Author Topic: Wrestling: The Baron Corbin Era  (Read 56434 times)

BeardFaceMan

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Re: Wrestling: The Baron Corbin Era
« Reply #2340 on: June 12, 2019, 03:12:52 PM »
Yeah I would also say the high YouTube views are from people who wont watch the whole show but cherry pick clips instead, which doesnt say much for the quality of their show. WWE are such an established behemoth at this point its hard for them to not make money but that money is increasingly coming from advertisers and tv deals and Saudi deals rather than gate attendance. They made more money for their last Saudi shitshow than they did for their highest grossing Wrestlemania of all time, thats why their profits are up, them making money certainly isnt any indication that theyre doing anything right and that they arent in trouble.

Re: Wrestling: The Baron Corbin Era
« Reply #2341 on: June 12, 2019, 03:17:25 PM »
in the 90s/early 00s you didn't want to miss a second of the show. something might happen. now it won't.

Re: Wrestling: The Baron Corbin Era
« Reply #2342 on: June 12, 2019, 03:26:08 PM »
In the 90s and early 2000s there was no Youtube and there werent much means to watch something a day later.

The shows are crap. Thats true.

But tbh I  cant think of a single tv show I actually watch when its broadcast on tv. Tv ratins are quite redundant in this day and age.

Re: Wrestling: The Baron Corbin Era
« Reply #2343 on: June 12, 2019, 04:08:21 PM »
But tbh I  cant think of a single tv show I actually watch when its broadcast on tv. Tv ratins are quite redundant in this day and age.

That’s arguably less true for professional wrestling on network TV than any other form of programming though. Assuming the Saudi seal is not going to be a reliable revenue stream for the long term, ratings become vital for them. If they bomb on Fox, their next TV deal will be worth less money. The network doesn’t bring in enough money to be able to absorb massive TV losses. They make next to nothing on PPV any more.

I genuinely think the Saudi deal and FOX deal are papering over massive cracks in the company. All it takes is the Saudis to pull their money and FOX to realise they’ve bought a product with a massively declining viewership and they’re in major trouble after the next renewal

Re: Wrestling: The Baron Corbin Era
« Reply #2344 on: June 12, 2019, 04:19:37 PM »
Tv ratins are quite redundant in this day and age.

WWE's massive TV deal says otherwise. Fox aren't paying them $5 billion because they dont care about ratings. WWE got the Fox deal because Fox has an obsession over live TV programming which they believe is DVR proof. Unfortunately while this may be true for sports like American Football & Basketball it's clearly not true for wrestling. The deal was also made on the basis of ratings that were 20% higher than they currently are now. Fox will boost WWE's ratings at the start as it's available in more homes, but if the product remains as stale and boring as it currently is then those rating will tank quickly as it will be Football season in the US.

Re: Wrestling: The Baron Corbin Era
« Reply #2345 on: June 12, 2019, 05:10:10 PM »
WWE's massive TV deal says otherwise. Fox aren't paying them $5 billion because they dont care about ratings. WWE got the Fox deal because Fox has an obsession over live TV programming which they believe is DVR proof. Unfortunately while this may be true for sports like American Football & Basketball it's clearly not true for wrestling. The deal was also made on the basis of ratings that were 20% higher than they currently are now. Fox will boost WWE's ratings at the start as it's available in more homes, but if the product remains as stale and boring as it currently is then those rating will tank quickly as it will be Football season in the US.

I agree wih every word of this. Without the TV deal WWE is going out of business. They just about break even on house show business and that is done on the back of rapidly increasing ticket and merch prices that rinse a diminishing fan base for more and more per person per year (and by people I include little kids paying £20 for a lunch box you can get for a quid in Poundland).

Youtube would be relevent if it was leveraging cash for them elsewhere. The scale is at least a few magnitudes smaller but AEW used Youtube to get people to pay $50 for a PPV. Yes it seemed a lot compared to the 9.99 for WWE Network but people realise you getting other stuff for free so it balances out a bit. I have heard the argument elsewhere that there are people who will not pay for anything ever but AEW has already got round that. They have 500,000 people willing to pay for a t-shirt for a start. If you using Youtube to sell PPVs and T-shirts great. For what I can see WWE uses to Youtube to give people an option not to watch the TV show which is making them all of their money. It's more madness from the mad bastards

BeardFaceMan

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Re: Wrestling: The Baron Corbin Era
« Reply #2346 on: June 12, 2019, 06:47:29 PM »
In the 90s and early 2000s there was no Youtube and there werent much means to watch something a day later.

