Fleabag - Series 2 [split topic]

[sevendaughters]

if the camera is meant to represent some kind of solipsistic gaze that simultaneously offers some kind of inner world access AND some kind of critique (like, look at this narcissist, literally acting as if the world surrounds her, and isn't that like other tv ooh made you think) then i do think that is a little bit noteworthy but noteworthy doesn't really cut it. that said i've seen Killing Eve so i don't think it is meant to be smart and groundbreaking television, just fluffy, and like Miranda with pretensions of Brecht/House of Cards.

[Dr Sanchez]

I've watched 4 episodes. It's taken me three weeks to do so. I was intrigued by the good reviews but I just can't get into it and I dislike every single character except the hamster.

My main issue is the lack of laughs. I don't think I've laughed once so far. I know comedy isn't supposed to be funny anymore but this takes the biscuit.

[Blue Jam]

"Women aren't actually allowed to..."
"FUCK OFF, I KNOW!"

Oh gawd, I love this series

[arpster]

rather enjoyed the first series but it's turned into smug, middleclass arsewater...with a cast of increasingly irritating cunts, particularly Fleabag herself...who's gone from funny as fuck free spirit to needy as fuck pain in the arse...

[BlodwynPig]

rather enjoyed the first series but it's turned into smug, middleclass arsewater...with a cast of increasingly irritating cunts, particularly Fleabag herself...who's gone from funny as fuck free spirit to needy as fuck pain in the arse...

yes. Thinking back to the end of the last series - that was great television and didn't take itself too seriously. This is Pride and Prejudice for the cunt-set.

[chveik]

yes. Thinking back to the end of the last series - that was great television and didn't take itself too seriously. This is Pride and Prejudice for the cunt-set.

I hope you mean the TV adaptation of Pride and Prejudice, not the book itself.

btw this is absolutely terrible.

[BlodwynPig]

I hope you mean the TV adaptation of Pride and Prejudice, not the book itself.

btw this is absolutely terrible.

The TV adaptation of Pride and Prejudice.

[BritishHobo]

rather enjoyed the first series but it's turned into smug, middleclass arsewater...with a cast of increasingly irritating cunts, particularly Fleabag herself...who's gone from funny as fuck free spirit to needy as fuck pain in the arse...

Funny as fuck free spirit? The first series was all about her coming to terms with having a sex addiction and struggling with feeling responsible for the death of her best friend because she fucked the friend's boyfriend.

[Blue Jam]

Will the wedding actually be going ahead then? I hope not, I'd love a happy ending.

[MiddleRabbit]

Funny as fuck free spirit? The first series was all about her coming to terms with having a sex addiction and struggling with feeling responsible for the death of her best friend because she fucked the friend's boyfriend.

I'm with you on this.  Fleabag's always been an arsehole.  It's not like she has any particular connection with Moriarty, she wants him because she can't/shouldn't have him in exactly the same way she wanted her mate's boyfriend.

[poodlefaker]

Has anyone accused it of ripping off Chewing Gum yet? If not, I could probably knock up a Guardian column about how black women's voices are once again being subsumed by white privelege.

[Clownbaby]

.

[Clownbaby]

It just try's too hard to be the "Honest" and only female narrative that goes on in all women's heads.

It's a middle class and Guardian five star approved version of what women go through that puts me off.

WITH LOOKS TO CAMERA

An edgy anal sex experience of life, death and everything in between. But it isn't. And worst of all, it's  just not that funny.

Yeah. There's an overwhelming vibe of "by women for women, finally something edgy and sassy that WOMYN can relate to". Truthfully I've never struggled to relate to characters that aren't women and I've never had a problem discussing sexual things with people so it does not impress me or make me feel empowered (how some reviewers seem to be pushing it) particularly to see a female comedy character talking about anal and not being pareticularly nice. I just want to laugh. I haven't laughed yet.

[Ignatius_S]

Has anyone accused it of ripping off Chewing Gum yet? If not, I could probably knock up a Guardian column about how black women's voices are once again being subsumed by white privelege.

