What do women want men to be like? (Help a brother out)

[Buelligan]

Hey Nero, tell me about your lovely motorbikes please. 

[Shoulders?-Stomach!]

I frequently encounter men doing the same to me, a man.

A lot of my interests are traditionally masculine, so I get guitar salesmen 'teaching' me how to play, or guiding me away to another style than the one I want to buy ("you don't want that one...") or even worse - just playing the guitar I am interested in as I stand and listen.

Have had that happen on several occasions. Perhaps that specific example is peculiarly pronounced when its salespeople.

My experience is that some people tend to dispense information they know, as you put it, AT people rather than genuinely interacting socially by listening and developing on comments or asking questions. This has happened a lot of times to me with people of all genders as I think that's peculiar to narcissism rather than to a specific gender.

If you throw in a sales/hobby dynamic that gets amplified. Men seem to be competitive with hobbies and knowledge more, so that may come across poorly when directed at women, if the woman feels like they're acting that way because she's a woman. I can't easily run out of examples where a guy's idea of socialising is trying to out-do everything I say. In my view it's most likely because they're like that to everyone.

[gilbertharding]

You didn't just mansplain mansplaining, did you?

Oh, brother.

[Cuellar]

You're doing it now!

Edit: Bah! Beaten by 5 seconds.

[pancreas]

Shoulders, give Nero and Buelligan some space to talk about Hogs. It would be *one* good thing to come out of this terrible thread.

[Shoulders?-Stomach!]

Are you trying to mansplain to me what mansplaining is? Because I will mansplain you so hard your feet won't touch the ground

[Buelligan]

Thanks for telling a woman how it is for her, Shoulders.  It's exactly what we needed in this shitty thread at this point.

I think you need to try being a woman, worst of all, try being a woman who knows one or two things, before you claim any sort of parity. 

The number of times I've said, could it be a bit of dirt in the carb? or Have you checked the HT leads? and so on, to be roundly ignored and then sat through the explanation of the amazing discovery that the problem was all about fuel interruption or spark.  FUCK OFF you sexist cunts, sort it out on your own next time and keep your thieving hands off my tools.

[Lemming]

Mandatory link to relevant Fast Show clip

[Captain Z]

Look guys, you've had your fun with the mainsplaining, there's going to be no more mainsplaining today.

[Shoulders?-Stomach!]

Buelligan, I wasn't. I was telling her what it's like for me, as her post contained behaviour I recognize as having been directed at me. Interesting, I thought as her post suggested only seeing this as being in a sexist context. I am empathising and confirming my experience that this behaviour exists. Possibly more subtly than the crude term mansplaining as it occurs between men and also directed toward men by women sometimes. That doesn't equate to stating sexism doesn't exist.

Was the reply alright, or was I mansplaining by being a man and explaining what I meant?

[Buelligan]

You're a victim too.  What relevance does that have in this thread, as a response to Nero's post?

[Sexton Brackets Drugbust]

Buelligan, I wasn't. I was telling her what it's like for me, as her post contained behaviour I recognize as having been directed at me. Interesting, I thought as her post suggested only seeing this as being in a sexist context. I am empathising and confirming my experience that this behaviour exists. Possibly more subtly than the crude term mansplaining as it occurs between men and also directed toward men by women sometimes. That doesn't equate to stating sexism doesn't exist.

Was the reply alright, or was I mansplaining by being a man and explaining what I meant?

Are you menquiring now?

[Shoulders?-Stomach!]

You're a victim too.  What relevance does that have in this thread, as a response at this to Nero's post?

I don't believe I am a victim nor was that the thrust of the post.

To summarise:

Me: #metoo , however I have noticed the behaviour you describe displayed by different people not just men, and it seems worse in a faux-matey context like a sales environment. Perhaps men are more competitive, though that is only from my learned experience

Perhaps if she wants to reply she will, without your aid. That's enough from me now.

[Buelligan]

I'm not speaking for Nero, I'm speaking for myself.  I think you need to reflect on why you seem unable to recognise that what you're doing is effectively undermining the experience not just of one poster but of many, many women. Attempting to imply that the treatment they receive is not unusual or sexist.  Why do you think The Fast Show made a character about it, as Lemming so helpfully pointed out?

[Cuellar]

You can't mansplain your way out of a manxplanation.

[Funcrusher]

I frequently encounter men doing the same to me, a man.

Have had that happen on several occasions. Perhaps that specific example is peculiarly pronounced when its salespeople.

My experience is that some people tend to dispense information they know, as you put it, AT people rather than genuinely interacting socially by listening and developing on comments or asking questions. This has happened a lot of times to me with people of all genders as I think that's peculiar to narcissism rather than to a specific gender.

