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March 29, 2024, 12:15:46 AM

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Topic: Top of the Pops on BBC Four - Thread Two.

Started by Dr Rock, August 26, 2018, 02:21:41 PM

Previous topic - Next topic

daf

You might know this Buzby, but any idea why the Lionel Richie video looked such garbage?

Like it had some sort of 'echo' filter added on (possible NTSC-PAL botched conversion?) - real eyeball grot!

Sebastian Cobb

I think spitting image was on the way out, I remember Blair's 2DTV caricature being ubiquitous at the time though.



Then again those cartoons generally looked like a SI rip off

Sebastian Cobb

Quote from: daf on January 13, 2019, 12:03:46 PM
You might know this Buzby, but any idea why the Lionel Richie video looked such garbage?

Like it had some sort of 'echo' filter added on (possible NTSC-PAL botched conversion?) - real eyeball grot!

There's been a few really ropey video conversions around on there of late. The Debbie Harry one looked like they'd pointed a camera at an untuned telly.

Chriddof

Quote from: buzby on January 12, 2019, 07:47:43 PM
It's Jim Blashfield, who also did Nu Shooz' I Can't Wait, Jacko's Leave Me Alone and the US version of Gabriel & Bush's Dont Give Up. It's that odd mix of low-frame rate animation that's been digitised and comped together in a Quantel Harry.

And in the Talking Heads one (which is all film), the way everything's been photographed or maybe post-processed makes it all look quite horrid as well. I get the same feeling from the "And She Was" video that I do when looking at 1950s photos of food, where everything looks simultaneously lurid and faded somehow (not to mention inedible). Also the Boy In The Bubble's video suffers from some boringly literal imagery (and I personally find something weirdly pompous about the visual device of all those objects continually floating / revolving everywhere - I don't know why).

Re: Spitting Image - it ended in February 1996, roughly 15 months before the '97 election. That Blair puppet is bollocks, though they did capture the generally deranged look of Cherie Blair quite well.

buzby

Quote from: daf on January 13, 2019, 12:03:46 PM
You might know this Buzby, but any idea why the Lionel Richie video looked such garbage?

Like it had some sort of 'echo' filter added on (possible NTSC-PAL botched conversion?) - real eyeball grot!
I've just watched it back on the iPlayer stream (you do realise you made me sit through Ballerina Girl again, don't you?) and it looks slightly better than the most of the versions online. I don't know if it looked any worse on TX on Friday, but it was shot on film (spot the pinhole blowthrough in the negative in the lower left about 1:19) by Bob Giraldi who did most of Ritchie's 80s videos, and he used a diffusion filter or masses of vaseline on the lens for a soft focus effect by the looks of it, and the overlaying and long image fade optical effects have further softened the image. The record company will have produced PAL transfers from the film master to distribute to the media in the UK, so it's unlikely that there will be any NTSC conversion artefacts.

Unfortunately, really soft focus images like in that video is nearly as bad as fast motion when it comes to digital video compression. The JPEG algorithm used to compress the I frames and compute the motion vectors for the P and B frames works primarily in the colour space, and when the input frames are very soft and lacking distinct transitions between the colours it can end up looking pretty ropey. I think you need to ask the cinematographer Daniel Pearl why they went with such a soft, subdued look (check his credits - he's photographed more music videos than I've had hot dinners).

In a related note, the ballet teacher was played by Michael DeLorenzo, who played one of the minor characters in Fame, appeared as a dancer in Jacko's Beat It (also directed by Bob Giraldi) and Thriller videos, and also played the unfortunate Private Willy Santiago in A Few Good Men.

Sebastian Cobb

The iPlayer SD profile is a bit lacking innit. I wouldn't expect them to go to the effort of upscaling it before streaming it out but they could give SD-only content a higher-bandwidth profile for HLS/DASH to progress to when there's not a HD stream to progress to.

daf

Quote from: buzby on January 13, 2019, 11:32:53 PM
(you do realise you made me sit through Ballerina Girl again, don't you?) and it looks slightly better than the most of the versions online.

