Roseanne

[jobotic]

Did anyone here fall for Pizzagate?

Nice to see the old calling the racists racist is the real bigotry.

[Ferris]

I've literally never heard of Joy Ann Reid, so I looked her up. She wrote some dodgy things in a blog 10 years ago implying various politicians were closeted, along with some offensive stuff about homosexuality. She said she literally had no recollection of writing these things because they were so alien to her, asked cyber security experts to see if her words had been manipulated, and accepted their conclusion that no hacking took place and apologized.

Come on - that is not the same as what Roseanne did. I've heard of Roseanne, she tweeted this stuff out live (not found in a defunct blog from 2007), and it was done at the height of her public visibility vs being a nobody at college.

It's disingenuous in the extreme to say these things are the same.

[ieXush2i]

It was better when the Roseanne apologists rightwingers went "ah but Bill Maher compared Trump to an ape". Ban bad Bill Maher, we can all get behind that

[Famous Mortimer]

I had issues to fall asleep, in a very competitive setting

You used to be a competitive sleeper?

[Jumblegraws]

THere's a distinction between saying something racist and being racist and a difference between saying something racist to be offensive or shocking and saying it to seriously advance genuine racism.

There's a whole spectrum of things that "advance genuine racism" that you're glossing over, it doesn't have to be systematic segregation or worse to be "genuine racism", using racial minority status as a basis for insulting someone, whether for pure shock value or as a full-on assertion of superiority, advances racism by necessity and "racist" is a fine word to describe people who do this.

[Jockice]

Did anyone here fall for Pizzagate?

Not at all. Fabregas couldn't have hit Sir Alex from that distance.

[Ant Farm Keyboard]

You used to be a competitive sleeper?

Almost. France has basically a two speed upper education system, university and something called grandes écoles (Polytechnique, various engineering schools, the various Écoles Normales Supérieures, business schools,...). Prior to the grandes écoles, there's a two year curriculum in a preparatory class for the entrance examinations. These classes run the full gamut from "improved university curriculum for people who don't want to spend their first two years in an actual public university" to "we send 12 people from the same class in Paris every year to that school where only 22 people get admitted, and you have to be one of these 12", which is a slightly more competitive environment where even your friends are rivals, given that you just get one or two shots at these schools.
But it didn't make a racist out of me.

[Desirable Industrial Unit]

To briefly divert back the show itself...

It's looking quite likely that a spin-off with whichever cast members are willing is going to happen now, but it's not clear whether it's in the 'Roseanne universe' or if it's a proposition along the lines of using them as a rep company for a new project.  It's probably the former, which seems unlikely as Roseanne has some degree of creative ownership over the show, but then again, I think that may only extend to the character of 'Roseanne'.  If she dies on the table during her knee op they're in the clear.

It'll be the weirdest first episode to a series if it does come back, but we'll all definitely be watching.  Less so as it goes on, of course, but as with Seinfeld she was always the least appealing presence in it, so who knows.

[ieXush2i]

Does she actually have any rights to the show? Perhaps to the Roseanne character, but Matt Williams is the sitcom's credited creator.

[Ignatius_S]

Does she actually have any rights to the show? Perhaps to the Roseanne character, but Matt Williams is the sitcom's credited creator.

Various reports claim it's a complicated picture, for instance:

...Still, sources close to the situation caution that there are major hurdles to overcome. While independent production company Carsey-Werner owns and produces Roseanne, there are legal and rights issues that need to be settled as Barr was co-creator and executive producer on the series and has ownership/backend. Warner Bros. TV's decision to fire Two and a Half Men star Charlie Sheen and continue the show without him resulted in him filing a $100 million lawsuit against the studio, eventually settled for $25 million that WBTV paid him to cover his backend.
https://deadline.com/2018/06/roseanne-followup-spinoff-without-roseanne-abc-darlene-pitch-meeting-problems-1202402239/

[St_Eddie]

It looks like a Rosanne spin-off is indeed on the cards...

Executive Producer, Tom Werner and Roseanne Barr have reached an agreement that will allow Werner Entertainment to produce a spinoff of the Roseanne series for ABC without Barr's further creative or financial participation. "I regret the circumstances that have caused me to be removed from Roseanne. I agreed to the settlement in order that 200 jobs of beloved cast and crew could be saved, and I wish the best for everyone involved" said Barr. Werner added: "We are grateful to have reached this agreement to keep our team working as we continue to explore stories of the Conner family."