Well, both shows were based on plays - Fleabag was the earlier work, FWIW.

[Josef K]

Anybody else feeling like the sexy priest is going to turn out to be an absolute wrong-un?

There's little flashes of him being controlling, plus interrupting a confession by a woman exhibiting signs of mental illness (talking to voices) to initiate sex would 100% be labelled abuse outside of a comedy show.

[MiddleRabbit]

Anybody else feeling like the sexy priest is going to turn out to be an absolute wrong-un?

There's little flashes of him being controlling, plus interrupting a confession by a woman exhibiting signs of mental illness (talking to voices) to initiate sex would 100% be labelled abuse outside of a comedy show.

In the confession booth scene, yes definitely.  Taking advantage of a woman who was obviously vulnerable was, I thought appalling.  I found the reaction on Twitter similarly disturbing: a load of alleged feminists phwoaring about it?  Not a great look for them.

This last week though, I didn't have a problem with him because she wasn't the one having advantage taken.  As I said, I don't think she's changed much.  She's a bit like Al Pacino in that thread in the Movies sections where he ate too many chickens and went vegan for 17 hours.  She knows she's fucked in the head but can't seem to stop herself having it off with people who she really ought not.  She fancies him alright, but I don't think she really has any connection with him.  You know, 'arms', 'neck, things like that.  Their conversations seem stilted.  He doesn't really want to be a priest, he just likes the clothes, the surface accoutrements.  Just like her towards him.

[Alternative Carpark]

Anybody else feeling like the sexy priest is going to turn out to be an absolute wrong-un?

There's little flashes of him being controlling, plus interrupting a confession by a woman exhibiting signs of mental illness (talking to voices) to initiate sex would 100% be labelled abuse outside of a comedy show.

I think that was meant to be disturbing, or at any rate, not something we were supposed to condone in him, yes.  They are probably both meant to be rather damaged or at least flawed people.

Wouldn't really say this was a comedy, or at least not a sitcom, anyway.  More of a sort of offbeat comedy drama, usually with more of the latter.  It's arguably experimenting with the form a little, such as the way she moved the camera at the end of the last episode, and the priest being able to notice her making asides to the audience is an interesting kind of twist on that convention.  Plenty of drama and comedy has featured that sort of 'addressing the audience' thing - goes back centuries, to stage plays - but it's unusual to have other characters commenting directly on that.  You can maybe rationalise that, as some have, about it being a symptom of the character being emotionally or mentally unstable and the priest either being the only one who notices, because he also is, or the only one who comments on it whereas everyone else is tactful and pretends not to notice.  Or there may be an element of just playing around with the fourth wall and raising questions about how 'real' or 'reliable' a fiction like this can be.

Don't mind it anyway, I find it an interesting programme - having missed the first series, so this one didn't really have anything to live up to - I've been catching up a bit with the first series since, having watched the first two episodes of that as well, so far.  I do know what people mean about the characters not being very sympathetic, but that's not necessarily a problem, some novels and plays have that too - they just need to be interesting enough, and I'm curious enough about it to be interested in carrying on with it.

[arpster]

Funny as fuck free spirit? The first series was all about her coming to terms with having a sex addiction and struggling with feeling responsible for the death of her best friend because she fucked the friend's boyfriend.

yep, and before that particular rug / reveal was pulled in the final episode she'd gone about her bidness in a funny as fuck free spirited way...which made for an enjoyable 6 episodes...this series she's turned into a needy fuckin nuisance ...and every other character has also upped the pain-in-the-dirtbox dial a few notches..and I also cant stand the smarmy little twat priest....so overall it's made for a less enjoyable experience...

[NoOffenceLynn]

Yeah. There's an overwhelming vibe of "by women for women, finally something edgy and sassy that WOMYN can relate to". Truthfully I've never struggled to relate to characters that aren't women and I've never had a problem discussing sexual things with people so it does not impress me or make me feel empowered (how some reviewers seem to be pushing it) particularly to see a female comedy character talking about anal and not being pareticularly nice. I just want to laugh. I haven't laughed yet.