Ha - sorry about that!

Looking at it again, it wasn't as bad as I remembered : The 'echoey trails' bit seems only to be on the ballerina at around 30 seconds in - and I think must be a deliberate effect bunged on at that point -  I thought it was a mistake due to all the soft focus.

daf

15 January 1987: Presenter: Mike Smith

(18) IGGY POP – Real Wild Child (Wild One)
Real Wild Mime (He's just mucking about now!)
(24) THE MISSION – Wasteland (video)
We are The Goths! . . . We are The Goths! . . . we are, we are . . . We are The Goths!
(6) ROBBIE NEVIL – C'est La Vie
Nice pair of Bongos (!)
(15) THE STYLE COUNCIL – It Didn't Matter
Eton's Rivals! Eton's Rivals!
- - - - - - - - - - - - (breakers) - - - - - - - - - - - -
(31) UB40 – Rat In Mi Kitchen
(30) SIOUXSIE & THE BANSHEES – This Wheel's On Fire
(29) DEAD OR ALIVE – Something In My House
(28) BANGLES – Walking Down Your Street
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -


https://www.flickr.com/photos/51106326@N00/sets/72157663877100676

(5) ELKIE BROOKS – No More The Fool
No More the Brucie Impressions at the end (good gurn! good gurn!)
(1) JACKIE WILSON – Reet Petite (video)
Manipulated by Giblets
(3) ALISON MOYET – Is This Love? (video / credits)
. . . No, it's the Cornwall Coliseum

- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
https://wetransfer.com/downloads/4afc99e366b455517fbba6f6881158c820190110233230/10e008

This must be where I stopped following pop for a few years because I recognize only a couple of those enough to hum them.

Norton Canes

#519
Something In My House is comfortably the best single from that edition.

buzby

Quote from: daf on January 10, 2019, 09:05:42 PM
1 January 1987: Presenter: Gary Davies

(8) ALISON MOYET – Is This Love?
Simmons SDS kit? Check. DX7? Check.
What's this? an Oberheim OB8? Very odd for this veritable antique from the golden age of analogue polysynths to turn up. I can only presume the rental house the Beeb used for props had no use for it by 1987 so they were getting it at a discounted rate.
Quote
(18) ELKIE BROOKS – No More The Fool (video)
i'm getting a strong vibe of trying to do a copy of Bonnie Tyler's Total Eclipse Of the Heart, but with Russ Ballard doing a poundshop version of Jim Steinman's overblown production.
Quote
(31) GARY MOORE – Over The Hills & Far Away
I can't stand bloody Celtic Rock. The ludicrously-barneted walloper on keyboards has an Ensoniq Mirage DSK-1 8-bit sample workstation (the cost-reduced version of the original Mirage DSK-8), so beloved of Jam & Lewis.

Quote from: daf on January 11, 2019, 09:25:30 PM
8 January 1987: Presenter: Gary Davies

(38) SWING OUT SISTER – Surrender
Still not got that coat mended
Corinne's now -famous Joe Casely-Hayford designer jacket/mum's stripey T-shirt combo returns, as do the Simmons SDS kit, PPG Wave 2.3 and MiniMoog. Always liked this song, though it's a bit more 'smooth jazz' than Breakout! Corinne looks absolutely stunning in a posh frock in the video.

buzby

Quote from: daf on January 15, 2019, 12:07:31 PM
15 January 1987: Presenter: Mike Smith
Ooh, he's just so wacky!. Fuck off, Mike.
Quote
(18) IGGY POP – Real Wild Child (Wild One)
Real Wild Mime (He's just mucking about now!)
As is the buzzcut-haired Heino lookalike on the Hammond.
Quote
(24) THE MISSION – Wasteland (video)
We are The Goths! . . . We are The Goths! . . . we are, we are . . . We are The Goths!
I dunno, they are not quite 'full Goth' here. Soundwise it bit of a mix of early Sisters Of Mercy (unsurprisingly) and U2 (Hussey even looks like Joshua Tree-era Bono in the video). It's all a bit humdrum, really.
Quote
(6) ROBBIE NEVIL – C'est La Vie
A relatively rare sighting of a Prophet 5 above the regulation DX7, with another try-hard keyboard player. We also continue the current vogue for sax solos, this time from ex-Deaf School and Club Tropicana sax man Ian Ritchie

