused another error (They flipped the Daleks around in episode 5/6 so the sucker stick and gun are the wrong way around). There's obviously some dodgy scenes of animation here and there but for a first release of a it's kind it's still a great release and I'm overjoyed that the BBC decided to do this. Hopefully next time they'll give the animation team a looser deadline to iron out the kinks etc. As I understand it the deadline was brought forward to hit the November anniversary date.

There was a survey sent around last week from the BBC regarding Power and interest in further animations. Unfortunately it was only sent to people who had signed up with the BBC to complete surveys or something, I didn't get it. One of the questions was would we rather have cut down versions in the future or the full length stories. The other was asking should existing footage be used or fully animated. I believe they where also enquiring as to whether there was any interest in animations based on the Titans comics.

Interesting stuff if the BBC are researching the future of animated stories. My opinion would be to have the full stories animated (cutting down the odd occurrence of dead air/silence within a scene) however I'd still buy cut down versions if that was the way they chose to go (as I'm a completist). In terms of existing footage I'm not against using fully existing episodes however I wouldn't want a 3 second scrap edited into a 98% animated episode. So long as any existing footage is included as a bonus feature that's enough. Whilst I enjoyed Levines Shada I think, for a commercial venture, the constant mixing of live action and animation would be very jarring. I'm not fussed at all about animated versions of Titans comics as it mainly focuses on Eccleston, Tennant, Smith and Capaldi...........however if they where ever to consider animating some of the earlier Big Finish plays that's a different matter. I'd love to see stories such as "Spare Parts", "Spectre Of Lanyon Moor", "Davros", "Project Twilight", "Project Lazarus", "The One Doctor" etc animated. I'd also love to see them visualise the original run of 8th Doctor/Charlie stories (particularly "Sword of Orion".

Nick Briggs held an open question session on Facebook last week. I broached the possibility of them animating some of the earlier Doctor Who stories. He told me that it would require a different licence to the one they held and so it wasn't "on the cards". However if the BBC decided to do it themselves it could be possible. I know they're primarily audio plays but I do think, considering the calibre of some of the early stuff, they'd make smashing visual adventures.

On the subject of Big Finish they've got a sale on their Doctor Who main range at the moment. CDs 51 to 120 are £6 each or £5 for download so if you're looking to plug any gaps or interested in getting into the audio stuff now's the time.

Deanjam

Full animation. Don't mind mixing in full episodes a la The Moonbase, but not mixing scene to scene. Don't care about the comics.

That's my tuppence worth BBC.

Now go do Evil of the Daleks.

Small Man Big Horse

Quote from: The Giggling Bean on February 13, 2017, 06:19:38 PM
There was a survey sent around last week from the BBC regarding Power and interest in further animations. Unfortunately it was only sent to people who had signed up with the BBC to complete surveys or something, I didn't get it. One of the questions was would we rather have cut down versions in the future or the full length stories. The other was asking should existing footage be used or fully animated. I believe they where also enquiring as to whether there was any interest in animations based on the Titans comics.

Interesting stuff if the BBC are researching the future of animated stories. My opinion would be to have the full stories animated (cutting down the odd occurrence of dead air/silence within a scene) however I'd still buy cut down versions if that was the way they chose to go (as I'm a completist). In terms of existing footage I'm not against using fully existing episodes however I wouldn't want a 3 second scrap edited into a 98% animated episode. So long as any existing footage is included as a bonus feature that's enough. Whilst I enjoyed Levines Shada I think, for a commercial venture, the constant mixing of live action and animation would be very jarring. I'm not fussed at all about animated versions of Titans comics as it mainly focuses on Eccleston, Tennant, Smith and Capaldi...........however if they where ever to consider animating some of the earlier Big Finish plays that's a different matter. I'd love to see stories such as "Spare Parts", "Spectre Of Lanyon Moor", "Davros", "Project Twilight", "Project Lazarus", "The One Doctor" etc animated. I'd also love to see them visualise the original run of 8th Doctor/Charlie stories (particularly "Sword of Orion".

That's really interesting to hear, and I hope something comes of it. Whilst I'd like to see some of the Big Finish stories animated as well I wouldn't write off the comics, some of them have been a lot of fun (Paul Cornell's issues especially) and there have been some which feature the third and fourth doctors as well as the new lot. Plus I'd love to have some more Eccleston stories, though I don't know how likely it is that he'd be interested in doing them.

