Author Topic: Fucking state of Apple  (Read 4516 times)

a duncandisorderly

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Re: Fucking state of Apple
« Reply #60 on: November 24, 2018, 09:40:57 PM »
I'm not sure why what I said is cognitive dissonance...

Blumf

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Re: Fucking state of Apple
« Reply #61 on: November 24, 2018, 09:59:14 PM »
Re-read the quoted text, compare them. But, if you still don't understand then that just confirms the cognitive dissonance.

Also, just after I typed the previous post, looked over to my wife mumbling about her laptop, Win10, and the update system has broken on it again.

a duncandisorderly

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Re: Fucking state of Apple
« Reply #62 on: November 24, 2018, 10:07:03 PM »
Re-read the quoted text, compare them. But, if you still don't understand then that just confirms the cognitive dissonance.


I think I understand my own writing, cheers. what I meant what this: I don't boot any of the machines into linux, though I know I could, because I use them for actually doing things- audio, video, music, graphics- where building & using a linux box has always seemed to me to be the sort of thing a computer hobbyist would do just to be different. sure, I could probably persuade photoshop or reaper to run on linux, but why bother? & so onto the next bit you've quoted- what it means is that I don't just slavishly update to the latest version of macOS when it comes out because it tends to break stuff... I bought & paid for CS5, & that only works under later releases of macOS if you re-install an older version of java that the new OS has over-written. that's a for-instance. there are hardware compatibility issues from time to time, or else I'll discover that the new OS means I have to pay for parallels to be updated... hidden costs like that.

that's not the same thing as "dicking around with code".

mobias

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Re: Fucking state of Apple
« Reply #63 on: November 24, 2018, 10:07:24 PM »
There's been rumours going around for ages that Mac would dearly love to kill off the Mac Pro and Mac Mini lines but doing the former would be signalling total withdrawal (and admitting defeat) from the professional side of desktop computing, something they're not ready to do yet. I'm sure I read somewhere that they make a net loss on the Mac Pro line.

pigamus

  • Sex, death, mayonnaise.
Re: Fucking state of Apple
« Reply #64 on: November 24, 2018, 10:12:18 PM »
What are iPads like? Could you buy one and a bluetooth keyboard and use it like a proper computer?

Blumf

  • Not long now
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Re: Fucking state of Apple
« Reply #65 on: November 24, 2018, 10:13:03 PM »
I think I understand my own writing, cheers. what I meant what this: I don't boot any of the machines into linux, though I know I could, because I use them for actually doing things- audio, video, music, graphics- where building & using a linux box has always seemed to me to be the sort of thing a computer hobbyist would do just to be different.
...
that's not the same thing as "dicking around with code".

What do you mean "building & using a linux box"?

List of "dicking around with code" I had to do with the last clean install of Mint on my laptop (which, I didn't need to build):
 1: Enter Wifi password

Is that what you mean?

a duncandisorderly

  • the rough and tumble of the internet
Re: Fucking state of Apple
« Reply #66 on: November 24, 2018, 10:15:34 PM »
What do you mean "building & using a linux box"?

List of "dicking around with code" I had to do with the last clean install of Mint on my laptop (which, I didn't need to build):
 1: Enter Wifi password

Is that what you mean?

no. by building & using, I mean creating an environment in software & hardware in which I can actually do stuff (pshop, after-effects, reaper & so on).

let me put this another way- what do you use your mint box for?

Beagle 2

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Re: Fucking state of Apple
« Reply #67 on: November 24, 2018, 10:20:42 PM »
What are iPads like? Could you buy one and a bluetooth keyboard and use it like a proper computer?

Pretty much. Unfortunately you can't use a mouse (without jailbreaking) which is fucking ridiculous and limits their potential in that respect. They're great, though.

I've got a Chromebook which also runs Linux, an iPad, two Android tablets, an android games console, an iMac, a Windows laptop and a bunch of other shite. I genuinely felt I needed all of those things at the time for specific reasons, and I kind of did. Daft though, innit.

Blumf

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Re: Fucking state of Apple
« Reply #68 on: November 24, 2018, 10:21:57 PM »
let me put this another way- what do you use your mint box for?

Which one?

