Hippy bullshit, without all the hippy bullshit

[ZoyzaSorris]

Could you compare your experiences on dmt to the ayouasca you made? Is it more/the same  intensity just with a shorter length?

I always think 'one day...'

DMT id be happy to do on my own as the effects so short, its much more practical to integrate into your everyday life, though its long term effects are probably proportionally less profound compared with a massive beefy ayahuasca sesh (which these days id only consider doing with a guide of some sort) as a result. A great tonic though.

[ZoyzaSorris]

Is that the Carhart-Davis one?
I hope it goes well :)

Unfortunately I didnt get on it because they found some mild heart abnormality, which was a real disappointing bugger!

[Keebleman]

Resurrecting this thread because, well I started it after all, and also because I'm about to board the bus for Amsterdam: Magical Mystery Tour is go!  The actual 'ceremony' is on Friday; the retreat ends on Sunday.  Will give an account of the experience once I have resolved it into some sort of coherence, which could be Monday, but then again could be some time in the 2030s.

[NJ Uncut]

Resurrecting this thread because, well I started it after all, and also because I'm about to board the bus for Amsterdam: Magical Mystery Tour is go!  The actual 'ceremony' is on Friday; the retreat ends on Sunday.  Will give an account of the experience once I have resolved it into some sort of coherence, which could be Monday, but then again could be some time in the 2030s.

Good on you and have fun at the ceremony! May you come back from this refreshed, reborn, stronger and better.

You might have a few days of reflection when you're back in reality, sometimes, often, that's the best part.

Is "have a wild time" the correct wish?

[Keebleman]

Been there, done that!

Headlines: despite taking a large dose of psilocybin truffles (brand name, High Hawaiians) there were no strong emotions, no sense of 'oneness', no sense of achieving an insight into 'true' reality.  Of the 15 of us on the retreat I had by far the mildest experience.

I saw lots of coloured lights but there was little coherence to my visions.  "There's no narrative!" I kept telling myself.  I also kept thinking of the advice Michael Pollan had been given: If you see a door, open it; if you see some steps, climb them.  But I saw nothing that I could interact with.  I made myself chuckle when I realised I was like a crappy soldier in a chaotic battle, wandering around looking for someone or something to surrender to.  "Excuse me, could you tell me where I might find The Void?"

I was surprised how much it felt like a dream state, the main difference being that I was always aware of my physical surroundings.  I kept patting the mattress I was lying on, or stretching, or crossing my legs.  I would quite often raise the eye-mask we'd been given, and when I did so reality looked far less impressive than it does normally: colours looked faded and watery, like on an overexposed photograph.  This was contrary to what others reported.

Closest I came to a breakthrough was when I felt a tingling in my nose and upper lip, whereupon that area of my face began to disintegrate like sand being blown in the wind.  "Oh wow, I've heard about this!" I thought.  This was the disintegration of the ego, a literal disintegration in this case.  I felt no fear at all, rather I was very pleased and excited, especially as I hadn't heard of it occurring quite this way before.  Throughout the experience I had been conscious that what I was seeing and feeling was strongly informed by things I had read or movies I had seen (2001's stargate sequence seemed to be a strong influence); I found this really frustrating - "I'm thinking in cliches!" I kept telling myself - but this new phenomenon did seem, at least in its detail, unique to me.

I thought how the tickling felt a little bit like a fly crawling over my face and lift my hand to scratch my nose.  And, sure enough, the fly that had been walking over my face flew away, hitting my hand.  "Oh, there is one!" I said out loud.  The vision of my disintegration vanished.

Immediately after the session I felt both relief and disappointment.  The sense of disappointment grew over the next 24 hours as the others in the group shared their experiences - often with overwhelming emotion - and I was feeling rather left out.

It was not a waste of time though: I am participating in the Imperial College London research into psychedelics and so my experience will be fed back into the academic literature.  And I am not ready to give up on psychedelics just yet; I wonder if despite all my preparations and good intentions, and despite feeling more excited than apprehensive on the day, my nervousness did inhibit me from the full experience, and so further investigation could be fruitful.  But if I had just been there for the drug then, yes, I would have felt I had wasted my time.

[NJ Uncut]

Been there, done that!

Headlines: despite taking a large dose of psilocybin truffles (brand name, High Hawaiians) there were no strong emotions, no sense of 'oneness', no sense of achieving an insight into 'true' reality.  Of the 15 of us on the retreat I had by far the mildest experience.

I saw lots of coloured lights but there was little coherence to my visions.  "There's no narrative!" I kept telling myself.  I also kept thinking of the advice Michael Pollan had been given: If you see a door, open it; if you see some steps, climb them.  But I saw nothing that I could interact with.  I made myself chuckle when I realised I was like a crappy soldier in a chaotic battle, wandering around looking for someone or something to surrender to.  "Excuse me, could you tell me where I might find The Void?"