Nevil was a songwriter who got his chance to be a frontman, with this being his debut single from his eponymous debut album released the year before. It was co-written with his sometime writing partners Duncan Pain and Mark Holding, and produced by Duran Duran/Thompson Twins/Grace Jones veteran Alex Sadkin. It features Carol 'Temptation' Kenyon and S/A/W regular Miriam Stockley on backing vocals (neither of whom are playing the bongos).

Nevil wasn't quite a one-hit wonder (and had a bit more success in the US), but this did turn out to be his biggest hit. He did carry on writing for other artists (like Jefferson Starship, El DeBarge and Alison Moyet) during his solo career, and by the time his solo career was done after his third album in 1991 he went back behind the scenes, writing songs for the likes of Taylor Dane, Jessica Simpson, En Vogue, Eternal/Louise Nurding and Nickelodeon and Disney shows like Hannah Montana and High School Musical.
Quote
(15) THE STYLE COUNCIL – It Didn't Matter
Weller & co. having a go at Jam & Lewis-style electro-funk, slathered in DX7 presets. There are hints of Odyssey's 'Inside Out' throughout, particularly in the 3-note descending synth riff at the end of each line in the chorus.
Quote
- - - - - - - - - - - - (breakers) - - - - - - - - - - - -
(31) UB40 – Rat In Mi Kitchen
Written by Astro about Ali's problems with rodents in his new house. The video was filmed during their 1986 tour of the Soviet Union, the first band from the West to tour there
Quote
(30) SIOUXSIE & THE BANSHEES – This Wheel's On Fire
Swoon! Siouxsie in peak eyeshadow phase. The lead single from their Through The Looking Glass covers album. The video production is basically a complete rehash of the video for Spellbounnd (minus John McGeoch, sadly)
Quote
(29) DEAD OR ALIVE – Something In My House
Their last foray into the Top 40. It's basically S/A/W reworking You Spin Me Round for the production - same Emulator orch hit sample and synth patches, same stuttering sampled vocals. I suspect they were more concerned with their newer artists like Mel & Kim and Rick Astley at this point, The artwork and video show Burns & co have jumped on the Goth bandwagon (despite the record being more Hi-NRG than Goth). The punningly awful-titled 'Mortevicar' 12" remix adds to the goth effect by sampling dialogue from horror films (hope you cleared them, Pete!) plus that bloody Emulator Shakuhachi flute library preset.
Quote
(5) ELKIE BROOKS – No More The Fool
The DX7 from earlier reappears, and this time it's brought it's mate. However, we do get to see that rental Oberheim OB8 again. There was a Fairlight used on this track, so i'm pretty much certain that kick drum at the start was the Roland CR78 kick drum sampled directly off Ultravox's Vienna.

famethrowa

Quote from: buzby on January 17, 2019, 11:55:47 PM
A relatively rare sighting of a Prophet 5 above the regulation DX7, with another try-hard keyboard player.

I caught the video for Real Life's "Send Me An Angel" last night, featuring the main riff played on a Prophet 5. But lead singer and songwriter David Sterry personally told me it was all done on a Jupiter 8! Shameful.

Quote from: buzby on January 17, 2019, 11:48:46 PM

Corinne's now -famous Joe Casely-Hayford designer jacket/mum's stripey T-shirt combo returns, as do the Simmons SDS kit, PPG Wave 2.3 and MiniMoog.

