Author Topic: What Non-New Films Have You Seen? (2018 Edition)  (Read 74226 times)

Shameless Custard

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Re: What Non-New Films Have You Seen? (2018 Edition)
« Reply #480 on: March 17, 2018, 10:51:54 AM »
Mean Streets SPOILERZ ahead

De Niro doesn't cark it on screen, but appears to have been shot in the neck and is pissing out blood. He staggers off into the night, as Keitel worries about his (also still alive) lady friend

Fin.

So I guess we'll never know. But I'd guess he survived, and there's ten late sequels coming. A Mean Streets Universe. The MSU

Watched Raging Bull (1980) last night. Another beauty. Insanely great performance from De Niro

The boxing scenes are a bit rubbish, mind. Has Hollywood ever managed realistic boxing?

Again, the film has little to no excess or flab, and it absolutely rattles along. One great scene after the next

Scorsese really has a thing for Pesci and Frank Vincent trying to kill each other, doesn't he? Raging Bull, Goodfellas, Casino. Three rounds

Thinking Taxi Driver or New York, New York next. Don't wanna blow through all the great ones too quickly, as I plan to watch the lot, and before I know it I'll be slogging through The Age Of Innocence. I really didn't like The Age Of Innocence.

St_Eddie

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Re: What Non-New Films Have You Seen? (2018 Edition)
« Reply #481 on: March 17, 2018, 11:03:53 AM »
The boxing scenes are a bit rubbish, mind.

I've heard it all now!

Shameless Custard

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Re: What Non-New Films Have You Seen? (2018 Edition)
« Reply #482 on: March 17, 2018, 11:20:44 AM »
They are though! Not realistic or natural at all. One fighter keeps his arms down by his side, as the other punches him square in the face.

Maybe it's a really hard thing to pull off, realistic boxing, I dunno

Genuinely trying to think of one film that has done it well

itsfredtitmus

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Re: What Non-New Films Have You Seen? (2018 Edition)
« Reply #483 on: March 17, 2018, 11:23:37 AM »
The boxing scene in gummo

Z

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Re: What Non-New Films Have You Seen? (2018 Edition)
« Reply #484 on: March 17, 2018, 11:28:47 AM »
Thinking Taxi Driver or New York, New York next. Don't wanna blow through all the great ones too quickly
New York New York it is, so!

Ah, but did DeNiro die at the end of Taxi Driver?  It's an interesting theory.
I never even considered that option, what does that add that fits better than accepting it all as is?

The boxing scenes are a bit rubbish, mind. Has Hollywood ever managed realistic boxing?
Unsure if you're joking but in case you're not, they're stylised to replicate boxing photos from the period that you'd have in newspapers more than actual matches. So it's a lot more about trying to pile in images of that one shot that very clearly says "this guy won"

Thought it was shite myself, but The Fighter has pretty realistic boxing scenes iirc.

Shameless Custard

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Re: What Non-New Films Have You Seen? (2018 Edition)
« Reply #485 on: March 17, 2018, 12:10:44 PM »
Ah interesting, didn't know that about replicating pictures, thanks

But there is plenty of boxing action. And it's a bit, well, rubs. Very stagey, and unnatural. It reminded me a bit of wrestling. One bloke leaving his head open, for the other bloke to punch with no opposition. Just looks strange and unnatural

Small gripe really, as it's a fucking dynamite film

Oh, and I love New York, New York! Very underrated!

St_Eddie

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Re: What Non-New Films Have You Seen? (2018 Edition)
« Reply #486 on: March 17, 2018, 12:30:34 PM »
I never even considered that option, what does that add that fits better than accepting it all as is?

The idea is that Travis being lauded as a hero and having Betsy fawn over him, are a part of his dying dreams and a complete fantasy.

Z

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Re: What Non-New Films Have You Seen? (2018 Edition)
« Reply #487 on: March 17, 2018, 12:48:47 PM »
The idea is that Travis being lauded as a hero and having Betsy fawn over him, are a part of his dying dreams.
Yeah, I mean, I get it, I don't get why anyone would want that to be the context of the ending.

