Smart man DESTROY Cathy Newman on her own show

[manticore]

Whereas 40 years ago everyone loved everyone else and there were no disagreements or biases or anger or violence and we were joined in cosmic unity of perfect mental syncronicity. There was no counter culture or underground. Everyone listened to the same song over and over and no outsiders ever came along and changed anything.

Until the blacks and women started getting all uppity and ruined everything. Until then they just knew their place and didn't say anything to ruin the wonderous harmony of man.

I'm not sure if you're answering me or Peterson there, but if me I was talking about very long term things that have been discussed at least back to Marx and how capitalism is "a universal energy which breaks every limit and every bond and posits itself as the only policy, the only universality, the only limit and the only bond". The abysmal traditional family and religion with their oppressive rules have been undermined by late capitalism and what has followed, and nothing has appeared to replace it.

Peterson has barely half a clue about how this has happened - he's an anxious man who reacts with his gut and lashes out at scapegoats.

i'm no shrink, but it sounds like you might have an anxiety disorder.

Where lies the difference between being acute to the conditions of universal alienation and just being anxious? It's not always clear I admit.

[greenman]

If he has studied these texts, and has twisted them to his own ends, he's a charlatan.

If he hasn't studied these texts (and I think we might be getting closer to the truth here), he's a fraud.

He does seem to be actively targeting the STEMlord kind of culture to me though which I find isn't generally populated by individuals with strong backgrounds in these areas so much as it is an attempt to co opt the credibility's of areas into a religious replacement that suits their own personal biases. The kind of "alpha" mindset that draws on crude understandings of evolutionary theory to justify a sociopathic world view.

[Sebastian Cobb]

Yeah it's really brilliant, selling pseud philosophical self-help stuff to the stemlord crowd who don't believe in the 'ologies' or the 'osophys'. He's a complete grifter.

The further gifting comes is that he is 'significant' within his field, which is a narrow gamut, and plenty of people don't agree with him anyway. But he's cashing in on that, and I've seen a few people not realise a loads of people citing you doesn't mean loads of people are agreeing with you.

A complete 'stupid person's idea of a clever person' basically.

[ieXush2i]

This video gives you a taste of his views on IQ. The author of the study he refers to is Linda Gottfredson, an educational psychologist who does believe racial inequality, especially in employment, is the direct result of genetic racial differences in intelligence. He doesn't name her in the video (he is capable of censoring himself when he wants to) and I don't think he's ever argued in favour of race research, but he has used her work on 'Why g matters' as study material in his lectures on 'Personality and Its Transformations' (Psych 230h).

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5-Ur71ZnNVk

Some more Peterson IQ vids, which he not only "gee i don't know"s race IQ but slides in a lil "gosh" about how society treats those at a mental/neuro/learning disadvantage.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jSo5v5t4OQM

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iF8F7tjmy_U With fellow Cultist Molyneux

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=goxR1m5qBrg

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9MJUhDQKJcY

Yup he cites Charles Murray!

[ieXush2i]

I'm not sure if you're answering me or Peterson there, but if me I was talking about very long term things that have been discussed at least back to Marx and how capitalism is "a universal energy which breaks every limit and every bond and posits itself as the only policy, the only universality, the only limit and the only bond". The abysmal traditional family and religion with their oppressive rules have been undermined by late capitalism and what has followed, and nothing has appeared to replace it.

Peterson has barely half a clue about how this has happened - he's an anxious man who reacts with his gut and lashes out at scapegoats.

Where lies the difference between being acute to the conditions of universal alienation and just being anxious? It's not always clear I admit.

Can't find the reference, but recently Michael Brooks was talking about a head of the Jung Institute in the 90s who argued that the majority of issues psychologists/psychiatrists etc are trying to help patients manage are the effects of a rampant capitalist society. I guess a perfect example would be job security fears, or being unable to bring a grievance against management because you don't want to rock the boat - so it just gets internalised amongst the workers.