The Minimoog would not have been very "cool" at that point, lost in the plastic polysynth mire.... but poised for a return in the 90s once everyone realised it was still the best.

buzby

Quote from: famethrowa on January 18, 2019, 12:11:48 AM
The Minimoog would not have been very "cool" at that point, lost in the plastic polysynth mire.... but poised for a return in the 90s once everyone realised it was still the best.
Unlike most of the keyboards on these editions, Swing Out Sister's Andy Connell brought his own - they aren't hired-in props. The Moog came from his background playing keyboards in soul and funk groups, which in his own words always had 'a Fender Rhodes with a Clavinet sat on top and Moog to the side, eternally going out of tune under the stage lighting'.

I'd argue the ARP Odyssey was always the best though ;)

daf

#524
22 January 1987: Presenters: Gary Davies & Steve Wright

(12) DEAD OR ALIVE – Something In My House
Something in My Trousers  (fun-sized black pudding?)
(13) UB40 – Rat In Mi Kitchen (video)
Red Red Square
(20) RANDY CRAWFORD – Almaz
. . . Her arms must be aching (!!!)
(15) CURIOSITY KILLED THE CAT – Down To Earth
Frank Spencer Lent the Hat
- - - - - - - - - - - - (breakers) - - - - - - - - - - - -
(24) TAFFY – I Love My Radio
(22) PEPSI & SHIRLIE – Heartache
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
(14) SIOUXSIE & THE BANSHEES – This Wheel's On Fire
Absoluxsie Fabulouxsie
(1) STEVE 'SILK' HURLEY – Jack Your Body (video)
Silent but Deadly



(7) SWING OUT SISTER – Surrender (video / credits)
Trumpet Spook

Neomod

Quote from: daf on January 18, 2019, 10:03:36 PM
(15) CURIOSITY KILLED THE CAT – Down To Earth
Frank Spencer Lent the Hat

Sans hat..



Why is someone else holding Mike Read's questions for him!


non capisco

Quote from: daf on January 18, 2019, 10:03:36 PM
(24) TAFFY – I Love My Radio

My "DJ's" radio? Didn't that used to go "my midnight radio"?

steveh

Quote from: non capisco on January 20, 2019, 12:19:15 PM
My "DJ's" radio? Didn't that used to go "my midnight radio"?

Radio One didn't go 24 hours until 1991 so they probably didn't want to promote the idea of there being DJs on at midnight.

Uncle TechTip

Quote from: non capisco on January 20, 2019, 12:19:15 PM
My "DJ's" radio? Didn't that used to go "my midnight radio"?

It was remixed and reemerged a couple of years later, I too only recall that version.

buzby

Quote from: non capisco on January 20, 2019, 12:19:15 PM
My "DJ's" radio? Didn't that used to go "my midnight radio"?
It was originally released in 1985 in Italy and mainland Europe with the 'Midnight Radio' lyrics. It was picked up by Mute's nascent dance offshoot Rhythm King for a UK release (under their Transglobal sub-label) at the end of 1986 and a range of new remixes were commissioned - the 'UK Mix' (by Sam Smith & Stephen Bentinck-Budd at Good Earth studios), the 'House Mix' (by Vince Lawrence, co-writer of many early Chicago House records, including 'Love Don't Turn Around' and founder of Trax Records) and the 'American Mix' by New York DJ (and partner of Mark Kamins) Freddy Bastone along with the original mix by Massimo Carpani (as the 'European Mix').

After it started gaining popularity in the clubs, Rhythm King went back to the original producer Claudio Cecchetto and asked for a more radio-friendly version of the chorus for UK radio plugging, as we didn't have much in the way of 24-hour radio broadcasting at the time, He came back their the 'DJ's Radio' version of the UK Mix. However, Rhythm King released both the original and new versions of the 'UK Mix'
as 7" singles with the similar catalogue numbers (TYPE 1 for the original and E TYPE 1 for the 'DJ's Radio' version) in the same sleeves (which have the subtitle 'Midnight Radio' on the tracklisting on the back cover for both versions) with a sticker on the front saying 'Radio Version' to distinguish the version with the new chorus. The mixes on the 12" releases in the UK were only available with the original lyrics.

