Chart Music Podcast

[gilbertharding]

Ah - see what you mean.

No, it was just this one girl who used to take the piss because I liked the Beatles.

Although I do remember the 4th year juniors becoming a very odd time of life (I presume this is universal) as you suddenly see one of life's small cliff edges looming, and there's a sense that you're suddenly going to have to grow up.

I definitely had developed the idea, probably thanks to my big sister (10 years older than me) that the music you liked was hugely important to defining your identity, and might make the difference to whether or not people might think you were cool...  I presume a few others had reached similar conclusions.

I remember a conversation with a boy who wanted to be a DJ, I THINK after getting the hang of Saturday Night Fever, somehow (the film was an X, wasn't it?). Some other kids reckoned Gary Numan was so good and futuristic, all other music was basically redundant.

It was only a few people - like you say, I suppose most of the kids were just happy to like (or not) pop music.

Do you remember the Bay City Rollers chant though?

[Satchmo Distel]

The analyses of Joe Jackson and The Specials are great, but I don't think they quite resolve why it's OK to like a song as misogynistic as 'Too Much Too Young'.  The feminist quote* Simon found about 'Bodies' is good in explaining that sometimes music with menace and edge is more important to a feminist than self-policed PC blandness, and we give The Pistols and Specials a licence for that reason, but there is still the issue (as they acknowledge, to be fair) that boys are going to be going up to each other, and to girls, quoting the more obnoxious lines without irony.

*From here: https://sites.psu.edu/punk/files/2016/05/Ellen_Willis_on_Sex_Pistols-1xkhngq.pdf

[boki]

I remember a conversation with a boy who wanted to be a DJ, I THINK after getting the hang of Saturday Night Fever, somehow (the film was an X, wasn't it?).

Originally it was, but it was re-released with a family friendly cut to capitalise on Travolta's megastardom.

[Brundle-Fly]

Ah - see what you mean.

No, it was just this one girl who used to take the piss because I liked the Beatles.

Although I do remember the 4th year juniors becoming a very odd time of life (I presume this is universal) as you suddenly see one of life's small cliff edges looming, and there's a sense that you're suddenly going to have to grow up.

I definitely had developed the idea, probably thanks to my big sister (10 years older than me) that the music you liked was hugely important to defining your identity, and might make the difference to whether or not people might think you were cool...  I presume a few others had reached similar conclusions.

I remember a conversation with a boy who wanted to be a DJ, I THINK after getting the hang of Saturday Night Fever, somehow (the film was an X, wasn't it?). Some other kids reckoned Gary Numan was so good and futuristic, all other music was basically redundant.

It was only a few people - like you say, I suppose most of the kids were just happy to like (or not) pop music.

Do you remember the Bay City Rollers chant though?

It all got more tribal when I started secondary school in 1977. That year, I just liked anything that was in the charts except drippy stuff. It was only when the New Wave bands came along that I started to form my own tastes beyond my parents record collection, K-Tel pop compilation albums and Mr Blue Sky.

Yep, I do remember the chant.

[Crabwalk]

I think Taylor's dismissal of 'Brass In Pocket' was about as far off base as he's been on the podcast. Even when I disagree with him, I usually enjoy the wonderful precision with which he lays out what a song or performer gets right and wrong. But tt did sound more like a forced stance due to his intense dislike of Chrissie Hynde on this occasion.

It was another good listen, but I think they should leave the Eighventies alone for a bit - at least with Simon and Taylor. They're covering a lot of similar ground to old episodes now.

[Pauline Walnuts]

It was another good listen, but I think they should leave the Eighventies alone for a bit - at least with Simon and Taylor. They're covering a lot of similar ground to old episodes now.

My heart did sink when I heard they were doing 1980 for what, 4th time? That and the fact it was about 6 hours long.

[DrGreggles]

Why is more a bad thing?

[dr beat]

I really enjoyed this episode but yes I do think they should vary up the eras a bit more.  And I don't they should feel they have to do 4.5 hours plus every time.  I've been going back to some of the old eps, and they are perfectly fine even if they are a bit shorter.