[José]

get a hobby you miserable twats.

[Zetetic]

The suggestion that the nature of our society makes people distressed to the point of illness is quite common, (and you don't need to look to psychodynamic mystics for it).

Generally I think the suggestion is deeper than that - people's sense of self-worth and purpose are tied to the society (and its modes of production) and all their interactions with other people are mediated by it as well. The nature of capitalism to reproduce inequality (including maintaining a pool of people out of employment) and the nature of industry to so sharply produce division of labour and so on...

[ieXush2i]

get a hobby you miserable twats.

off to the roller derby this arvo lad

[ieXush2i]

The suggestion that the nature of our society makes people distressed to the point of illness is quite common, (and you don't need to look to psychodynamic mystics for it).

Generally I think the suggestion is deeper than that - people's sense of self-worth and purpose are tied to the society (and its modes of production) and all their interactions with other people are mediated by it as well.

I've got a disability that binds my self-worth to my ability to work, and having to actually fight management for some support in order to help me work optimally ironically impacts my ability to work optimally, and thus happily and healthily. So. You're dead right.

[José]

off to the roller derby this arvo lad

an excellent way to meet new people, utterly destroy them and cut trophies from their broken bodies.

take a leaf from this posters book you 'orrible bunch of sadsack hermits.

[Twed]

He does seem to be actively targeting the STEMlord kind of culture to me though which I find isn't generally populated by individuals with strong backgrounds in these areas so much as it is an attempt to co opt the credibility's of areas into a religious replacement that suits their own personal biases. The kind of "alpha" mindset that draws on crude understandings of evolutionary theory to justify a sociopathic world view.

This is very good.

[Cloud]

get a hobby you miserable twats.

Like what, trolling on internet forums?

[Sebastian Cobb]

That's not a hobby, it's a calling.

[José]

Like what, trolling on internet forums?

i reckon you've got enough to chew on already with paulie and biggy.

i was thinking more along the lines of day drinking, an unfairly maligned activity in my opinion. great way to meet colorful characters.

[ieXush2i]

He does seem to be actively targeting the STEMlord kind of culture to me though which I find isn't generally populated by individuals with strong backgrounds in these areas so much as it is an attempt to co opt the credibility's of areas into a religious replacement that suits their own personal biases. The kind of "alpha" mindset that draws on crude understandings of evolutionary theory to justify a sociopathic world view.

This is wonderful, and certainly explains his supporters here and elsewhere. Even if they think he's bonkers, he helps their complacency in the long run.

[José]

he's shit a litmus test for cunts.

[Endicott]

My impression of the world out there into which I admittedly rarely venture nowadays is that men and women are really not sure of the right ways to approach and talk to eachother, not just in the workplace. Here in the virtual world in the 'Fuck off' thread as arandom example it's clear that people are really not clear on what's appropriate behaviour and what isn't, what to talk about and how. I don't think this is news to anybody.

Just generally everyone's cut off from everyone else, that's the nature of this society. That's not news to anybody either. Random people like Peterson come along and give people Rules to live by and that's a big part of his appeal.

Sorry I disappeared for a few days, I've been too busy to go online. Thanks for answering. The thing is, you are not describing the UK society that I live in. It's as if you think everyone is autistic, or something. This is just my opinion, but I think you should get out more.

[manticore]

Sorry I disappeared for a few days, I've been too busy to go online. Thanks for answering. The thing is, you are not describing the UK society that I live in. It's as if you think everyone is autistic, or something. This is just my opinion, but I think you should get out more.

It's not a matter of everyone being autistic - it's a social pathology of the relationships between people, not a mass of individual conditions. Look at this board here and all the people ravaged by anxiety, depression, rage, misanthropy and feelings of loneliness and messed up relationships. Everyone knows about this.

[Soup]

Is CaB a census now?

[manticore]

Is CaB a census now?

