Give Out But Don't Give Up - The Memphis Recordings

[greenman]

Anybody else given this a listen? I always liked the odd track on the original album rather than the whole thing but this is a very significant improvement for me. It doesn't have any the George Clinton stuff which whilst I enjoyed it didn't ever really feel like it belonged on the same album. Generally its a more stripped back clearer more genuine sound to it than original release with the sax/trumpet/organ giving more prominence, you could question whether stuff like Jailbird or Rocks sound better of worse here I spose having a bit less punch but feeling a bit less cartoonish, The big improvement though is I think the more soulful tracks that make up most of the album, originally I felt that material just fell on the wrong side of cheesy pastiche but here it does for me anyway actually pull of a more geuine attempt at that sound.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GDv_ooF9TFw

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hV1SgW_tMgg

I can almost imagine some alternative timeline were Bobby ends up spending his career in the southern US as a soul singer which technically he was always much better at that any attempt to be John Lydon.

[bim sherman shirts]

Is this a Glasgow band thing?

[greenman]

Mogwai have a collection of Elvis covers coming out next year.

[greenman]

A BBC doc to get certain CaB's putting their foot through the screen....

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mpUVOVDy0iw

[Astronaut Omens]

A BBC doc to get certain CaB's putting their foot through the screen....

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mpUVOVDy0iw

On the contrary, I found Gillespie quite charming in that. His usually grating tendency, when not pretending to be Iggy or Lydon, has been to turn every conversation into an unemotionally delivered catalogue of records he likes,
and this has always done their records a disservice I think- even when I really loved some of their music, I always had doubts that there was something a bit hollow going on beneath, that these were nothing more than songs about other songs.
But, somehow, that very same fanboyish tendency comes across as totally humble and craftsmanlike in that documentary. Maybe it's because it's about him talking about not being as good as Aretha and wishing he was rather than claiming to be the new Miles/MC5/Parliament etc.

[greenman]

On the contrary, I found Gillespie quite charming in that. His usually grating tendency, when not pretending to be Iggy or Lydon, has been to turn every conversation into an unemotionally delivered catalogue of records he likes,
and this has always done their records a disservice I think- even when I really loved some of their music, I always had doubts that there was something a bit hollow going on beneath, that these were nothing more than songs about other songs.
But, somehow, that very same fanboyish tendency comes across as totally humble and craftsmanlike in that documentary. Maybe it's because it's about him talking about not being as good as Aretha and wishing he was rather than claiming to be the new Miles/MC5/Parliament etc.

There did always seem to be a bit of a mismatch between Gillespie and the typical way indie bands were interviewed playing up the "tortured artist" or "witty banter" aspects, neither of which he really fits into very well where as here I'd agree just a genuine love of music and a more humble working class boy made good focus comes across far better.

[kidsick5000]

A BBC doc to get certain CaB's putting their foot through the screen....

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mpUVOVDy0iw

Nice to see the origins of the band.
And there's a really sweet moment where the get to play with the Al Green track.

I can see Alan McGee's point in not releasing the Memphis version. Even the chosen version of GOBDGU was too radical for the Screamadelica fans

[greenman]

I suspect it might have gone down a bit better critically, maybe not universally but I think you do get more of a feeling of a genuine attempt at a certain sound where as it was much easier to listen to the album that was released as think "well this is what they are without Weatherall and co".

[SteveDave]

Bobby G needs to smile more. His little face lights up. For reference please see Primal Scream's Instagram where there's a photo of him in front of a Christmas tree wearing his new PIL t-shirt and he looks about 12.

[phantom_power]

Noel Gallagher is OK with the odd witty bon mot but he is such a narrow-minded cunt. He is musical gammon

[poodlefaker]

Bob's comment that the UK music press slated GOBDGU becuase "they hate black music" was classic. I gave up on the doc soon after that.

I can't stand PS's "classic rock/soul" side tbh, Bob's voice has just never been up to it. Much prefer the Vanishing Point/XTRMNTR stuff.

[greenman]

Bob's comment that the UK music press slated GOBDGU becuase "they hate black music" was classic. I gave up on the doc soon after that.