Indeed, all my friends seem to like it. When I mentioned that I didn't think it was that great, you would swear I had just admitted to being a neo nazi, such was their over the top reaction. Almost like I was "letting the side down" by not getting the fabulousness of Fleabag.

[kalowski]

Yeah. There's an overwhelming vibe of "by women for women, finally something edgy and sassy that WOMYN can relate to". Truthfully I've never struggled to relate to characters that aren't women and I've never had a problem discussing sexual things with people so it does not impress me or make me feel empowered (how some reviewers seem to be pushing it) particularly to see a female comedy character talking about anal and not being pareticularly nice. I just want to laugh. I haven't laughed yet.

*Looks to camera*
"I haven't"

[Blue Jam]

Yeah. There's an overwhelming vibe of "by women for women, finally something edgy and sassy that WOMYN can relate to"

Sorry, I just can't agree with this. In a world of well-meaning but lazy and one-dimensional "sassy women" and "strong female characters" I've found it refreshing to see a flawed, vulnerable, complex one who is an unsympathetic arsehole. More than one, in fact- her sister and future mother-in-law (or not- here's hoping) are arseholes too.

Her sister's husband takes the cake here though- he makes my skin crawl. One of the least likeable comedy characters ever, in a good way- I don't think I've enjoyed hating a character that much since Martin Mucklowe.

[mjwilson]

I'm with you on this.  Fleabag's always been an arsehole.  It's not like she has any particular connection with Moriarty

I don't think that's quite fair, he can sense when she's turning to camera, which presumably is supposed to show that they have a real connection.

(Alternative explanation: actually everyone in Fleabag can see her turning to an imaginary camera to say what she thinks about everything, but everyone else has politely agreed to ignore it.)

[Dr Sanchez]

Indeed, all my friends seem to like it. When I mentioned that I didn't think it was that great, you would swear I had just admitted to being a neo nazi, such was their over the top reaction. Almost like I was "letting the side down" by not getting the fabulousness of Fleabag.

I know the feeling. I have a friend who pretty much likes the same comedy as me. He would message me frequently asking if I'd watched Fleabag. I put it off for ages because it looked like something I wouldn't like. Eventually I gave in and found it utterly unfunny and mostly hard to watch due to "smug rich girl has great sex and hates everyone but is sassy with it" I messaged him my opinion and he couldn't believe it. He had the audacity to suggest I wasn't ready for how "out there" this show is.

If anything I found it dull. Do some people think this stuff is shocking or edgy in 2019?

[kalowski]

If anything I found it dull. Do some people think this stuff is shocking or edgy in 2019?

Yes. My wife.

But she likes Miranda.

[BlodwynPig]

It's Peep Show for Middle-Class women approaching the menopause

[Blue Jam]

...or Peep Show for people with really fucked-up families... more fucked-up than Mark's, I mean...

[MiddleRabbit]

I don't think that's quite fair, he can sense when she's turning to camera, which presumably is supposed to show that they have a real connection.

(Alternative explanation: actually everyone in Fleabag can see her turning to an imaginary camera to say what she thinks about everything, but everyone else has politely agreed to ignore it.)

Maybe it's nitpicking, but I think that's him feeling a connection to her, I don't get the impression that she's paid that much attention to him beyond the fact that she 'can't' have him.  A couple of episodes ago - after they went shopping for cassocks - she gave him the cold shoulder as soon as he started asking questions about her.  She didn't seem to like the idea of letting anybody into her head and, more or less, told him to fuck off.

He thinks there's a connection, but I don't think there is and that's because she doesn't really want one.

[Z]

Is the priest not an alcoholic? Is that just the way yer man acts in general?

[Dr Sanchez]

Yes. My wife.

But she likes Miranda.

She must have missed the series where Miranda went mad for arse sex and depression.

[Lisa Jesusandmarychain]

" shopping for cassocks ". What a lovely phrase.