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March 28, 2024, 10:01:28 AM

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Trump number 8

Started by Fambo Number Mive, August 23, 2018, 08:19:52 AM

Previous topic - Next topic

Will Trump be re-elected in 2020?

Yes because we're all fucked now
21 (38.2%)
Aye, probably
14 (25.5%)
No because Trump will eventually trip himself up
0 (0%)
No because the Democrats will triumph
2 (3.6%)
I HEAR YOU'RE A RACIST NOW FATHER
4 (7.3%)
Lincoln, Garfield, McKinley, Kennedy and Stuart Sutcliffe
1 (1.8%)
It's all pointless - like bringing a knife to a gun party (Sandford, 18/06/16)
0 (0%)
Rode slipshod over all dumbshits, he were curious orange
1 (1.8%)
Search for "Goatse" increased by 600% since election outcome
2 (3.6%)
Pee Tape emerges with no real impact other than increased awareness of prostate check
0 (0%)
Trump steps down, Pence rises like a greying Ken doll found in a sewer full of pig fat
0 (0%)
In the episode, Captain Kirk stands trial on charges of negligence after a crewman fakes his own death.
0 (0%)
Imagine the size of his balls
0 (0%)
Obama emerges from the void screaming PULL YOUR PANTS UP, DAD'S HOME
0 (0%)
Not as good as The Wire
1 (1.8%)
Raoul Moat
3 (5.5%)
PLEASE GAS THIS WHITEHOUSE OF CUNTS
2 (3.6%)
Sauron falls through the bar
0 (0%)
As predicted by Frank T. J. Mackie
0 (0%)
Carry On Up The Arse
2 (3.6%)
The Mueller-Lite Effect
0 (0%)
The Further Adventures of Snow White Supremacist and the Fifteen Stupid Twats
0 (0%)
Trump re-elected as man plays Bela Lugosi's Dead on a tuba made of smegma
1 (1.8%)
#NotAllFAtStupidYanks
0 (0%)
I had a fat stupid yank in me car once, made a right fuckin mess
1 (1.8%)

Total Members Voted: 55

kngen

Quote from: Hank Venture on November 28, 2018, 04:09:44 PM
I'd believe that if it wasn't Luke Harding writing it, whose continued employment at The Guardian is evidence of severe journalistic malpractice. He lifted literal paragraphs from The Exile, and nothing happened to him.

If you ever saw Patrick Wintour's raw copy, it'd become immediately obvious that good journalistic practice is pretty far down the list of priorities of the Guardian's foreign desk.

The point I'm making is that changing a live story isn't cloak-and-dagger stuff; it's someone mopping up a pile of shit that's been left for them to deal with. Wikileaks are now suing the Guardian, and you can bet it's the unsubbed, unlegalled story they'll be citing as evidence. I'm not defending Luke Harding whatsoever, and you'd have to imagine that someone is feeding him this material, but the first version of that story is schoolboy-error stuff that gets you sued, all for want of an 'alleged' and 'sources say'. In the basic everyday machinations of a newspaper, that's unforgiveable and someone will be getting their arse felt for that. The Graun's digital-first policy, which allows writers to upload their own material, circumventing subs desks, legal etc, has been a disaster waiting to happen. This could well be that disaster.


steve98

I was excited reading this story last night... but in the cold light of day - it's garbage :(

Hank Venture

Quote from: kngen on November 28, 2018, 05:27:50 PM
The point I'm making is that changing a live story isn't cloak-and-dagger stuff; it's someone mopping up a pile of shit that's been left for them to deal with. Wikileaks are now suing the Guardian, and you can bet it's the unsubbed, unlegalled story they'll be citing as evidence. I'm not defending Luke Harding whatsoever, and you'd have to imagine that someone is feeding him this material, but the first version of that story is schoolboy-error stuff that gets you sued, all for want of an 'alleged' and 'sources say'. In the basic everyday machinations of a newspaper, that's unforgiveable and someone will be getting their arse felt for that. The Graun's digital-first policy, which allows writers to upload their own material, circumventing subs desks, legal etc, has been a disaster waiting to happen. This could well be that disaster.

