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Stuff you've always wondered about live music

Started by Nice Relaxing Poo, April 16, 2019, 04:23:40 PM

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famethrowa

Quote from: Dr Sanchez on April 17, 2019, 11:30:29 PM
Springsteen has become completely reliant on them it seems. In his Netflix Broadway show he has at least 4 different monitors setup at different angles that he's reading off at any given moment and this was filmed after he'd performed the same setlist and stories hundreds of times before on the run.

He does it in a very subtle way but once you notice it there's no unseeing it.

True. I love this song but can't watch this, the eyes go down before every single line, sometimes halfway through the line.

https://youtu.be/pvfFuASYgfM

Dr Sanchez

Quote from: famethrowa on April 18, 2019, 12:24:11 AM
True. I love this song but can't watch this, the eyes go down before every single line, sometimes halfway through the line.

https://youtu.be/pvfFuASYgfM

Yeah, I love Bruce but it's off putting, especially on songs he should know inside out.

I noticed it first on the Live from NYC DVD which was circa 2000 I believe. It looks like he's closing his eyes or really concentrating but he's sneakily having a little read.

Dr Syntax Head

Didn't Michael Stipe just have a stand with lyric sheets on stage later in REM's career? Not a bad thing

Keebleman

Quote from: Dr Sanchez on April 17, 2019, 11:30:29 PM
Springsteen has become completely reliant on them it seems. In his Netflix Broadway show he has at least 4 different monitors setup at different angles that he's reading off at any given moment and this was filmed after he'd performed the same setlist and stories hundreds of times before on the run.

He does it in a very subtle way but once you notice it there's no unseeing it.

Really?  How did he work this then?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oGyff2FdcxE

This was Cardiff in 2013.  I was there as a steward and hadn't been particularly excited by the prospect of an evening with Bruce.  But as the hours ticked by I was gradually won over, and was particularly impressed by the section where he played the requests of people in the crowd.  The song chosen this time was something called TV Movie.  He says at the start that it had never been performed live before and, even though it's not on this video, I remember him saying at the end, "You heard it here first, you heard it here last."  I checked on a Springsteen website that has a database of all his setlists, and indeed TV Movie had never been performed live before this night in Cardiff.

Was it a plant?  He does seem to be glancing down on a couple of occasions, but I don't suppose it would be too tricky for some minion to call up the lyrics at a moment's notice.

JesusAndYourBush

Quote from: Dr Sanchez on April 16, 2019, 05:53:42 PM
Yeah, if they point to their ears then it's a problem with the mix they're hearing.

Bands with elaborate stage setups will also have click tracks and vocal cues for each member.

Here's a U2 in ear recording. I think they rely too heavily on in ear monitors but they were never the best live band in the world.

https://youtu.be/pl-VzRZVVJI

Is that real?  Blimey, he needs talking through it like a likkle baby.

Dr Sanchez


Quote from: Keebleman on April 18, 2019, 02:13:04 AM
.

Was it a plant?  He does seem to be glancing down on a couple of occasions, but I don't suppose it would be too tricky for some minion to call up the lyrics at a moment's notice.

It's exactly that. He has a guy backstage that pulls up lyrics,  chords, and whatever. Bruce will say something like "we've never played this" the minion will get to work and send the information to the monitors of Bruce and the musicians. The drummer even has a little monitor on his kit.

I don't think this is necessarily cheating as such because it still takes skill and a good band to pull it off but it's definitely not the magic it would seem to be.

This video is a good example of Bruce getting info from backstage and also working stuff out with the band for a more complicated cover song.

https://youtu.be/L-Ds-FXGGQg



Quote from: JesusAndYourBush on April 18, 2019, 02:37:22 AM
Is that real?  Blimey, he needs talking through it like a likkle baby.

Haha yeah it's 100% real. Did you know they also have a keyboard player who is hidden under the stage? There's a video where the band mess up and Bono starts counting the invisible 5th member in.

holyzombiejesus

There was a story a few years ago about how Bono stopped security from preventing a woman from getting on stage - "hey guys, leave that woman alone!" - and then invited her up and danced with her. Then the next night, in a different city, Bono stopped security from preventing a woman from getting on stage...

