Author Topic: Mark Fisher/Critiques of Capitalism and modern life  (Read 1956 times)

buttgammon

  • You don't know what you really want
Re: Mark Fisher/Critiques of Capitalism and modern life
« Reply #30 on: April 13, 2018, 01:02:18 PM »
The rumour I've heard is that on the theory module in my English department (which I will hopefully be teaching in a year or two), the newest person they've hired has to deliver the psychoanalysis lecture as some sort of hazing ritual, because nobody really wants to do it. I can see the problem, but I still think it has a place as one of many approaches on modules like that.

Funcrusher

  • Been shot up more times than Tom Mix
Re: Mark Fisher/Critiques of Capitalism and modern life
« Reply #31 on: April 13, 2018, 01:08:56 PM »
As someone who hasn't really looked at any critical theory gubbins since I was an undergrad in the late 80's, I find it interesting how rapidly and entirely Freud seems to have all but disappeared. Virtually every take on everything was Freudian to some extent back in the day. I would agree with JG Ballard that Freud is maybe an interesting writer of stories but that psychoanalysis is bunk.

buttgammon

  • You don't know what you really want
Re: Mark Fisher/Critiques of Capitalism and modern life
« Reply #32 on: April 13, 2018, 02:10:26 PM »
It's amazing how quickly these things can change. From what I remember of the psychoanalysis part of my theory module, we barely looked at Freud - Lacan was the mainstay. Although a lot of his ideas were obviously influenced by Freud (he claimed he was bringing about a 'return to Freud), I think the difference with Lacan is that he has been kept alive by the likes of Zizek, so it feels as though he has a relevance to our age that Freud has lost.

marquis_de_sad

  • I only wrote that poem to test my printer!
Re: Mark Fisher/Critiques of Capitalism and modern life
« Reply #33 on: April 13, 2018, 02:23:01 PM »
Great post, MSS.

I mentioned Evans' In Defence of History upthread, and that deals with a similar issue: that the epistemological accusations made against history by postmodernist theorists often reduces it to a positivist strawman. Fisher himself wasn't immune to that sort of thing, explaining away criticism by calling it 'anglo-saxon thinking' etc. But he could be funny with it. He saw getting into Pseud's Corner as a matter of pride, for example.

Re: Mark Fisher/Critiques of Capitalism and modern life
« Reply #34 on: April 13, 2018, 05:32:44 PM »
He said something in one of them that gave me an idea for a thread in Oscillations actually. He suggested that if you beamed any 21st century music back to 1994, people of that time would 'recognise' it as music (i.e. get where the music came from). It was part of a wider point about the flattening out of the future, and also I suppose that we don't have anything really 'new'. He compared it to, say, someone in 1970 beaming music back to 1950 - what would a 50s audience's reaction be to some of the music that came out in the 70s.

Made me wonder if this was actually true. There must be SOME 21st century music that is so avant-garde and recherché that it would confound an audience of 20 years ago.

It would surely depend upon who you beamed it back to?  If you take some jungle music in 1992 and beam it to Delia Derbyshire in 1972 it isn't going to blow her head off.  Whereas my parents would think The Fall isn't music, if you played them a fall album from the 70s, just now in 2018.

In any case, loads of chicago footwork/juke music would drive people up the wall.  Most western people react weirdly to any proper (non-westernised) gamelan music.  Ghananian drumming is impossible to notate (as far I understand it).  It is certainly a lot more rhythmically experimental than jungle music.  I am pretty most of Ryoji Ikeda's stuff would be considered non-music by a majority.  Or the german label Raster-Norton in general.

People being perplexed doesn't necessarily indicate something new.  Like Stockhausen, it might just indicate something shite.

Kishi the Bad Lampshade

  • fingering gold in his mind
Re: Mark Fisher/Critiques of Capitalism and modern life
« Reply #35 on: April 14, 2018, 02:19:20 PM »
People have already covered most of what I'd recommend in terms of THEORY, but for something a bit lighter I'd recommend the book Kids These Days by Malcolm Harris, and the podcast Trashfuture, in particular the most recent episode on the 'experience economy'.

