Star Wars Battlefront 2

[Barry Admin]

lazarou, the CoD Zombies Easter eggs are deliberately obtuse as fuck, but I guess you may know that? This is also something else that has been kind of spoiled, by 1-month console exclusivity, and greedy youtubers. Regardless, it's not an apt comparison to unlocking a game-changing beast like Vader,, to be honest.

I also have no objection to grinding to unlock stuff, and have been working on my diamond sniper camos all week, and loving the shit out of it. However, it's worth restating the issue here is people being able to come in and skip the grind by paying money, which makes the grind longer (by necessity) for everyone else. I play to be competitive and adore shooters, so it would piss me off for sure to get out-sniped by some rich whale who paid to get an advantage.

I really want the game, but I dunno, god damn. I've also wanted Modern Warfare Remastered for over a year now, and thought I'd get it in a Black Friday sale. Turns out they split the community by launching a map pack (for like 12 quid, when I bought it originally for about 8, and it was free on PC), and they also brought in fucking supply drops with melee weapons and whatever, ruining the whole point of it as a faithful remaster.

[brat-sampson]

Important update.

[Barry Admin]

It's funny, but I just thought "written by a non-gamer who has never been drop-shotted or went prone."

I'm expecting CoD to start charging for bullets, at some point.

Anyway, damn, I want the Star Wars game, damn. Then I read stuff like this from the director of Bulletstorm:

Everybody in the gaming industry is watching the #StarWarsBattlefrontII drama unfold. The future is clear: no outrage and memes will matter if they're followed by tens/hundreds of millions earned by EA on in-game purchases. Your wallet has way louder voice than you.

Y'know?

I actually wanted to start a GB thread today about how I feel miserable about this situation and the Weinstein #metoo thing, because I value them highly, but believe nothing will ever fundamentally change. There will never be a major paradigm shift because a lot of people are just fundamentally rubbish, greedy bastards. I really need a joint.

[mobias]

I dunno I think this whole debacle might be a bit of a game changer. What you might find with paid for loot boxes is that they're brought in later in a game's lifecycle rather than at launch or indeed anywhere near launch. There is the argument that paid for loot boxes help your very part time gamer who can't devote their life to gaming get the cool kit that other more devoted players get. Thats the argument that you frequently hear in favour of paid for loot boxes and perhaps gamers would be more generous towards that argument if paid for loot boxes were brought into a games economy at a later date. Maybe after a year, say. Maybe that would be an acceptable compromise or maybe it wouldn't. I don't know.

As far as BF2 is concerned, as someone over on the Recetra forum pointed out, the main reason why the gaming community seems to have become so whipped up over this launch (loot boxes are nothing new, as we know) is that EA made the big mistake of making the 'pay to get ahead' deal with loot boxes so prominent in their marketing, which was clearly an unbelievably stupid thing to do, and then implement the feature so crudely in the game itself. The other reason of course being that its EA and Disney we're dealing with here and there is next to no goodwill towards either of them from anyone in the gaming community. 

Anyway, damn, I want the Star Wars game, damn.

Get it! Its an utterly incredible game. I think you can get it in the knowledge that this particular battle over loot boxes has been won by the gaming community and not buying the game now will have little or no effect on the long term war over the problem.

Edit. This is worth a watch https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BXwe0garDsE

[Zetetic]

What battle has been won here?

[mobias]

What battle has been won here?

EA have, for the time being anyway, removed paid for loot crates from the game. There's no pay to win now.

[bgmnts]

It will be back as soon as the refund date expires.

[lazarou]

lazarou, the CoD Zombies Easter eggs are deliberately obtuse as fuck, but I guess you may know that? This is also something else that has been kind of spoiled, by 1-month console exclusivity, and greedy youtubers. Regardless, it's not an apt comparison to unlocking a game-changing beast like Vader,, to be honest.

Ah, you might be right. And yeah, I knew they were sort of obtuse but had no idea they were that bad. Like, unless I joined up with a dedicated group and committed to it it was never going to happen kind of bad.

In other news, I just unlocked Vader and he's not all that great, hey ho. I just can't get the hang of the lightsaber fellas in MP matches before I get hammered, might need to work on that.

[Shay Chaise]

I wish I'd preordered this so I had an excuse to play it guilt free. It really does look and sound absolutely sensational.

[mobias]

In other news, I just unlocked Vader and he's not all that great, hey ho. I just can't get the hang of the lightsaber fellas in MP matches before I get hammered, might need to work on that.

I think the hero's are somewhat nerfed in this compared to the first game so you can upgrade them later with the star cards. In the hands of a good player they can still be quite annoyingly deadly but from my brief experience of playing as one its not nearly as easy to go on massive killing sprees with Vader or Luke, or the others.

One thing thats been discussed elsewhere and that does slightly bug me about the game is the mixing up of the generation timelines and being able to play as hero on a map that they were never a part of in the movies. Playing as Kylo Ren on Naboo for example.  Seems a bit out of place.

