The Cloverfield Paradox (formerly God Particle)

[phantom_power]

Pretty much this.  Except that it wasn't the satellite itself which awoke the creature but rather the satellite's owner, the Tagruato company.  They discovered the creature, whilst attempting to recover their satellite and subsequently set about researching it.  This intrusive research, along with their mining of the seabed nectar around the creature (used in their Slusho! branded drink) is what awoke the creature from its slumber.

You wouldn't know any of that from watching the film though. In fact, how DO you know that?

[kidsick5000]

Half in the Bag on the film. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OTVF8zFIyyQ
They kind of overthink the issue of Netflix being the new direct to video.
Which it is, and that works to an extent. I've only recently started on it and likened it to inflight entertainment in the home.
Aside from the quality stuff, I've used it to watch daft and trashy stuff (Antonio Banderas appears to pick up a lot of Liam Neeson's action cast-offs)  I wouldn't want to see in a cinema and I don't have regular or cable tv.

After watching the episode, Paradox does seem much more of a retro fit addition to the series. One that sadly manages to jettison creatures background along with the effort and solutions put into the fun mystery trail St_Eddie mentioned.

[St_Eddie]

You wouldn't know any of that from watching the film though. In fact, how DO you know that?

Via the extensive ARG (Augmented Reality Game - viral marketing), which accompanied the first film.  Those details are also covered in the 'Special Investigation Mode' of the Blu-Ray (an in-universe commentary track, which plays in tandem with the film).

From the thread for 10 Cloverfield Lane; here's my original breakdown for the Cloverfield backstory (forgive the formatting errors; the loss of annotations to this website has messed things up a little)...

Unlike a lot of viral marketing, the ARG for Cloverfield is 100% official in relation to the events depicted in the movie and was developed directly by J.J. Abrams and Matt Reeves.  As filmmakers, they decided on what this creature is and where it came from and then gave those who'd care to look, pieces of the larger puzzle.

All of the ARG information (and more) can be found on the Cloverfield Blu-Ray's 'Special Investigation Mode'.  A feature which, in-universe, is a post-movie military document, that plays concurrently with the found footage, overlaying the locations of the protagonists, the LSA (Large Scale Aggressor - the military's code name for the creature) and the military, at various stages of that fateful night (on a map to the left of the screen) and also provides a stream of constant information, which was subsequently gathered by the military, following their hammer-down protocol (in a text box at the bottom of the screen).

Elements tied to the ARG can also be seen in the movie itself and I'll do my best to summarise the most salient information from the ARG below...

Protagonist, Marlena's friend, Jamie, had consumed copious amounts of a substance known as seabed nectar.  This had been sent to Jamie by her boyfriend, Teddy (a member of TIDO Wave; a environmentalist group).  TIDO Wave had discovered that Tagruato, a Japanese conglomerate, that has its hands in various monetary pies; including scientific research and satellites, were involved in a secretive and potentially dangerous operation.  Essentially, they're the Cloverfield equivalent of the Alien series' Weyland-Yutani.  They had been using the highly addictive, physically enhancing and mentally unstabilising seabed nectar in their soft drink, Slusho!

TIDO Wave were involved in and had recently begun collecting evidence to use against Tagruato.  Teddy had been active as a spy aboard Tagruato's oil rig, Chuai Station.  Teddy became aware that Tagruato were using the oil rig as a cover to conduct deep sea experiments on something at the very depths of the ocean floor. However, Tagruato discovered Teddy's connection to TIDO Wave and took him hostage, for questioning.  He was most likely still being held captive on Chuai Station when it was destroyed and is now believed to be dead.  All of the relevant videos of Jamie can be seen here - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K7eAkNFxCWg&list=PL15EA29F79ED2CB1B.