I can't stand PS's "classic rock/soul" side tbh, Bob's voice has just never been up to it. Much prefer the Vanishing Point/XTRMNTR stuff.

I'v always tended to think that its a situation were his voice is best suited for rock/soul but the band as a whole have produced their best work elsewhere.

The new mixs for me actually benefit from shifting away from the typical Stone's comparisons. That side of the band is IMHO best in small doses like Moving on Up or Country Girl but over a whole album they don't have the the same kind of dirty loose limbed swing to them the Stones did. Moving more towards soul actually plays to their strengths more for me, found myself listening though the album several times now which I rarely did with the original.

[gilbertharding]

Bob's comment that the UK music press slated GOBDGU becuase "they hate black music" was classic. I gave up on the doc soon after that.

Fucking hell.

I read the music press at the time, and that really wasn't the problem. In fact, listening to Chart Music Podcast confirms that the people involved in that (all of them) bend over backwards to love black music. And not just (as they have observed) in that classic white boy way of 'only liking black music by dead black people' - which I'd say PRML SCRM are probably 80% guilty of.

So no - it wasn't The Music Press which hated black music. Perhaps the readers of the music press...

I thought parts of GOBDGU were quite good. Lots of it was excruciating. Consequently it never gets played round mine anymore.

They were always a bit embarrassing though, weren't they? I like a lot of their stuff in spite of them, if you know what I mean.

[greenman]

Fucking hell.

I read the music press at the time, and that really wasn't the problem. In fact, listening to Chart Music Podcast confirms that the people involved in that (all of them) bend over backwards to love black music. And not just (as they have observed) in that classic white boy way of 'only liking black music by dead black people' - which I'd say PRML SCRM are probably 80% guilty of.

So no - it wasn't The Music Press which hated black music. Perhaps the readers of the music press...

I thought parts of GOBDGU were quite good. Lots of it was excruciating. Consequently it never gets played round mine anymore.

They were always a bit embarrassing though, weren't they? I like a lot of their stuff in spite of them, if you know what I mean.

I would argue perhaps the opposite issue in the indie music press, they had time for contemporary black music but much less so for black music of previous generations, maybe the odd bit of dub but the NME for example wasn't really known for much interest in soul music just as very few indie bands of the era were.

Again I found this version of Give Out much more listenable all the way though, the original I'd typically give Jailbird, Rocks, Call on Me and the Clinton stuff a listen and slip the rest but the slower soul tracks worked much better with for me actually feeling like genuine attempts rather than pastiche.

[the science eel]

There's too much music knocking around and this type of shit shouldn't be there. It shouldn't have been made. It's a waste of money and a waste of talents (none of which were BG's, who is a fucking clown).


I came across a burnt-out motorcycle in the street this morning, no wheels, no seat, just a charred metal skeleton. It had obviously been stolen and dumped by a gang of teenage wild boys. It was the most beautiful thing I've seen since last night's evening sky. You don't find 'art' in galleries, it's all around you. The city is alive and on fire. Long may it burn.

[MidnightShambler]

I quite liked this but the original album is probably the least played record I own, haven't heard since I bought it when it was released. So outside of Rocks and Jailbird I had absolutely no memory of the other songs so i'm fucked if I can make a comparison. Suppose i'll have to give it a listen eventually.

When Rocks came out, I thought it was the best thing I'd ever heard. Everybody at school was playing it constantly for what felt like months, so I can't tell you how disappointed I was when I heard Tattoo You a few years later and realised it was a complete fucking rip off of Little T&A (thematically and lyrically at least). Still love Primal Scream though.

[Ballad of Ballard Berkley]

When Rocks came out, I thought it was the best thing I'd ever heard. Everybody at school was playing it constantly for what felt like months, so I can't tell you how disappointed I was when I heard Tattoo You a few years later and realised it was a complete fucking rip off of Little T&A (thematically and lyrically at least). Still love Primal Scream though.

It's an homage. That's what Bobby would tell you anyway.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wg2ZtSHoKY0

Also, lest we forget, the Stones actually have a song called Rocks Off, which kick-starts one of their most well-known and critically acclaimed albums.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_lNP-x94-SE

[dontrunyoullfall]

Was it badly reviewed when it came out? Select gave it 5/5, NME maybe 7? Melody Maker probably weren't effusive, it was all Wu-Tang round their way by then.