Look, I'm not saying the Guardian as an organization deliberatelly put this out there in a concerted effort to hurt Assange. I'm just saying that the US/UK intelligence community must be rubbing their hands together at the thought of a company man like Harding having the opportunity to publish without proper editorializing. It's an open goal; whether Harding has done this deliberately or not, The Guardian has let him. It doesn't look to good for them, imo.

Dog Botherer

Trump's car took off mysteriously tonight after turning on some Christmas lights. Took off sharpish leaving behind the entire press pool and some of his entourage. Hasn't been any updates for 2 hours.

50/50 he stroked out in the back of the car.

BlodwynPig

Quote from: Hank Venture on November 28, 2018, 08:35:33 PM
Look, I'm not saying the Guardian as an organization deliberatelly put this out there in a concerted effort to hurt Assange. I'm just saying that the US/UK intelligence community must be rubbing their hands together at the thought of a company man like Harding having the opportunity to publish without proper editorializing. It's an open goal; whether Harding has done this deliberately or not, The Guardian has let him. It doesn't look to good for them, imo.

Who here has made their 1 pound/dollar donation to support the Guardian and it's independent journalism. (or wikipedia for that matter). LoLs.

Bhazor

THERE ARE FOOOOOORRRRCEESS AT PLAY HERE SHEEPLE

Blue Jam

#1026
Melania has got Donald a pack of Handmaids for Christmas:



https://youtu.be/viYF7jV0ZSM

The 2017 trees were white of course. So classy... Melania probably only just managed to persuade him not to order them in gold.

Paul Calf

Workaround for persistent New Post indicator

<something amusing>

Hank Venture

Quote from: Bhazor on November 29, 2018, 08:59:46 AM
THERE ARE FOOOOOORRRRCEESS AT PLAY HERE SHEEPLE

https://www.politico.com/magazine/story/2018/11/28/paul-manafort-julian-assange-222694

Here is a piece lending credence to my theory that this story was planted. It differs from my theory in that the motivation for the planting was not to get Assange, a man who airs the dirty laundry of very powerful people in public, but rather to get *Luke Harding*, a hack Guardian journo.

The point of this nefarious plot is to ruin his reputation in order to discredit his reporting on Russian collusion (it skips over the fact that Harding's reputation is, uh, in tatters after being caught plagiarizing to the extent of being named "Plagiarizer of the Year" by Private Eye). It's Russian plots within Russian plots. Russian plots all the way down, maaaaan.

So who wrote this piece, a clever co-opting of the very real concerns about The Guardian's reporting?

"Alex Finley is the pen name of a former CIA officer and author of Victor in the Rubble, a satire of the CIA and the war on terror. Follow her on Twitter: @alexzfinley."

Oh. No longer content with unnamed sources, we now have unnamed authors from the CIA.

If you read that completely dishonest and propagandistic piece written by an unnamed ex-CIA officer and think I'm a swivel-eyed conspiracy loon for saying that Western intelligence has sway over what Western media report on and how they report it, I genuinely don't know what to tell you.

Mr Farenheit

Quote from: Dog Botherer on November 29, 2018, 02:53:37 AM
Trump's car took off mysteriously tonight after turning on some Christmas lights. Took off sharpish leaving behind the entire press pool and some of his entourage. Hasn't been any updates for 2 hours.

What, like Repo Man?

kngen

Quote from: Hank Venture on November 29, 2018, 12:07:02 PM
https://www.politico.com/magazine/story/2018/11/28/paul-manafort-julian-assange-222694

Here is a piece lending credence to my theory that this story was planted. It differs from my theory in that the motivation for the planting was not to get Assange, a man who airs the dirty laundry of very powerful people in public, but rather to get *Luke Harding*, a hack Guardian journo.

The point of this nefarious plot is to ruin his reputation in order to discredit his reporting on Russian collusion (it skips over the fact that Harding's reputation is, uh, in tatters after being caught plagiarizing to the extent of being named "Plagiarizer of the Year" by Private Eye). It's Russian plots within Russian plots. Russian plots all the way down, maaaaan.