Jamie is seen passed out on the sofa at the party, during the opening segment of the movie; a direct result of overdosing on the seabed nectar that Teddy had sent to her from Chuai Station, to be used as evidence.  Seabed nectar is a strange, naturally occurring substance, which is located several miles below sea level.  This nectar is believed to have mutated the LSA and is also used, in small quantities, as the secret ingredient in Tagruato's commercial drink, 'Slusho!'.  Seabed nectar is highly addictive and when consumed in large quantities; it causes those whom consume it to become increasingly erratic and aggressive; as well as displaying an immense increase in energy and strength (this obviously also applies to the LSA).

Then there's the Tagruato satellite, ChimpanzIII, which can be seen in the background at the very end of the movie (when we flashback to Rob and Beth at Coney Island) , crashing into the sea[nb]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TpiyCGMhsfc.  It was this downed satellite and the subsequent attempt to retrieve it, which lead to the Tagruato corporation discovering the LSA  in hibernation at the bottom of the ocean.

They also discovered the parasites...



...which feed off the nectar infused blood of the LSA (their bites are similar to that of a flea.  They are able to penetrate the LSA's thick skin by causing it to swell and rupture.  Something which is lethal when used on a relatively miniature human being - poor Marlena).  These monumental finds were discovered very close to the location of Tagruato's offshore oil rig, Chuai Station, which they subsequently used as a base of operations, whilst they studied the creature.  Tagruato's interference resulted in awakening the creature and it swims up from the ocean floor, directly below Chuai Station...


Here's a zoomed-in close up on the creature, as it ascends to destroy the oil rig...



The LSA swam up to the surface, destroying Chuai Station.  In this footage, you can briefly see a senior staff member of Tagruato (possibly the vice president), escaping from the collapsing oil rig with a briefcase handcuffed to his hand.  This briefcase is thought to have contained some very important, highly-classified information pertaining to the company's motives regarding the LSA - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cCTIgSmohe0, which leads us into the events seen in the movie.

It's unknown whether Tagruato's motives were malevolent, although it is highly suspected.  The CEO of Tagruato, Ganu Yoshida, went into hiding following the case file designated as 'cloverfield' and was subsequently wanted by the US Government for questioning.  One thing that is known is that an oil tanker owned by Tagruato was present at the harbour of New York on the night of the incident.  It was destroyed by unknown means shortly before the attack on Manhattan occurred and was later discovered to not be carrying any oil.  It's speculated that it was carrying vast quantities of seabed nectar (the substance that the LSA feeds upon) and that it was purposefully destroyed by Tagruato, in order to lead the LSA on land, to initiate the attack.   The destroyed oil tanker, bearing the logo of the Tagruato Corporation, can be seen in the movie itself...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_OOmDH7lWiY.

I'm only just scratching the surface of the ARG with this information and as I've previously stated in this thread, it's preciously why there is a fanbase for this movie.  There's so much more going on in Cloverfield than is apparent to the layman.

As a side note, I would also like to bring up one of my favourite pieces of information in regards to the LSA.  J.J. Abrams has gone on record as stating that the creature was actually a relative newborn; lost and confused.  It is in no way inherently malicious.  It is wondering around New York, screaming for its Mother, scared out of its mind, as it's attacked by these strange, relatively ant-sized creatures.  The LSA is terrified and acting as a spooked animal might in a similar situation.  The only difference from your standard animal being that this creature is as tall as a New York skyscraper.  I love having that in mind when watching the movie.

Also, one last interesting tidbit; the LSA attacked the Statue of Liberty because it initially thought it to be a biological creature and therefore a possible threat.  It ripped the head off the statue with it's claw and tried to bite down on it.  Realising that it was not an organic lifeform, the LSA threw the head away, towards the streets of Manhattan.

After watching the episode, Paradox does seem much more of a retro fit addition to the series. One that sadly manages to jettison creatures background along with the effort and solutions put into the fun mystery trail St_Eddie mentioned.