Jockice

Quote from: holyzombiejesus on April 18, 2019, 09:41:31 AM
There was a story a few years ago about how Bono stopped security from preventing a woman from getting on stage - "hey guys, leave that woman alone!" - and then invited her up and danced with her. Then the next night, in a different city, Bono stopped security from preventing a woman from getting on stage...

When I was in my late teens most of my friends were U2 fans. I didn't get it then and I still don't. They just seemed totally fake to me. So I have no problem at all believing that story. As for that Live Aid performance, I think my dad summed it up best. 'Is that clown trying to start a riot?'

Sebastian Cobb

I always liked the one about Bono clicking his fingers and saying 'every time I click my fingers a child dies' and someone piping up 'stop fucking clicking then'. According to snopes that's bollocks :(

Sebastian Cobb

Also are those cues pre-recorded by a producer as tracks that get played into his monitors? They sound kind of voice-synthy, is it something computers can do all by themselves?

Icehaven

I once read an interview with Tamsin Grieg and she said she was at some showbiz thing and was heavily pregnant, and when Bono saw her he dropped to his knees in front of her and kissed her belly (despite them having never met before). She should #metoo the fuck out him for that now.   

Cuellar

Quote from: thecuriousorange on April 17, 2019, 07:10:38 PM
How common is it for big acts to just read the lyrics from monitors hidden at the front of the stage? Liam Gallagher admitted recently that he does exactly that and I suddenly realised they all must.

I was at the Bert Jansch memorial concert in the Royal Festival Hall a few years back and Martin Carthy completely forgot the lyrics to a song about halfway through. Gamely started again a few times before conceding and getting and iPad from the wings and placing it at his feet. Of course, he couldn't see that far so a stage hand had to run on and hold it up for him for the rest of the song.

No artifice about it, just said something like "...I can't remember the bloody song"

Legend.

Sebastian Cobb

I've definitely seen iPads being used at smaller venues.

Not just for lyrics, they seem to have replaced sheet music as well in quite a few cases.

pigamus

Quote from: Dr Sanchez on April 17, 2019, 11:30:29 PM
Springsteen has become completely reliant on them it seems. In his Netflix Broadway show he has at least 4 different monitors setup at different angles that he's reading off at any given moment and this was filmed after he'd performed the same setlist and stories hundreds of times before on the run.

He does it in a very subtle way but once you notice it there's no unseeing it.

I've just made myself laugh by imagining how it might have started - a very slow, beautiful introduction to a song in front of a hushed and reverent crowd, which ends with him stepping up to the microphone and singing "The screen door waves..." and then losing his shit, having a massive paddy, smashing his guitar and walking off stage.

sevendaughters

there was a really good interview in Q once with The Edge's guitar guy. He lives in a little housing under the stage during the show and he doesn't just cue him in but he presses all of his pedals for him. It's understandable because they have those big 360 degree shows where you can't tell whether you're in time because of the delay on the sound and they're not all stood next to each other like you normally would be. I'm pretty sure in a practice situation he'd be fine doing it alone, it just makes the show smoother and professional. U2 fans aren't there for edge-of-seat interplay and energetic reinterpretations. They want the songs as they know them.

I imagine U2 play to clicks for lots of songs to solve the problem of time-synching The Egg's delays. That would probably explain the Egg-2-3-4 thing on that recording. I understand that having a tech changing pedals in huge shows is pretty commonplace. It can't be too hard to have it done in Mainstage if you're playing to clicks too, and I have heard of a few bands having everything automated.

Quote from: drummersaredeaf on April 18, 2019, 12:11:15 PM
I imagine U2 play to clicks for lots of songs to solve the problem of time-synching The Egg's delays. That would probably explain the Egg-2-3-4 thing on that recording. I understand that having a tech changing pedals in huge shows is pretty commonplace. It can't be too hard to have it done in Mainstage if you're playing to clicks too, and I have heard of a few bands having everything automated.

I remember James Dean Bradfield of the Manics having a go at Stuart Braithwaite of Mogwai after he passed comment on the fact that JDB has a roadie to switch his pedals when they toured together. The gist of it being that it's all well and good switching them yourself when you're rooted to the spot and not singing, but not when your show is a bit more energetic and you have to multitask so basically you can fuck off Mogwai feller.