In general though I'm so much more preferring this points based system for unlocking hero's, ships and classes during a game. It makes the whole thing much more full on because in the first game people did spend a lot of time running around trying to find hero and weapons pick ups and camping where the choice ones spawned.   

I wish I'd preordered this so I had an excuse to play it guilt free. It really does look and sound absolutely sensational.

Just get it. Its amazing. They've removed the pay to win.

[colacentral]

As few people as possible need to buy it for any "battle" to be "won." It's getting mediocre reviews, no one needs it that badly. There are thousands of better games that are older, cheaper, and better, so everyone should just play one of those if they need to.

[Ham Bap]

I might buy this in about 3-4 weeks, it would be nice to play over Christmas.
I also read they may price drop it a bit when The Last Jedi comes out, dunno by how much though.

[Barry Admin]

Best bet is to wait and see how the sales are over this weekend. And get a bit more feedback from players. As the director of Bulletstorm says, the real test is gonna be when they bring back pay to win, and how much money they make from it, despite all this fuss.

[biggytitbo]

The whole thing has been such a PR disaster that even if the game still does well you'd hope even a publisher as shameless as EA, and certainly other less shitty game companies will be a lot more wary about pushing it too far in future games.


You'd hope at least,  rather than expect.

[Barry Admin]

Just reading that the progression is all front-loaded, and slows to a crawl very noticeably. There's an XP cap per game, too. Also saw this week that they stopped you from using arcade mode to farm credits. Pride and accompliment.

This is the stuff I'm really interested in, graphics don't keep me invested in a game. I love UFC2, but got
it for a tenner when it was on sale, and the grind was atrocious, so I already know how dedicated EA are to the pay to win model. I had to sit and watch adverts regularly, just to get credits for the chance of getting good loot/upgrades for my fighters. Fuck this shit, let the whales buy cosmetics, and cosmetics only. NOT enhanced abilities.

Edit: biggy, it's worth remembering that the first game was pretty controversial as well, because it was shipped with hardly any content so people would purchase the season pass. Now they're testing out this new model.

[mobias]

Its interesting what that guy from Youtube I linked to above said about Dice being really limited about cosmetic upgrades because Lucas and Disney are so anal about not allowing certain cosmetic changes in the game.

The progression is front loaded but thats fairly typical of online games ins't it? Reward players early but keep them playing to unlock cool stuff later on.

The progression such that it is does seem a bit of an afterthought simply to address the criticism that the first game had next to no progression after a certain point, which was quite early on. In this game I seem to have found my chosen set up at rank 11 now and I've found a good blaster that suits my ability (or lack of) level and I'm doing pretty well. I get in the top 10 in most matches and get an average of 20 or so kills per match. Its pretty obvious I think that all these star cards and ability unlocks have quite subtle effects in the game, so far anyway. Its certainly not like the first game where there were some unlocks, like the jet pack and personal force field, had quite a profound influence on things. If you want a jet pack now its locked to a certain class. I think I prefer this new system.

[Zetetic]

It will be back as soon as the refund date expires.

Exactly.

Temporarily ripping out pay-to-win at the last minute isn't any sort of consumer victory, it's a trivial sop to change the story for a bit. There's no commitment to fixing the mechanics, built as they are in large part around loot boxes, and no commitment to change the business model (and how could there be at this point, for this game? Presumably the business case for producing it was made with loot boxes in mind.).

If this is something that concerns you, the only immediate power available to a consumer is not to buy it.

[George Oscar Bluth II]

The exact same mechanics are in play in FIFA's Ultimate Team. EA are...appalling. It is gambling, and the exact same tricks are used as are used as in FOBTs and online casinos.

It's really high time government/regulators got involved in this shit.

[Barry Admin]

They have again "made the outrage outdated", as mentioned on page 2, its all PR.

And you still have some pay to win in the Deluxe version, too: https://www.polygon.com/2017/11/17/16670542/star-wars-battle-front-2-elite-trooper-deluxe-edition-cards

I hate all this shit that makes me feel like I'm missing out by being a broke cunt! I can afford a game every once in a while, but then I have to try and buy the whole game again in paying for a season pass? And I have to miss out on all the cool stuff that is given away for preorders and deluxe editions? And now I have to sit and mindlessly grind for hours and hours and hours to earn credits which don't even guarantee me abilities?  That's not fun, that's a job.

[Moribunderast]

Is it true they've released this game with an unfinished single-player campaign? A couple videos I've seen have made reference to it basically reaching a point in the story and then saying "Welp, hope you enjoyed that, check out the DLC for the conclusion!"

As someone who doesn't really do multiplayer games and has never watched a Star War, the bollocking this game is taking doesn't really concern me but I am concerned at just how quickly these microtransactions and loot-boxes have evolved to the point where I soon won't want to buy a AAA game again. I wish companies would learn from stuff like Horizon that you can make a lot of money without selling out your game's balance or locking off content. My fear is that, despite the backlash, the simple fact that this is a Star Wars game means it will make millions and AAA companies will be further emboldened because, at the end of the day, gamers will still buy this shit even if they stamp their feet and complain while doing it.