It is a retro fit but it doesn't contradict anything which was already established within the Cloverfield mythology.  The events onboard the space station cause rifts within multiple universes, unleashing creatures from rifts to appear upon different versions of Earth, across time.  One of these is the aliens from 10 Cloverfield Lane, another is the creature from the original Cloverfield (sent to the bottom of the ocean, thousands of years ago; where it went into hibernation).  The similar creature from The Cloverfield Paradox isn't the same one from Cloverfield.

It's very likely that the creature at the end of The Cloverfield Paradox is the mother of the creature from Cloverfield, separated through time and space (accounting for the vast difference in size between the two).  J.J. Abrams and Matt Reeves had already gone on record as stating that the creature in Cloverfield was an infant, separated from its mother and in great confusion and fear at its surroundings (like a wild elephant being dropped off in downtown Manhattan; being attacked by what are, essentially, militaristic ants).

[BritishHobo]

Fucked it.

Completely fucked it.

[St_Eddie]

I am fucking furious. I JUST moved house last night and don't get internet until a week tomorrow. This is such a brilliant move on their part, but I can't help but fume.

Fucked it.

Completely fucked it.

You were fuming back then because you couldn't see it and you're fuming now because you have seen it.  How deliciously ironic.

[Replies From View]

LSA stands for Learning Support Assistant.

I hope this helps.

[St_Eddie]

LSA stands for Learning Support Assistant.

I hope this helps.

Ahem...

...the LSA (Large Scale Aggressor - the military's code name for the creature)...

The LSA (Large Scale Aggressor) does have a side job as an LSA (Learning Support Assistant), however.  That's confirmed to be canonical, by the way.

[ASFTSN]

Quite honestly one of the worst films I can remember watching, sci-fi or not.  A ton of different attempts at sub-plots that all went nowhere*, fucking shite.  Whoever said about the tone being all over the place above was dead on too.

I loved 10 Cloverfield Lane, even the ending, but this was a proper stinker.  I watched cheapo gut-munching Zombie Flesh Eaters rip-off Dr Butcher, MD last week and compared to this latest Cloverfield film it has a plot worthy of an Oscar.
 

_{*off the top of my head:  dual realities, international espionage/sabotage, collusion across the dimensions with the gyro inserted in a corpse, neglectfully installed reading lights leading to tragic child death (ahahah), wanting to go back to your doppelganger family that isn't yours, captain going down with the ship for no reason I could ascertain ("this door has to be locked to detach this section of the ship" - so why do you have to be on the other side of it??) and the mind-blowingly obvious Kaiju twist at the end.}

[St_Eddie]

Whoever said about the tone being all over the place above was dead on too.

That was me but to be fair, I think that everyone who's watched this film has noticed what an absolutely shambolic tonal mess it is.  Including yourself.   It's a clusterfuck of ideas, concepts and even genres, sometimes within a single scene.

A ton of different attempts at sub-plots that all went nowhere...

...off the top of my head:  dual realities, international espionage/sabotage, collusion across the dimensions with the gyro inserted in a corpse, neglectfully installed reading lights leading to tragic child death (ahahah), wanting to go back to your doppelganger family that isn't yours, captain going down with the ship for no reason I could ascertain ("this door has to be locked to detach this section of the ship" - so why do you have to be on the other side of it??) and the mind-blowingly obvious Kaiju twist at the end.

You forgot the worst offender; the rescued child back on Earth.  Why was that subplot even in there?!

Actually, I'll answer my own question; it's there because test audiences demanded that they wanted to see what was happening back on Earth and so all of the Earth scenes were shot during reshoots.  Thanks, test audiences.  Once again, you've proven what an incapable and clueless bunch of idiots you are.  Not that the film would have been good, had those scenes not been in there, of course but it might have been slightly less shit, maybe?

[ASFTSN]

You forgot the worst offender; the rescued child back on Earth.  Why was that subplot even in there?!

