Corbyn 23: Hail Discorbia

[Mrs Wogans lemon drizzle]

I think they sell those in ASDA.  Yummy.

[sponk]

I'd be interested in knowing what Corbyn would accept as "credible evidence". People saying they know it was Iran are no worse than the usual suspects saying they know it's a false flag by the States. Fuck em all.

[Howj Begg]

Well, the Trump admin's comments seem non-credible thus far.

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/us-politics/trump-oman-gulf-tanker-attack-oil-japan-kokuka-courageous-strait-hormuz-a8958916.html

The owner of the Japanese tanker attacked on Thursday said US reports have provided "false" information about what happened in the Gulf of Oman.

The ship operator said "flying objects" that may have been bullets were the cause of damage to the vessel, rather than mines used by Iranian forces, as the US has suggested.

Yutaka Katada, chief executive of the Japanese company operating the ship called Kokuka Courageous, one of two vessels attacked near the Strait of Hormuz on Thursday, said the damage could not have been caused by mines or torpedos that are shot underwater, since the damage was reportedly above the ship's waterline.

"It seems that something flew towards them. That created the hole, is the report I've received," Mr Katada said at a press conference in Tokyo on Friday, the Financial Times reported. Mr Katada also described reports of a mine attack as "false" according to several outlets in attendance at the press conference.

Donald Trump's administration has meanwhile insisted the attacks were carried out by Iran, which has denied having any involvement in either of the two incidents.

[Zetetic]

How about if you spell his last name 'Qatadah'?

[DrGreggles]

I'd be interested in knowing what Corbyn would accept as "credible evidence". People saying they know it was Iran are no worse than the usual suspects saying they know it's a false flag by the States. Fuck em all.

I think some evidence stronger than 'man said so' would be a start.

[Howj Begg]

How about if you spell his last name 'Qatadah'?

Hiding in plain sight.

[Paul Calf]

Johnson's going to get his war.

[greencalx]

Corbyn's not saying it definitively isn't Iran. Just that we shouldn't jump to conclusions.

[chveik]

I'd be interested in knowing what Corbyn would accept as "credible evidence". People saying they know it was Iran are no worse than the usual suspects saying they know it's a false flag by the States. Fuck em all.

are you proud of this? do you think it's representative of your best work?

[Johnny Yesno]

I'd be interested in knowing what Corbyn would accept as "credible evidence". People saying they know it was Iran are no worse than the usual suspects saying they know it's a false flag by the States. Fuck em all.

Ooh, I dunno. A dodgy dossier. That isn't dodgy. A dossier, in fact. That kind of thing.

[Johnny Yesno]

Well, the Trump admin's comments seem non-credible thus far.

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/us-politics/trump-oman-gulf-tanker-attack-oil-japan-kokuka-courageous-strait-hormuz-a8958916.html

The owner of the Japanese tanker attacked on Thursday said US reports have provided "false" information about what happened in the Gulf of Oman.

The ship operator said "flying objects" that may have been bullets were the cause of damage to the vessel, rather than mines used by Iranian forces, as the US has suggested.

Yutaka Katada, chief executive of the Japanese company operating the ship called Kokuka Courageous, one of two vessels attacked near the Strait of Hormuz on Thursday, said the damage could not have been caused by mines or torpedos that are shot underwater, since the damage was reportedly above the ship's waterline.

"It seems that something flew towards them. That created the hole, is the report I've received," Mr Katada said at a press conference in Tokyo on Friday, the Financial Times reported. Mr Katada also described reports of a mine attack as "false" according to several outlets in attendance at the press conference.

Donald Trump's administration has meanwhile insisted the attacks were carried out by Iran, which has denied having any involvement in either of the two incidents.

I think we've had enough of so-called experts, don't you? I say we ask these guys what they think.

[sponk]

Corbyn's not saying it definitively isn't Iran. Just that we shouldn't jump to conclusions.

Of course. I should have made it clear that I wasn't referring to Corbyn then. Other people on this thread have strongly implied that it was a false flag, and lots of people elsewhere have said it blatantly. I was talking about them.

[biggytitbo]

Corbyns willingness to continue to stand up to the Empire group-think remains brilliant but I am starting to worry about what lengths they will go to to stop him becoming PM. A UK PM willing to call out the latest 'looked at me funny' pub psycho provocation seems like something that won't be allowed.

[Buelligan]

Of course. I should have made it clear that I wasn't referring to Corbyn then. Other people on this thread have strongly implied that it was a false flag, and lots of people elsewhere have said it blatantly. I was talking about them.

Like who sponk?  Who here would dare to consider the possibility that the US and Israel might work together for war in the Middle East?  I mean, why would they even think it?

[biniput]

I'd be interested in knowing what Corbyn would accept as "credible evidence". People saying they know it was Iran are no worse than the usual suspects saying they know it's a false flag by the States. Fuck em all.

Well someone must have done something right? This is only behaviour that is carried out in certain circumstances and only by a very narrow set of institutions/individuals. Who would benefit from such attacks other than the US in it's quest for a war. If it isn't Iran or the US then who?

[BlodwynPig]

Well someone must have done something right? This is only behaviour that is carried out in certain circumstances and only by a very narrow set of institutions/individuals. Who would benefit from such attacks other than the US in it's quest for a war. If it isn't Iran or the US then who?

