Students suspended over WhatsApp group

[Lost Oliver]

Curious to know what CaB thinks of this as I'm not entirely sure myself, other than the fact that it's sad and that either way you look at it, people are upset https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-47060367

I work there and it's all everyone has been talking about for the last two days.

[ToneLa]

One of the messages said: "Sometimes it's fun to just go wild and rape 100 girls."

While another said: "Rape the whole flat to teach them all [a] lesson."

Didn't know Gary n Daz were students at Warwick

[Lost Oliver]

This morning I opened my inbox to find this:

Hi all

I am completely shocked to read today that the students responsible for these criminal threats are being allowed back to study at your place of work. I'm sure you are too. I am sending this email to implore you to take action and ensure these dangerous individuals are held accountable for their repeated disturbing actions. 

Although you may not be involved in this decision, as an employee reading this, you have the ability, and responsibility to speak out about your place of work condoning this behaviour. Please use your voice and take action, speak to your boss, go on strike, share this petition and help encourage them to change their decision.

If you don't, as yourself why.

I'm sure, you'll have asked yourself the question 'how did they get away with it? How didn't people realise what was going on?' about situations such as Harvey Weinstein, R Kelly and Jimmy Saville. The answer is, people did know, just like you, reading this, know what students of your university have done. The question is, are you going to let them get away with it? . It comes down to this, do you condone threatening rape, or not. Simple as that. No, buts.

Please use your voice, please hold each other accountable- it's a danger not to, remember "the Holocaust did not begin in the gas chambers, it began with words."

A bit much?

[ToneLa]

What's a bit much? Writing off more than half of the entire human race being condemned?

What's the right amount of condemnation and how did you work it out? How is that worse than the "rape 100 women lol" shit I quoted?

Think it's spot-on to call out apathy. Although if you don't work there it is OTT if it's in yer inbox!

[biggytitbo]

'Captain fartsalot' sounds like a bit of a character.

[BritishHobo]

The fact that the chat discussed specific women and yet they're allowed back on campus while those women are still there is absolutely batshit. Whoever sat on that appeal is beyond demented. What sane person would make that decision?

[Twed]

Who will be the stars of this thread's huge multi-page argument? Tune in in about 12 hours to find out!

[ToneLa]

Who will be the stars of this thread's huge multi-page argument? Tune in in about 12 hours to find out!

Cheeky bastard you OOTSIDE

[Sebastian Cobb]

This morning I opened my inbox to find this:

Hi all

I am completely shocked to read today that the students responsible for these criminal threats are being allowed back to study at your place of work. I'm sure you are too. I am sending this email to implore you to take action and ensure these dangerous individuals are held accountable for their repeated disturbing actions. 

Although you may not be involved in this decision, as an employee reading this, you have the ability, and responsibility to speak out about your place of work condoning this behaviour. Please use your voice and take action, speak to your boss, go on strike, share this petition and help encourage them to change their decision.

If you don't, as yourself why.

I'm sure, you'll have asked yourself the question 'how did they get away with it? How didn't people realise what was going on?' about situations such as Harvey Weinstein, R Kelly and Jimmy Saville. The answer is, people did know, just like you, reading this, know what students of your university have done. The question is, are you going to let them get away with it? . It comes down to this, do you condone threatening rape, or not. Simple as that. No, buts.

Please use your voice, please hold each other accountable- it's a danger not to, remember "the Holocaust did not begin in the gas chambers, it began with words."

A bit much?

Unless you're directly involved in this. Then you need to work on your email filters.

[Funcrusher]

I'm assuming that the defence offered was something like it was a private conversation which they hadn't expected to become public (is this the case?) and that it was just macho bullshitting which they wouldn't actually do in reality. Which was maybe judged to not be sufficient grounds to expel them.

[bgmnts]

One for the "what cheers you up" thread.

[up_the_hampipe]

It's a Facebook messenger group chat, not Whatsapp. Urgh, clickbait!

[Mr_Simnock]

The fact that the chat discussed specific women and yet they're allowed back on campus while those women are still there is absolutely batshit. Whoever sat on that appeal is beyond demented. What sane person would make that decision?

yes to this

[Cuellar]

Should be 'expelled' or whatever the uni equivalent is. No idea why they should ever be allowed back to study there. Cunts.

[thenoise]

It's a Facebook messenger group chat, not Whatsapp. Urgh, clickbait!

Are we absolutely certain they weren't talking about 'facebook raping'?

[chveik]

Who will be the stars of this thread's huge multi-page argument? Tune in in about 12 hours to find out!

Who's gonna win? who's gonna lose?


Pop up some popcorn, welcome aboard!

[BlodwynPig]

It's a Facebook messenger group chat, not Whatsapp. Urgh, clickbait!

Soon to be merged

[Bazooka]

In these times it will a millisecond to discover an individual on a campus.

[Lost Oliver]

What's a bit much? Writing off more than half of the entire human race being condemned?

What's the right amount of condemnation and how did you work it out? How is that worse than the "rape 100 women lol" shit I quoted?

Think it's spot-on to call out apathy. Although if you don't work there it is OTT if it's in yer inbox!

I take your points and I don't know, am happy to be wrong, but I think equating it to the holocaust is as you say OTT.

[Noodle Lizard]

It's really hard to judge with so few out-of-context snippets or paraphrasings.  You could pull up posts from here which would read similarly.  I think the clearly-exaggerated statements like "it's fun to go wild and rape 100 girls" imply that it's probably poor-quality uni bantz moreso than any genuine threat.