Ah, no it was obviously in there as a genius bit of foreshadowing for true Cloverfield fans, 'coz when he first approaches the collapsed building with the child in, there's a shot with a brief suggestion of something huge and stampy moving through the smoke and dust.

[St_Eddie]

Ah, no it was obviously in there as a genius bit of foreshadowing for true Cloverfield fans, 'coz when he first approaches the collapsed building with the child in, there's a shot with a brief suggestion of something huge and stampy moving through the smoke and dust.

Yeah but he could have just stopped the car, got out, looked at the shadow of fan-wankery, got back in his car and driven off to the next unnecessary scene.  The child literally served no purpose whatsoever.

[Cuellar]

"Why didn't you tell her about the huge monsters?"
"Oh...ye-There wasn't any time really"
"What?"
"Well you know, she'd already sort of said 'Bye' and then I said 'Bye'...you can't really go back from there, bit awkward isn't it? Bit awkward so I just sort of left it. It'll be alright though?"
"hmm. I would have said though, jus-"
"Yeah. Yeah probably should have"

[BritishHobo]

I think the most unforgivable thing about it - aside from it being a generic retread of the fucking countless 'boring space crew on a space mission gone wrong' and completely missing the ground-level character stuff that made Clover field and to a lesser extent Lane feel so unique - is that its explanation for the monsters is incredibly boring and unimaginative. Cloverfield and its famous marketing understood mystery, and set up a really fascinating story about Tagruato and Slusho and awakening something dormant. This pisses all over that it with its big fuckin AW A SPACE MACHINE'S THROWN CREATURES ALL THROUGH PARALLEL DIMENSIONS AND THAT'S WHY CLOVERFIELD HAPPENED GET IT

[St_Eddie]

I think the most unforgivable thing about it - aside from it being a generic retread of the fucking countless 'boring space crew on a space mission gone wrong' and completely missing the ground-level character stuff that made Clover field and to a lesser extent Lane feel so unique - is that its explanation for the monsters is incredibly boring and unimaginative. Cloverfield and its famous marketing understood mystery, and set up a really fascinating story about Tagruato and Slusho and awakening something dormant. This pisses all over that it with its big fuckin AW A SPACE MACHINE'S THROWN CREATURES ALL THROUGH PARALLEL DIMENSIONS AND THAT'S WHY CLOVERFIELD HAPPENED GET IT

Yes, yes and fucking yes.  Spot on.

[kidsick5000]

here's my original breakdown for the Cloverfield backstory

As much as I enjoyed reading that, an issue did strike me.

How did the satellite that splashed down by Coney Island lead them to Cloverfield, hundreds of miles away in the mid-Atlantic?
Benefit of the doubt edition: That was only part of the satellite. As you were.

[phantom_power]

I think the most unforgivable thing about it - aside from it being a generic retread of the fucking countless 'boring space crew on a space mission gone wrong' and completely missing the ground-level character stuff that made Clover field and to a lesser extent Lane feel so unique - is that its explanation for the monsters is incredibly boring and unimaginative. Cloverfield and its famous marketing understood mystery, and set up a really fascinating story about Tagruato and Slusho and awakening something dormant. This pisses all over that it with its big fuckin AW A SPACE MACHINE'S THROWN CREATURES ALL THROUGH PARALLEL DIMENSIONS AND THAT'S WHY CLOVERFIELD HAPPENED GET IT

I imagine about 98% of people are unaware of that backstory

[kidsick5000]

I imagine about 98% of people are unaware of that backstory

Sure. But the people responsible for attaching it to the franchise shouldn't be.

[mothman]

Two things I've always wondered: was the Hammerdown Protocol a nuclear strike? And, why "the area formerly known as Central Park?" What's it called in the "now" when the footage is dicovered and catalogued? As in, how long after was that? What has happened subsequently that an area, known for many decades as "Central Park," is no longer called that by people?

[phantom_power]

Sure. But the people responsible for attaching it to the franchise shouldn't be.

