Author Topic: Post Beatles Beatles relationships  (Read 11741 times)

grassbath

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Re: Post Beatles Beatles relationships
« Reply #330 on: January 07, 2019, 10:09:11 PM »
Ah interesting - admittedly I read it a while ago with a less critical eye. Didn't realise it had undergone a reevaluation.

Re: Post Beatles Beatles relationships
« Reply #331 on: January 08, 2019, 12:19:02 AM »
It's because that book's a pile of mince. Most of the historical detail is provably wrong, and a lot of the insider stuff has been refuted by other Abbey Road staff, as well as not really fitting with a lot of what we already know for certain. Great engineer, but a very unreliable source.

This sort of memoir is also (I think) one of the reasons that Lewisohn is taking so long. I seem to remember reading that he'd conducted all the main interviews at the very beginning of the project for the whole period of the the band's existence, and the rest of the time has been spent either exhaustively cross-checking stories where accounts differ, or sniffing out other eyewitness interviewees based on info gleaned from the first slew of interviews. I'm also guessing that, should he kark it unexpectedly, his work is probably in very good order for someone else to take over and finish off (there might even be a stipulation in his contract).

the science eel

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Re: Post Beatles Beatles relationships
« Reply #332 on: January 08, 2019, 12:37:47 AM »
I'd argue that both of these are eclipsed by Recording The Beatles when it comes to the actual music. Learned more from this than Lewisohn about how everything was put together in the studio. You think it's going to be very technical, but it's actually the story of the band members learning how to capture the sound they're looking for by using (and abusing) the technology to hand. It's well worth the $100 when it's back in print (but maybe not the £700 it is on Amazon at the moment...) - here are a couple of pages (hopefully at a legible size) I've used in the past to illustrate (for example) why Ringo had teatowels on his snare. Below those are the links to the high-res samples of the book's website.





http://recordingthebeatles.com/1963ProductionPreview.pdf

http://recordingthebeatles.com/1968ProductionPreview.pdf

http://recordingthebeatles.com/PersonnelExcerpt-TapeOp.pdf

http://recordingthebeatles.com/IsoScreens-excerpt.pdf

http://recordingthebeatles.com/RS106-FilterExcerpt.pdf

Jesus fuck that looks amazing.

Re: Post Beatles Beatles relationships
« Reply #333 on: January 08, 2019, 02:09:18 AM »
There is also The Beatles Recording Reference Manual (4 volumes) by Jerry Hammack

Shameless Custard

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Re: Post Beatles Beatles relationships
« Reply #334 on: January 08, 2019, 09:44:14 AM »
As much as I loved Peter Doggett's Beatles book, sadly I've got to say his Bowie one wasn't up to much. Quite the disappointment.

Can't believe You Never Give Me Your Money is already nine years old, though. I remember devouring it when it released. Truly fascinating stuff. Maybe it's time for another read

Talking of fascinating, there has been some amazing information and links in this thread, so thanks well much for those. The YouTube John and Paul ones especially

This may have been mentioned here or elsewhere, but Macca has a nice little interview/chat with Jarvis Cocker in front of an audience here - https://youtu.be/-gxdrjRqcZQ Jarvis looks suitably stunned that he's sat in front of him. Lovely stuff. Fuck me, Macca is in great shape for his age. The voice is starting to sound a bit more fragile and worn, but he's still looking the biz

non capisco

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Re: Post Beatles Beatles relationships
« Reply #335 on: January 10, 2019, 01:10:19 AM »
I'm reading 'You Never Give Me Your Money' at the moment. I know I'm not saying anything that hasn't been said a million times here but I find it astonishing that a band with so much acrimony and tension at the time made something as outright joyous and effortlessly hook-filled as the closing 'Abbey Road' medley. Especially given how comparatively listless and knackered most of 'Let It Be' is. 'Golden Slumbers/Carry That Weight/The End' is as triumphant as pop music gets IMO and by most accounts they were seething at each other.

Re: Post Beatles Beatles relationships
« Reply #336 on: January 10, 2019, 03:06:34 AM »
I think it was respect for George Martin that kept John and George in line with the McCartney-driven project. And also they wanted a better, more polished work as their legacy than the mostly crock of shit Let It Be* stuff that was sitting in the can.

*which I don't think they'd have released in 1970 had they not been contractually committed to doing a soundtrack for the film.

