Tip jar

If you like CaB and wish to support it, you can use PayPal or KoFi. Thank you, and I hope you continue to enjoy the site - Neil.

Buy Me a Coffee at ko-fi.com

Support CaB

Recent

Welcome to Cook'd and Bomb'd. Please login or sign up.

March 29, 2024, 01:33:42 PM

Login with username, password and session length

Mortimer and Whitehouse: Gone Fishing

Started by ColinPopshed, June 09, 2018, 01:26:55 AM

Previous topic - Next topic

St_Eddie

If this show was replaced with Ricky Gervais and, oh, I don't know.... Alan Carr, saying the exact same words and doing the exact same things as Whitehouse and Mortimer, people on this forum would be slagging it off left, right and centre.

So, in summation; whether you enjoy this programme or not, depends entirely upon how much you care for Whitehouse and Mortimer.  That's not a criticism, by the way.  Just an observation.

shiftwork2

Carr and Gervais would never say those words.  They would say different words entirely, and that's why I'd hate it.

St_Eddie

Quote from: shiftwork2 on July 13, 2018, 11:31:38 PM
Carr and Gervais would never say those words.  They would say different words entirely, and that's why I'd hate it.

Well, yes, obviously but just suppose that they did say the same words, hypothetically speaking.

Twed

Nobody would be hating the show, they'd be baffled by the cosmic-level weirdness of their personalities being completely different.

St_Eddie

Quote from: Twed on July 14, 2018, 12:44:34 AM
Nobody would be hating the show, they'd be baffled by the cosmic-level weirdness of their personalities being completely different.

My point still stands.  Stand does my point.  Does my point stand?  Stand point does my.  My stand does point.  Point my stand does.

Ferris

Quote from: St_Eddie on July 14, 2018, 01:08:23 AM
My point still stands.  Stand does my point.  Does my point stand?  Stand point does my.  My stand does point.  Point my stand does.

How about if it was Yasser Arafat and Gore Vidal saying the same things? Or Nick Knowles and Barbara Windsor? Or Nikki Six and Béla Bartók?

Or maybe the personality and chemistry of the people drives what they say, and makes the program watchable (or otherwise), and substituting random people and assuming the script and delivery would stay the same isn't a good way to go.

(I really enjoyed thinking of people who were semi-related, but who would probably not get on. Fun!)

c

Quote from: St_Eddie on July 14, 2018, 01:08:23 AM
My point still stands.  Stand does my point.  Does my point stand?  Stand point does my.  My stand does point.  Point my stand does.

Agree. The creaking and crunching sounds of people bending over backwards in this thread is agonising

Cuntbeaks

What is it with the English and their preference for short crust pastry on pies, it's a fucking travesty.

Puff pastry or fuck right off.

St_Eddie

Quote from: FerriswheelBueller on July 14, 2018, 04:51:07 AM
Or maybe the personality and chemistry of the people drives what they say, and makes the program watchable (or otherwise), and substituting random people and assuming the script and delivery would stay the same isn't a good way to go.

Ahem...

Quote from: St_Eddie on July 13, 2018, 10:31:38 PM
So, in summation; whether you enjoy this programme or not, depends entirely upon how much you care for Whitehouse and Mortimer.  That's not a criticism, by the way.  Just an observation.

The fact remains that if, hypothetically speaking, two personalities that the majority on this forum didn't care for, were to make a show about fishing, hypothetically speaking, where the exact same things were said, you lot would probably hate it and slag it of, hypothetically speaking.

The point I'm making, if I am making a point, is that I think that a sizeable number of the people who are enjoying this show, are doing so largely due to a predisposition to like its two stars.  Remove those particular two stars and replace them with someone you don't personally care for, or even two complete unknowns and I suspect that all enjoyment would be sapped from the show because what you'd be left with is a big pile of nothing.

Again, that's not a criticism as such, just an observation.  People are enjoying the programme, which ultimately, is all that matters but because this a comedy forum for the discussion and dissection of comedy and other forms of entertainment, it is my wont to discuss and dissect the show.

shiftwork2

Quote from: Ballad of Ballard Berkley on July 12, 2018, 12:01:41 AM
Bob's healthy five-minute meals and 'quirky' accommodation choices (not actually chosen by him, obviously) tick the Guardian Weekend lifestyle boxes so beloved of BBC commissioners.

This is the only aspect that grates, for me.  These fellas would appreciate the chance to stay in a huge yurt, or a converted railway carriage, but by God would they have some funny observations about it and we're unfortunately not hearing them.

Ferris

Quote from: St_Eddie on July 14, 2018, 03:52:57 PM
Ahem...