The shows are crap. Thats true.

But tbh I  cant think of a single tv show I actually watch when its broadcast on tv. Tv ratins are quite redundant in this day and age.

Dont be such a silly sausage, of course ratings matter, especially to a network tv station, its how they set the prices for advertisers. If no one wants to advertise during the show, there is no show. If fewer people watch the show they cant charge as much for ad space. As soon as the network can find another show to take RAWs place if its not pulling its weight with advertisers, they will, because thats where the network makes its money. And WWE  are complete whores and will get their wrestlers to advertise literally anything during the show, theyll even interupt a wrestling match to show adverts, they'll even show adverts during a PPV that you paid premium cash for, its no wonder the networks love them and are willing to pay such big bucks to secure them for their channel, its all about advertising. Which is all dependant on ratings.

Ja'moke

  • based on the novel Push by Sapphire
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Re: Wrestling: The Baron Corbin Era
« Reply #2347 on: June 12, 2019, 06:58:03 PM »
Speaking of wrestling on YouTube, the latest Road to Fyter Fest is really good.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uEB9CUGMoeo

In just one promo I'm already invested in Darby Allin, someone I'm not overly familiar with other than hearing his name online.

And glad to see Riho is on the Fyter Fest show! Riho v Yuka Sakazaki v Nyla Rose.
« Last Edit: June 12, 2019, 07:11:35 PM by Ja'moke »

Re: Wrestling: The Baron Corbin Era
« Reply #2348 on: June 12, 2019, 07:13:53 PM »
God help the WWE ratings when NFL comes back in September.

Re: Wrestling: The Baron Corbin Era
« Reply #2349 on: June 12, 2019, 10:37:29 PM »
This will be the new Smackdown logo for the Fox show, I don't know why they have photoshopped Bayley to look like Aphex Twin.


Re: Wrestling: The Baron Corbin Era
« Reply #2350 on: June 12, 2019, 10:43:49 PM »
That Logo is shit.

Re: Wrestling: The Baron Corbin Era
« Reply #2351 on: June 12, 2019, 11:42:41 PM »
So did Sky cancel WWE?

Re: Wrestling: The Baron Corbin Era
« Reply #2352 on: June 13, 2019, 01:31:57 AM »
So did Sky cancel WWE?

Yep. Gone to BT but it was Sky's decision and BT picked it up. Ratings were dreadful even compared to what they used to be.

Re: Wrestling: The Baron Corbin Era
« Reply #2353 on: June 13, 2019, 01:33:37 AM »
That Logo is shit.

I quite like it. At least it looks completely different from what they have now. If nothing else they could do with a huge aesthetic makeover. ANYTHING is better than the current boring sets that could be from any time in last 10 years.

Re: Wrestling: The Baron Corbin Era
« Reply #2354 on: June 13, 2019, 08:00:39 AM »
T
Yep. Gone to BT but it was Sky's decision and BT picked it up. Ratings were dreadful even compared to what they used to be.

Do you have a source for this? Would be an interesting read.

And I quite like the new logo.

Re: Wrestling: The Baron Corbin Era
« Reply #2355 on: June 13, 2019, 08:46:30 AM »
if you google 'wwe sky ratings' there are a lot of people saying that, admittedly none of them super credible, but there isn't a Europe-focused Meltzer really. People on the Digital Spy forum seem to know what's what.

BeardFaceMan

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Re: Wrestling: The Baron Corbin Era
« Reply #2356 on: June 13, 2019, 08:57:51 AM »

Do you have a source for this? Would be an interesting read.


Why else do they think this happened, other than Sky not making their money back on their investment because of low ratings? Sky chose to drop WWE, WWE didn't choose to go to BT. I don't know the figures but I'd be massively suprised if this was a steal by BT and they're paying WWE more than Sky were.