[Brundle-Fly]

They could record forty-odd eps from 1980 TOTP editions in a row, as far as I'm concerned.  I've never startled more pigeons and train passengers guffawing than this week. But yeah...Al will probably shake it it up next CMP podcast.

[Natnar]

I really enjoyed this episode but yes I do think they should vary up the eras a bit more.  And I don't they should feel they have to do 4.5 hours plus every time.  I've been going back to some of the old eps, and they are perfectly fine even if they are a bit shorter.

They've only done 3 episodes from between 88 and 93 (still no 88, 90 or 92 episodes)

[shiftwork2]

They've only done 3 episodes from between 88 and 93 (still no 88, 90 or 92 episodes)

I'm personally quite happy that CMP de-emphasises that period and it's not just based on my advancing age - TOTP was arguably lacking in identity and in terminal decline from mid 80s onwards.  There's much less to talk about.  Where's the Neol Edmonds Gas Disco?  Fucking nowhere that's where.

[DrGreggles]

Yep

[non capisco]

Having been through the process of watching all the existing TOTP episodes from '67-'80 this winter I can confirm there is still a bounty of interesting non-Savile episodes they can cover for a while yet. Loads of fresh territory at both the 'mint and skill' and 'catshit' ends of the spectrum.

[Nice Relaxing Poo]

The quality of the music in the 88-93 episodes is dogshit, It ends up being too much of coat-down fest and it doesn't even have the pleasing oddball quirks of the rubbish music of the early 80s.

[Jockice]

The analyses of Joe Jackson and The Specials are great, but I don't think they quite resolve why it's OK to like a song as misogynistic as 'Too Much Too Young'.  The feminist quote* Simon found about 'Bodies' is good in explaining that sometimes music with menace and edge is more important to a feminist than self-policed PC blandness, and we give The Pistols and Specials a licence for that reason, but there is still the issue (as they acknowledge, to be fair) that boys are going to be going up to each other, and to girls, quoting the more obnoxious lines without irony.

*From here: https://sites.psu.edu/punk/files/2016/05/Ellen_Willis_on_Sex_Pistols-1xkhngq.pdf

Pricey's analysis of Pearl's Cafe by The Specials in that Unknown Treasures booklet that MM gave away was completely incorrect. I think he described it as sexist and cold-hearted. It's anything but. I agree with a lot of his writings but that really was a load of bollocks. So bollocks to it all.

[Jockice]

I think Taylor's dismissal of 'Brass In Pocket' was about as far off base as he's been on the podcast. Even when I disagree with him, I usually enjoy the wonderful precision with which he lays out what a song or performer gets right and wrong. But tt did sound more like a forced stance due to his intense dislike of Chrissie Hynde on this occasion.

Yeah, strange. I've always thought it was one of those rare singles that nobody (no matter what their musical tastes are) really dislikes.

[Satchmo Distel]

Pricey's analysis of Pearl's Cafe by The Specials in that Unknown Treasures booklet that MM gave away was completely incorrect. I think he described it as sexist and cold-hearted. It's anything but. I agree with a lot of his writings but that really was a load of bollocks. So bollocks to it all.

"When I first met you, I really thought you were a wet dream come true
Now I know that you don't care, about somebody else's nightmare."

Seems quite clear. The singer is expressing empathy for a middle-aged working-class woman and is shocked his girlfriend does not share it.

There's also a female backing vocal (Rhoda Dakar?)

[Johnboy]

i don't mind how often they do 1980, anything from 77-84 is fine with me

[Satchmo Distel]

I agree but would also include 1970-1976 and might exclude 1984, which apart from Frankie and Prince had a lot of shit clogging up the Top 10, although that's partly because I heard it through the prism of Radio 1 so it's interminably mixed with Bates, Wright and DLT in my head. TOTP was also in its worst balloons phase in 1984, like a children's birthday party.

[dr beat]

One thing 90s CMPs have going for them is that they are a good excuse for the gang to talk about their experiences in the music journalism trenches.

[Jockice]

"When I first met you, I really thought you were a wet dream come true
Now I know that you don't care, about somebody else's nightmare."

