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Wrestling Thread: the New Generation

Started by Z, July 26, 2018, 09:33:21 PM

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up_the_hampipe

Quote from: hummingofevil on February 12, 2019, 02:00:17 PM
I actually agree with Timothy (for once) about having Ronda beat Becky beat Charlotte and carry feud on from there. We all know Vince likes nothin more than a swerve and if they going to get Ronda over as mega heel what better place to do it.

When was the last truely great heel win at Mania last match?

What makes you think they're trying to get Ronda over as a mega heel? She might heel it up a bit for this feud, just out of necessity, but I don't see them turning her. She's also supposed to be leaving and/or taking time off after Wrestlemania, so what is point? After four years of Roman fuckshit, we need a Mania main event that goes well.

Timothy

Then put Rollins and Lesnar in the main event and have Becky etc open Mania. Its the better spot anyway considering Mania last for nearly eleven hours inc getin and getout and preshow etc. Crowd is asleep when main event starts.


Quote from: Timothy on February 12, 2019, 02:03:12 PM
The fans do cheer people out of nowhere. Just like they suddenly chant we are awesome or throw a beach ball around.  Fans suddenly cheered her and popped, she got more airtime and she used that.

People aren't cheering her for no reason.

Deanjam

Quote from: ToneLa on February 12, 2019, 01:27:08 PM

Becky question. Does she move much merch? 'A draw' is a bit of a weird question these days.

Apparently WWE hasn't been stocking much of her merch at events which shows you how little planned her push has been. Although it seems women's merch isn't stocked much throughout the division. One of the reasons Cena, Reigns & AJ sell so much is that they have so much gear readily available at events. It's not an even playing field.

No one is really a draw in WWE anymore, but there's little doubt that Becky has been able to generate a great deal of interest in herself, largely off her own bat.

Quote from: up_the_hampipe on February 12, 2019, 02:03:20 PM
What makes you think they're trying to get Ronda over as a mega heel? She might heel it up a bit for this feud, just out of necessity, but I don't see them turning her. She's also supposed to be leaving and/or taking time off after Wrestlemania, so what is point? After four years of Roman fuckshit, we need a Mania main event that goes well.

WWE have form in pissing on the hopes and dreams of the most ardent of wrestling fans so I wouldn't rule it out.

Timothy

Quote from: An Actual Propeller on February 12, 2019, 02:07:48 PM
People aren't cheering her for no reason.

Not anymore.

Anyway I am probably wrong like you all said but I literally have no idea why she was suddenly Stone Cold over.

Quote from: Timothy on February 12, 2019, 02:05:19 PM
Then put Rollins and Lesnar in the main event and have Becky etc open Mania. Its the better spot anyway considering Mania last for nearly eleven hours inc getin and getout and preshow etc. Crowd is asleep when main event starts.

The opening spot of WrestleMania is better than the main event slot of WrestleMania <- are you seriously suggesting that this is the case?

Ja'moke

Quote from: Timothy on February 12, 2019, 01:53:43 PM
What contradictions? She was boring and didnt do much until Evolution. After that the fans suddenly decided to cheer her. She used that and her personal imput and creative inspiration (I find it dull but I'm fairly alone in this) to get even more over. The fans gave her the ball and she started running. None of it happened organically but Lynch made good use of the situation therefore proving its possible to get in the main event if you work hard or use the fans wantijg to let themselves heard to your advantage.

I think shes an awful face and her matches and promos bore me to bits but that doesnt change the fact that what she did is impressive. Same how Fandango used his themesong to get over.

The fact that she broke through the glass ceiling proves that even the dullest wrestler can get over if they are both lucky and work hard.

You said two pages back she got herself over. Then said she didn't get herself over. Hence the contradiction.

Also, you're just plain wrong. Becky was already super over before Evolution. When she attacked Charlotte at Summerslam? Massive pop. And those pops continued after that on every Smackdown, at the Hell In a Cell Match when she won the title. Hell, she got cheered over Hall of Famer Edge when making fun of his career ending neck injury.

Evolution happened at the end of October. Becky had been super over for at least a good two months before that. You should actually know what you're talking about before posting.

Timothy

I think your definition of super over and massive pops is just different then mine. You also said that the crowd was super into her Royal Rumble match and on fire while I didn't hear that.

Did you try adjusting the volume knob on your telly mate?

Ja'moke

Quote from: Timothy on February 12, 2019, 02:09:50 PM
Not anymore.

Anyway I am probably wrong like you all said but I literally have no idea why she was suddenly Stone Cold over.

Here, let me explain how the storyline went...

