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Doctor Who - Series 11 (Part 2)

Started by Mister Six, November 02, 2018, 01:50:06 PM

Previous topic - Next topic

The Roofdog

Quote from: Alberon on January 04, 2019, 08:23:17 PM
Yeah, this is clearly a funding decision above showrunner level.

As biggy isn't here anymore I guess it'll have to be me... How can cutting a consistent revenue generator be a funding decision? It's clearly a showrunner decision. Moffat because he wanted to do Sherlock and then leave but couldn't find a replacement, Chibnall because he is shit and has no ideas.

It costs the BBC money not to make Doctor Who.

Alberon

Because IIRC commercial profit from BBC shows is not allowed to figure into commisioning of programmes from the main non-commercial BBC. The two have to be kept separate.

Replies From View

Quote from: Alberon on January 05, 2019, 10:10:10 AM
Because IIRC commercial profit from BBC shows is not allowed to figure into commisioning of programmes from the main non-commercial BBC. The two have to be kept separate.

Yes, and I think this was explained while biggy was still here.

Doctor Who was also making more money than it was costing in the 1980s, when it was axed.


Amazing to think the one-off six-month slide between Colin Baker's first and second series caused so much consternation at the time, and now it's just routine.

Thomas

Relevance aside (and it is slightly relevant, as a spoiler below reveals), I've just finished reading Moffat's Target novelisation of 'The Day of the Doctor'.

Wow. If you're familiar with and/or like the episode, do give it a read. It's a very witty and inventively structured retelling, with many extras (love the Cushing inclusion). Far from typing up a simple cash-in, Moffat uses the opportunities afforded by prose to demonstrate his complex interpretation of the Doctor's character(s) - an interpretation I enjoy - and to explore a multi-dimensional story from some fascinating perspectives. Totally incomprehensible if you're not familiar with the episode, of course.

He also manages - spoiler territory - to include narration by the Twelfth Doctor, the Curator, and even the Thirteenth Doctor, and playfully addresses several details left patchy in the TV series. At one point he jokily suggests that, following the Tenth Doctor's melodramatic 'farewell' tour, he revisited all of his companions to apologise for making such a big deal out of it. The whole thing plays with the very format of a novelisation. I urge you to pick it up if you're interested in the twin worlds of Doctor Who and writing.

Phil_A

Do you reckon Akinola's been instructed to "Murray Gold up" his music? Because that's definitely what it sounds like to me. None of his earlier work on the show has had that particularly strident quality that it did here, that one theme that kept threatening to turn into "Kashmir" by Led Zep sounded more Gold than Gold.

Thomas

#2195
Those drums didn't sound particularly Murray Golden to me. Perhaps he was asked to compose a particularly strident theme for the Dalek episode, or just felt that drum-driven rock instrumental was the way to go. Murray Gold would be more grand and sweepingly orchestral, I think.

EDIT: Listening back, it is actually far more orchestral than I'd remembered. Quite Zimmery (and Hans has Doctor Who previous).

Replies From View

Quote from: Thomas on January 05, 2019, 11:55:17 AM
Those drums didn't sound particularly Murray Golden to me. Perhaps he was asked to compose a particularly strident theme for the Dalek episode, or just felt that drum-driven rock instrumental was the way to go. Murray Gold would be more grand and sweepingly orchestral, I think.

Sweepingly orchestral would be an option with a higher budget (Murray Gold didn't have an orchestra for series 1; you hardly notice that once you are swept away by it all, but I think you do notice the opportunities opening up in series 2), but I'm not sure that would be Akinola's style anyway.

I'd prefer for him to go his own way.  If the BBC higher-ups are getting involved I'd hope the music wouldn't be their first port of call.

Quote from: Thomas on January 05, 2019, 11:36:48 AM
Relevance aside (and it is slightly relevant, as a spoiler below reveals), I've just finished reading Moffat's Target novelisation of 'The Day of the Doctor'.

Wow. If you're familiar with and/or like the episode, do give it a read. It's a very witty and inventively structured retelling, with many extras (love the Cushing inclusion). Far from typing up a simple cash-in, Moffat uses the opportunities afforded by prose to demonstrate his complex interpretation of the Doctor's character(s) - an interpretation I enjoy - and to explore a multi-dimensional story from some fascinating perspectives. Totally incomprehensible if you're not familiar with the episode, of course.

He also manages - spoiler territory - to include narration by the Twelfth Doctor, the Curator, and even the Thirteenth Doctor, and playfully addresses several details left patchy in the TV series. At one point he jokily suggests that, following the Tenth Doctor's melodramatic 'farewell' tour, he revisited all of his companions to apologise for making such a big deal out of it. The whole thing plays with the very format of a novelisation. I urge you to pick it up if you're interested in the twin worlds of Doctor Who and writing.

My favourite one liner is, early on, there's a note that the first and second Drs were colorblind.

Norton Canes

Belated thanks for the recommendation Thomas, been meaning to get this for ages and with your prompting finally picked it up over the weekend. A few chapters in now; it's simultaneously a bumper compendium of all Moffat's tropes but also constantly surprising and delightful. Chapter nine is incredible.

Thomas

Quote from: A Hat Like That on January 07, 2019, 08:46:38 AM
My favourite one liner is, early on, there's a note that the first and second Drs were colorblind.