They also might not want to be beholden to a mythology that most people don't know about. Think of it as a retcon

[St_Eddie]

Two things I've always wondered: was the Hammerdown Protocol a nuclear strike?

It definitely wasn't a nuclear strike.  The exact ordinance used is unknown.  From the Cloverfield Wiki...

Prior to the beginning of the protocol, Mk-82 general purpose bombs were used against the LSA. A number of eighty bombs were dropped in a single bombing run by a B-2 Spirit.

According to the case notes from the investigation of the footage that survived the protocol, the HAMMERDOWN Protocol used "significantly heavier ordinance" than that witnessed by Hudson Platt from the evacuation helicopter.

It's likely that the bombs used for the Hammerdown Protocol were Mk-84s, which are four times heavier ordinance than the prior used Mk-82 bombs.

...why "the area formerly known as Central Park?" What's it called in the "now" when the footage is dicovered and catalogued? As in, how long after was that? What has happened subsequently that an area, known for many decades as "Central Park," is no longer called that by people?

It's simply a case that Central Park was completely leveled during the Hammerdown Protocol.  It's scorched-earth and is no longer anything resembling a park, central or otherwise.

They also might not want to be beholden to a mythology that most people don't know about. Think of it as a retcon

It's less of a retcon and more of an expansion.  Again, the events of The Cloverfield Paradox do not undo the prior backstory.  Tagruato, seabed nectar/Slusho!, Chuai Station.  All of that stuff still happened.

[BritishHobo]

I imagine about 98% of people are unaware of that backstory

Yeah but that's why it's so great. It stands completely on its own as a film. It's all about Hud and Marlena and Rob and their ordinary people dramas being interrupted by something too big to fathom. If you do come away wanting more, you can chase the rabbit holes online, or watch the Investigation Mode on the DVD/Blu-ray. But you don't have to. It doesn't need a big bombastic space movie to explain the monster is from another dimension. Going ground level is what differentiated it.

And whether people know or not, they put a lot of time into making it, and it was far better told than some genero-cunts on a spaceship doing a bad space experiment. The ten or so videos of that Jamie girl leaving messages for her long-distance boyfriend piss all over Paradox and show just how it misses the point. There you've got just a daft girl in her bedroom getting more and more annoyed at her boyfriend's failure to call her back, and THAT'S the way they show you that something is wrong on the Tagruato oil rig. The video where she rings Tagruato to ask where he is and they ring back is a fuckin masterwork in an awful sinister bigger picture creeping into something mundane, and well-observed, and funny ("Can I talk to Teddy Hansen? Okay can I talk to someone who speaks American?"). There's nothing like that in Paradox, and the overall reveal that this shit space machine done a dimension hole is so much less inventive and gripping and memorable than this shady company with links to everything drilling in the sea and awakening something awful.

I just don't get why of all the directions to take the story, they went for this. If they really wanted to link the films instead of doing it anthology style (as we all assumed after Lane), why not do something else fresh and interesting, continue the story in a cool new way in that universe instead of blending it up with some bland space thriller killing time until a bland reveal?

Sorry, phantom power. My obsession with this is daft.

[St_Eddie]

Yeah but that's why it's so great. It stands completely on its own as a film. It's all about Hud and Marlena and Rob and their ordinary people dramas being interrupted by something too big to fathom. If you do come away wanting more, you can chase the rabbit holes online, or watch the Investigation Mode on the DVD/Blu-ray. But you don't have to. It doesn't need a big bombastic space movie to explain the monster is from another dimension. Going ground level is what differentiated it.