Development on some, but I also (have to) use Windows for that too, and it's exactly the same experience (well, a little harder on Windows)

pigamus

  • Sex, death, mayonnaise.
Re: Fucking state of Apple
« Reply #69 on: November 24, 2018, 10:29:23 PM »
Pretty much. Unfortunately you can't use a mouse (without jailbreaking) which is fucking ridiculous and limits their potential in that respect. They're great, though.

I've got a Chromebook which also runs Linux, an iPad, two Android tablets, an android games console, an iMac, a Windows laptop and a bunch of other shite. I genuinely felt I needed all of those things at the time for specific reasons, and I kind of did. Daft though, innit.

Oooh, I might be tempted have a go then, with Christmas coming up. Cheers for that.

I had a Chromebook and I really liked it. I liked the lack of bullshit - just sign into Chrome, off you go, no fucking about. The only problems were the lack of iTunes and the lack of Skype, but beyond that it was a lovely little fucker.

a duncandisorderly

  • the rough and tumble of the internet
Re: Fucking state of Apple
« Reply #70 on: November 24, 2018, 10:31:38 PM »
Which one?

Development on some, but I also (have to) use Windows for that too, and it's exactly the same experience (well, a little harder on Windows)

developing what? you seem to be saying you use windows & your mint box(es) both as environments to write more software.
that's not what I do. I'm using existing applications, shrink-wrapped stuff, for the most part, to make music, edit audio & video, that sort of thing. I'm not really interested in creating apps or writing little scripts, though that's not to say I haven't done it. I don't even game on them, except (guilty pleasure) the really old MBP will still run 'maelstrom'.

NoSleep

  • feat. Keith Jarrett and his singing parrot
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Re: Fucking state of Apple
« Reply #71 on: November 24, 2018, 10:44:53 PM »
I think I understand my own writing, cheers. what I meant what this: I don't boot any of the machines into linux, though I know I could, because I use them for actually doing things- audio, video, music, graphics- where building & using a linux box has always seemed to me to be the sort of thing a computer hobbyist would do just to be different. sure, I could probably persuade photoshop or reaper to run on linux, but why bother? & so onto the next bit you've quoted- what it means is that I don't just slavishly update to the latest version of macOS when it comes out because it tends to break stuff... I bought & paid for CS5, & that only works under later releases of macOS if you re-install an older version of java that the new OS has over-written. that's a for-instance. there are hardware compatibility issues from time to time, or else I'll discover that the new OS means I have to pay for parallels to be updated... hidden costs like that.

that's not the same thing as "dicking around with code".

Have you ever tried using Carbon Copy Cloner? Rather than reinstalling, just have a bootable back-up of your system at hand and not a fucking Time Machine one that doesn't also back up your chosen OS (whether Apple care to offer it you or not). Thankfully I'm currently on a machine that won't upgrade past El Capitan, so things are fairly stable (and backed-up on another bootable drive via Carbon Copy Cloner).
I would happily fuck Apple off but I'm stuck with my choices of peripheral hardware and their respective drivers (audio interface, UAD2 PCIe cards) and my long standing experience of using Logic Pro (which also lets me play around with custom microtonal tunings in way nothing else does so easily). I can't believe how fucked Apple has become in the last 10-12 years but I'm still glad not to have to deal with the bollocks that is Windows.

Re: Fucking state of Apple
« Reply #72 on: November 24, 2018, 10:48:38 PM »
There's been rumours going around for ages that Mac would dearly love to kill off the Mac Pro and Mac Mini lines but doing the former would be signalling total withdrawal (and admitting defeat) from the professional side of desktop computing, something they're not ready to do yet. I'm sure I read somewhere that they make a net loss on the Mac Pro line.

Their fucking about with that is really odd too. They left the Mac Pro dead for a crazy amount of time, and then came back with a genuinely remarkable design... and have then left it again for years.

They were the designer's choice but had some sort of falling out with Adobe. They were making a big deal of Final Cut Pro becoming a competitor for Avid, and then massively changed it and pissed off every professional user. I think Logic's the one pro thing that's not gone a bit wonky. I wonder what proportion of their pro audience is now iOS devs.