Unclear whether the two students being allowed back even said anything questionable or were just in the group - I'm assuming the latter.

[Golden E. Pump]

I do think that today's society would do well to remember that irony exists.

The Dennis Reynolds classic 'implication' scene? Cancelled, mate.

That being said, I don't know the full context behind this, but rendering a shit private joke amongst friends akin to calling for the Holocaust is a dangerous wave of thought in and of itself.

[Blue Jam]

Sorry for the Tab link, but this is pretty disturbing stuff, the hair straigheners comment in particular (again, about a specific, named woman) made me shudder:

https://thetab.com/uk/warwick/2018/05/09/named-and-pictured-the-warwick-boys-who-made-rape-jokes-in-their-group-chat-28615

There have also been reports that some of the men said they would "do it all over again", so it doesn't sound like they've learned any lessons here.

[Icehaven]

There's a bloke at my work who targeted students, broke into their flats and robbed and sexually assaulted them. I'm sure these chatting boys would think he's quite the hero for living out their fantasies. He's doing 15 years in jail and will be on the SOREG for the rest of his life, and now he gets his kicks trying to steal newspapers by putting them down his pants. Maybe they should pop in and visit him, actually meet the kind of person they aspire to be. They'd piss their Y fronts.

[phantom_power]

I do think that today's society would do well to remember that irony exists.

The Dennis Reynolds classic 'implication' scene? Cancelled, mate.

I think a scripted TV show that has built up a certain style and characterisation and goodwill isn't a great analogy for this. You expect fiction to be, well, fictitious and not necessarily agreeing with the viewpoint it presents.

[canadagoose]

They'd piss their Y fronts.

The smuggled newspapers would come in handy in that case.

I do find it a bit disgusting, what those guys said, although I shouldn't be surprised. Plenty of immature LEDGE BANTZ LAAAADS seem to enjoy that sort of thing. Some kind of power-play? I'm not really an expert, to be honest.

[Flouncer]

It's really hard to judge with so few out-of-context snippets or paraphrasings.  You could pull up posts from here which would read similarly.

Not really - there's a difference between HAHA RAPE and 'joking' about raping specific people. The latter is where they crossed the line by making it personal and creating a situation whereby a particular person could reasonably feel threatened by coming into contact with them. Also with the victim blaming shit about someone who has been sexually assaulted, I think it's pretty fair to say that this looks less like a bit of laddish banter and more like a bunch of actual scumbags revelling in hardcore misoginy.

[jobotic]

Would you share a lesson with these cunts? I wouldn't and they haven't been fantasizing about raping me or burning my genitals.

I'd walk out if they were present and I'd expect the lecturers to as well.

[Blue Jam]

Plenty of immature LEDGE BANTZ LAAAADS seem to enjoy that sort of thing. Some kind of power-play? I'm not really an expert, to be honest.

I grew up with 90's lad culture and it seems like good clean fun compared to what we have now. Lads just wanted to have a bit of fun, they'd do stupid stuff but they wouldn't hurt anyone, and women were even welcome to join in as Ladettes. Now it seems to be more about reclaiming power over women, flaunting a lack of respect for them, and openly treating them with contempt and even hatred- and heaven forfend women try and do anything even slightly unladylike, their behaviour must be policed and they must be shamed over it.

I prefer Tony and Gary to Legend Gary, or something.

[canadagoose]

I grew up with 90's lad culture and it seems like good clean fun compared to what we have now. Lads just wanted to have a bit of fun, they'd do stupid stuff but they wouldn't hurt anyone, and women were even welcome to join in as Ladettes. Now it seems to be more about reclaiming power over women, flaunting a lack of respect for them, and openly treating them with contempt and even hatred- and heaven forfend women try and do anything even slightly unladylike, their behaviour must be policed and they must be shamed over it.

I prefer Tony and Gary to Legend Gary, or something.

It's strange. I don't know when things changed, but the current Legend Gary stuff has been going on since the mid-2000s at least. Someone's bound to have written a paper or two about it. I should have a look sometime (when I'm not at risk of feeling crap about that sort of behaviour occurring).

And yeah, Tony and Gary seem like they're at the vanguard of feminism compared to some modern stuff...

[grassbath]

It's really hard to judge with so few out-of-context snippets or paraphrasings.  You could pull up posts from here which would read similarly.  I think the clearly-exaggerated statements like "it's fun to go wild and rape 100 girls" imply that it's probably poor-quality uni bantz moreso than any genuine threat.

This is my initial reaction - the racist comments especially, while heinous, read like the kind of blurted shock value stuff that many groups of friends indulge in, in private. I think they were just group-wanking over the extremeness of the bantz. One of the boys said "They shouldn't have read the chat. Were they expecting compliments or something. If you open this chat when you're not in it, you are asking to be offended. It's letting people stick their noses in where it doesn't belong" - and although I think he's a disgusting unrepentant little cunt, I can see his point. This has only blown up to the extent it has because the extreme bantz got aired in a non-extreme bantz environment.

Where it becomes particularly disgusting and cunty, though, and becomes inexcusable regardless of any 'private bantz' factor, is that they were friends with these girls and supposedly close to them.

Re: the University's decision, I've always been suspicious about the moral conduct of the higher-ups at Warwick Uni, after the security team physically attacked and tear-gassed some student protesters a few years back. Mind you I witnessed that all through a pretty hysterical student left-wing lens.