Planting false stories with credulous nitwits to discredit them and/or their newspaper is a common tactic used by secret services though - cf. Piers Morgan/The Mirror and the fake British Army Iraqi torture photos. And, as mentioned before, the fact that the Graun ran with it before any grown-ups could take a look at it means it could very well be hugely damaging to them, possibly to a greater extent than was planned. I'm not saying there isn't an agenda against Assange, but this seems an awful roundabout way of doing it.


Mister Six

Quote from: Hank Venture on November 29, 2018, 12:07:02 PM
If you read that completely dishonest and propagandistic piece written by an unnamed ex-CIA officer and think I'm a swivel-eyed conspiracy loon for saying that Western intelligence has sway over what Western media report on and how they report it, I genuinely don't know what to tell you.

So are the Western intelligence services practicing their machinations in secret with dodgy sources, or are they doing it with a byline?

Was the first story a plant (to smear Manafort or Assange) or the second one a plant (to smear, I dunno - Harding? Russia? The CIA?)? Are the two stories part of the same elaborate scheme, and if so why use the mystical controlling powers of the Deep State to place the second part in a smallish organisation like Politico rather than the NYT or WaPo?

Hank Venture

Quote from: Mister Six on November 29, 2018, 12:48:47 PM
So are the Western intelligence services practicing their machinations in secret with dodgy sources, or are they doing it with a byline?
Why can it not be both? The notion that it's too far fetched to believe that Western intelligence are looking out for their countries' interest by shifting the blame for Western political corruption over on this amorphous blob of catch-all Russian Collusion (tm), but completely within reason that the Russians outfoxed us all by pulling the strings for Donald Trump as president in some undefined Machiavellian plot, is a bit odd to me. Are Russians really this competent?

Did they hack the election (whatever the fuck that means)? Do they have kompromat and disinformatsya (oooh, scary words) on Trump? Are there Russian troll farms? Who knows, but in this political climate it doesn't seem to raise any critical counter-arguments as long as you say "The Russians did it" - you can pose pretty much any argument you want. Do I believe in corrupting Russian influences in American politics? Yes. Is Russia disproportionally used as a boogey man? Yes. I mean, Mueller is going to lose his mind when he finds out what reach Israel, the Gulf States, Turkey has in US politics. But they're allies, so it's no big deal. Or when he finds out about gerrymandering and the purging of black voters from voter rolls in Georgia, but that's not "Russians hacking the election", so again, no big deal.

I mean, in this political climate you have more or less powerful US media people praising a complete loon like Louise Mensch publicly. Either I am losing my mind, or there is neo-McCarthyite mass-psychosis in the media. I'm open to the possibility of it being the former.

Quote from: Mister Six on November 29, 2018, 12:48:47 PM
Was the first story a plant (to smear Manafort or Assange) or the second one a plant (to smear, I dunno - Harding? Russia? The CIA?)? Are the two stories part of the same elaborate scheme, and if so why use the mystical controlling powers of the Deep State to place the second part in a smallish organisation like Politico rather than the NYT or WaPo?

Well, *if* the first story was a plant - and I'm not saying it definitely is, I'm saying it possibly is, given the weak evidence provided by The Guardian - it's surely to tie Assange to Russia in the public image, thereby discrediting WikiLeaks and their work. That powerful people would benefit from a weakened WikiLeaks is obvious.

The second piece isn't a plant as much as it's completely dishonest stenography. It literally says that if the story is true, it is the fault of Russia. If the story is untrue, that is also the fault of Russia. End of. Signed, an ex-CIA officer. Why Politico would publish it, is beyond me. Again, "The Russians" seems to be a surefire way of getting to say anything you want.

Re: your question about whether or not it's a concerted effort: I don't know. I doubt it is, but I think it's two different instances of people furthering the same agenda without it being deliberately co-ordinated. Furthermore, you're putting words in my mouth by insinuating that I think the NYT and WaPo are completely controlled by the CIA - I don't think that. I think there is some influence in what they report and how they report it, not that Gina Haspel or whoever has final say. Maybe they didn't pitch it to NYT or WaPo, maybe they got rejected - I don't know. I just think it's curious that a literal ex-CIA agent is allowed to write a dishonest op-ed in the relatively respected Politico (is it even stenography when they write it themselves?).