Blumf

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Re: Fucking state of Apple
« Reply #73 on: November 24, 2018, 10:53:00 PM »
developing what? you seem to be saying you use windows & your mint box(es) both as environments to write more software.
that's not what I do. I'm using existing applications, shrink-wrapped stuff, for the most part, to make music, edit audio & video, that sort of thing. I'm not really interested in creating apps or writing little scripts, though that's not to say I haven't done it. I don't even game on them, except (guilty pleasure) the really old MBP will still run 'maelstrom'.

Still lost in your cognitive dissonance I see. Clue: you are not restricted to developing software on Linux, it can do everything else too. No you don't have to use the command prompt (unless you want to)

Can't speak for music production much (except for a friend who lost her music setup to a Mac failure and got rid of the Mac based stuff) but I have heard about more people switching to Linux based music tools as Apple screws itself up. In the end it's just a matter of what you're used to.

NoSleep

  • feat. Keith Jarrett and his singing parrot
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Re: Fucking state of Apple
« Reply #74 on: November 24, 2018, 10:58:07 PM »
The fucking ashtray version of the Mac Pro (a kind Mini-Mac Pro, I suppose) meant that anyone who had invested in PCIe cards for their macs would now have to either buy an alternative from scratch (costing £000's) or buy some kind of clunky add-on that created latency. And the iMac Pro is a pisstake. And constantly trying to tear up standards like Firewire 400, Firewire 800, Thunderbolt, Thunderbolt 2, rendering external hardware obsolete for no particular reason. I'm happy for the time being buying old Macs off ebay for a few hundred quid and carry on working as I've done for years.

NoSleep

  • feat. Keith Jarrett and his singing parrot
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Re: Fucking state of Apple
« Reply #75 on: November 24, 2018, 11:01:13 PM »
Can't speak for music production much (except for a friend who lost her music setup to a Mac failure and got rid of the Mac based stuff) but I have heard about more people switching to Linux based music tools as Apple screws itself up. In the end it's just a matter of what you're used to.

Eventually, abandoning Apple seems to be the only way forward. In the meantime I'll just buy old Macs and install (or back-up) operating systems they no longer support, if necessary. They won't get any money from me for sure.

a duncandisorderly

  • the rough and tumble of the internet
Re: Fucking state of Apple
« Reply #76 on: November 24, 2018, 11:13:53 PM »
Still lost in your cognitive dissonance I see. Clue: you are not restricted to developing software on Linux, it can do everything else too. No you don't have to use the command prompt (unless you want to)

Can't speak for music production much (except for a friend who lost her music setup to a Mac failure and got rid of the Mac based stuff) but I have heard about more people switching to Linux based music tools as Apple screws itself up. In the end it's just a matter of what you're used to.

>sigh< well, if you're going to be like that...

BlodwynPig

  • Throwing two dogs at a goblin
Re: Fucking state of Apple
« Reply #77 on: November 24, 2018, 11:15:53 PM »

a duncandisorderly

  • the rough and tumble of the internet
Re: Fucking state of Apple
« Reply #78 on: November 24, 2018, 11:19:01 PM »
Have you ever tried using Carbon Copy Cloner? Rather than reinstalling, just have a bootable back-up of your system at hand and not a fucking Time Machine one that doesn't also back up your chosen OS (whether Apple care to offer it you or not). Thankfully I'm currently on a machine that won't upgrade past El Capitan, so things are fairly stable (and backed-up on another bootable drive via Carbon Copy Cloner).
I would happily fuck Apple off but I'm stuck with my choices of peripheral hardware and their respective drivers (audio interface, UAD2 PCIe cards) and my long standing experience of using Logic Pro (which also lets me play around with custom microtonal tunings in way nothing else does so easily). I can't believe how fucked Apple has become in the last 10-12 years but I'm still glad not to have to deal with the bollocks that is Windows.

I use CC all the time for backups. daily. I use it by folder, rather than by volume, so that the backups are distributed across several drives rather than being a clone of everything that's on one drive. that way I won't lose everything all in one go. I also use drives from several vendors.

the macs aren't the centre of my music set-up... that's all hardware sequencers & stuff. the computers are for recording, editing, configuring, artwork... I'm happy with the macs how they are- what annoys me is this updating for the sake of updating, where it has a negative effect on existing functionality... breaking drivers, that sort of thing.