-Becky, after a good year or so of being underused, and only having the "I was the first ever Smackdown Women's champion" tagline to fall back on, said she was sick of using that as her calling card and said she wanted to be champion again.

-And so Becky started working her way through the Smackdown roster. Week after week she earned a victory over a different opponent. She pretty much beat everyone on the roster, including the current champion Carmella, and so earned a one-on-one title match at Summerslam.

-Then Charlotte returned after weeks of absence, beat Carmella once, and was put into the title match, making it a triple threat. This started the whole "Charlotte always stealing Becky's spotlight" storyline. Becky had gone through the entire roster to earn her title match while Charlotte sat at home and then waltzed back in and was immediately given the chance to enter the match.

-At SummerSlam, Becky had Carmella in the Dis-ARM-her, Charlotte hit the Natural Selection on Becky while she had the submission in, pinned her and won the title. After the match, Becky attacked Charlotte, the crowd went crazy.

-In the weeks afterwards, Becky explained why she attacked Charlotte. How Charlotte always held her back, always stole her spotlight. It's around this time the WWE tried making Becky heel, had her shit on the crowd the first week after the Summerslam attack, but the fans rejected it. The fans wanted to cheer Becky, and they did, loudly and all the time. And so WWE quickly dropped the whole "shitting on the crowd" thing, even editing it out of subsequent replays and YouTube highlights.

-Becky was granted her one-on-one title match with Charlotte at Hell In A Cell and won the title. It was a great match and the fans were happy. Becky was even more over at this point. Her promos on Smackdown were great, loud reactions. This is when the aforementioned segment with Edge happened.

-Becky and Charlotte continued to have great matches, at Super Showdown and eventually Evolution, which is when you seem to think the crowd randomly started supporting Becky, even though the evidence to the contrary is all there.

hummingofevil

Quote from: Timothy on February 12, 2019, 02:09:50 PM
Anyway I am probably wrong like you all said..

Oh man, can't we all hug it out?

Making me sad this. It's not real.

hummingofevil

Quote from: up_the_hampipe on February 12, 2019, 02:03:20 PM
What makes you think they're trying to get Ronda over as a mega heel? She might heel it up a bit for this feud, just out of necessity, but I don't see them turning her. She's also supposed to be leaving and/or taking time off after Wrestlemania, so what is point? After four years of Roman fuckshit, we need a Mania main event that goes well.

Sorry for confusion. Posting too much today so not being clear. My bad.

What I meant was THEY ABSOLUTELY SHOULD TRY TO GET HER OVER AS A MEGA HEEL AS IT WOULD BE FREAKING AWESOME. Heel Ronda is awesome Ronda. Doesn't matter if she fucks up promos as she can just kick off with the crowd. Ronda's best attribute is that we are all in full knowledge that she can fuck people up legit in a minute. So play off that, especially if she's in the audience's face.

They should be trying to get Ronda booed than have Steph and HHH get fully behind her with a trying-to-protect-their-investment storyline. It writes itself because it is true. Constantly tease them having Charlotte being paid off or bribed or what ever to align her with Ronda and they are off.... the heat at Mania will be nuclear.

If Becky wins then fine but I for one would love them to troll the audience with a Ronda going over. Fuck it, have Becky win the belt at Raw the next night... they'll blow the roof off Barclays and why the hell not (probably more people watching too).


Timothy

Yes exactly!!!! And with Rousey being part of authority it makes sense for Lynch to be anti establishment. Amazing idea and baffled that they arent going that route!

hummingofevil

Quote from: Timothy on February 12, 2019, 04:13:32 PM
Yes exactly!!!! And with Rousey being part of authority it makes sense for Lynch to be anti establishment. Amazing idea and baffled that they arent going that route!

I reckon you trying to fool me Timothy. You want Ronda to win because you love her really not because you want to boo her. Trying to sneak that past us. If Becky loses you will be on here giving it the Yes! chants, swinging it like the big I am under your customised Rowdy kilt. :)

Trying to get the whole world to boo her so when they do you will cheer for her so she falls in love with you and you can go live on her farm together.... fallen into my trap.

---

Sorry about that again. Mind wandering.