As far as I know the people who post here are real people and they're close at hand so why not talk about them? I think it's a good idea to talk about the things we all have knowledge of, it makes the discussion more tangible and less abstract. You only have to look at studies of emotional distress in this society to know CaB isn't some strange aberration.

There's a massive terror of self-reflection in this society.

[Zetetic]

What do you (anyone) imagine people's mental health and relationships were like in the '50s?

(If you like, you can exclude the people who'd spent several years in camps, or several years recently killing other people, or several years under foreign occupation, or who'd recently fled their homes or the ruins of them, or recently back to their old homes, or had their children sent away from them, or been a child sent away and so on. Won't be many people left in the West, mind you.)

Edit: My point, in case I'm being needlessly oblique, is that our impression is likely to be grossly coloured by how visible emotional distress is.

[Zetetic]

You only have to look at studies of emotional distress in this society to know CaB isn't some strange aberration.

No, I really think it is. (And there are various biases at work here that make the misery posts more salient, perhaps particularly you at the moment.)

Would be interesting to compare even something crude like WEMWBS scores, mind you.

[Zetetic]

Because I'm extremely prone to being unclear at the moment -

It's not that I don't think we have problems with depression and with loneliness across our society or that there are not things that have been getting worse that exacerbate these.

It's that I think it's easy to exaggerate the impact of this, and mistake a phenomena that affects certain groups of people very badly with one that is widespread.

[manticore]

What do you (anyone) imagine people's mental health and relationships were like in the '50s?

Terrible, from what I know. That was in the era of late capitalism. As I said a little while back, this has been talked about back to Marx and beyond. The whole history of the world is the history of different kinds of domination and suffering but I'm talking about the particular forms it's taking now. My impression is that in some ways these things are better than in the '50s and in some ways worse, for example it seems to me the apparent escape of many women from the narrow constraints of the nuclear family and integration in to the work world is a blessing and a curse. The 'liberation' of sexuality has gone along with its greater commodication. So many contradictions.

As you say emotional distress is more visible now, but in general the way it's talked about doesn't help it much.

[Mark Steels Stockbroker]

If anyone cares, Jordan is doing a big show at the O2 tonight with the other popular cabaret turns Sam Harris and Douglas Murray.

[garbed_attic]

If anyone cares, Jordan is doing a big show at the O2 tonight with the other popular cabaret turns Sam Harris and Douglas Murray.

My pastor and old D&D dungeon master are both going together :(

[Danger Man]

My pastor and old D&D dungeon master are both going together :(

He must be charging a fortune to play D&D when the O2 tickets are selling for £200

[dallasman]

Derren Brown called it "phenomenal", an "utter delight" and a "must-see". Why not get him in the mix next time around, maybe drop Dr. J? He's got his own thang anyway, and there are other provocative people out there. Harris and Murray are having "A Day Of Reckoning" with the Weinstein brothers in NZ and Oz next month, hosted by Josh Szeps (famous for wanting to kill newborn children). Then in November, there's a LARGE event in New York City where ALL the difficult issues are going to be aired. It's called "A Day of Reflection", and here are some of the participants: Sam Harris, Eric Weinstein, Bret Weinstein, Claire Berlinski, Douglas Murray. As usual, their thoughts are brought to you by Travis Pangburn, the man who gave you the exploding mind grenade. Come, have a look at some of his thoughts:



OK, now for the debate sessions. They will be asking the following questions:

* Has #metoo gone too far?
* Can we move beyond race?
* Does Islam pose a unique threat to modernity?

And for the main event:

* Is reason sacred?

This is where Sam Harris will take the stage, and if he's not in Beast Mode already, boy you better believe he's gonna be. It'll be a glorious day of destruction, so if you're in the New York area, you'd be a fool to miss it.

[garbed_attic]

I wonder if old C&B fave Luke Bozier has gotten into Peterson et al!

[phantom_power]

I would love to hear what a load of white blokes think about whether we can move beyond race