I was surprised how much it felt like a dream state, the main difference being that I was always aware of my physical surroundings.  I kept patting the mattress I was lying on, or stretching, or crossing my legs.  I would quite often raise the eye-mask we'd been given, and when I did so reality looked far less impressive than it does normally: colours looked faded and watery, like on an overexposed photograph.  This was contrary to what others reported.

Closest I came to a breakthrough was when I felt a tingling in my nose and upper lip, whereupon that area of my face began to disintegrate like sand being blown in the wind.  "Oh wow, I've heard about this!" I thought.  This was the disintegration of the ego, a literal disintegration in this case.  I felt no fear at all, rather I was very pleased and excited, especially as I hadn't heard of it occurring quite this way before.  Throughout the experience I had been conscious that what I was seeing and feeling was strongly informed by things I had read or movies I had seen (2001's stargate sequence seemed to be a strong influence); I found this really frustrating - "I'm thinking in cliches!" I kept telling myself - but this new phenomenon did seem, at least in its detail, unique to me.

I thought how the tickling felt a little bit like a fly crawling over my face and lift my hand to scratch my nose.  And, sure enough, the fly that had been walking over my face flew away, hitting my hand.  "Oh, there is one!" I said out loud.  The vision of my disintegration vanished.

Immediately after the session I felt both relief and disappointment.  The sense of disappointment grew over the next 24 hours as the others in the group shared their experiences - often with overwhelming emotion - and I was feeling rather left out.

It was not a waste of time though: I am participating in the Imperial College London research into psychedelics and so my experience will be fed back into the academic literature.  And I am not ready to give up on psychedelics just yet; I wonder if despite all my preparations and good intentions, and despite feeling more excited than apprehensive on the day, my nervousness did inhibit me from the full experience, and so further investigation could be fruitful.  But if I had just been there for the drug then, yes, I would have felt I had wasted my time.

My man I'm fucking proud of you.

You've already got something valuable from this. You tried to fix yourself. You didn't give in. You didn't just pop pills. You didn't get beaten down.

You took charge. This wasn't about drugs, it was about control.

You sincerely have my respect - it's easy to gamble with drugs and come out one way or another; even the hugest connoisseurs must surely admit you placing yourself in a position of trust of not only drugs but others who believe in magic mushies is is admirable.

I think you'll get the benefits in a subtle way. Not even for any drug reasons; what you explain about the tripping elements is grist for the mill and fun, but what YOU REALLY wanted is a sea change for the soul.

I'm nothing but another troubled soul who has backed this in my various forms, but can I leave you with a question?

What will you be scared of after this?

(I'd consider it a roaring success if you can simply chip away some of the more uncontrollable stuff. The rest, well, it's good being human. I'm pro drug, but I'm not into sterilising yourself. I genuinely admire you for such a big step, that I think will give you presents and gifts over time. You might be too close to it to even appreciate what a positive, brave story it is. Do talk about it - who knows where it will lead, who it can help, and what this kind of treatment can do for others?)

I don't think I've ever had an instant reinvention. I've even obliterated my psyche for a few hours. It's called a trip because you come back - and the fun part has always been examining, searching for meaning. Which, I suppose, leads me back to: what's next for you?

Damn, you've made my night. Really. Sincerely, thank you. You might not feel you've done much, but you're not meant to have all the answers, no matter how many shrooms you glug with a robe on :)

[bgmnts]

It's not exactly hippy but does anyone know if CBD oil helps relax you? I've never had luck with getting high with weed as I guess the thc doesnt affect me but i've heard on the grapevine that cbd is good for anxiety and all that shit.

[NJ Uncut]

It's not exactly hippy but does anyone know if CBD oil helps relax you? I've never had luck with getting high with weed as I guess the thc doesnt affect me but i've heard on the grapevine that cbd is good for anxiety and all that shit.

I've heard enough testimony I can respect to say yeah it would help the generic You.

But for the person unaffected by THC? You? not the same chemical, but bets're off pal.

[bgmnts]

Nice one, will get on it.

Also, is that a tattoo on New Jack's forehead or is it just utterly mulched from blading?

[NJ Uncut]

Nice one, will get on it.

Also, is that a tattoo on New Jack's forehead or is it just utterly mulched from blading?

I was gonna say "it's a couple quid in my local chemist and it seems almost ubiqituous so just buy some" seemed hopelessly reckless, so I am glad you reached the conclusion I merely implied. Dunno if you're on SSRIs or owt like that, but I've mentioned that soooo (also tempted to chalk your THC immunity up to a hormone issue, but that's cursory research. Shouldn't have bearing on CBD, but who the fuck knows)

New Jack is Hardcore, sunshine. Like you've never been in a job interview going south and wanted escape, Bigmounts. Blading = INSTANT GETAWAY!