Seems quite clear. The singer is expressing empathy for a middle-aged working-class woman and is shocked his girlfriend does not share it.

There's also a female backing vocal (Rhoda Dakar?)

Indeed. I can't remember the exact words he used but he compared it to other Specials songs like Little Bitch and Hey Little Rich Girl, which could be seen as very sexist. I seem to remember the words 'ageing tart' used for the middle-aged women and making out that the lyrics were just aimed at  insulting her rather than showing compassion. 'The pubs were closed, she'd got nowhere to go when she'd spilt her tea. Have you never thought one day that could be me?' has been known to reduce me to tears if I'm in the right (or wrong) frame of mind.

Although I agree with him that More Specials is one of the most underrated albums of all time (I think it's the second-greatest ever made) it really annoyed me that he seemed to get that one song so wrong.

[gilbertharding]

One thing 90s CMPs have going for them is that they are a good excuse for the gang to talk about their experiences in the music journalism trenches.

One thing I hate about 90s CMPs is that they are an excuse for the gang to go on and on about their old jobs. It's a credit to their self awareness that the anecdotes never end 'Needless to say I had the last laugh.'

I always disliked the Melody Maker. I couldn't tell you why: I only ever bought it as a last resort (those weeks when you had to go to the launderette TWICE, sort of thing).

Of course, the fact that former NME writers seem to have a stranglehold on so much modern media (Quantick, Maconie, Collins, um... there must be more...) reminds me that they were also terrible - but still.

[DrGreggles]

I personally found the MM 'end of days' episode with Neil and Sarah to be absolutely fascinating but, as they were the only 2 of the CM crew on board at the time, I doubt it will be something they will revisit.

[gilbertharding]

Actually to say I hate 90s CMPs for that reason is too strong.

I can't remember a CMP I didn't enjoy - but 90s TotPs are a hate watch, and the endless raking over the coals of The End of MM has is a bit tedious.

Mind you - the retelling of Blue Tulip Rose Read (with added awareness of how, actually, serious it was) was a bit unhappy this week.

[Camp Tramp]

One thing I hate about 90s CMPs is that they are an excuse for the gang to go on and on about their old jobs. It's a credit to their self awareness that the anecdotes never end 'Needless to say I had the last laugh.'

I always disliked the Melody Maker. I couldn't tell you why: I only ever bought it as a last resort (those weeks when you had to go to the launderette TWICE, sort of thing).

Of course, the fact that former NME writers seem to have a stranglehold on so much modern media (Quantick, Maconie, Collins, um... there must be more...) reminds me that they were also terrible - but still.

Lamacq?

[Crabwalk]

There have been plenty of garbage 70s TOTP episodes discussed and the podcasts have still been great. Can't see why we shouldn't have some more from 86-94 and hear their views on some different presenters and artists. There must be 3 or 4 episodes from each of those years with a sprinkling of decent/interesting music among the more coat-downable stuff?

[phantom_power]

They always go on about the battle and differences between NME and MM but I used to see them as pretty much interchangeable when I bought them in the 90s. I would just get whichever one(s) had the most interesting front cover or free tape

[Jockice]

They always go on about the battle and differences between NME and MM but I used to see them as pretty much interchangeable when I bought them in the 90s. I would just get whichever one(s) had the most interesting front cover or free tape

You weren't supposed to use the word 'I' in the NME but it was encouraged in the MM. As someone once told me anyway.

[Satchmo Distel]

My understanding was that Simon was retelling the story of Blue Tulip Rose Read for the benefit of new listeners. It's rough on existing subscribers though, paying for repeats.

[easytarget]

My understanding was that Simon was retelling the story of Blue Tulip Rose Read for the benefit of new listeners. It's rough on existing subscribers though, paying for repeats.

Maybe I don't remember the original story perfectly, but I don't think Simon actually repeated that much (despite, as you say, claiming that re-telling the story was for the benefit of new listeners). I think there were new quotes from the doc and the mood was also slightly different with more of an acknowledgement of her mental health issues and the awkwardness of laughing at her.

Anyway - great episode. More please.