You can check the top 10 programs for each channel on the Barb site, most months WWE shows don't even crack the top 10 so its hard to say how many viewers there are. Some months the show at number 10 has around 35k viewers so it's less than that.

Re: Wrestling: The Baron Corbin Era
« Reply #2357 on: June 13, 2019, 11:14:16 AM »
Everything interesting going on in wrestling at the moment is outside of WWE, there's literally no reason to pay any attention to WWE anymore, it's basically irrelevant to wrestling apart from it's name value and longevity. Leave Vince to play with his Hasbros in his bubble, but anything actually relevant and interesting to us all in the real world is AEW, NJPW and the indie scene. I hope they continue to fail and lose money, and that AEW do brilliant and gain a ton of traction, so at least then they may realize they need a reality check and to actually make a sea change in the product they're putting out

Re: Wrestling: The Baron Corbin Era
« Reply #2358 on: June 13, 2019, 11:17:48 AM »
Everything interesting going on in wrestling at the moment is outside of WWE, there's literally no reason to pay any attention to WWE anymore, it's basically irrelevant to wrestling apart from it's name value and longevity. Leave Vince to play with his Hasbros in his bubble, but anything actually relevant and interesting to us all in the real world is AEW, NJPW and the indie scene. I hope they continue to fail and lose money, and that AEW do brilliant and gain a ton of traction, so at least then they may realize they need a reality check and to actually make a sea change in the product they're putting out

Yes and no. WWE is the Hollywood of wrestling and by certain measures any progress made elsewhere will be measured against this yardstick. Also, the postmodern turn in wrestling shows us that going behind the curtain is just as interesting if not more so than what is in front of it. Right now, from a certain perspective, WWE has never been hotter!

Re: Wrestling: The Baron Corbin Era
« Reply #2359 on: June 13, 2019, 11:24:46 AM »
I tell you what, whoever thinks that is crackers. I don't know why they are the yardstick anymore, considering anything done within WWE is meaningless and nothing these days, nobody cares. Jon Moxley spent eight years there with multiple title rains and lots of achievements, but he's still a story of 'what could have been' after he left. He's accomplished more in two or three weeks outside of that bubble than he did in eight years, and I'm sure a lot of people would agree with that perspective.

Re: Wrestling: The Baron Corbin Era
« Reply #2360 on: June 13, 2019, 11:29:25 AM »
I tell you what, whoever thinks that is crackers. I don't know why they are the yardstick anymore, considering anything done within WWE is meaningless and nothing these days, nobody cares. Jon Moxley spent eight years there with multiple title rains and lots of achievements, but he's still a story of 'what could have been' after he left. He's accomplished more in two or three weeks outside of that bubble than he did in eight years, and I'm sure a lot of people would agree with that perspective.

Wrestling is a capitalist art and WWE has been the best at that pecuniary aspect and will be for the next half-decade. That's why they're the yardstick. I haven't enjoyed their television since the botched Invasion angle 18 years ago, and only sporadically engaged with PPVs. People enjoy scale in respect to wrestling; people laugh when I say that Zero1 was as good as New Japan in 2013/4, but it was, but no one was watching it so who gives a fuck. Tree falling in the woods.

up_the_hampipe

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Re: Wrestling: The Baron Corbin Era
« Reply #2361 on: June 13, 2019, 11:39:56 AM »
I quite like it. At least it looks completely different from what they have now. If nothing else they could do with a huge aesthetic makeover. ANYTHING is better than the current boring sets that could be from any time in last 10 years.

We need new sets, we need unique PPV sets, or at least just one different, slightly grander set they use for PPVs. They think that the LED graphics can make any show look different, but it don’t!

Re: Wrestling: The Baron Corbin Era
« Reply #2362 on: June 13, 2019, 11:43:06 AM »
Wrestling is a capitalist art and WWE has been the best at that pecuniary aspect and will be for the next half-decade. That's why they're the yardstick. I haven't enjoyed their television since the botched Invasion angle 18 years ago, and only sporadically engaged with PPVs. People enjoy scale in respect to wrestling; people laugh when I say that Zero1 was as good as New Japan in 2013/4, but it was, but no one was watching it so who gives a fuck. Tree falling in the woods.
That's why I want AEW to be successful, they've got the money, they're going to be a legitimate big budget alternative to WWE. I just don't think WWE can be a yardstick anymore. Anything people do on the main shows is meaningless and I think many people don't actually care or get invested in what they're putting out in terms of characters or storylines. That's why the ratings are going down the pan, but the WWE made it that way themselves.