Large Noise

Before we all get carried away, can I just propose that the real Russian plant is the Politico piece?

It's obviously an intentionally absurd piece written to discredit those who are trying to defend Harding.

BlodwynPig

Quote from: Large Noise on November 29, 2018, 01:39:07 PM
Before we all get carried away, can I just propose that the real Russian plant is the Politico piece?

It's obviously an intentionally absurd piece written to discredit those who are trying to defend Harding.

Shall I call the cops?

Blue Jam


Paul Calf


Alberon

Quote from: Blue Jam on November 29, 2018, 02:47:58 PM
Michael Cohen to plead guilty:

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-46390368

Mueller has been advancing quite quickly for a legal investigation. No wonder Trump's been getting nervous on Twitter again.

Looks like Cohen is playing ball, unlike Manafort. The real question, like the BBC says, is if he has documentation to back up his testimony.

kngen

Quote from: Alberon on November 29, 2018, 03:46:31 PM
Mueller has been advancing quite quickly for a legal investigation. No wonder Trump's been getting nervous on Twitter again.

Looks like Cohen is playing ball, unlike Manafort. The real question, like the BBC says, is if he has documentation to back up his testimony.

Trump submitting his written answers seems to have kicked everything up a notch. It was the perjury that did for Nixon, not the actual crime, wasn't it?


Head Gardener


Howj Begg

No leverage. None whatsoever. As various posters in the Trump threads were aggressively, possibly recklessly keen to emphasise, often framing "leverage" or "kompromat" in scornful scare quotes or italics to hammer home home the point, over and over again.

Yet Cohen was lying about Trump's real estate deals to Congress as late as August 2017. No leverage, though.

I'd suggest believing the statements of one of the most corrupt men on Earth is never going to pan out well, despite how "Russophobic" blogs tell you it is to state what is staring you clearly in the face. Interestingly, the Steele dossier is again vindicated.

Twed

This is all so much better than policies and progress

Ryan Gosling

Before Trump hands out his sanctions like Trump cards..maybe he should read this.

The US brought in $192.3 billion from weapon sales last year, up 13 percent

https://www.defensenews.com/industry/2018/11/08/the-us-brought-in-1923-billion-from-weapon-sales-last-year-up-13-percent/

Howj Begg

Deutsche bank and Trump's law firm were also both raided today.

Timeline looks to be: the SC investigation moving into its end phase in January when the new House convenes, giving it some protection.

Don Jr definitely in the shit too for lying about the Moscow real estate deal that continued throughout the campaign. I'm guessing the Trump Tower meeting concerned that too.

Hank Venture

I genuinely think Bernie Sanders being the Democratic nominee in 2020 is the only thing that can possibly reel us in from complete cataclysm. It really feels like we're living in the "reasons for ... " phase before "total annihilation" phase.

Imagine how another financial crash will compound all this. Fun fact: did you know the JP Morgan quantitative analysis chief predicts the next crash sometime in 2019, a crash that will send us into "social upheaval not seen since the Great Depression"? And that's JP Morgan, a completely rotten capitalist institution.

Urinal Cake

It will be a woman- Elizabeth Warren, Kamala Harris or Tulsi Gabbard.
It will be a 'their time has come moment.'

Gabbard seems least likely to shift towards the DNC.

Twed

As long as it isn't Kamala.

It will be Beto anyway, because establishment Democrats only care about identity when it's a tool for maintaining the status quo.

Howj Begg

Quote from: Urinal Cake on November 29, 2018, 07:19:09 PM
It will be a woman- Elizabeth Warren, Kamala Harris or Tulsi Gabbard.
It will be a 'their time has come moment.'

Gabbard seems least likely to shift towards the DNC.

Or Gillibrand, who seems more progressive than the last two. Warren would be ideal though. Bernie for sec of state.

kalowski

Did Trump basically say, "Well, when the president does it, that means that it is not illegal," today?

"There would be nothing wrong if I did do it,"