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Louis CK returns to comedy after wankbeast shenanigans [split topic]

Started by up_the_hampipe, August 28, 2018, 08:41:20 AM

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rasta-spouse

I, for one, would like Ansari to open up more about his fuckstyle in his stand-up. The whole thing is quite interesting. My lasting memory (might be a false one) of how he performs is that he really stretches out the last word of his punchline. So something like:


"My cousin Sammy just came out of Cinnabun and said to me 'Whaaaasup Aziz?" - and I said 'Dude, I wouldn't be in this shit if Stephen Colbert's trumpet player had some game maaaaaaaaaan!'"



NoSleep

Quote from: Brundle-Fly on January 05, 2019, 12:06:33 AM
It's very well acted but so drawn out and boring; irrespective of its virtues and subsequent besmirchment. Fine to watch on stage, but on TV?

It was never shown on TV was it? You had to grab it from his website as each episode became available. Just an online experiment.

Twed

Quote from: grassbath on January 04, 2019, 11:39:04 PM
This floored me when I first saw it, but it feels pretty besmirched now. Not by the wanking stuff - I could just about put that out of my mind to applaud the guy who wrote and performed that scene.

But I'm really disgusted by the sheer hypocrisy and cognitive dissonance involved in writing and performing that scene, and then clawing back depressing Cheap Laffs from an audience who *he knows* don't know any better. With that scene in mind, he's willingly stooping to their level, willingly pandering to cunts that *he knows* are actively making the world a worse place for others. That's the shittest part.
I think it's a good example of the sociopathic, calculated wokeness present in Hollywood and politics. Many public figures know the right things to say to improve their brand, but there's absolutely nothing behind it. There's a sex pest behind many supposed feminist allies, a boot crushing entire demographics of women behind glass-ceiling-breaking power politicians, etc.

I just don't trust people's words anymore. Just saying the right things is easy, and shouldn't be rewarded.

wub1234

Quote from: BeardFaceMan on January 20, 2019, 04:04:01 PMThats not really got much to do with it. If its such a private matter why did he make a public statement in the first place? Probably because he needed to get the public on his side so he could carry on making a living off them. Now its becoming clear he can carry on making a living so he has no need to pretend to apologise in public.
Well, I don't know if people have really considered the act, but the abuse of power / inappropriateness of it isn't the notable thing for me.

Think about the reality of asking to wank in front of someone, and not requiring them to do anything. Now I don't know about you, but while I achieve some transcendence when sexually aroused (not that the prospect of doing that would be arousing for me) if I was to have a wank in front of a woman, and neither wish to interact with her, or for her to interact with me, I would feel a little bit self-conscious.

It doesn't make any sense on any level for a normally adjusted person. It's simply aberrant behaviour. If he'd abused his position to have sex with someone, one could understand this, regardless of the moral implications. This would be potentially morally dubious, but I wouldn't characterise it as aberrant behaviour; we can all understand the motive here.

If you can wank in front of someone, require nothing from them at all, find this arousing, and even repeat the act with several women, then you have serious psychological problems, particularly relating to a lack of basic understanding of social mores and empathy. I would just intrinsically understand that wanking in front of someone would make them uncomfortable, and consequently it would make me uncomfortable.

If he couldn't understand this then I doubt that he's capable of normally adjusted empathy, hence the fact that he doesn't feel the need to apologise. In fact, the key issue would be...why did he want to do this in the first place? The only possible motive that I can conceive is that he likes having power over people, and / or putting them in an uncomfortable situation. What other possible explanation could there be?

Schnapple

Quote from: wub1234 on February 14, 2019, 07:52:21 PM
If you can wank in front of someone, require nothing from them at all, find this arousing, and even repeat the act with several women, then you have serious psychological problems, particularly relating to a lack of basic understanding of social mores and empathy. I would just intrinsically understand that wanking in front of someone would make them uncomfortable, and consequently it would make me uncomfortable.