[New Jack]

Maybe she is racist and the medication made her reveal this.

Think this is way more likely than she's not racist and it artificially made her so

I worked in a mental health Trust for years, and my heart broke several times at the sad cases, and the drugs they were on as I both seen and read cases where they changed people, not necessarily for the better.

But lithium, as an extreme example, is barely used anymore, and if I've been familiar with people on it not acting offensively, why should I give a pass to actual racism on something a large amount more mild?

Sort of rhetorical. Fuck Roseanne. I can't even name a chemical that imbues you with what isn't there already. If it was alcohol she blamed, nobody would buy it. She's demonising people who need medication.

[St_Eddie]

...Fuck Roseanne. I can't even name a chemical that imbues you with what isn't there already. If it was alcohol she blamed, nobody would buy it. She's demonising people who need medication.

Bang on the money.

[Scrapey Fish]

Think this is way more likely than she's not racist and it artificially made her so

I worked in a mental health Trust for years, and my heart broke several times at the sad cases, and the drugs they were on as I both seen and read cases where they changed people, not necessarily for the better.

But lithium, as an extreme example, is barely used anymore, and if I've been familiar with people on it not acting offensively, why should I give a pass to actual racism on something a large amount more mild?

Sort of rhetorical. Fuck Roseanne. I can't even name a chemical that imbues you with what isn't there already. If it was alcohol she blamed, nobody would buy it. She's demonising people who need medication.

The only possible middle ground is if someone instinctively has racist thoughts due to their background/upbringing etc, but their conscious, educated mind knows that it's wrong and stops them from saying anything or acting on them, but the drugs then remove that rational filter

[Isnt Anything]

The only possible middle ground is if someone instinctively has racist thoughts due to their background/upbringing etc, but their conscious, educated mind knows that it's wrong and stops them from saying anything or acting on them, but the drugs then remove that rational filter

this seems likely

[New Jack]

The only possible middle ground is if someone instinctively has racist thoughts due to their background/upbringing etc, but their conscious, educated mind knows that it's wrong and stops them from saying anything or acting on them, but the drugs then remove that rational filter

Possibly, but I'm thinking of Doug Stanhope's book where he met her on a beach and she's a right Legend Sally. It does seem to add up...

Ultimately I suppose, I can accept that some thoughts and inclinations linger, but understanding isn't as far as excusing someone. (it doesn't cost me personally, but I don't agree with this element being subjugated)

The shite she said would have to be quite close to the surface: to me it smacks of excuse, and there's no way I can excuse her.

I also don't think you're entirely innocent if you have secret, hidden awful thoughts well into adulthood. That's easy to misread - please don't - but to excuse this is hugely disrespectful to people who take the same, and different drugs, from far less privileged backgrounds (honestly, isn't she a multi millionaire for the past two decades?) and I will side with them. We are into the realm of inventing defences for her that nobody else would receive. You wouldn't. I wouldn't. Isn't that the definition of privilege?

Occam's razor suggests she has opinions or thoughts that are racist, and her lips got loosened. Sure, that removes a little culpability... But 'it was the drugs talking' is the oldest excuse in the book.

I can't help but find it disingenuous. Ultimately the buck has stopped and I don't have a huge problem with where and how it did stop.

I can't ultimately agree with her receiving the same judgement as someone who doesn't even have this issue in them waiting to erupt. Seems unfair to the majority.

[PaulTMA]

The only possible middle ground is if someone instinctively has racist thoughts due to their background/upbringing etc, but their conscious, educated mind knows that it's wrong and stops them from saying anything or acting on them, but the drugs then remove that rational filter

Morrissey

[Phil_A]

I imagine Roseanne after her car accident being a bit like Richard Briers in "If You See God, Tell Him", but instead of advertisements, she unquestionably accepts every loony conspiracy theory under the sun as truth.

[Bhazor]

Currently retweeting people saying she's being held hostage by the shadow government and that Qanon thing.

Oh and the show was shit too.

[fucking ponderous]

I'm not reading 13 pages of Roseanne shit all I want to say is I'm very disappointed in John Goodman