Ja'moke

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Re: Wrestling: The Baron Corbin Era
« Reply #2363 on: June 13, 2019, 12:05:23 PM »
This will be the new Smackdown logo for the Fox show, I don't know why they have photoshopped Bayley to look like Aphex Twin.



It's not real apparently. A fan on Reddit claimed they made the logo and tried to see how many news outlets they could fool.

Re: Wrestling: The Baron Corbin Era
« Reply #2364 on: June 13, 2019, 12:14:51 PM »
Ah, I have been duped. I was hoping that Bayley's new entrance theme would be Come To Daddy by Aphex Twin but alas it's not to be.

Re: Wrestling: The Baron Corbin Era
« Reply #2365 on: June 13, 2019, 12:24:20 PM »
I tell you what, whoever thinks that is crackers. I don't know why they are the yardstick anymore, considering anything done within WWE is meaningless and nothing these days, nobody cares. Jon Moxley spent eight years there with multiple title rains and lots of achievements, but he's still a story of 'what could have been' after he left. He's accomplished more in two or three weeks outside of that bubble than he did in eight years, and I'm sure a lot of people would agree with that perspective.

But why is Moxley hot right now? Because WWE made him a massive star and therefore he's a massive draw for any company that books him. His new gimmick is that he is now unleashed and there's no way he could have that without what he did with WWE.

That's not to say that he wouldn't have been an indie darling like Omega, but I think we need to let the dust settle a bit and judge him on his own merits further down the line. He's got heat right now, but that heat is all thanks, one way or another, to WWE.

Re: Wrestling: The Baron Corbin Era
« Reply #2366 on: June 13, 2019, 01:51:49 PM »
But why is Moxley hot right now? Because WWE made him a massive star and therefore he's a massive draw for any company that books him. His new gimmick is that he is now unleashed and there's no way he could have that without what he did with WWE.

That's not to say that he wouldn't have been an indie darling like Omega, but I think we need to let the dust settle a bit and judge him on his own merits further down the line. He's got heat right now, but that heat is all thanks, one way or another, to WWE.

Yeah, agreed.

Do you'll think Moxley would have been as big of a star as he is now with AEW if he didn't had his succesful WWE career? I doubt it. In ring wise he's nothing special imo.

Re: Wrestling: The Baron Corbin Era
« Reply #2367 on: June 13, 2019, 01:55:43 PM »
I think he'd be about where Janela is as comparable characters, and why their upcoming feud is a masterstroke.

up_the_hampipe

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Re: Wrestling: The Baron Corbin Era
« Reply #2368 on: June 13, 2019, 01:56:21 PM »
Yeah, agreed.

Do you'll think Moxley would have been as big of a star as he is now with AEW if he didn't had his succesful WWE career? I doubt it. In ring wise he's nothing special imo.

Dripping with charisma, incredible on the mic, capable of having good to great matches. He's a damn star. He had so much hype around him even before he'd debuted on the main roster in WWE, before NXT had become what it is, he was the first developmental talent to generate such huge buzz. He'd made a decent name for himself on the indies prior to WWE, he was always destined to stand out really.

BeardFaceMan

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Re: Wrestling: The Baron Corbin Era
« Reply #2369 on: June 13, 2019, 02:01:19 PM »
Dripping with charisma, incredible on the mic, capable of having good to great matches. He's a damn star. He had so much hype around him even before he'd debuted on the main roster in WWE, before NXT had become what it is, he was the first developmental talent to generate such huge buzz. He'd made a decent name for himself on the indies prior to WWE, he was always destined to stand out really.

Exactly, he was name on the indies before WWE so it's inaccurate to say all his heat is down to WWE. He's now 'unleashed', which meant he wasn't allowed to work his usual style in WWE and now he can go back to doing what he did before. There's a reason he got such a massive reaction at DoN, and it's not because he's an ex-WWE star, it's because the people were excited to see Jon Moxley again instead of Dean Ambrose.