.... I'm probably gonna buy some of those "microdose" packs from wholecelium.com and do them at Big Oil. For creativity! Churning out reports in MS Word in a fucking oil refinery. Creativity, that's what I need!

[Keebleman]

My man I'm fucking proud of you.

You've already got something valuable from this. You tried to fix yourself. You didn't give in. You didn't just pop pills. You didn't get beaten down.

You took charge. This wasn't about drugs, it was about control.

You sincerely have my respect - it's easy to gamble with drugs and come out one way or another; even the hugest connoisseurs must surely admit you placing yourself in a position of trust of not only drugs but others who believe in magic mushies is is admirable.

I think you'll get the benefits in a subtle way. Not even for any drug reasons; what you explain about the tripping elements is grist for the mill and fun, but what YOU REALLY wanted is a sea change for the soul.

I'm nothing but another troubled soul who has backed this in my various forms, but can I leave you with a question?

What will you be scared of after this?

(I'd consider it a roaring success if you can simply chip away some of the more uncontrollable stuff. The rest, well, it's good being human. I'm pro drug, but I'm not into sterilising yourself. I genuinely admire you for such a big step, that I think will give you presents and gifts over time. You might be too close to it to even appreciate what a positive, brave story it is. Do talk about it - who knows where it will lead, who it can help, and what this kind of treatment can do for others?)

I don't think I've ever had an instant reinvention. I've even obliterated my psyche for a few hours. It's called a trip because you come back - and the fun part has always been examining, searching for meaning. Which, I suppose, leads me back to: what's next for you?

Damn, you've made my night. Really. Sincerely, thank you. You might not feel you've done much, but you're not meant to have all the answers, no matter how many shrooms you glug with a robe on :)

Thanks for that!  What am I scared of now?  Well, a few days before leaving for Holland I told someone that the thing I was most worried about was coming back home exactly the same...and that is more or less what happened.  Not that I dislike myself - quite the opposite in fact - and I tend to be a very positive and optimistic person, but I was hoping to come back with a deeper understanding of myself and the world, and more original ways of thinking and of expressing myself.  And, well, neither of those things happened, at least as far as I can tell.  A next step - and perhaps you can tell me whether this would be a waste of money or not - is a session with a psychedelic integration therapist to help me make sense of the experience.  The retreat organizers have sent us a list of PITs along with lots of other material and advice.

A word about the retreat itself: it was superbly well organised.  There were activities throughout designed to help us prepare for the ceremony and then deal with the aftermath.  The location was a gorgeous house about 100 miles from Amsterdam.  The food was all prepared on site and was magnificent.

There were 11 men at the retreat and 4 women.  Average age was 45ish, I don't think anyone was under 30 (in contrast with the guides, all of whom, I think, were in their 20s).  Brits were the majority but there were also Americans, a Brazilian, a Swede an Italian and a French lady.  There were no conflicts or tension at all, in part I suppose, because in the 72 hours we were together we were so busy!  But not oppressively so: as I say, it was very well structured.

[Ferris]

It's not exactly hippy but does anyone know if CBD oil helps relax you? I've never had luck with getting high with weed as I guess the thc doesnt affect me but i've heard on the grapevine that cbd is good for anxiety and all that shit.

I take THC/CBD capsules occasionally to help me sleep. They're mildly psychoactive (I think 2.5mg of THC and the same of CBD per capsule), about equivalent to having 2 pints I'd say. Very relaxing and nice, sleep like a mentalist.

I don't think such things are legal in the UK, though pure CBD oil (in a very weak form and with no THC) can be had. It'd be the equivalent of a thimbleful of weak lager in my opinion, so I doubt it is effective to anyone but the most hyper-sensitive user.

Smoked a monster bifter the other day from a dispensary and time started to speed up and slow down at random and blinding green/white lights kept occasionally flashing in the corners of my vision. First time I've smoked anything for a very long time, not tempted to do it again (although it was fun in hindsight).

[NJ Uncut]

Thanks for that!  What am I scared of now?  Well, a few days before leaving for Holland I told someone that the thing I was most worried about was coming back home exactly the same...and that is more or less what happened.  Not that I dislike myself - quite the opposite in fact - and I tend to be a very positive and optimistic person, but I was hoping to come back with a deeper understanding of myself and the world, and more original ways of thinking and of expressing myself.  And, well, neither of those things happened, at least as far as I can tell.  A next step - and perhaps you can tell me whether this would be a waste of money or not - is a session with a psychedelic integration therapist to help me make sense of the experience.  The retreat organizers have sent us a list of PITs along with lots of other material and advice.

Hmm, I'm unfamiliar with what a PIT might do but it sounds worth a try if you're trying to wring meaning out of it.

