'New' Brexit Thread 2 - The Empire Strikes Back

[Paul Calf]

A) Nobody cares about MEPs, too distant, too anonymous, have very little power b) When we vote at national level we vote for specific policies, nobody votes for policies at the EU level, they're set by diktat and rubber stamped or not by the non-entities in the parliament.

Is that what happened with the Working Time Directive? Air quality laws? Or did Britain just decide to ignore the EU and continue farting CO into the air we breathe and forcing workers to spend their lives toiling?

Good job we have our glorious national government isn't it?

[Jumblegraws]

When we vote at national level we vote for specific policies, nobody votes for policies at the EU level, they're set by diktat and rubber stamped or not by the non-entities in the parliament.

Can't speak for others, but when I vote in GEs, I'm much more interested in the makeup of the Commons and what that bodes for its role as the legislative arm than I am in the executive policies of parties.

Ever followed the life of a piece of EU legislation from consultation level to enactment? That's a pretty slow-motion diktat.

[Howj Begg]

Oh look, Leave voters were played for suckers so Farage's hedge fund mates could get richer off the back of a national and economic disaster:

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/features/2018-06-25/brexit-big-short-how-pollsters-helped-hedge-funds-beat-the-crash

[jobotic]

Good news about Erdogan eh? I hope we can get a big strong leader like that post-Brexit, to destroy the excesses of neo-liberalism.

[petril]

We can vote the tories out, we can't vote the EU out. We can, and did, vote to leave though.

We can vote Britain out as well. And Brexit will just make it so much easier

[shh]

Good news about Erdogan eh? I hope we can get a big strong leader like that post-Brexit, to destroy the excesses of neo-liberalism.

Francis Fukuyama joins Nostradamus in the dustbin of history.

[jobotic]

Brexit uncertainty putting 860,000 jobs at risk, warns car industry

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2018/jun/26/brexit-uncertainty-putting-860000-jobs-at-risk-warns-car-industry?CMP=Share_AndroidApp_Copy_to_clipboard

Fuck em. Probably all anti-democratic elitist neo-liberal remoaners.

[George Oscar Bluth II]

Good post. The EU is essentially Blairism writ large, which is why he and the reset of the centrists who have dominated western politics for 20 years are so determined to somehow, anyhow, reverse brexit. Neocons + identify politics. LGBT rights + endless war. Globalism + everyone getting shafted by neo-liberalism and fealty to the bankers.

All the most toxic shit with a cherry on the top and thankfully people are finally seeing it for the comprehensive con it is.

And we're going to replace it with pure nationalism mixed in with even more neoliberalism, after a complete collapse of the economy after we get no deal in April 2019. Good work bigs, that's what you wanted all along right?

[George Oscar Bluth II]

Brexit uncertainty putting 860,000 jobs at risk, warns car industry

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2018/jun/26/brexit-uncertainty-putting-860000-jobs-at-risk-warns-car-industry?CMP=Share_AndroidApp_Copy_to_clipboard

Fuck em. Probably all anti-democratic elitist neo-liberal remoaners.

It does feel like we're starting to get Project Reality. Businesses have kept quiet, not wanting to be attacked by the high priests of our new nationalism for not believing fervently enough, but we're now...9 months from Brexit and we have no idea at all what it means. None.

If businesses aren't shitting themselves they're not paying attention.

[Howj Begg]

"Fuck business"
The secretary of state for foreign and commonwealth affairs

[George Oscar Bluth II]

Imagine if John McDonnell had been caught saying "fuck business".

Somehow doubt the high priests of the new nationalism would have been nodding in agreement.

Also don't forget Johnson was taped saying this:

"You've got to face the fact there may now be a meltdown. OK? I don't want anybody to panic during the meltdown. No panic. Pro bono publico, no bloody panic. It's going to be all right in the end."

A crisis is coming and they know it. These fuckers.

[phantom_power]

Is there a site that tracks polls of the public's political concerns over the last 10 years? I imagine "being in the EU" was nowhere in sight before the referendum, nor any of the reasons leavers have given for us leaving, other than immigration.

There is all this talk about the will of the people but what about the will of the people who didn't want a referendum about a topic that was so complicated most politicians and economists haven't got a clue about the ramifications of the many aspects of leaving the EU, let alone Joe Public?