Re: What Non-New Films Have You Seen? (2018 Edition)
« Reply #488 on: March 17, 2018, 12:59:47 PM »
The 'dream ending' theory also takes away the power from the final sequence where he looks sharply into his rear view mirror, suggesting that he's still a coiled ball of paranoia and rage and has found no kind of redemption at all. I prefer it as a hollow victory rather than a dream. Especially with the veiled threat in the letter "we have taken measures to make sure she never does this again" or something like that

St_Eddie

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Re: What Non-New Films Have You Seen? (2018 Edition)
« Reply #489 on: March 17, 2018, 01:18:24 PM »
Yeah, I mean, I get it, I don't get why anyone would want that to be the context of the ending.

I don't personally choice to interpret the ending that way.  I just find it to be an interesting theory.

The 'dream ending' theory also takes away the power from the final sequence where he looks sharply into his rear view mirror, suggesting that he's still a coiled ball of paranoia and rage and has found no kind of redemption at all.

Indeed.  That's always been the main chink in that particular theory's armour.

Re: What Non-New Films Have You Seen? (2018 Edition)
« Reply #490 on: March 17, 2018, 01:20:07 PM »
Raging Bull has no excess or flab?? Did you see DeNiro??

Fat cunt.

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Re: What Non-New Films Have You Seen? (2018 Edition)
« Reply #491 on: March 17, 2018, 03:05:26 PM »
The 'dream ending' theory also takes away the power from the final sequence where he looks sharply into his rear view mirror, suggesting that he's still a coiled ball of paranoia and rage and has found no kind of redemption at all. I prefer it as a hollow victory rather than a dream. Especially with the veiled threat in the letter "we have taken measures to make sure she never does this again" or something like that

I agree, the dream ending theory dilutes the film. Has Scorsese ever commented on it?

What do we think about the dream ending theory attached to The King Of Comedy? I think the cold, cynical, prescient power of the film is heightened if we take Pupkin's post-prison stardom at face value. He's not a very good comedian, he's a disturbing sociopath who achieves undeserved fame. He does this, not through talent and effort, but by committing a high-profile criminal act. When he smirks into the camera at the very end, he appears to be saying to the audience "YOU did this. You made me. I won."

Isn't the whole point of the film that becoming famous for being famous is a hollow victory and a damning indictment of society?

However, Pupkin's fantasies throughout the film are never depicted in a surreal or dreamlike manner. They co-exist with the reality presented in the rest of the film, just as they do in Pupkin's head. The epilogue could be another example of that technique, but I don't think Pupkin becoming briefly notorious before being imprisoned and fading into obscurity has as much punch as the literal interpretation.

St_Eddie

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Re: What Non-New Films Have You Seen? (2018 Edition)
« Reply #492 on: March 17, 2018, 03:40:48 PM »
However, Pupkin's fantasies throughout the film are never depicted in a surreal or dreamlike manner. They co-exist with the reality presented in the rest of the film, just as they do in Pupkin's head. The epilogue could be another example of that technique, but I don't think Pupkin becoming briefly notorious before being imprisoned and fading into obscurity has as much punch as the literal interpretation.

Actually, I think that the ending absolutely has a surreal and dreamlike quality to it.  I've always interpreted it as being a fantasy in Pupkin's mind.

Re: What Non-New Films Have You Seen? (2018 Edition)
« Reply #493 on: March 17, 2018, 03:52:47 PM »
They are though! Not realistic or natural at all. One fighter keeps his arms down by his side, as the other punches him square in the face.

Maybe it's a really hard thing to pull off, realistic boxing, I dunno

Genuinely trying to think of one film that has done it well

..are they intended to be natural though? I think the boxing scenes have a clear operatic quality to them rather than a desire for total realism.

Re: What Non-New Films Have You Seen? (2018 Edition)
« Reply #494 on: March 17, 2018, 04:42:38 PM »
I agree, the dream ending theory dilutes the film. Has Scorsese ever commented on it?