Looking at a Mogwai pedalboard you'd expect them to have to spend half the show tap dancing!

PlanktonSideburns

Love that on that in ear monitor recording the edge is called EDGE but (googles) Adam Clayton is known as BASS

Icehaven

Quote from: PlanktonSideburns on April 18, 2019, 01:06:37 PM
Love that on that in ear monitor recording the edge is called EDGE but (googles) Adam Clayton is known as BASS

As a fellow bass player I've always quite wanted to be Adam Clayton. He has all that money and gets to see the world and play huge stadiums, but he doesn't really have to do much, won't get bothered a lot as no one really know who he is, and he doesn't even have to be Irish.

Captain Crunch

Quote from: Dr Syntax Head on April 18, 2019, 01:17:56 AM
Didn't Michael Stipe just have a stand with lyric sheets on stage later in REM's career? Not a bad thing

You notice it on the 1991 MTV Unplugged show:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vRiyWYIR9Ww

Ah, MTV Unplugged.  That was something wasn't it? 

Captain Crunch

I've always wondered a bit about travel and accommodation.  If bands play a town do they normally stop there that night or drive on to the next armpit and sleep in the morning before the show?  I sincerely hope 'Get In The Van' is not the way things are now. 

Spiteface

Quote from: Nice Relaxing Poo on April 18, 2019, 12:43:15 PM
I remember James Dean Bradfield of the Manics having a go at Stuart Braithwaite of Mogwai after he passed comment on the fact that JDB has a roadie to switch his pedals when they toured together. The gist of it being that it's all well and good switching them yourself when you're rooted to the spot and not singing, but not when your show is a bit more energetic and you have to multitask so basically you can fuck off Mogwai feller.
Bradfield actually started working his own pedals around touring for Lifeblood. Definitely was doing it on the 2005 "Past/Present/Future" tour. I remember being surprised when a guitar tech brought out a pedalboard. The gigs didn't suffer for it. Swansea on that tour remains one of my favourite Manics gigs.

I remember Braithwaite also criticising James for having an acoustic pickup in his guitar around the time they toured together (the first UK leg for This is My Truth), thinking it was easy to accuse them of miming with that. It was out of necessity though, a few songs on This is My Truth have a mix of acoustic and electric parts in them (The Everlasting, If You Tolerate This Your Children Will Be Next, Ready for Drowning), and they had yet to just bring out a touring guitarist then (Guy Massey in 2004/5, Wayne Murray filling that role since 2006, having previously toured with James when he was  touring his solo album "The Great Western").

sponk

I've always wondered how people can relax and enjoy gigs and dance and sing in such a confident,  carefree way. I feel too self conscious to dance and sing at gigs when I'm drunk and or on AN E. How people do it sober is beyond me.

NoSleep

Quote from: Captain Crunch on April 20, 2019, 09:16:29 PM
I've always wondered a bit about travel and accommodation.  If bands play a town do they normally stop there that night or drive on to the next armpit and sleep in the morning before the show?  I sincerely hope 'Get In The Van' is not the way things are now.

Depends how well planned the tour is. You may have to be in another town/country several hundreds of miles away in 18 hours. You might be lucky to catch a nap in the van.

Icehaven

Quote from: Captain Crunch on April 20, 2019, 09:16:29 PM
I've always wondered a bit about travel and accommodation.  If bands play a town do they normally stop there that night or drive on to the next armpit and sleep in the morning before the show?  I sincerely hope 'Get In The Van' is not the way things are now.

Quote from: NoSleep on April 21, 2019, 07:24:03 AM
Depends how well planned the tour is. You may have to be in another town/country several hundreds of miles away in 18 hours. You might be lucky to catch a nap in the van.

It took me a few years of wondering why band's tour dates sometimes seemed to involve going back on themselves a lot to get that it depends on venue availability and what else the date will coincide with (festivals etc.). Isn't always the case of course but does explain what looks like some illogical travel plans.

NoSleep

A friend of mine used to organise his own tours and would stage dates to maximise ease for the band. Venue availability was balanced between how much they paid, so that a couple of low paid gigs would act as stepping stones between the places where they could make a bit back.