---

Speaking of which it's been bugging me for ages but I've just actually realised that they spell IIconics fucking weird. Two capital "i"s which makes sense for it to be pronounced Iconic but no actual sense in any grammar in any language on Earth. I'm learning a bit of Welsh so Llonics works or even the "Yuh" sound in Spanish. Its like they don't know what they doing.

petril

Quote from: Ja'moke on February 12, 2019, 03:19:41 PM
It's around this time the WWE tried making Becky heel, had her shit on the crowd the first week after the Summerslam attack, but the fans rejected it. The fans wanted to cheer Becky, and they did, loudly and all the time. And so WWE quickly dropped the whole "shitting on the crowd" thing, even editing it out of subsequent replays and YouTube highlights.

this is the most Austin bit, right there

ToneLa

#2447
Quote from: Timothy on February 12, 2019, 02:03:12 PM
The fans do cheer people out of nowhere. Just like they suddenly chant we are awesome or throw a beach ball around.  Fans suddenly cheered her and popped, she got more airtime and she used that.

Are you not a fan? There is a certain element of the fans running with what they, a group of ever-changing individuals in different cities weekly, decided.

This isn't chanting WHAT or throwing a beach ball, it is part of the show, and though I have zero stake in it beyond my own selfish entertainment, I oddly just see "the fans chose her" as, frankly, a massive, huge, fuck-off compliment: Tie it to whatever factor ye want, but over is over, and she is not the female John Cena 06.

She is, if anything, closer to Punting-Orton-as-heel-with-pops, Punk-as-anti-WWE-face, Austin being Austin... there is a rich lineage of the type of character she is portraying. I appreciate what she is trying to do. I asked you earlier: Do you understand why they booked Austin as they did? The reason is, her character is a TYPE of face, and "bad babyface" is meaningless if people want it. A whole show, maybe; I've seen late Nitro. One character you're putting the title on at Mania? Sound!

If you want, Timothy, do explain what a "proper face" is: I don't have Bruiser Brody as an avatar because I think that's a linear concept. No such thing. It may be for you (just going off how you talk about it); but personally I've been watching for so long my fandom has developed perhaps annoying little traits like Booker Hat and so on.

No opinion is invalid, but are your opinions money, as Kevin Nash would say? This is a greedy business! Becky is probably not huge money, she is arguably the next Stone Cold in surely every other metric, but the thing is, WWE are hurtin for a proper, over, authentic face, and if the fans want you to win you are a face.

She is by any measure that includes the majority of the audience a face.

Quote from: Timothy on February 12, 2019, 04:13:32 PM
Yes exactly!!!! And with Rousey being part of authority it makes sense for Lynch to be anti establishment. Amazing idea and baffled that they arent going that route!

+1 I respect your longer term booking here.

Mania is one night, but it's such a night, it has special importance. If anything, perhaps we might agree on the idea WWE have booked themselves in a corner; but there is much value on Becky as the chaser (let's not get too Russo but let's not also get hung up on faces vs heels)

I just think sooner or later on a challenger you pull the trigger. If not Mania with this build - winning the women's Rumble! - when? No other PPV has anything like the cachet, except, heh, Takeover

Personally, I felt something at Asuka beating her (and that's a sore point as the dearth of plans arises AGAIN), and her winning the Rumble.

Frankly. vs Ronda at Mania? Who better?

hummingofevil

And you know what. If they do exactly that then you already got your Ronda face turn lined up for next year's Mania (baby permitting) where she takes huge offense with Steph and HHH for not believing she was good enough to beat Becky by herself.

What I'm trying to say is all these storylines involve Stephanie getting beaten up.

Im taking a break from here for a bit. Need some fresh air.

OBVIOUSLY Becky should be in the main event and win the fucker.  It's her time!*

* (if you ignore the TV ratings)

ToneLa

Quote from: An Actual Propeller on February 12, 2019, 05:10:37 PM
OBVIOUSLY Steph should be in the main event and win the fucker.  It's her time!*

* (if you ignore the TV ratings)


Fixed for omfg




Ja'moke

Usos and Miz/Shane did well to sell that match in one ten minute segment.

Ja'moke


hummingofevil

Yeah. Cracking that. The highest compliment I would give Smackdown is that I looked at clock at 3am and was surprised that it was over so soon. 2 hour shows are infinitely better than the 3 hour Raw (as everyone including Vince knows).

Shhh but I did quite enjoy McMiz TV too. What's happening to me?

Ja'moke

Kofi v Bryan should be the Mania match. The feud with the New Day would work perfectly, they're all about consumerism and hawking merch and food that's not good for you.

Here's a great promo from the New Day lads after that gauntlet match: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F6n5Pf3gaEU

Timothy

Oh man. A D Bry Kofi feud where Bry beats Kofi, but Kofi finally wins the MITB and cashes in to win that well deserved WWE championship only to turn on the New Day and go heel.... high on my I want this to happen list.

Ja'moke

Why you always trying to turn people heel? Haha. WWE struggle enough for faces as it is, and New Day are one of their consistently over acts.