Your actual trip sounded like it was a threshold dose, and certainly not the mad sledgehammer-to-personality ego death of a higher dose. That's much scarier; but if you've any interest in that, I'd be tempted to speak to a PIT to root around and see what's what.  Moolah though? I'd be tempted to at least pick up some literature or read experience reports on Erowid.

My all time favourite analytical drug book is The Essential Psychedelic Guide by D.M. Turner, he's very graphic and was a superb writer when it came to describing what drugs did what for him. His book is on Erowid (soft bastard died of supposedly doing ket in the bath)

https://erowid.org/library/books_online/essential_psychedelic_guide/2c-b.shtml

Warning: drug lit sometimes gets a bit mystical. Like, I don't know if you know a zen koan is, but sometimes the meaning is like a Roshach test: it's your interpretation, and what you can get hung up on looking for is in fact the answer you seek.

I don't think it's a miracle cure anyway.  Well, I believe it could do great things for people with PTSD for example but I'm hardly going to be dosing people up myself to find out! I can be quite reflective and deep, and as above, it's usually when embracing normality I've found the benefits of getting away from myself.

What do you desire a deeper understanding for anyway? Not a deliberately obtuse question: there may be an element of you looking too hard. Sometimes a harsh trip or even a bad life experience simply tells you to hold onto what you got. I'm glad for you, because you sound pretty free, pretty driven. Maybe you don't feel it, but if you ask many people what they fear, it can range from macabre to outlandish to laughably inane.

Perhaps you're capable and well adjusted already? And if not, well. I'm not asking for a thesis on yer moral life past and present, but I've found even low doses of shrooms are effective at changing patterns. Leaving the drink be a really common one.

See how you turn out. We're all constantly changing, anyway :)

A word about the retreat itself: it was superbly well organised.  There were activities throughout designed to help us prepare for the ceremony and then deal with the aftermath.  The location was a gorgeous house about 100 miles from Amsterdam.  The food was all prepared on site and was magnificent.

There were 11 men at the retreat and 4 women.  Average age was 45ish, I don't think anyone was under 30 (in contrast with the guides, all of whom, I think, were in their 20s).  Brits were the majority but there were also Americans, a Brazilian, a Swede an Italian and a French lady.  There were no conflicts or tension at all, in part I suppose, because in the 72 hours we were together we were so busy!  But not oppressively so: as I say, it was very well structured.

If you remove the drug element entirely it sounds very communal, fun, beautifully set...!  I hope it's an experience you treasure. It is certainly intriguing enough an idea and setting even without the massive questions about what psychedelics can do for the nature of the self.

[Keebleman]

Resurrecting this thread because Michael Pollan has returned to the Ezra Klein show: his 2018 interview there was what got me interested in giving this stuff a try.  This time they discuss Oregon's new proposal, voted in on Nov 3rd, that psychedelics should be used in therapy in the state.

https://www.stitcher.com/show/the-ezra-klein-show/episode/michael-pollan-on-the-psychedelic-society-80125450

I was listening to it today in work as I patrolled the building (I'm a security guard).  Around 19 and a half minutes in, when Pollan is describing how a therapy session with a psychedelic would be set up and structured, I had a flashback to my psilocybin trip in Holland.  In the 15 months since the retreat I've had a couple of dreams which came close to recreating the feel of the experience for me, but this is the first time it has happened while I was awake.  It wasn't very pleasant: for a few seconds I felt very claustrophobic and anxious, and I had a mental image which resembled those I experienced at the time.  Had to switch the interview off for a moment.

[Keebleman]

Resurrecting this thread yet again (third time) because there was an excellent programme on BBC2 tonight about the Imperial College pscilocybin trials that I applied to participate in three years ago.  The section on the modern history of psychdelics was very brief and cursory, and there was rather a lot of David Nutt who has too much of the evangelist about him for my liking, but on the whole I found it extremely well done and very worthwhile.  It was particularly interesting for me to hear about the experiences of the volunteers and how they compared with my own, and those of my fellow psychonauts on the retreat in Holland.

It's available on iplayer for a month.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode/m000w7bq/the-psychedelic-drug-trial

[peanutbutter]

Done a lot of acid last year outta boredom. Maybe as often as once a month.

It  was pretty handy in terms of like... in a situation where I'm stagnated as fuck it did manage to feel like a nice little stretch for the brain. And the 6 hours or so after you start coming down where you're not madly tripping but also not really useful in an kind of way is about as close as I can get to deliberately doing fuck all these days.
Will  probably take some clubbing over the next year but man... the length is a big commitment. Could do shrooms but they're a much more introspective thing, I always find.




Definitely some people I really can't imagine dealing with it too well though, especially first time. Wouldn't want to be near really intense people on it either, not that scanning through this thread is making me think of anyone in particular...