[MidnightShambler]

The opening 'owww yeeaahh' at the start of the Stones Rock Off is one of my favourite pieces of music, really sets the tone for what's to come and describes what it's like to be the most decadent, hedonistic shagger on the planet in the 70s in a second, Jagger at his best never needed long winded solos or vocal gymnastics, he could say all that needs to be said in a well timed grunt or a 'one, two'. He overdid it a lot later but up til then he was perfect.

Always thought Primal Scream were a great band but that they never totally trusted themselves. Always moving on from one identity to another without really exploring it to its fullest. XTRMNTR and Evil Heat were fucking great and then blam! Riot City Blues, which was good but seemed pointless.

Great live though.

[gilbertharding]

I would argue perhaps the opposite issue in the indie music press, they had time for contemporary black music but much less so for black music of previous generations, maybe the odd bit of dub but the NME for example wasn't really known for much interest in soul music just as very few indie bands of the era were.

Read what i wrote again. You agree with me.

[greenman]

Read what i wrote again. You agree with me.

As I said I think the issue was more the reverse, the press and to some degree audiences were receptive to say hip hop or house but older black music like soul seemed pretty much non existent in the indie world view of that era, the closest would maybe be Mcalmont and Butler yet even that was I'd argue more 60's pop.

Not sure you could level the criticism at Primal Scream of only being receptive to yesterdays black music, I mean Screamadelica has a lot of house influence to it rather than the more typical drum machine/techno side to Madchester and Vanishing Point/XTRMNTR both arguably have a hip hop elements to them as well.

[holyzombiejesus]

Ha! Just found this ...

https://www.ilxor.com/ILX/ThreadSelectedControllerServlet?boardid=41&threadid=54570

and there are some real corkers from Bobby. This one might be my favourite...

So there was five of us, Andrew Innes on guitar, me on vocals, Jaki Leibezeit on drums, Michael Karoli on guitar and Liam Gallagher on one finger piano. We jammed our arses off, till five in the morning, hard and heavy on a two-chord Karoli groove, what a night! I'll never forget it. We all fell out of the studio arm-in-arm and walked up the road high and happy, blasted by the magick of Can, The Can!

[phantom_power]

I am always suspicious of people who "love" music but then only talk about the obvious big names like Al Green and MC5, obvious cultural touchstones. Most music fans have weird idiosyncratic obsessions that they will talk about at any given opportunity and I have never heard Gillespie talk about those. Where are the quotes of him enthusing about the Housemartins or Renegade Soundwave or anything from the last 30 years for that matter?

[the science eel]

I am always suspicious of people who "love" music but then only talk about the obvious big names like Al Green and MC5, obvious cultural touchstones. Most music fans have weird idiosyncratic obsessions that they will talk about at any given opportunity and I have never heard Gillespie talk about those. Where are the quotes of him enthusing about the Housemartins or Renegade Soundwave or anything from the last 30 years for that matter?

ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha

[Hundhoon]

I never got into Give out but dont give up, it must have been infuriating for fans in 1994 expecting more tracks like Higher than the Sun or a Screamadelica part 2.  it seems like a pointless detour between Screamadelica and Primal Screams best album Vanishing Point.

When they have delved into the deep south style i music, I acctually liked Riot City Blues more, found it funny and dumb. at least it sounds like they are enjoying taking the piss.
I like every other style of music they have delved into, Industrial, Post Punk, Dub, House, Ambient, Jangle pop, but found their Southern rock sound the most boring. 

[phantom_power]

ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha

I don't know if that is laughter of agreement or mockery. There seem to be too many "ha"s for it to be genuine

[the science eel]

I don't know if that is laughter of agreement or mockery. There seem to be too many "ha"s for it to be genuine

No - you made me laugh, what you wrote was very funny.

I was looking for a....

If we had emoticons on this stupid fucking board then there wouldn't have been the confusion.

[PaulTMA]

Bobby G did once say he liked MMMBOP by Hanson.  I think he may have been saying that to counter that very accusation about his tastes, possibly.