The fact remains that if, hypothetically speaking, two personalities that the majority on this forum didn't care for, were to make a show about fishing, hypothetically speaking, where the exact same things were said, you lot would probably hate it and slag it of, hypothetically speaking.

The point I'm making, if I am making a point, is that I think that a sizeable number of the people who are enjoying this show, are doing so largely due to a predisposition to like its two stars.  Remove those particular two stars and replace them with someone you don't personally care for, or even two complete unknowns and I suspect that all enjoyment would be sapped from the show because what you'd be left with is a big pile of nothing.

Again, that's not a criticism as such, just an observation.  People are enjoying the programme, which ultimately, is all that matters but because this a comedy forum for the discussion and dissection of comedy and other forms of entertainment, it is my wont to discuss and dissect the show.

Totally agree!

BeardFaceMan

Quote from: St_Eddie on July 14, 2018, 03:52:57 PM
Ahem...

The fact remains that if, hypothetically speaking, two personalities that the majority on this forum didn't care for, were to make a show about fishing, hypothetically speaking, where the exact same things were said, you lot would probably hate it and slag it of, hypothetically speaking.

The point I'm making, if I am making a point, is that I think that a sizeable number of the people who are enjoying this show, are doing so largely due to a predisposition to like its two stars.  Remove those particular two stars and replace them with someone you don't personally care for, or even two complete unknowns and I suspect that all enjoyment would be sapped from the show because what you'd be left with is a big pile of nothing.

Again, that's not a criticism as such, just an observation.  People are enjoying the programme, which ultimately, is all that matters but because this a comedy forum for the discussion and dissection of comedy and other forms of entertainment, it is my wont to discuss and dissect the show.

Bit of an odd observation though. If Rik & Ade were replaced in The Young Ones by two comedians I dont care for who deliver the same script, chances are I wont like it. Of course people wont enjoy something starring people they dont like. And?


St_Eddie

Quote from: BeardFaceMan on July 14, 2018, 04:11:04 PM
Bit of an odd observation though. If Rik & Ade were replaced in The Young Ones by two comedians I dont care for who deliver the same script, chances are I wont like it. Of course people wont enjoy something starring people they dont like. And?

It wouldn't even need to be two personalities who people don't like.  As I said earlier, it could be two unknowns, or two people that viewers are indifferent towards.  If that were the case, I doubt that many within this thread would have continued watching past the first episode.

I can't stress enough, that I'm not attempting to invalidate people enjoying the show.  Naturally, there's nothing wrong with watching and enjoying it.  In fact, I'm glad that people are.  I just feel that perhaps some people are perhaps being a tad disingenuous, in regards to the show's inherent quality.  In essence, I think that a few people are possibly giving the show a free pass because of a predisposition to like its two stars.  There's a certain amount of bias involved with its critical appraisal, I feel.

Sebastian Cobb

Did any of you ever watch extreme fishing with Robson Green? It wasn't intended to be a comedy but what made it both funny and captivating was how much of a wanker he was.

St_Eddie

Quote from: Sebastian Cobb on July 14, 2018, 04:30:52 PM
Did any of you ever watch extreme fishing with Robson Green? It wasn't intended to be a comedy but what made it both funny and captivating was how much of a wanker he was.

It was a very relatable programme, I thought.

Sebastian Cobb

He wasn't a prick to people or anything but I thought he got quite excited and looked like a wally. Endearing wanker, rather than bad wanker.

St_Eddie

Quote from: Sebastian Cobb on July 14, 2018, 04:44:17 PM
He wasn't a prick to people or anything but I thought he got quite excited and looked like a wally. Endearing wanker, rather than bad wanker.

Sorry, I haven't actually seen it.  I was making a self-deprecating joke.

BeardFaceMan

Quote from: St_Eddie on July 14, 2018, 04:28:45 PM
It wouldn't even need to be two personalities who people don't like.  As I said earlier, it could be two unknowns, or two people that viewers are indifferent towards.  If that were the case, I doubt that many within this thread would have continued watching past the first episode.

I can't stress enough, that I'm not attempting to invalidate people enjoying the show.  Naturally, there's nothing wrong with watching and enjoying it.  In fact, I'm glad that people are.  I just feel that perhaps some people are perhaps being a tad disingenuous, in regards to the show's inherent quality.  In essence, I think that a few people are possibly giving the show a free pass because of a predisposition to like its two stars.  There's a certain amount of bias involved with its critical appraisal, I feel.

Thats the whole point of these kinds of shows though. All these "personality does x" programs rely 100% on the personality to make the show enjoyable, it doesnt matter what the 'x' is, the activity is pretty much irrelevant.  Its not a comedy show, its a reality show so I'm not sure where the critical appraisial comes in. You either like the personalities and like the show, or you dont like the personalities and you dont like the show.

