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March 28, 2024, 10:55:11 AM

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Tory Party Watch: parts 8245–8249 & 117

Started by Absorb the anus burn, March 02, 2019, 11:16:30 AM

Previous topic - Next topic

Alberon

Given May's track record she isn't going to go for any of this shit. Stubbornness beyond all rational sense is her superpower.

BlodwynPig

Quote from: hummingofevil on March 23, 2019, 10:51:42 PM
Sounds pretty convincing. 11 cabinet members saying off the record she must resign and ultimatum by Monday. Livington or Gove to be caretaker to get WA through then leadership election in the Autumn.

How the fuck do people keep voting for these utter cunts?

THAT IS KICKING NOT JUST THE CAN BUT THE WHOLE SHIT BUCKET DOWN THE ROAD

And denies us any real joy at her departure and leaves us with a resurgent Tory party

pancreas

Why do they think Gove or Lidlington are more likely to get the WA through than May?


pancreas


hummingofevil

Quote from: pancreas on March 23, 2019, 11:52:02 PM
Why do they think Gove or Lidlington are more likely to get the WA through than May?

Because the ERG lot are after an excuse to vote it through without losing face. Forcing May out would be a nice power move from them. The WA has always been a stepping stone and the real discussion start after it is signed so having a sympathetic "Brexiteer" like Gove in place means they think they can get more of what they want.

I think it comes down to the very simple premise that they think she is shit and needs to fuck off.

DrGreggles

Quote from: royce coolidge on March 23, 2019, 09:05:32 PM
Nice to see ex Dollar front man and human turd David van Day elected Tory councillor for Thurrock Essex.
This country is fucked,absolutely fucked.

David van Day's Public Office


hummingofevil

Worth reposting this if we get Gove as PM in charge of negotiations with the EU/Irish and held in place by DUP.

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/world/uk/michael-gove-a-fanatic-who-would-damage-peace-process-1.2710224


Shoulders?-Stomach!

Quote from: pancreas on March 23, 2019, 11:52:02 PM
Why do they think Gove or Lidlington are more likely to get the WA through than May?

They don't but this is all stemming from May's complete intransigence. It's likely a replacement would not have the psychological scars and fear that drives everything May does, or rather doesn't do.

finnquark

I half think the Tory right will be induced to vote for this deal if it comes to a vote this week. She's having a few of the big boys to Chequers today - vote for my deal and I'll fuck off, or get Lidington/Gove who'll go for a customs union on Labour votes.

Shoulders?-Stomach!

Quote from: finnquark on March 24, 2019, 09:40:11 AM
I half think the Tory right will be induced to vote for this deal if it comes to a vote this week. She's having a few of the big boys to Chequers today - vote for my deal and I'll fuck off, or get Lidington/Gove who'll go for a customs union on Labour votes.

Is that even within her power to grant them now?

finnquark

Yeah I don't see why not; unless there's a desire to politicise the Queen she can keep plowing on.

Shoulders?-Stomach!

Quote from: finnquark on March 24, 2019, 10:05:24 AM
Yeah I don't see why not; unless there's a desire to politicise the Queen she can keep plowing on.

I don't think May comprehends the situation, and from past evidence she will dig in rather than offer her resignation.

The whole indicative votes thing looks like it is going ahead whether May wants it to or not. So she can't really offer the ERG or DUP any guarantee that those votes won't render their objectives irrelevant by signalling they are a minority view in parliament.

May stays if she lets those votes go through and then obeys whichever route MPs coalesce around. This itself involves a level of humility she has proven incapable of.

Or brings the "final" go at getting the deal through so far forward that there isn't enough time for those indicative votes to take place. Unlikely given its highly likely to lose full stop, not to mention pissing off moderate MPs and that a heavy loss, even 70+ margin will put the final nail in her coffin.

idunnosomename

Do remember that May hired James Slack from The Mail - author of "Steel of the new Iron Lady", "Crush the Saboteurs", and "Enemies of the People" - as her cheif publicist and speech writer, so it's no wonder she's come out of all this as a deluded, megalomaniacal husk

Paul Calf

Quote from: hummingofevil on March 24, 2019, 12:52:22 AM
Worth reposting this if we get Gove as PM in charge of negotiations with the EU/Irish and held in place by DUP.

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/world/uk/michael-gove-a-fanatic-who-would-damage-peace-process-1.2710224



Gove is an actual fascist. I'm entirely convinced of it. He and Farage and transatlantic characters like Bannon and Richard Spencer might have minor ideological differences (I think Gove is a less radical, more conservative example especially than Bannon) but on the whole, their goals are aligned. Anyone concerned about our becoming entangled in the increasingly bellicose, despotic, authoritarian direction of US - and in fact, world - politics will resist a Gove premiership at every cost.