Mark Fisher was good but sadly I think his biggest legacy was Vampire's Castle, a piece which had some good points but is now basically a Bible for male socialists who want a valid reason to yell at leftist women who complain about sexism.
« Last Edit: April 14, 2018, 02:39:02 PM by Kishi the Bad Lampshade »

Large Noise

  • Hey there! I am using Whatsapp
Re: Mark Fisher/Critiques of Capitalism and modern life
« Reply #36 on: April 15, 2018, 08:07:44 AM »
the podcast Trashfuture, in particular the most recent episode on the 'experience economy'.
Listening to this on your recommendation.

Quite interesting but there's a certain irony in them doing an irreverent analysis of millennial culture on a podcast that's so clearly trying to be British Chapo.

Also, I'd like to ban anyone who went to Cambridge and writes for a living from using the phrase 'failson'.

Kishi the Bad Lampshade

  • fingering gold in his mind
Re: Mark Fisher/Critiques of Capitalism and modern life
« Reply #37 on: April 15, 2018, 12:39:16 PM »
They're definitely Chapo-derivative, and can go a little hard on the Chapo/Left Twitter memes, but I think they're coming into their own a little bit in terms of focusing specifically on tech and culture in late capitalism. I'm hoping they'll find a little more of their own voice, but still find it very funny and enjoyable.

Mark Steels Stockbroker

  • Lost in the former West
Re: Mark Fisher/Critiques of Capitalism and modern life
« Reply #38 on: April 15, 2018, 03:22:53 PM »
Mark Fisher was good but sadly I think his biggest legacy was Vampire's Castle, a piece which had some good points but is now basically a Bible for male socialists who want a valid reason to yell at leftist women who complain about sexism.

No one gets to pick their fans. Just ask Nietzsche.

Mark Steels Stockbroker

  • Lost in the former West
Re: Mark Fisher/Critiques of Capitalism and modern life
« Reply #39 on: April 15, 2018, 03:30:04 PM »
Full confession: I was a bit sneery about Fisher a few years back. I wasn't particularly bothered about the Vampires Castle stuff, I had a quick look and it just added to my main impression of a middle-aged trendy lecturer feeling grumpy because The Kids aren't bothered about his collection of classic 7 inch singles and all the gigs he went to.

But after I read The Weird And The Eerie and other things, and also after seeing the shitty comments from Twitter no-marks like stavvers, I see I was wrong.

newbridge

  • Endless Summer of George
Re: Mark Fisher/Critiques of Capitalism and modern life
« Reply #40 on: April 15, 2018, 03:35:45 PM »
They're definitely Chapo-derivative, and can go a little hard on the Chapo/Left Twitter memes, but I think they're coming into their own a little bit in terms of focusing specifically on tech and culture in late capitalism. I'm hoping they'll find a little more of their own voice, but still find it very funny and enjoyable.

I listened to one and they are 80% less annoying than the Chapo hosts, though it suffers from the same problem of sort of seeming like the leftist politics are just a useful context for shitting on people in their peer group they dislike.

Cuellar

  • MUSKATNUSS, HERR MULLER
Re: Mark Fisher/Critiques of Capitalism and modern life
« Reply #41 on: April 16, 2018, 09:39:35 AM »
Full confession: I was a bit sneery about Fisher a few years back. I wasn't particularly bothered about the Vampires Castle stuff, I had a quick look and it just added to my main impression of a middle-aged trendy lecturer feeling grumpy because The Kids aren't bothered about his collection of classic 7 inch singles and all the gigs he went to.

But after I read The Weird And The Eerie and other things, and also after seeing the shitty comments from Twitter no-marks like stavvers, I see I was wrong.

Ha, just read Capitalist Realism and I must admit your first paragraph resonates. I found it thought-provoking, but there's a definitely a 'kids these days with their fast food and ipods, and bloody jobsworth managers and bloody redtape and don't get me started on call centres' vibe to it. Tweaked ever so slightly it could be a hack observational comedians routine :)

I've got Ghost of My Life on order though, so I'm definitely going to persevere with him.

spamwangler

  • fay bentos
Re: Mark Fisher/Critiques of Capitalism and modern life
« Reply #42 on: April 23, 2018, 06:34:14 PM »
80% less annoying than the Chapo hosts

still too annoying

saltysnacks

  • Hair in ALL the right places.
Re: Mark Fisher/Critiques of Capitalism and modern life
« Reply #43 on: May 01, 2018, 12:55:36 AM »
The section on depression in Capitalist Realism is probably one of the greatest sections in any book. It entirely changed my view of mental illness.