It still seems ridiculous to me that because one fuck-headed politician rolled the dice on firming up his support and losing, and then a referendum where it is clear both sides didn't have the required information on what they were voting for or what any of it would mean in the long run, and despite two years of struggling to even begin to leave showing we don't have a government good enough to exit with any degree of dignity or control and an EU that, quite rightly, won't cede anything to this pisspot country that has decided to leave, we should just carry on over the top and into oblivion because....well, because we lost and they won apparently.

[George Oscar Bluth II]

Oh yeah absolutely no-one except hard right nationalists like biggy and sovereignty weirdos gave a shit about the EU.

That's why the £350m a week for the NHS was so devastating to the Remain campaign. It made the campaign about real shit.

[Norton Canes]

'Experts' first, now 'business'. When will people learn that the Tories know more about Brexit than anyone else?

[Johnny Yesno]

Oh look, Leave voters were played for suckers so Farage's hedge fund mates could get richer off the back of a national and economic disaster:

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/features/2018-06-25/brexit-big-short-how-pollsters-helped-hedge-funds-beat-the-crash

That article really is worth a read.

Fuck business, indeed.

[Mark Steels Stockbroker]

A) Nobody cares about MEPs, too distant, too anonymous, have very little power b) When we vote at national level we vote for specific policies, nobody votes for policies at the EU level, they're set by diktat and rubber stamped or not by the non-entities in the parliament.

Non-entities like Farage and Hannan.

[dr beat]

I see good bunch of lads Macron is bringing back national service.

[Zetetic]

(Not sure what this has to do with Brexit.)

Looks like it was toned down a bit from the more militaristic nonsense being promised.

The first phase is a mandatory one-month placement with a focus on civic culture, which the government says will "enable young people to create new relationships and develop their role in society".

Voluntary teaching and working with charities are among the options being looked at, alongside traditional military preparation with the police, fire service or army.

The second phase is a voluntary placement of at least three months and up to a year, in which young people will be encouraged to serve "in an area linked to defence and security" - but again, they could opt to carry out volunteer work linked to heritage, the environment or social care.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-44625625

I vaguely remember a friend having to do a day's "national service" back in the 2000s, which seemed to involve being lectured at the French Embassy.

[dr beat]

I fear it could get toned up again. The 'mandatory phase' sounds at best community service. This wasn't the liberal Europe I signed up for.

Or - it's promoting 'civic cohesion'. Some allegiance to a constructed jurisdictional entity, as probably all jurisdictional entities are.

[Zetetic]

From this distance, it does feel like there's an ongoing push towards the militarisation of French public life.

A stupid question, perhaps, but are there still soldiers routinely on the streets of Paris?

The 'mandatory phase' sounds at best community service.

Yes, which I'll admit to not being terribly upset by - in theory it doesn't seem a terrible idea to me to extract some time from everyone and using it expose them to a greater diversity of others' experiences.

In practice, I'll grant I'd guess it'll tend towards a waste of everyone's time, and show the limitations of trying to hamfistedly force any sort of culture.

[dr beat]

Last time I was in France was December 2010, and I was greeted by armed soldiers at the Gare du Nord.

[dr beat]

I am a Scouser  btw.

[Zetetic]

I was last in Paris in late November 2015, which had a bit of an odd atmosphere all round.

(Lots of smiling and nodding at awkward heavily armed blokes of North African ancestry - at a guess - on my part.)

[Zetetic]

Some allegiance to a constructed jurisdictional entity, as probably all jurisdictional entities are.

Except mobs, perhaps.

There's probably another thread in what sort of pride and allegiance to one's 'artificial' communities is positive - if any sort of nationalism is a good thing, if a critical attachment is possible.

[dr beat]

As long as it's not the French government doing a 'Big Society', eh?

[Zetetic]

I suppose it serves to distract from the various strikes and protests.

[dr beat]

Well, who knows it might perpetuate them. Fifty years and all that.

[Paul Calf]

Unless they're deployed as strikebreakers and scabs. Which they will be, of course.

[dr beat]

Everyone wins!

[king_tubby]

https://news.sky.com/story/farmers-worried-over-lack-of-detail-in-post-brexit-plans-11396083

Does this mean subsidies for having fuck off huge UKIP billboards in fields are being reduced?