St_Eddie

Quote from: BeardFaceMan on July 14, 2018, 05:59:00 PM
Thats the whole point of these kinds of shows though. All these "personality does x" programs rely 100% on the personality to make the show enjoyable, it doesnt matter what the 'x' is, the activity is pretty much irrelevant.

I do agree with that.  It's just that I think that this show is kind of weak sauce, even when taking the personalities into account.

Quote from: BeardFaceMan on July 14, 2018, 05:59:00 PMIts not a comedy show, its a reality show so I'm not sure where the critical appraisial comes in.

Quote from: St_Eddie on July 14, 2018, 03:52:57 PM
People are enjoying the programme, which ultimately, is all that matters but because this a comedy forum for the discussion and dissection of comedy and other forms of entertainment, it is my wont to discuss and dissect the show.

Quote from: BeardFaceMan on July 14, 2018, 05:59:00 PMYou either like the personalities and like the show, or you dont like the personalities and you dont like the show.

There's always option C (which is where I stand); you like the personalities but don't like the show.

BeardFaceMan

Still not sure where the critical appraisal fits in. There hasnt been much criticism other than 'its a bit gentle and not much happens', which again, is the point of the show, its not a comedy. How would you improve the show? Better writing and script editing? Better sets? Fair enough if you dont like it, no one is saying you have to, just seems odd to say the only reason other people like it is because of the people involved when thats the entire point of the show and why people watch in the first place. Its not because theyre fans of fishing.

Im suprised Whitehouse agreed to this, to be honest. Hes always been a bit camera shy and seems to hate talking about comedy or himself, he only ever seems comfortable on screen when playing a character. Bob is a fucking joy though and is carrying the whole show for me. Whitehouse does seem to be loosening up a bit though, it looks like the show is actually doing him good.

Dr Rock

I like the personalities and the people and what they are saying but hate the fact that they are fishing, as I fucking hate fishing.

Twed

Not all shows have to be focused around material, I think. Thought the same thing with people criticising Dayworld for having no message or whatever.

If you want material, check out the excellent Rich Hall's Fishing Show.

Dr Rock

I'd watch Nikki Six and Béla Bartók play pool.

BeardFaceMan

The thing I dont get about fishing is putting it straight back after you caught it. At least eat the fucking thing. You spend all that time and money and effort buying equipment, learning to use it, and you end up throwing back anything you catch. Surely there are easier and less expensive ways to relax than interrupting a fishes day?

phes

Problem I have with this is actual Paul Whitehouse just isn't a very funny guy. I don't know what else to add really, Bob starts off lots of fun stuff that goes nowhere because Whitehouse isn't very playful. Liking them both immensely isn't really enough to carry it for me.

It's not very good this. But they remain two all time heroes

the science eel

Quote from: the science eel on July 05, 2018, 05:56:09 PM
Whitehouse on the other hand tends to dismiss things a little too readily. There were a couple of moments last night where it looked like they were going to get their teeth stuck into something interesting (usually prompted by Bob), and PW was kind of 'yeah right LET'S GET ON WITH THE FISHING'


phes

Hmm, I do wonder whether Whitehouse just doesn't have the kind of processing speed that's required from those kind of exchanges. It would be easy to misenterpret all the times he bounces the conversation back to Bob as dismissive, rather than his realising he's not on the same wavelength

Bob's naivety and Paul's short tempered grumpiness are a really awkward fit, they don't come across as genuine friends or that they even like each other very much. It's forced and clumsy when you'd expect it to be a very natural and endearing window.

The latest episode was quite painful when Bob was relentlessly ribbing Paul about his bald spot. Mates just don't do that, it felt really contrived and staged just for the sake of the (weak) visual comedy of Bob applying the fake hair to Paul's scalp. I actually found that entire stretch depressing. There were a lot of other personal jabs at each other that felt off to me.

This is probably the worst thing both Bob and Paul have been involved in, and that is really saying something. Monkey Tennis at its worst. Really can't be arsed with the rest of the series, and I expected to love it.

Hecate

They're both quite shy and sensitive types, aren't they? They were probably both pissed to the gills whenever they socialised in the past.

Bob might have been slowly pushing that rusty old, unlubricated banter vortex down a riverbank on the first day of filming and thinking "I didn't sign up for this!"

BeardFaceMan

It feels like Bob is aware they're making a tv show and tries to be entertaining where Paul just wants to go fishing with his mate to relax after a health scare and isnt aware there are cameras there. But then Bob has a lot more experience being himself on tv while Paul very rarely does that so thats kind of expected really. They both look like theyre enjoying themselves though.