Had a quick gander at Wikipedia and it would seem that Scorsese doesn't unequivocally rule it out (although a 'dream' does not seem to have been his intention), whereas Schrader does:

Quote
On the Laserdisc audio commentary, Scorsese acknowledged several critics' interpretation of the film's ending as being Bickle's dying dream. He admits that the last scene of Bickle glancing at an unseen object implies that Bickle might fall into rage and recklessness in the future, and he is like "a ticking time bomb".[35] Writer Paul Schrader confirms this in his commentary on the 30th-anniversary DVD, stating that Travis "is not cured by the movie's end", and that "he's not going to be a hero next time."[36] When asked on the website Reddit about the film's ending, Schrader said that it was not to be taken as a dream sequence, but that he envisioned it as returning to the beginning of the film—as if the last frame "could be spliced to the first frame, and the movie started all over again."[37]

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Re: What Non-New Films Have You Seen? (2018 Edition)
« Reply #495 on: March 17, 2018, 05:17:35 PM »
Actually, I think that the ending absolutely has a surreal and dreamlike quality to it.  I've always interpreted it as being a fantasy in Pupkin's mind.

You're right, the ending does come across as disconcertingly artificial. The incessant torrents of  laughter echo the earlier fantasy scene in which Pupkin performs his routine in front of a huge diorama of an appreciative audience.

I do like the ambiguity of that ending - it's probably is all in his head, but we can't be certain - but I personally prefer to think of it as a literal depiction of what actually happened to Pupkin. It has more bite.


Ballad of Ballard Berkley

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Re: What Non-New Films Have You Seen? (2018 Edition)
« Reply #496 on: March 17, 2018, 05:18:20 PM »
Had a quick gander at Wikipedia and it would seem that Scorsese doesn't unequivocally rule it out (although a 'dream' does not seem to have been his intention), whereas Schrader does:

Interesting, ta.

St_Eddie

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Re: What Non-New Films Have You Seen? (2018 Edition)
« Reply #497 on: March 17, 2018, 05:27:41 PM »
..are they intended to be natural though? I think the boxing scenes have a clear operatic quality to them rather than a desire for total realism.

This is my thought on the matter too.

Re: What Non-New Films Have You Seen? (2018 Edition)
« Reply #498 on: March 18, 2018, 12:36:03 AM »
Needed a daft film to zone out to so stuck on Eraser.

Re: What Non-New Films Have You Seen? (2018 Edition)
« Reply #499 on: March 18, 2018, 12:42:44 AM »
Eraser is Arnie's worst, for me.

And i fucking love Arnie.

zomgmouse

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Re: What Non-New Films Have You Seen? (2018 Edition)
« Reply #500 on: March 18, 2018, 01:54:04 AM »
If you're doing a Scorsese fest don't miss After Hours!

St_Eddie

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Re: What Non-New Films Have You Seen? (2018 Edition)
« Reply #501 on: March 18, 2018, 02:21:18 AM »
Eraser is Arnie's worst, for me.

And i fucking love Arnie.

I've yet to watch Eraser but I did recently watch End of Days and other than Arnie being woefully miscast as a down on his luck, depressed, alcoholic and suicidal detective (whom somehow must still have the motivation and time to spend hours down the gym everyday), it's actually rather enjoyable.  It has a terrible reputation, so I was pleasantly surprised.  Who knows?  Perhaps I'll enjoy Eraser too.  I doubt it though.

Re: What Non-New Films Have You Seen? (2018 Edition)
« Reply #502 on: March 18, 2018, 02:25:10 AM »
I've yet to watch Eraser but I did recently watch End of Days and other than Arnie being woefully miscast as a down on his luck, depressed, alcoholic and suicidal detective (whom somehow must still have the motivation and time to spend hours down the gym everyday), it's actually rather enjoyable.  It has a terrible reputation, so I was pleasantly surprised.  Who knows?  Perhaps I'll enjoy Eraser too.  I doubt it though.

Yeah End of Days is pretty good.