Wet Blanket

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Re: Post Beatles Beatles relationships
« Reply #337 on: January 10, 2019, 11:11:02 AM »
The closing medley is nevertheless a load of odds and sods mixed together in virtuoso stylee, like a delicious stew made by a Michelin-starred chef, the ingredients of which are, nevertheless, leftovers.

There is a bit of a fixed grin about Abbey Road. Paul’s contributions are overcheerful, Lennon’s more bitter than average. On the other hand, it's George who really stands out on that album for me, he was blossoming as a songwriter at the point his bandmates were circling their own arses.

SteveDave

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Re: Post Beatles Beatles relationships
« Reply #338 on: January 10, 2019, 01:09:33 PM »
As much as I loved Peter Doggett's Beatles book, sadly I've got to say his Bowie one wasn't up to much. Quite the disappointment.

I've been dipping in and out of it (his Bowie book) for a few months (when the need arises) and I'm finding it quite interesting.

Re: Post Beatles Beatles relationships
« Reply #339 on: January 10, 2019, 03:04:13 PM »
It probably helped that Lennon was not present when the main Abbey Road sessions started, due to his car crash, so McCartney and George Martin could shape it like they did Pepper, where Lennon was often incapacitated by acid. George Martin's finest hour as a producer was perhaps the vocal harmonies he got from the group on Side 2 of Abbey Road.

Lennon's best Beatles work across a whole album has to be the White Album, facilitated initially by coming off drugs while in India, whereas I think McCartney maintains a consistent level of excellence from Rubber Soul to Abbey Road.

the science eel

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Re: Post Beatles Beatles relationships
« Reply #340 on: January 10, 2019, 03:06:25 PM »
Bit puzzled by all the approbation that Doggett book's getting. I read it a couple of years ago and wasn't struck by anything much, really.

I want to tackle the Anthology book but (and I know this sounds ridiculous) it's so fucking thick and big and heavy that it's actually not easy to read...

biggytitbo

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Re: Post Beatles Beatles relationships
« Reply #341 on: January 10, 2019, 09:34:38 PM »
The closing medley is nevertheless a load of odds and sods mixed together in virtuoso stylee, like a delicious stew made by a Michelin-starred chef, the ingredients of which are, nevertheless, leftovers.


Lennon's contributions to the the medley are absolute dogshit. He certainly had some gall to complain about Maxwell's Silver Hammer when he was contributing lazy, meaningless toss-offs like Polythene Pam and Mr Mustard. It always amused me how annoyed Lennon got about Maccas 'granny shit', whilst having a songwriting vice himself of plowing Lear like nonsense lyrics a few times too many.

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Re: Post Beatles Beatles relationships
« Reply #342 on: January 10, 2019, 10:27:12 PM »
I want to tackle the Anthology book but (and I know this sounds ridiculous) it's so fucking thick and big and heavy that it's actually not easy to read...

Try reading it in bed.

grassbath

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Re: Post Beatles Beatles relationships
« Reply #343 on: January 10, 2019, 10:28:20 PM »
Got to say, even with all the bad stuff going down in the summer of 1969, you'd never know from audio of the Abbey Road sessions - in these outtakes they're laughing and japing like it's five years prior:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AtUYx0FLolA

John, excitedly: 'Do you want me to do that bit, George? I can do it, y'know.'

MiddleRabbit

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Re: Post Beatles Beatles relationships
« Reply #344 on: January 10, 2019, 10:38:37 PM »
Bit puzzled by all the approbation that Doggett book's getting. I read it a couple of years ago and wasn't struck by anything much, really.

I want to tackle the Anthology book but (and I know this sounds ridiculous) it's so fucking thick and big and heavy that it's actually not easy to read...

I thought Doggett's book was just weak.  Nothing new, no particularly interesting perspectives on anything.  It wasn't dreadful (like Howard Sounes's Macca biography) but I don't get the love for it, no.


Shameless Custard

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Re: Post Beatles Beatles relationships
« Reply #345 on: January 11, 2019, 06:39:41 AM »
There's a paperback edition of the Anthology book. Probably still a mission to read it in bed, mind!

biggytitbo

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Re: Post Beatles Beatles relationships
« Reply #346 on: January 11, 2019, 09:06:50 AM »
Try reading it in bed.


Or using it as a bed.