TL:DR you could buy both versions in the shops during it's chart run, but the 'DJ's Radio' version is the one that was usually played on the radio.

non capisco

^ I knew you'd know!

My mum must have bought the 'midnight radio' one then as I know that song mainly from her mixtapes she used to do for the parties my parents threw which she'd also play in the day.

Something else you might know, Buzby. I see that a rerelease of 'I.O.U' by Freeez is in the last couple of '87 chart rundowns. Were the vocals on that still as painfully weak and strained as the first time it featured on these repeats? It was another song my mum used to play a lot and I don't remember matey boy's vocals sounding as much like Alan Partridge attempting 'Close To You' in the wrong key. 

Bobby Treetops

Did anyone else notice another early house record gracing the low end of the charts

Raze - Jack The Groove*
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5P1qNZlrftc

It'll be interesting to see how many other house records chart in '87.

*Their classic 'Break For Love' got to number 28 in 1988.

Quote(15) CURIOSITY KILLED THE CAT – Down To Earth
I hate the lead singer from Curiosity Killed The Cat in much the same way I hate Jay Kay. I don't know if it's the hat or the annoying smug dance moves.

buzby

#533
Quote from: non capisco on January 20, 2019, 03:19:28 PM
My mum must have bought the 'midnight radio' one then as I know that song mainly from her mixtapes she used to do for the parties my parents threw which she'd also play in the day.
She may have bought one of the 12" releases, where you didn't get the option of the 'DJ's Radio' version.
Quote
Something else you might know, Buzby. I see that a rerelease of 'I.O.U' by Freeez is in the last couple of '87 chart rundowns. Were the vocals on that still as painfully weak and strained as the first time it featured on these repeats? It was another song my mum used to play a lot and I don't remember matey boy's vocals sounding as much like Alan Partridge attempting 'Close To You' in the wrong key.
It was the original track remixed in the then-contemporary 'throw a sampler at it and hope for the best' style in 1986. Freeez vocalist and main member John Rocca had started releasing records under his own name in 1984 and had some success in the US dance charts, so for this 1986 release (originally in the US on Arthur Baker's Criminal Records label) Baker credited it to 'Freeez featuring John Rocca'. It was then picked up for a UK release by Beggar's Banquet dance offshoot Citybeat Records (Beggar's Banquet having released the original 83 version in the UK), and edits of the two vocal remixes were produced for a 7" release..

The new mixes were the Ultimate Club Mix (both in vocal and dub versions) and the Ultimate Shakedown GoGo mix, produced by Baker's associates the Latin Rascals and DJ Raul Solo. John Rocca also gets a credit for editing (there are acetates of the mixes credited with just his name rather than Freeez, so he may have had some hands-on involvement with the remix).

It sounds like Baker trying desperately to compete with this new-fangled 'House' sound coming out of Chigago, but it feels like it was released a year too late. Baker did a similar 'contemporary remix' thing with New Order's Confusion in 1990. Being the writer, producer and owner of the recording (or co-writer, co-producer and co-owner in Confusion's case) allowed him the right to produce or commission remixes whenever he felt like.

buzby

Quote from: daf on January 18, 2019, 10:03:36 PM
22 January 1987: Presenters: Gary Davies & Steve Wright