It's increasingly obvious that our only hope of ending up on the right side of history is to get rid of this corrupt, tired administration and install a government with guts and principles.

rjd2

Quote from: Kryton on March 23, 2019, 11:54:04 PM
Nicky Morgan?

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2019/03/23/senior-brexiteers-touting-nicky-morganas-potential-successor/


She's loathed by the party base though, so would be a very odd choice even if for many on the left she would be more tolerable than any of the other choices.  The likes of her Allen etc have always been dismissed as Lib Dem wannabes.

finnquark

Quote from: Shoulders?-Stomach! on March 24, 2019, 10:12:31 AM
Or brings the "final" go at getting the deal through so far forward that there isn't enough time for those indicative votes to take place. Unlikely given its highly likely to lose full stop, not to mention pissing off moderate MPs and that a heavy loss, even 70+ margin will put the final nail in her coffin.


I'm not sure this precludes what I'm predicting - your final point is what I think she'll do, I just think she has a good chance of getting it through if she says that she will resign, given the next leader is going to be from the harder wing of the party. She'll also have the added stick that the right know Parliament will coalesce around some form of softer Brexit, so why would they wait for that to happen? I'll likely be proved wrong I guess, who knows what's going on.

"Vote for my deal or you'll get Soft Brexit" does seem to be the gambit. But if they vote against, they'll get a leadership election in the Autumn which is surely what they want, as they can then do a hard Brexit under Boris even if they temporarily suffer a Soft Brexit in the interim. They have no incentive to prop her up. Timetable would be something like:

1) WA is voted down
2) Lidington replaces May, delivers Soft Brexit
3) Lidington beaten by Boris in the Autumn
4) Boris calls election, gets bigger majority, cancels Soft Brexit and replaces it with Hard Brexit by canceling the Customs Union or whatever Lidington has agreed.

Alberon

It will not be Boris. No way in hell will Tory MPs let him be on the ballot that goes to the membership.

idunnosomename

Johnson is such a lazy bastard that he won't bother to scheme his way to the top. Gove on the other hand does actually read briefings and does his job as environment secretary.

I don't think May did it on purpose (she's barely more than a caretaker rather than a master strategist) but his stint as foreign secretary was so atrocious it really did show up how awful he is. and I don't think the public like him that much anymore

jamiefairlie

Quote from: Satchmo Distel on March 24, 2019, 02:12:26 PM
"Vote for my deal or you'll get Soft Brexit" does seem to be the gambit. But if they vote against, they'll get a leadership election in the Autumn which is surely what they want, as they can then do a hard Brexit under Boris even if they temporarily suffer a Soft Brexit in the interim. They have no incentive to prop her up. Timetable would be something like:

1) WA is voted down
2) Lidington replaces May, delivers Soft Brexit
3) Lidington beaten by Boris in the Autumn
4) Boris calls election, gets bigger majority, cancels Soft Brexit and replaces it with Hard Brexit by canceling the Customs Union or whatever Lidington has agreed.

So the EU just sits and twiddles their thumbs as this pantomime unfolds? The UK's had its last warning, it will not be allowed to fuck about like this.

greencalx

The Guardian decided to wait until the one of most tumultuous weeks in politics before deciding to devote a couple of column inches to Islamophobia in the Tory Party:

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2019/mar/24/tory-islamophobia-row-15-suspended-councillors-quietly-reinstated

I'm sure they will keep doggedly at it like they did when it was Labour's turn.

Shoulders?-Stomach!

QuoteA councillor on Dover district council, Bob Frost, quit the party last year after being suspended for a third time for offensive social media posts. He was suspended in 2011 after he joked with another Facebook user about the London riots: "I can assure you that all the bunnies here are of the woodland variety rather than jungle," he said. He later said he had been referring to "the urban jungle".

Phew, well that's a relief!

petril

Quote from: Satchmo Distel on March 24, 2019, 02:12:26 PM
4) Boris calls election, gets bigger majority, cancels Soft Brexit and replaces it with Hard Brexit by canceling the Customs Union or whatever Lidington has agreed.

He wouldn't be inheriting a majority anyway, and he'd still have to dredge up 100+ MPs to go for his election. He'd need at about a third of Labour to agree with him for that, and considering how they've been polling this year they might all want to just wait for a better chance of getting back into power. Tories can't just call elections whenever they feel they're doing better than Labour any more, the Tories put a stop to that.

I'm not sure currently it's looking like there even being a majority if there was a GE this year either

idunnosomename

jesus fuck i laughed so hard at this actual front page of tomorrow's telegraph


gib

Quote from: idunnosomename on March 24, 2019, 10:44:13 PM
jesus fuck i laughed so hard at this actual front page of tomorrow's telegraph



fucking hell, tomorrow is going to be amazing

pancreas



Danger Man

The reality is worse

Theresa May is a chicken who's bottled Brexit. The only way forward is to come out of the EU now