Re: Fucking state of Apple
« Reply #79 on: November 24, 2018, 11:25:25 PM »
There's been rumours going around for ages that Mac would dearly love to kill off the Mac Pro and Mac Mini lines but doing the former would be signalling total withdrawal (and admitting defeat) from the professional side of desktop computing, something they're not ready to do yet. I'm sure I read somewhere that they make a net loss on the Mac Pro line.

I read somewhere they're thinking of moving away from x86 on some lines towards an ARM processor and possibly trying to harmonise osx and ios.

This would basically mean they have to split into consumer and pro lines I guess as as much as I love ARM (I grew up on Archimedes and RISC OS) they're probably not going to be up to the job of video/photo editing and music stuff. They'll also kill macs as a tool for developers/infosec as they'll not be able to run x86 windows/linux virtual machines.

Blumf

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Re: Fucking state of Apple
« Reply #80 on: November 24, 2018, 11:35:48 PM »
Is it the case that you need to develop iOS software on macOS? I think it used to be like that, but no idea if they've opened it up since.

NoSleep

  • feat. Keith Jarrett and his singing parrot
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Re: Fucking state of Apple
« Reply #81 on: November 24, 2018, 11:38:00 PM »
I use CC all the time for backups. daily. I use it by folder, rather than by volume, so that the backups are distributed across several drives rather than being a clone of everything that's on one drive. that way I won't lose everything all in one go. I also use drives from several vendors.

Yeah, I keep my work on separate drives from my OS drives (which only have apps and app support on them), but backing up work is another thing to losing functionality on your OS drive, especially as Apple try to make it really hard not to continue using a particular OS. I believe, for example, that there's still a large number of users out there still using Snow Leopard (including myself, as well as having G4s and G5s still running Tiger). I've yet to experiment with reinstalling El Capitan using only a USB Flash drive but I have a DMG of an El Capitan installer at hand (although CCC has already got me hopefully sorted). Every time have have a bit of spare dosh I buy some more drives for backing up; I have so many drives (16 years of working with many people on Macs and another 16 years prior working on AtariST's and AKAI samplers on old SCSI drives and floppies, all still playable).

Cloud

  • Elon who?
Re: Fucking state of Apple
« Reply #82 on: November 25, 2018, 01:03:14 PM »
Linux is on my desktop and I could probably live with various shortcomings (that some of the more aggressive fans seem determined to deny existence of!), but I dual boot to Windows for games so much there's little point in not just biting the bullet and using Windows.  No, the paltry list of WINE-powered games on Steam and stuff like Tux Racer does not constitute "perfectly fine"  (as someone tried telling me once).  It's not Linux's fault, but the situation is what it is.

I like Chromebooks, especially now they can run Android apps.  But I'm not massively comfortable handing my life over to Google.  I'm not of the tinfoil hat brigade, but completely and totally putting all my eggs in the Google basket is another matter, that and their  tendency  to chop and change things.

I read somewhere they're thinking of moving away from x86 on some lines towards an ARM processor and possibly trying to harmonise osx and ios.

This would basically mean they have to split into consumer and pro lines I guess as as much as I love ARM (I grew up on Archimedes and RISC OS) they're probably not going to be up to the job of video/photo editing and music stuff. They'll also kill macs as a tool for developers/infosec as they'll not be able to run x86 windows/linux virtual machines.

Harmonise possibly and it wouldn't surprise me to see them change processors again, they've done it before and it'd give them more control which is what they like having. 

They've quite strenuously denied any plans to merge them though, thank goodness.

Cloud

  • Elon who?
Re: Fucking state of Apple
« Reply #83 on: June 04, 2019, 06:17:08 PM »
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seepage

  • throwing a dog at some goblins
Re: Fucking state of Apple
« Reply #84 on: June 04, 2019, 09:19:25 PM »
I'd like to show 4K video in native resolution in a window but all the 5K monitors seem to have disappeared. So Apple's new 6K one looks appealing but I'm not going to pay five grand for it. Probably wouldn't work with Windows anyway. Hopefully someone will do a cheap copy.

Re: Fucking state of Apple
« Reply #85 on: June 04, 2019, 09:22:49 PM »
The sign in with apple stuff sounds good though, as does one more year of support the SE.

Cloud

  • Elon who?
Re: Fucking state of Apple
« Reply #86 on: June 04, 2019, 09:56:26 PM »
Yeah the SE was and remains a nice phone and very affordable