I enjoyed all of those playful asides that would be a little too fan-servicey in the TV series, but which fit perfectly into the novelisation (which is, after all, quite a fan-servicey venture in itself). Also the deeper exploration of just what happened when Gallifrey was 'translated' into its pocket universe, with the increased cooperation of the many Doctors.

Quote from: Norton Canes on January 07, 2019, 09:49:50 AM
Belated thanks for the recommendation Thomas, been meaning to get this for ages and with your prompting finally picked it up over the weekend. A few chapters in now; it's simultaneously a bumper compendium of all Moffat's tropes but also constantly surprising and delightful. Chapter nine is incredible.

I'm glad you're enjoying it, Norton - I seem to remember being rather shocked by chapter 9, too, but the details are fuzzy now..

bobloblaw

Quote from: Ballad of Ballard Berkley on December 09, 2018, 11:05:20 PM
10.  The Tsuranga Conundrum
9. The Battle of Oo Givza Flyen Fugg
8. Kerblam!
7. The Ghost Monument
6. Arachnids in the UK
5. It Takes You Away
4. Demons of the Punjab
3. The Woman Who Fell to Earth
2. Rosa
1. The Witchfinders

almost exactly this. Just pop Kerblam at no. 6 and you're sorted.
Resolution tops the lot though. Mainly by featuring realistic secondary characters and even a few extras.

Norton Canes

Can't remember if I mentioned already, but I'd stick Resolution at my no.3, behind The Witchfinders and It Takes You Away.

Replies From View

Has anyone who loved the Frog episode rewatched it yet to see whether they agree with what they previously thought?

Mister Six

1. It Takes You Away
2. The Witchfinders
3. The Woman Who Fell to Earth
4. Resolution
5. Demons of the Punjab
6. Rosa
7. The Ghost Monument
8. The Tsuranga Conundrum
9. Kerblam!
10. The Battle of Bob Loblaw
11. Arachnids in the UK

Alberon

Quote from: Replies From View on January 08, 2019, 05:00:33 PM
Has anyone who loved the Frog episode rewatched it yet to see whether they agree with what they previously thought?

Yeah, not the entire episode at normal speed, but I've watched it again and largely my thoughts stay the same.

Replies From View

Quote from: Alberon on January 08, 2019, 05:27:46 PM
Yeah, not the entire episode at normal speed, but I've watched it again and largely my thoughts stay the same.

So you could say your estimation of the episode has gone down as you had to fast-forward through it.

Norton Canes

I'm guessing it was to detail the Graham/Yaz interactions..?

Alberon

Well yes, I was mostly fast forwarding as I doing that whole insane Yaz/Graham thing, but I slowed down to normal speed to watch some of the later parts of the episode again. I still like the way it doesn't feel the need to spoon feed the dialogue like in Chibnall's efforts trusting itself to get some messages across with just a look. And I still like the frog thing at the end even if Whittaker going over the top is a little forced.

It's still very good. A classic? No, but it's miles ahead of the rest of the series.

As to the rest.

1/ It takes you away
2/ The Witchfinders

The worthy but faintly dull duology
3-4/ Rosa and Demons of the Punjab

Chibnall putting the effort in to reach his best
5-6/The Woman who fell to Earth and Resolution

Confused message at best
7/ Kerblam!

Chibnall's standard 'some stuff happens and then the episode stops'
8-11

Norton Canes

Unsurprisingly, I'm not hugely tempted to re-watch any of this series. The only ones I'm remotely interested in seeing again actually aren't the ones I considered 'best' (Dalek, Witches, Frog) but the two historical ones, Rosa and Demons Of The Punjab. I just think that as they were a bit more weighty and potentially worthy, I might be a bit more inclined to positively re-evaluate them.

Replies From View

I didn't cancel my preorder of the DVD, and will be receiving it in the post some point next week.  I'm mostly only interested in the commentaries.

Alberon

I'll pick up the blu-ray eventually. But no rush. Maybe ask for it for Christmas.

lipsink

Quote from: Replies From View on January 08, 2019, 05:40:15 PM
I didn't cancel my preorder of the DVD, and will be receiving it in the post some point next week.  I'm mostly only interested in the commentaries.

Is Chibnall doing a commentary? I'd be interested to hear him try to explain himself.

daf

Quote from: lipsink on January 09, 2019, 02:48:38 PM
I'd be interested to hear him try to explain himself.

With Pip Baker heckling off-mic

Norton Canes

"It doesn't seem to have much to it. It hasn't improved that much since it went off the air. It could have been a lot better; it could have been slightly better written, especially the last story. It was also very clichéd, it was very routine running up and down corridors and silly monsters"

said Mr Baker

mothman

So what were the consolidated ratings for the NYD ep?

Ballad of Ballard Berkley

Quote from: mothman on January 09, 2019, 10:01:40 PM
So what were the consolidated ratings for the NYD ep?

They haven't been announced yet.

Small Man Big Horse

According to someone on DigitalSpy "The NYD episode of Doctor Who, excluding devices has consolidated to 6.96m" which is fairly disappointing.

lipsink

Quote from: daf on January 09, 2019, 03:10:20 PM
With Pip Baker heckling off-mic

I can't see Chibnall being arsed doing a commentary. He doesn't really seem that arsed having the job of a lifetime.

Deanjam

Re NYD ratings. Lizo speaketh thus:


BlodwynPig

Quote from: lipsink on January 10, 2019, 01:58:48 PM
I can't see Chibnall being arsed doing a commentary. He doesn't really seem that arsed having the job of a lifetime.

Job of a lifetime? Ha!