And whether people know or not, they put a lot of time into making it, and it was far better told than some genero-cunts on a spaceship doing a bad space experiment. The ten or so videos of that Jamie girl leaving messages for her long-distance boyfriend piss all over Paradox and show just how it misses the point. There you've got just a daft girl in her bedroom getting more and more annoyed at her boyfriend's failure to call her back, and THAT'S the way they show you that something is wrong on the Tagruato oil rig. The video where she rings Tagruato to ask where he is and they ring back is a fuckin masterwork in an awful sinister bigger picture creeping into something mundane, and well-observed, and funny ("Can I talk to Teddy Hansen? Okay can I talk to someone who speaks American?"). There's nothing like that in Paradox, and the overall reveal that this shit space machine done a dimension hole is so much less inventive and gripping and memorable than this shady company with links to everything drilling in the sea and awakening something awful.

I just don't get why of all the directions to take the story, they went for this. If they really wanted to link the films instead of doing it anthology style (as we all assumed after Lane), why not do something else fresh and interesting, continue the story in a cool new way in that universe instead of blending it up with some bland space thriller killing time until a bland reveal?

This guy/gal gets it.

[phantom_power]

Yeah but that's why it's so great. It stands completely on its own as a film. It's all about Hud and Marlena and Rob and their ordinary people dramas being interrupted by something too big to fathom. If you do come away wanting more, you can chase the rabbit holes online, or watch the Investigation Mode on the DVD/Blu-ray. But you don't have to. It doesn't need a big bombastic space movie to explain the monster is from another dimension. Going ground level is what differentiated it.

And whether people know or not, they put a lot of time into making it, and it was far better told than some genero-cunts on a spaceship doing a bad space experiment. The ten or so videos of that Jamie girl leaving messages for her long-distance boyfriend piss all over Paradox and show just how it misses the point. There you've got just a daft girl in her bedroom getting more and more annoyed at her boyfriend's failure to call her back, and THAT'S the way they show you that something is wrong on the Tagruato oil rig. The video where she rings Tagruato to ask where he is and they ring back is a fuckin masterwork in an awful sinister bigger picture creeping into something mundane, and well-observed, and funny ("Can I talk to Teddy Hansen? Okay can I talk to someone who speaks American?"). There's nothing like that in Paradox, and the overall reveal that this shit space machine done a dimension hole is so much less inventive and gripping and memorable than this shady company with links to everything drilling in the sea and awakening something awful.

I just don't get why of all the directions to take the story, they went for this. If they really wanted to link the films instead of doing it anthology style (as we all assumed after Lane), why not do something else fresh and interesting, continue the story in a cool new way in that universe instead of blending it up with some bland space thriller killing time until a bland reveal?

Sorry, phantom power. My obsession with this is daft.

I would never diss someone's obsession (within reason) so fair play. I suppose I just thought the first film was just about above average so this being a bit below average doesn't bother me that much. I think I am not as harsh on the film as most on here as it passed the time and wasn't aggressively stupid like most big budget sci-fi films. 10 Cloverfield Lane is easily my favourite of the franchise so far

[Claude the Racecar Driving Rockstar Super Sleuth]

Morbid curiosity got the better of us, so we gave this a watch earlier. To be honest, I was disappointed that it wasn't worse. It was mostly just rather dull.

About the most remarkable thing about it is that Zhang Ziyi doesn't seem to have aged since Crouching Tiger, Hidden Dragon.

[Namtab]

I've forgotten the majority of this film and I watched it about two weeks ago.

[purlieu]

Finally watched this.

I enjoyed it as a bit of sci-fi hokum. A bit of a Poundland Event Horizon. The premise did give them free reign to put any old weird shit in there which is a bit lazy but the weird shit they put in was on the whole entertaining. I quite enjoyed the tonal shifts and thought the comic relief was good, and preferable to the portentous bollocks of Prometheus and the like

This is pretty much my review. It was completely daft and I enjoyed it for that. Going in knowing it was utterly slated lowered my expectations, which helped. My main criticism is they should have dumped all the attempts at character stuff. The characters were totally one-dimensional, so why waste time trying to pretend they're not? Otherwise, weird mad parallel dimension nonsense with a fun, if predictable, ending.

Obviously the jarring tonal shifts were the result of colliding... realities. Or something.