Replies From View

Quote from: The Giggling Bean on February 13, 2017, 06:19:38 PM
Did anyone buy the fully animated "Power Of The Daleks" last year? The Blu Ray steelbook came out last week including a colourised version of the story (which was frowned upon by the original animators).

I did indeed proudly buy the DVD.  I hope everyone who wants to support future animations of lost Doctor Who has bought it in one way or another.

I didn't know the animators frowned upon a colourised version.  I assumed they'd made it in colour in the first place, and then shifted it to monochrome for the DVD release.  Seems a bit bizarre if it was made in black and white and then had to be colourised at further expense after that.

Personally I can't be arsed with a colour version, not least because I don't have a Blu Ray player.  The definition of the animation isn't high enough to justify a colour version being released only on Blu Ray anyway.  For me, this animation is supposed to fill a gap left by missing black and white episodes, and a colour version is far removed from that.  Yes, I know the animators took artistic liberties and the black and white one is still in widescreen etc, but still.  It's a personal matter of which lines can be crossed.

Alberon

If the BBC did cut-down versions there would be uproar from the fans. Bit like on the earliest VHS releases where they edited the stories into omnibus editions before they realised the fans preferred each episode complete with titles and reprises.

Anyone have any idea how Power did on DVD? Hopefully enough to do Evil of the Daleks at least.

Replies From View

Quote from: Alberon on February 13, 2017, 09:54:35 PM
If the BBC did cut-down versions there would be uproar from the fans.

I agree but I don't know whether the BBC would give a shit about that, as long as fans buy it, which they will.  The DVD release for The Underwater Menace was astonishingly minimal.  The people assembling the reconstructions of the lost episodes offered to do it properly at no extra cost, and they were apparently instructed to do less.

I don't know who's in charge of Classic Who releases these days, but I do think the days of generous extras and loving restoration are well behind us.

Alberon

To be fair, we were spoiled by them. Classic Who releases have never been a big seller and all the extras probably didn't alter the sales figures much.

The Giggling Bean

I groan every time I go onto Doctor Who news and see the latest releases from Titan Comics. As I grew up with Doctor Who in the 80s those are the Doctors that appeal to me and that's why I'd hope they'd consider some of the Big Finish stuff.. I love all of them prior to Smith but I would like to see a new set of comics featuring 5, 6 or 7. That said if they wanted to adapt some of the 8th Doctor Titan comics I'd be happy enough (mainly because we just need more 8th Doctor stuff. Mainly though it does always seem to be the post 2005 Doctors and; well they've had their turn. Colin and Sylvester have some cracking stories through Big Finish and they never had the chance to show what sort of Doctors they could be (okay McCoy had more of a chance than Colin). It's a shame that the 11 DVDs for Colin and 12 DVDs for Sylvester make up their entire era. Not as bad as McGann with his single disc.

Back to Power though. In terms of the colourised version, that only came about because BBC America joined later in the day. I think they requested a colourised version, I know it was done without the consent of the animation team. I think it was a company in Canada that worked from the original files and colourised them. Charles Horton, the guy in charge of the project, came onto Gallifrey Base and made it quite clear it was only supposed to be in Black and White and he did not endorse the colour version. In fairness I do think it looks quite nice, although it does make it a bit more obvious that the Daleks are CGI. Like I said before, it's nice to have the colour version however, the Black and White version is the intended version and I'll probably choose that from now on.

I have to say to Replies though the extras package we got with Power was pretty substantial. There was a documentary on the making of Power (the original story not the animated version), the existing film trims, the Telesnap recon, the leaked test footage, Photo Gallery and commentaries. The release of Power was certainly on par with some of the special editions of the range from back in the day. How further animated releases would be treated I don't know. The Telesnap recon for power had been previously released, so already existed. I'm not sure they'd do that again as well as creating the animations.

I have to agree that the treatment of "Underwater Menace" was very poor. I believe it was the same chap who created the recon for "Web Of Fear" episode 3 and offered recons along similar lines. Obviously these, despite being offered at no extra cost, where turned down. There was speculation that such a recon would have to be classified and rated at an extra cost.....still very poor though. I'd hope that, unless Phil Morris pulls the rabbit out of the hat, they'd go back and animate the missing eps of U.M and reissue it. I know it's not a popular story but it did at least deserve better treatment than it got.