If you throw in a sales/hobby dynamic that gets amplified. Men seem to be competitive with hobbies and knowledge more, so that may come across poorly when directed at women, if the woman feels like they're acting that way because she's a woman. I can't easily run out of examples where a guy's idea of socialising is trying to out-do everything I say. In my view it's most likely because they're like that to everyone.

My take would be that part of men's traditional gender role is to have to compete with other men in a dominance hierarchy that manifests in various ways. Women haven't traditionally had to deal with this and so it comes as an unpleasant surprise when they enter traditionally male circles

[bgmnts]

A man actually called the woman in work "love" today, when offering chocolate.

It didnt register enough to make me physically cringe but I did think "jesus do people still use that to address women?".

[Cuellar]

My take would be that part of men's traditional gender role is to have to compete with other men in a dominance hierarchy that manifests in various ways. Women haven't traditionally had to deal with this and so it comes as an unpleasant surprise when they enter traditionally male circles

Is there any truth to these sort of pop Social Darwinist explanations? They've always sounded like utter horse gravy to me.

"Men have to be overbearing wankers because of science"

[mrpupkin]

My nan used to call everyone love, but then again she was a rampant misogynist

[Wet Blanket]

My nan used to call everyone love, but then again she was a rampant misogynist

It's used more or less gender indiscriminately in my part of the world. A male friend of mine from down south was surprised to be addressed as 'love' by the giant tattooed bloke working the till in Morrisons just recently.

[Funcrusher]

Is there any truth to these sort of pop Social Darwinist explanations? They've always sounded like utter horse gravy to me.

"Men have to be overbearing wankers because of science"

Best to keep the conversation on men being cunts and/or wankers I guess.

[gilbertharding]

A man actually called the woman in work "love" today, when offering chocolate.

It didnt register enough to make me physically cringe but I did think "jesus do people still use that to address women?".

People (of whatever gender) calling other people 'love' 'flower' 'petal' are all just equivalent to men calling other men 'mate' 'son' 'pal'. Nothing to worry about.

That's right: Northsplaining...

[gilbertharding]

Is there any truth to these sort of pop Social Darwinist explanations? They've always sounded like utter horse gravy to me.

"Men have to be overbearing wankers because of science"

As long as it suits 'both sides' to believe there is a fundamental difference between us.

We're all human beings is what I say...

[Lemming]

I've experienced the one-upmanship thing, but it seems distinct from "mansplaining". The man-to-man version seems to be about men trying to impress upon you how much better or more skillful/knowledgeable they are on some topic, whereas with mansplaining they literally assume that the woman knows nothing.

My dad gives a great unintentional demonstration of this kind of shit. If he corners me into playing chess, he'll constantly talk at me through the whole thing, berate whatever I do and point out what I'm supposedly doing wrong (even if I'm winning).

Meanwhile, when he plays with my sister-in-law, who can reliably beat both me and him virtually single time and has been playing since she was a child, he's tediously explaining every fucking individual move to her in the tone of voice you'd use for a child, maybe even a child with severe brain damage. It's really nasty when you start noticing it, and just from my own experience watching it happen to my friends, I think it's much more frequently directed at women (by men) than it is at men.

[bgmnts]

Yes! Hagen!

[im barry bethel]

Buelligan, I wasn't. I was telling her what it's like for me,

Does she take sugar?

It's used more or less gender indiscriminately in my part of the world. A male friend of mine from down south was surprised to be addressed as 'love' by the giant tattooed bloke working the till in Morrisons just recently.

Whenever I've visited Stoke it's always duck, even from the giant tattooed bloke working the till

[pancreas]

I thought we were going to hear about motorbikes. Instead we're going to hear about TOTAL FUCKING BULLSHIT FOR THE MILLIONTH TIME. You're letting The Boston Crab win. This is what he wanted. You utter retards.

[Buelligan]

Is he really winning though, as he cries and wanks, dreams of hitting fish with stones and being the one ring to rule them all?  I somehow doubt it.

[bgmnts]

Actually for any motorbike enthusiasts here, is it worth getting a moped or similar vehicle?

[Lemming]

Yes! Hagen!

Exactly. I loved the John Linnell gif, but my posts were NOTHING without Nina freaking out next to them.

Is there any truth to these sort of pop Social Darwinist explanations? They've always sounded like utter horse gravy to me.

"Men have to be overbearing wankers because of science"

I read Funcrusher's post as suggesting that men are only hyper-competitive wankers because of societal conditioning, the opposite of innate. I'm probably reading it all arse-backwards though.