SteveDave

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Re: Post Beatles Beatles relationships
« Reply #347 on: January 11, 2019, 11:24:08 AM »
Got to say, even with all the bad stuff going down in the summer of 1969, you'd never know from audio of the Abbey Road sessions - in these outtakes they're laughing and japing like it's five years prior:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AtUYx0FLolA

John, excitedly: 'Do you want me to do that bit, George? I can do it, y'know.'

Probably hopped up on goofballs.

the science eel

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Re: Post Beatles Beatles relationships
« Reply #348 on: January 11, 2019, 01:09:37 PM »
I still hear and read - although these days I suppose it's relatively rare - stuff like 'oh this idea that the Beatles are the greatest group of all time is a fallacy'

It's strange, isn't it? even allowing for some people's innate anti-consensual nature

and of course you know how to counter those kinds of statements, right?

Re: Post Beatles Beatles relationships
« Reply #349 on: January 11, 2019, 01:20:05 PM »
"Yeah, well, you know, that's just, like, your opinion, man"

non capisco

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Re: Post Beatles Beatles relationships
« Reply #350 on: January 11, 2019, 02:03:39 PM »
I'm reading 'You Never Give Me Your Money' at the moment.

I never knew George banged Ringo's wife. He was a dark horse ahahahaha

SteveDave

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Re: Post Beatles Beatles relationships
« Reply #351 on: January 11, 2019, 02:25:38 PM »
I still hear and read - although these days I suppose it's relatively rare - stuff like 'oh this idea that the Beatles are the greatest group of all time is a fallacy'

It's strange, isn't it? even allowing for some people's innate anti-consensual nature

and of course you know how to counter those kinds of statements, right?

They're no Duke Ellington

Shameless Custard

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Re: Post Beatles Beatles relationships
« Reply #352 on: January 11, 2019, 02:47:20 PM »
So George sued Ringo, and banged his wife

FRENDS FOREVAZ

Rich Uncle Skeleton

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Re: Post Beatles Beatles relationships
« Reply #353 on: January 11, 2019, 04:15:21 PM »
Fuck me, they never mentioned that on Aspel & Co.

biggytitbo

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Re: Post Beatles Beatles relationships
« Reply #354 on: January 11, 2019, 04:39:24 PM »
George banged everyone's wives didn't he? It was his way of showing friendship. He never banged Linda hence why it was very frosty between him and Paul during the anthology.

Shameless Custard

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Re: Post Beatles Beatles relationships
« Reply #355 on: January 14, 2019, 04:28:53 PM »
Is this the Beatles thread now, then?

If so, I just wanna say how fucking great the bassline in Old Brown Shoe is. Had never really noticed before

THE BEATLES - THE GIFT THAT KEEPS ON GIVING

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Re: Post Beatles Beatles relationships
« Reply #356 on: January 15, 2019, 05:43:10 PM »
Paul's basslines could be a bit fussy, in my opinion.  Something in particular has moments that I think needed simplifying.

biggytitbo

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Re: Post Beatles Beatles relationships
« Reply #357 on: January 15, 2019, 07:07:39 PM »
Old brown shoe, like blue Jay way, is a great under the radar George beatles song.


The bass on that was apperently George though (according to George), not Paul, although there is sole dispute about that.

Ballad of Ballard Berkley

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Re: Post Beatles Beatles relationships
« Reply #358 on: January 16, 2019, 12:18:57 AM »
Fuck me, they never mentioned that on Aspel & Co.

Ringo was so pissed, he probably didn't remember.

Re: Post Beatles Beatles relationships
« Reply #359 on: January 17, 2019, 11:00:52 PM »
Jesus fuck that looks amazing.

brian 'moog cookbook' kehew came to london to do some research for this mighty tome & it happened that the brother of a drummer colleague of his was working for me at Mtv at the time. I'd encountered BK on the old mellotron yahoo group before this, but lost touch when a range-war broke out between the legal & moral owners of the trademark. anyway so BK came for a quick visit to see my 'tron & told me he aimed to nail the beatles' technology once & for all. I put myself on the list for the first edition, & was duly astonished when it arrived, looking like & weighing as much as an EMI 2" master-tape. a truly magnificent work, but I'd have to say it will either sit on your coffee table or become one (it should come with screw-in legs really) unless you are obsessed with EMI, studer, neumann & the rest.

just had a quick scan at google/ebay, & it seems I made a good investment!