If he couldn't understand this then I doubt that he's capable of normally adjusted empathy, hence the fact that he doesn't feel the need to apologise. In fact, the key issue would be...why did he want to do this in the first place? The only possible motive that I can conceive is that he likes having power over people, and / or putting them in an uncomfortable situation. What other possible explanation could there be?

I think what Louis did was bad, and I wonder if he misunderstands or worse, doesn't care as to why it was bad. But I also think that it's a bit rough to suggest that having power over someone to achieve arousal renders them morally abhorrent, or incapable of empathy elsewhere in their life or work. Sarah Silverman watched him doing this and remains friends with him to the day. I'd also suggest that wanking his bloated, ginger-self off has more to do with self-disgust and power than simply the latter, but we'll never know. Either way, I feel what he did was wrong due to the lack of permission or the inappropriate situations he requested permission, not the act or dynamic itself.

wub1234

Quote from: Schnapple on February 14, 2019, 08:10:46 PM
I think what Louis did was bad, and I wonder if he misunderstands or worse, doesn't care as to why it was bad. But I also think that it's a bit rough to suggest that having power over someone to achieve arousal renders them morally abhorrent, or incapable of empathy elsewhere in their life or work. Sarah Silverman watched him doing this and remains friends with him to the day. I'd also suggest that wanking his bloated, ginger-self off has more to do with self-disgust and power than simply the latter, but we'll never know. Either way, I feel what he did was wrong due to the lack of permission or the inappropriate situations he requested permission, not the act or dynamic itself.
That's fine, good for her.

Maybe it's strong to suggest that he's not capable of empathy. But clearly he has a massive blind spot. I mean, it's just obvious to me that you cannot ask to do this. I cannot imagine how f*cked up you would have to be before you thought "yeah, I'll ask if I can wank in front of someone else, and they can sit there until I'm done".

I would just feel utterly weird in that scenario. I can't see how you can just explain that away. Oh, God, yeah, I mean, we've all asked someone out of the blue if we can wank in front of them before, haven't we? Hey, I just happen to be famous.

Well, no. We haven't.

MortSahlFan

Dane Cook is not funny. He must be trolling for jokes so he can steal later. Oh, and a lot of ass-kissing where the wind blows for $$$ like a stockbroker and his mentality.

Bronzy

Quote from: wub1234 on February 14, 2019, 10:57:28 PM
That's fine, good for her.

Maybe it's strong to suggest that he's not capable of empathy. But clearly he has a massive blind spot. I mean, it's just obvious to me that you cannot ask to do this. I cannot imagine how f*cked up you would have to be before you thought "yeah, I'll ask if I can wank in front of someone else, and they can sit there until I'm done".

I would just feel utterly weird in that scenario. I can't see how you can just explain that away. Oh, God, yeah, I mean, we've all asked someone out of the blue if we can wank in front of them before, haven't we? Hey, I just happen to be famous.

Well, no. We haven't.

Perhaps not, but a lot of people do have sexual fetishes that would be considered strange, it's just that a lot keep it in their heads or they don't have the means to indulge in it.

The trouble with some fetishes (such as Louis CK's) is where the line is between it being a slightly unusual sexual behaviour to it being morally (and potentially legally) wrong. Louis almost certainly crossed that line despite asking for consent due to him not realising the power he held over these women due to his fame. Whether he meant it or not, they felt pressured.

In regards to him asking these women out of the blue, I reckon it's because earlier on, the Sarah Silverman incident (which was consensual and had a lack of a power differential) or one similar to it made him believe from that point on if he just asked, it would be okay.

Noodle Lizard

Voyeurism and exhibitionism aren't "aberrant", they're very common sexual fetishes, probably with some root in childhood or - maybe - just because that's what you're into.  Remember Chatroulette?  Or the amount of videos on Pornhub which are just self-made videos of guys/girls having a wank?

Your assertion that him coercing people into performing sex acts on him would be somehow less aberrant is totally bizarre, and a very simplistic reading.  Sexuality is a broad and complex spectrum, and provided it's consensual, there is nothing to judge - even if you personally find it repulsive.  The accusation is that he was inappropriate in how he went about it/power dynamics etc., not whether or not it's okay to like being watched.