They experimented with the cut down format on a few of the DVDs ("Enlightenment" and "Planet Of Fire" I think) it was okay as an extra but I doubt putting cut down versions of missing stories would be popular. As folk have cited that's how the VHS range started and they eventually conceded that we wanted the full episodes. I could see them animating the full episodes but maybe doing cut down colour versions as a broadcast alternative (if they decided they would broadcast them). This also brings speculation as to "The Celestial Toymaker" with it's controversial use of the N word. Debate has raged on Gallifrey Base as to whether it should be edited out or kept in as a product of its time. I'm not fussed either way, it would be nice to have the option of seeing it again. I don't want cut down versions but I'm not opposed to trims here and there.

I'd hope that since the BBC are canvasing opinions on how to move forward it looks promising that they'd try another couple. "Evil of the Daleks" appears to be the one everybody, including Alberon. is expecting next. I suppose from a cost cutting point of view it works. The animation team have the templates for Troughton and the Daleks plus an episode actually exists. It's clear the BBC expect that Dalek and Cybermen stories will sell better (hence why they where a bit sniffy about Enemy and Web) but I'd hope we'd get some of the other Troughton monster stories. I'd love to see "The Macra Terror", "The Faceless Ones" and "Fury From The Deep". I think Power must have done quite well for them to put the feelers out. I bought the DVD and Blu Ray and I think a lot of other people double dipped; a lot of people pre ordered it from the BBC store.

Fingers crossed we'll get more. I think they'll do more to keep it under wraps next time. The test footage got leaked which led to speculation and it was announced about 2 weeks later I seem to recall. I guess next time we won't find out until they're ready to announce. Still it all sounds pretty promising and maybe we haven't seen the end of the classic range just yet.

Replies From View

Quote from: The Giggling Bean on February 13, 2017, 10:48:46 PM
I have to say to Replies though the extras package we got with Power was pretty substantial. There was a documentary on the making of Power (the original story not the animated version), the existing film trims, the Telesnap recon, the leaked test footage, Photo Gallery and commentaries. The release of Power was certainly on par with some of the special editions of the range from back in the day.

You're right. 

It's simply that the 'Underwater Menace' release still rankles and I think a part of me is still concerned about the kinds of corners they'll cut for future releases if they can.

I just urge everyone who wants 'Power of the Daleks' to buy it and support future ventures along these lines.

purlieu

Oh yes, The Macra Terror would be an excellent choice. I'm hopeful about the future, I reckon we'll at least get another (agreed that Evil of the Daleks is most likely). If that's successful then I wouldn't be that surprised if they went the whole hog and did The Daleks' Master Plan to complete the set (and maybe The Wheel in Space to finish off the Cybermen set).

After that, I'd be hesitant to expect any more though. The Celestial Toymaker would be the best bet, as it's probably the most interesting of the remaining missing stories. What are the chances of another boxset for the remaining ones? The Crusade would take the least work - only two missing episodes - but it's not such a highly sought after story in itself. There are two episodes of The Faceless Ones, one of The Space Pirates, one of The Abominable Snowmen. The former two aren't exactly the biggest draws. But maybe a 'Revisitations' style box could justify them.

I can't imagine getting DVDs of stories like The Savages and The Smugglers at any point, though. Slight as they are, I'd love to have them, but unless they really do commit to doing the whole lot, there are a few stories like those which are never going to be touched.

Replies From View

After The Evil of the Daleks it has to be The Wheel in Space, surely.  It'll always be Daleks and Cybermen first, though I don't expect them tackle The Daleks' Master Plan until they've done at least The Abominable Snowmen and The Macra Terror (the latter purely because the Macra have appeared in the post-2005 series).

purlieu

Yes, that's probably a fair assessment. After that, though, none particularly leap out.

Replies From View

Quote from: purlieu on February 14, 2017, 12:33:32 AM
Yes, that's probably a fair assessment. After that, though, none particularly leap out.

Well it would be straightforward to complete seasons 1 and 2 with Marco Polo and The Crusade respectively.  So those would be a natural progression.

Then The Abominable Snowmen, since its sequel The Web of Fear is already out.  The Highlanders introduces Jamie, so after a while there'll be some desire to plug that gap.


Bit by bit all the pieces can be put together for one reason or another.  There could be a more generic 'historicals' box set but normally with box sets the idea is to offset the cost of an expensive release with the cheapness of another.  If they're all animated, they'd probably have to be released individually.

Attila

I am writing a book with a colleague who would vote for Marco Polo, no questions asked. He was fortunate enough to see it twice as a child, first on the original broadcast and then when his family were living in Australia a couple of years later.

Norton Canes

I'm like the smart Ogron in Day of the Daleks.

"No animations."