Jeremy Corbyn himself?

[pancreas]

Israel? Saudi Arabia?

[Suki Bapswent]

Just to add to the chorus, it's absolutely astonishing that Britain's Foreign Secretary would call a request for credible evidence "pathetic", rather than just provide said evidence, or at least respond diplomatically. What the fuck kind of age are we living in?

[Johnny Yesno]

Who would benefit from such attacks other than the US in it's quest for a war. If it isn't Iran or the US then who?

[Howj Begg]

Saudi Arabia is definitely the hot favourite at the moment, yeah.

[BlodwynPig]

Just to add to the chorus, it's absolutely astonishing that Britain's Foreign Secretary would call a request for credible evidence "pathetic", rather than just provide said evidence, or at least respond diplomatically. What the fuck kind of age are we living in?

What can be done? If it is those with ultimate power who are doing this and the electorate shrugs, what options are left to return to a time of accountability, decency and Bergerac?

[Johnny Yesno]

Saudi Arabia is definitely the hot favourite at the moment, yeah.

Who knows, but only a month ago there was this: Four ships 'sabotaged' in the Gulf of Oman amid tensions.

Saudi Arabia confirmed that two Saudi oil tankers sustained "significant damage".

Another vessel was Norwegian-registered, whilst the fourth was reportedly UAE-flagged.

Oil tankers have been attacked in the region before, by al-Qaeda off Yemen in 2002, by Somali maritime pirates in the Gulf of Oman, and more recently by Houthi rebels in the Red Sea.

Given that, I would definitely want to see some evidence before attacking another country.

[Howj Begg]

So if it is pirates, Saudi and USA would probably have correct intelligence about that. Which means they would be using this as a pretext. Seems too near to the previous very deliberate agenda-setting by Bolton for Iran as the "next one" to not be planned, I feel, but yes, who knows. The chance of it being Iran seems to be very weak, however.

The case for war with Iran is currently being fabricated in the White House in time to capture the 2020 election, so we'll find out soon enough that the identity of the perpetrators don't matter. Boris is a very timely PM for this role. I wouldn't be surprised if May knew this was in the wind and wanted no part of it.

[Suki Bapswent]

What can be done? If it is those with ultimate power who are doing this and the electorate shrugs, what options are left to return to a time of accountability, decency and Bergerac?

If the likes of Jeremy Hunt is who constitutes "ultimate power" we're truly fucked. But anyone who's looked at this beyond a newspaper headline knows the government aren't in charge. Which isn't to say it's some reptile-shapeshifting illuminati, but it's definitely a complicated mix of business interests, wealth generators, public manipulation and fear of regime change.

What can be done? Fuck knows. That's the great uncharted territory. But it's coming. Maybe not tomorrow, but it's where this current structure will change.

[chveik]

So if it is pirates, Saudi and USA would probably have correct intelligence about that. Which means they would be using this as a pretext. Seems too near to the previous very deliberate agenda-setting by Bolton for Iran as the "next one" to not be planned, I feel, but yes, who knows. The chance of it being Iran seems to be very weak, however.

The case for war with Iran is currently being fabricated in the White House in time to capture the 2020 election, so we'll find out soon enough that the identity of the perpetrators don't matter. Boris is a very timely PM for this role. I wouldn't be surprised if May knew this was in the wind and wanted no part of it.

I doubt that. these people would do anything to stay in power.

[Johnny Yesno]

So if it is pirates, Saudi and USA would probably have correct intelligence about that. Which means they would be using this as a pretext. Seems too near to the previous very deliberate agenda-setting by Bolton for Iran as the "next one" to not be planned, I feel, but yes, who knows. The chance of it being Iran seems to be very weak, however.

Oh, you can always rely on pirates or nutcases to do something eventually, if you're prepared to wait long enough for a pretext.

I wouldn't be surprised if May knew this was in the wind and wanted no part of it.

Hell, no. Hubby has investments in Lockheed Martin that need nursing.

[jamiefairlie]

What can be done? If it is those with ultimate power who are doing this and the electorate shrugs, what options are left to return to a time of accountability, decency and Bergerac?

None. It has to get much worse before the pendulum swings, decades probably.

[Buelligan]

Well I think the US is, if not solely responsible, then doing it with a mate.  The reason I think that is the little film of the alleged Iranian guys allegedly recovering an unexploded limpet mine from a tanker under cover of darkness. 

Because that film proves that either the US fabricated the whole fucking thing or they watch and film all the tankers all the time and film those tankers from every side, even at night.  Or it was a magical stroke of luck, they just happened to be filming that tanker in the middle of the night from that very angle because they enjoy filming random tankers.  Fuck off.

[hummingofevil]

It's the Saudis. The US are just their bitches. Where Israel falls into this (more as what the Saudi's have planned for Israel when Iran is out of the way - Israel is a useful ally at the moment obviously) I am still not entirely sure but it's the Saudi's who have a clear and present urge for at least regime change in Iran. This is all the Saudi's doing and I wouldn't even be surprised if it was the Saudi's pretending to be Iranian's to dupe the American's. It's the Saudi's goading the US into attacking Iran.

It's going to end up in a fucking disaster or all disasters.

[BlodwynPig]

Just dont expect the journalists to expose this

Heard that the BBC have been buying military grade body armour and hiring a military security firm