[biggytitbo]

Not sure about that, the reason EA are so cunty is they know they have the most foolproof license in gaming - people are going to buy a big Star Wars game whatever indignities the publishers inflict on them. Other publishers trying the same thing, but with far less bankable licenses, might just think twice now.

[Barry Admin]

Very interesting reading regarding psychological manipulation in f2p https://www.gamasutra.com/blogs/RaminShokrizade/20130626/194933/The_Top_F2P_Monetization_Tricks.php

This game is £50 in Asda btw, had a look at it last night. Fifty fucking quid.

A Jim Sterling unused quote from a WashPo article I need to go into incognito mode to read

As we've recently seen, Electronic Arts ran with its tail between its legs following widespread backlash, a disastrous Reddit AMA, and unflattering news headlines. It's temporarily removed the monetization from Battlefront II in an effort to curry favor with the audience and perhaps make those nervous investors a bit happier. In the long run, however, I believe companies will continue to see how far they can push the envelope. This is far from the first time a publisher has reached for too much too quickly, had to walk it back, and take baby steps toward its end goal of acquiring as much cash for as little additional effort as possible.

Despite EA's temporary retreat, it showed its hand quite clearly, and exposed the future potential the "AAA" game industry sees for loot boxes. With Activision Blizzard literally patenting methods of psychologically manipulating its players into spending money, I still fear this situation could get worse long before it gets better, and it won't get better until external pressures push publishers off their current course, or the whole microtransaction bubble bursts and they move onto the next get-richer-quicker scheme.

Here's the article: https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/comic-riffs/wp/2017/11/18/how-a-star-wars-video-game-faced-charges-that-it-was-promoting-gambling/?utm_term=.d381d48e4436&tid=sm_rd

[bgmnts]

Not sure about that, the reason EA are so cunty is they know they have the most foolproof license in gaming - people are going to buy a big Star Wars game whatever indignities the publishers inflict on them. Other publishers trying the same thing, but with far less bankable licenses, might just think twice now.

EA are cunty regardless. Be it a foolproof franchise like Star Wars or Fifa or a new IP like Dead Space.

They buy a studio, milk it of any revenue then kill the studio. Notorious for it.

[Barry Admin]

That article links to this, which I briefly mentioned upthread: Matchmaking that pairs you up with people in such a way as to encourage you to buy microtransactions.

https://kotaku.com/activision-patents-matchmaking-that-encourages-players-1819630937

[George Oscar Bluth II]

This tweet just popped up in my timeline: https://twitter.com/NyeBeverage/status/931958671415959555

One of the young lads at work took out a £500 loan to spend on Fifa points and I don't even know what they are but I still know it's the thickest thing anyone ever did.

It's exploitative.

I've really no problem with DLC game expansions, or cosmetic upgrades you can buy. But when it's as integral to the game as Fifa points are on Ultimate Team it's just exploitation. People have spent £50 to buy the damn game in the first place, it's staggering.

[bgmnts]

http://heavy.com/games/2017/10/scientific-revenue-mobile-gaming-jim-sterling/

This article sums up how we who enjoy gaming products are viewed. We are "whales", "cows", whatever terms they use to dehumanise their customer base now, nothing more than cattle. It's been happening slowly over the past 2 decades I think but it's ridiculous now, culminating with Battlefront 2 and Activision with their gross patents.

All just so some fat cunts in shit designer suits can buy another yacht or holiday home. I hope they get syphilis.

[Shay Chaise]

Aside from the grossness, I've basically got bored of this now. Good old EA Access! I probably played two hours of the trial, saved me fifty quid.

[Barry Admin]

Yeah I looked up the reddit last night when I was standing in front of the game at Asda, and read enough complaints about the gameplay to make myself feel better. I actually wasn't taken with the beta at all, but then ended up getting into the first game afterwards, so I was curious. I think I'll wait till I can get the second one for a tenner, also.

[Barry Admin]

Physical sales are down. CoD is still selling hand over fist, and I got my diamond snipers at 4 this morning, woohoo.

http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2017-11-20-star-wars-battlefront-2-physical-sales-down-60-per-cent-on-battlefront-1

[BeardFaceMan]

Physical sales are down. CoD is still selling hand over fist, and I got my diamond snipers at 4 this morning, woohoo.

http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2017-11-20-star-wars-battlefront-2-physical-sales-down-60-per-cent-on-battlefront-1

Ah happy days. Both for the shitty sales and for diamond snipers. Was it BlopsII where we went sniper mental for a while?  We really need to do that CaB leadeboard, we can post screenshots of our best times/kills/scores/k/d ratio etc. Posting game clips youve recorded would be good too. Its nice all this microtransaction bollocks looks like it might actually change something,  I've been pissed of with games for a while over all this, would be nice to do something to feel good about games again.