BeardFaceMan

Quote from: wub1234 on February 14, 2019, 10:57:28 PM
Maybe it's strong to suggest that he's not capable of empathy. ...

I would just feel utterly weird in that scenario. I can't see how you can just explain that away.

What was that you were saying about lack of empathy?

Quote from: Noodle Lizard on February 15, 2019, 01:23:07 AM
The accusation is that he was inappropriate in how he went about it/power dynamics etc., not whether or not it's okay to like being watched.

Still can't believe this has to be pointed out and people think this is solely about wanking.

up_the_hampipe

Quote from: Enrico Palazzo on February 14, 2019, 05:21:12 PM
Dane Cook seizes his moment - https://www.vulture.com/2019/02/dane-cook-louis-ck-stand-up-comedy-jokes.html

The article that comes from is here https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/features/bring-haters-dane-cook-plots-a-comedy-comeback-1185532

The article and Cook himself say that Louis accused him of stealing jokes. As far as I recall, that's not the case. Other people compared the jokes from the two albums and suddenly Cook was a "thief", Louis stayed quiet on the whole thing publicly, probably because he didn't know whether it was theft or just parallel thinking. It wasn't until the Louie episode with Cook that he openly talked about it, albeit through a script.

fatguyranting

The 'Better Things' episode co-written by Louis CK that aired on BBC2 last night had a scene where a guy tries to get his dick out whilst getting a lift from the Pamela Adlon character. Art imitating life there.

Enrico Palazzo

Quote from: up_the_hampipe on February 15, 2019, 10:12:34 AM
The article that comes from is here https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/features/bring-haters-dane-cook-plots-a-comedy-comeback-1185532

The article and Cook himself say that Louis accused him of stealing jokes. As far as I recall, that's not the case. Other people compared the jokes from the two albums and suddenly Cook was a "thief", Louis stayed quiet on the whole thing publicly, probably because he didn't know whether it was theft or just parallel thinking. It wasn't until the Louie episode with Cook that he openly talked about it, albeit through a script.

Seem to recall CK heavily criticising him for joke thievery on a radio show long before he appeared on Louie.

up_the_hampipe

Quote from: Enrico Palazzo on February 15, 2019, 11:08:05 AM
Seem to recall CK heavily criticising him for joke thievery on a radio show long before he appeared on Louie.

Are you sure that was about Cook? You might be thinking of Denis Leary https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iHqw54sQZgE

He references Cook briefly in this clip, though not by name, and not actually accusing him of thievery.

Enrico Palazzo

Quote from: up_the_hampipe on February 15, 2019, 11:10:59 AM
Are you sure that was about Cook? You might be thinking of Denis Leary https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iHqw54sQZgE

He references Cook briefly in this clip, though not by name, and not actually accusing him of thievery.

I definitely remember him talking about it on a radio show and it was many years before the Denis Leary accusation. Unless it was a dream, because I can't find it on YouTube.

kngen

He definitely called him out on Opie and Antony after being egged on a fair bit, and rounded it off by saying 'Fuck Dane Cook. He's a cunt!'

Twed

I always found that specific Denis Leary accusation a bit tenuous. It felt more like Louis CK copying Bill Hicks by claiming to be copied by Leary. Isn't the entire accusation that Leary copied the idea of calling people assholes? Maybe don't even own up to it because that's a shit bit.

Does anybody remember the anti-drink-driving ad Leary did off the back of that? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jkz12OslGhU

I saw it when I was seven or whatever, staying up late on Friday nights because there was great stuff on C4 and it has really stuck with me.

up_the_hampipe

Quote from: Twed on February 15, 2019, 05:01:17 PM
I always found that specific Denis Leary accusation a bit tenuous. It felt more like Louis CK copying Bill Hicks by claiming to be copied by Leary. Isn't the entire accusation that Leary copied the idea of calling people assholes? Maybe don't even own up to it because that's a shit bit.