Gabriel Byrne was on the wank fest that inside the cunt studio and patronisingly mentioned that Arnie was always into the craft and trying to get better at acting. I think it shows in thst film

Although i prefer arn as the one liner action hero.

Re: What Non-New Films Have You Seen? (2018 Edition)
« Reply #503 on: March 18, 2018, 05:57:17 AM »
I've yet to watch Eraser but I did recently watch End of Days and other than Arnie being woefully miscast as a down on his luck, depressed, alcoholic and suicidal detective (whom somehow must still have the motivation and time to spend hours down the gym everyday), it's actually rather enjoyable.  It has a terrible reputation, so I was pleasantly surprised.  Who knows?  Perhaps I'll enjoy Eraser too.  I doubt it though.

I wouldn't say its THAT bad(bar the CGI crocodiles), but it does end up feeling very much what it was, the last ebb of the 80's style actioner.

End of Days surely deserves a mention in the protagonist with a ridiculas name thread with Jericho Cane.

St_Eddie

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Re: What Non-New Films Have You Seen? (2018 Edition)
« Reply #504 on: March 18, 2018, 06:13:23 AM »
End of Days surely deserves a mention in the protagonist with a ridiculas name thread with Jericho Cane.

Ha, yeah.  The name Jericho Cane sounds like a character from Tekken or Mortal Kombat"Jericho Cane Wins".  It also sounds like Jerry Cocaine, if you say it fast enough.

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Re: What Non-New Films Have You Seen? (2018 Edition)
« Reply #505 on: March 18, 2018, 10:36:12 AM »
I'd rate Eraser over The 6th Day. They're both enjoyable fluff though.

itsfredtitmus

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Re: What Non-New Films Have You Seen? (2018 Edition)
« Reply #506 on: March 19, 2018, 09:58:23 PM »
children of nature (1991)
sweet, slightly sentimental old age story. every so often the music would go full on arvo part and Frioriksson would ramp up the tarkovskyisms

Re: What Non-New Films Have You Seen? (2018 Edition)
« Reply #507 on: March 19, 2018, 10:17:16 PM »
I found End of Days insulting at the time, but for whatever reason picked up the DVD from a bargain bin about five years ago and bloody loved the daft thing and have watched it more than once since. I particularly love the causality with which Satan (in the form of the camera) sneaks up in the lavy to possess Gabriel Byrne.

Eraser is a film I've seen a few times, always expecting to suddenly love it but I never quite do. It's fun but the actual plot is a bit of a drag.

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Re: What Non-New Films Have You Seen? (2018 Edition)
« Reply #508 on: March 19, 2018, 10:58:29 PM »
I found End of Days insulting at the time, but for whatever reason picked up the DVD from a bargain bin about five years ago and bloody loved the daft thing and have watched it more than once since. I particularly love the causality with which Satan (in the form of the camera) sneaks up in the lavy to possess Gabriel Byrne.


Me and a few schoolmates bugged Byrne when we discovered he was in attendance of a play we'd traveled down to Dublin to see (cheers, A-Level English department!) and I had him sign my ticket while I told him how much I liked him in this. Not Usual Suspects or any of the good things he was in like. Fuck all those films. Sure in End of Days he punches through a man's head.

As I remember it, Arnold is very impressive in that film as a depressed alcoholic. He'd kind of run out of big silly blockbusters at that stage and was giving real acting a go, wasn't he? Was very good in Maggie, years later, as well. I don't mean to discount his performances in his earlier films, especially The Terminator - he was a brilliant presence on screen, despite the 'flaws' (his accent chief among them). But to see him acting, proper acting, was class altogether.

I wonder if that holds up?

St_Eddie

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Re: What Non-New Films Have You Seen? (2018 Edition)
« Reply #509 on: March 20, 2018, 12:33:16 AM »
I wonder if that holds up?

He does give a decent performance but as I mentioned earlier, his beefed-up body is completely wrong for the character.  To use one of his former co-stars as an example, it needed to be more of a Michael Biehn type.