(12) DEAD OR ALIVE – Something In My House
It's that DX7 and Oberheim OB-8 again. I wish we could read that sticker on the end of the DX7 with the hire company's name on it. Pete looking more goth than The Mission, along with the largely decorative Flying V guitar. Note the lad in the big white jumper and stupid cap on the podium behind the drummer doing the 'You Spin Me Round' dance.
Quote
(20) RANDY CRAWFORD – Almaz
Singing live (not sure about the piano player - maybe she wasn't happy standing up there on her own). Possibly could have done with a bigger pop shield on the mic though.
Quote
(15) CURIOSITY KILLED THE CAT – Down To Earth
FUCK OFF YOU SMUG HATTED CUNT
Quote
(24) TAFFY – I Love My Radio
I covered the different versions earlier. I did notice though that Gina G's Ooh Aah Just A Little Bit basically nicked it's main synth riff from this. The video appears to have been filmed at a drag racing & custom car meet at the Monza GP circuit, intercut with some old NHRA drag racing footage from the US.
Quote
(22) PEPSI & SHIRLIE – Heartache
Is it just me or does this sound like a lost Madonna track?
Quote
(14) SIOUXSIE & THE BANSHEES – This Wheel's On Fire
Blimey - Siouxsie always looks beautiful and terrifying at the same time. She could snap you like a twig with just a look.I like this cover version - it's been remade in the Banshees' distinctive style, rather than a slavish recreation of the original
Quote
(1) STEVE 'SILK' HURLEY – Jack Your Body (video)
Michael Hurll's nightmare begins - the anonymous house act. I mentioned earlier on in the thread that Jack Your Body had been making waves in the UK clubs for a few months by this time, and had obviusly been an influence on Mel & Kim's Showing Out.

This was actually Hurley's second UK single, the first being his cover of I Can't Turn Around (as J. M. Silk with vocalist Keith Nunnally) which had got to No. 1 in the Billboard Dance charts in November 1986, but never entered the Top 40 over here as his ex-roommate Farley Jackmaster Funk had got his copy of it released here first, and had the added bonus of the larger -than-life Daryl Pandy to promote it.

Jack Your Body would be released by RCA (who had signed J. M. Silk from D.J. International, Chicago's main competitor to Trax)) in some European territories and Australia as 'J. M. Silk Featuring Steve 'Silk' Hurley', and it was also included as a bonus track on the only J. M. Silk album. In the UK is was released under his own name, by London Records (Pete Tong, A&R for London's FFRR dance sublabel, had signed a distribution deal for DJ International's output). It was also the first UK Number 1 where the 12" version outsold the 7" (despite the 12 running time exceeding the maximum 26 minutes to qualify for chart eligibility - it was only pointed out to the BPI/Gallup after it had got to No. 1).


Johnboy

This was a relatively good episode, I don't remember that Dead or Alive track at all - pretty decent

Curiosity singer seems lacking in confidence 32 years later

It's the camerawork though that was really annoying me then and now - shots from below that just didn't work and quick cuts and too far away views, just do it like you did in 1980!!

Taffy's - I Love My Radio and also Cookie Crew's - Rok Da House were suggested to Rhythm King as possible releases by DJ Mark Moore when he used to pop into their offices to grab 12" promos for club play. They were so happy with the success of both tracks that they offered him an A&R position there. He didn't accept that, but managed to wangle some studio time out of them. They suggested he work with studio engineer Pascal Gabriel - this session resulted in Theme From S'Express which went to #1 and was Rhythm King's biggest hit.

#537
Quote from: Bobby Treetops on January 20, 2019, 04:03:00 PM
Did anyone else notice another early house record gracing the low end of the charts

Raze - Jack The Groove*
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5P1qNZlrftc

It'll be interesting to see how many other house records chart in '87.

*Their classic 'Break For Love' got to number 28 in 1988.


Nitro Deluxe - This Brutal House #48
Fast Eddie- Can U Dance #67

Also Cookie Crew mentioned above was a top 10 hit

Also to tie in with Buzby's post above in 1987 Criminal Records remixed and re-released John Rocca's (Freez) I Want It To Be Real from 1984 with a gorgeous piano led remix from Farley Jackmaster Funk which is a certified house classic. This was released by Beggers Banquet Citybeat house imprint in 1987 and reached #97.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=Hzd5u1Z9NW4

Sebastian Cobb

Love brutal house. Would quite like to know where the 'brutal with the melody/millimetre' sample comes from though.

Quote from: Sebastian Cobb on January 22, 2019, 03:43:13 PM
Love brutal house. Would quite like to know where the 'brutal with the melody/millimetre' sample comes from though.

Yeah me too, chances are it was there own vocal sample in those days.

The remix - Let's Get Brutal  was where the classic Inner City - Good Life stab came from, check this out

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=2r1h2XmWXBI