No, the bit is Louis calling himself an asshole, giving examples of why he's an asshole. The accusation is that Leary watched him do the bit, commented on it and then stole it.

Quote from: kngen on February 15, 2019, 04:52:29 PM
He definitely called him out on Opie and Antony after being egged on a fair bit, and rounded it off by saying 'Fuck Dane Cook. He's a cunt!'

Don't remember this at all. Upon Googling, apparently this occurred on the "Free Beer & Hot Wings" radio show when Louis called in. Fair enough, I guess he was lying when he said he'd never spoken about it until the Louie episode. Sensing a pattern of dishonesty with this chap.

Twed

Quote from: up_the_hampipe on February 15, 2019, 06:24:17 PM
No, the bit is Louis calling himself an asshole, giving examples of why he's an asshole. The accusation is that Leary watched him do the bit, commented on it and then stole it.
I thought it was broader than that. I specifically remember Louis complaining that Leary made lots of money on the song version of the skit, which is  dentifying the American national identity of assholery. If I did a routine about even vaguely that I wouldn't be upset even if it directly inspired somebody else, TBH. Different to Leary's word-for-word copying of Hicks.

Small Man Big Horse

Louis's coming over to the UK next week: https://www.chortle.co.uk/news/2019/05/14/43036/uk_dates_for_louis_ck - If it was London I'd go just to heckle, but it's in Leeds unfortunately.

up_the_hampipe

Quote from: Small Man Big Horse on May 14, 2019, 02:52:00 PM
Louis's coming over to the UK next week: https://www.chortle.co.uk/news/2019/05/14/43036/uk_dates_for_louis_ck - If it was London I'd go just to heckle, but it's in Leeds unfortunately.

You wouldn't actually go to his show to heckle, would you?

Flouncer

Somebody from here should definitely go and shout "WANKBEAST!" at him.

MortSahlFan


jobotic

Are you also hanging around a Dennis Leary forum telling them they're shit? Nice one.

Ornlu

Well, got my ticket. Couldn't really pass up this opportunity.

Small Man Big Horse

Quote from: up_the_hampipe on May 14, 2019, 03:03:52 PM
You wouldn't actually go to his show to heckle, would you?

Normally I'd never think of doing such a thing but I feel CK is a special case. That said I would judge the show on the material rather than the man himself and not just heckle him for no reason, but if it was as abhorrent as that found in the leaked December set I'd be tempted.

Quote from: Flouncer on May 14, 2019, 03:12:45 PM
Somebody from here should definitely go and shout "WANKBEAST!" at him.

Quote from: Ornlu on May 14, 2019, 03:45:08 PM
Well, got my ticket. Couldn't really pass up this opportunity.

And we have a volunteer! ;)

Quote from: MortSahlFan on May 14, 2019, 03:28:11 PM
Bill Hicks and Louis CK = great
Leary and Cook'd = shit

Given that you started this thread - https://www.cookdandbombd.co.uk/forums/index.php/topic,72569.msg3795826.html#msg3795826 - I'm not surprised by your statement at all, sadly.

up_the_hampipe

Quote from: Small Man Big Horse on May 14, 2019, 03:50:53 PM
Normally I'd never think of doing such a thing but I feel CK is a special case. That said I would judge the show on the material rather than the man himself and not just heckle him for no reason, but if it was as abhorrent as that found in the leaked December set I'd be tempted.

If he dropped in at a comedy club unannounced, you were strongly against ever seeing him perform again and hated what he had to say and his existence in general, I'd get why you would heckle. Seems like a bad idea to pay to see him specifically and heckle though.

Petey Pate

£32 is a bit of a steep a ticket price for a disgraced wankbeast. Plus I wouldn't pay that just to heckle someone.

Maybe the whole audience could coordinate a mass masturbation frenzy while he's on stage.

Sebastian Cobb

Presumably the place has a back or side loading entrance where you could bellow Wankbeast for free.