Barbaric abortion laws

[Buelligan]

Fucked up cunts.

[Howj Begg]

Ctrl + F "patriarchy" no results found

Above it was mentioned that there are many "pro-life" women. This misses the point. Official American Christianities, Evangelical, Catholic, Orthodox etc are strongly patriarchal in nature. God the Father sets the rules, and these are interpreted here on Earth by men, from church ministers and politicans, to the father of the family home. That very much includes rapists and abusers, as much as it includes the "disinterested" politicians bribed and lobbied to pass antiabortion laws. All these men either know what they're doing, or if by some wile of woman they were bewitched and do not, social morality via religion invests men with the power, automatically, to be able to choose over women. It's the natural way, it's the sun rising in the morning. That is what us "pro-choice" people often don't get, when we try to argue about the science, or the irrationality, or the harm to women, or the economic injustice of such laws. Men are always right, even when they're wrong, and men have the power to choose what happens with a woman's body. To people brought up with ever-present cultural, religious and economic patriarchalism, it's normal to think that way, and absurd to deny it. Giving women power of any kind, is chaos, is sin, is insanity. "Pro-life" Women happily believe this, because it's how they've been brought up to think from infancy.

I think all of this needs to be understood even before we get to questions of white birth demographics, which is an after-thought. After all, a blanket abortion ban would affect ethnic group birth rates in similar ways, if not producing the same outcomes. But the starting point, the first cause behind the whole thing, is the necessary control of women's freedoms, choices and whole social and physical being in a patriarchy. Anti-abortion is meant as a domino which pushes every other freedom down, and secedes all of them to powerful men, and to the relatively powerless men, who might be husbands, fathers, brothers, rapists, abusers. They get to exercise the only power they have left, and one which their quasi-religious cultures believes is theirs, that is power over the women and the girls in their family. and in their orbit.

I am saying that patriarchy is sufficient to be pro-life, but it's not necessary: I'm sure some feminist women have arrived at a pro-life position based on personal ethics: I've met some. But I think they are a rarity.

[mothman]

They're also talking about a law that'll let rapists sue their victims to prevent them getting abortions. If that doesn't underline what's already been said above about how it's all about men's power over women, then I don't know what else could do it...

[Sebastian Cobb]

I think what needs to be understood is that the concepts that embody 'the patriarchy' have already been well discussed before you did a lazy ctrl+f and decided it hadn't.

[Howj Begg]

I think what needs to be understood is that the concepts that embody 'the patriarchy' have already been well discussed before you did a lazy ctrl+f and decided it hadn't.

Sure, I read the previous page. No need to be a cunt about it.

There were various excellent and interesting speculations about the psychological, political, religious and social causes of this new law. I was just extending some of the things already mentioned and using an absent word that, you particularly seem to have a bee in your bonnet about. Have a good evening duckie.

[Sebastian Cobb]

Apology accepted!

[Howj Begg]

Apology accepted!

why do you feel you need to be apologised to?

[Howj Begg]

So the Alabama bill already passed, and Georgia's prospective 6 week law, are effectively kamikaze attempts to take it to the SC. Even then, not hugely likely that Roe v Wade would get struck down, although obviously there's a greater chance than last year with Devil's Triangle Boofer and clear rapist Kavanaugh. But they're playing with fire, really, because this is galvanising Congress to pass a new bill, which could get passed in a Dem-controlled Senate as early as next year. At the very least, there's no way this hangs around for too much longer without a considerable fight, and a Democratic president will hopefully lead that.

[peanutbutter]

What is this sudden abortion push all about? Is it a fear of the more left leaning democrats framing things towards actual economic matters (and therefore highlighting just how badly they've been fucked by their current leaders on a state level) turning some GOP strongholds so they need to make the next run of elections a single issue deal for those areas?

[Sebastian Cobb]

What is this sudden abortion push all about? Is it a fear of the more left leaning democrats framing things towards actual economic matters (and therefore highlighting just how badly they've been fucked by their current leaders on a state level) turning some GOP strongholds so they need to make the next run of elections a single issue deal for those areas?

It's a good question. It's easy to say it's a political bargaining chip to throw a bone at some of the more conservative members to keep them on side, but who the fuck would they be voting for otherwise?

[mothman]

I'd like to think they know that sooner or later - increasingly sooner - Trump will be on the way out, and they just want to get as much of their fantasy Gilead knockoff achieved while they can.

[Lord Mandrake]

How much of this do we think is rooted in the principle of white birth rates being lower than ethics minorities? Are there any stats on the number of abortions each year by race? I feel like a fucking psychopath for even thinking it but is there anyone out there on Conservative/Evangelical platform arguing that the MOTIVATION for repealing abortion laws is to get more white babies.

Fucking mental country.

According to Candice Owens;

In Alabama, 60% of abortions are performed on African Americans, they are 23% of the female population and in fact, the racist architects of planned parenthood are committing genocide to over 800,000 black babies a year in the U.S.

[Buelligan]

What ethnicity are the fathers or don't they count?

This is probably the subject, more than any other that makes me angriest.  The idea that anyone can impose their philosophy on another in this question is beyond astounding to me. 

What woman looks forward to an abortion?  What woman does not care?  If she exists, should she have a baby (with all the reasons she would, otherwise, have the abortion unaddressed.  She and the child disadvantaged financially - no small thing in the capitalist paradise - and both despised socially)? 

[Bazooka]

Yeah but it sorts itself out, if said baby grows up and murders someone, they can be legally killed in Alabama.

[Lord Mandrake]

What ethnicity are the fathers or don't they count?

This is probably the subject, more than any other that makes me angriest.  The idea that anyone can impose their philosophy on another in this question is beyond astounding to me. 

What woman looks forward to an abortion?  What woman does not care?  If she exists, should she have a baby (with all the reasons she would, otherwise, have the abortion unaddressed.  She and the child disadvantaged financially - no small thing in the capitalist paradise - and both despised socially)?

I don't know about the ethnicity of the fathers or why it matters, the potential baby would still be in a minority group.
And please, dont get angry at me - I don't have an opinion.

Still, imagine if euthaniasia were offered  to poor people as a way out of financial disadvantage?

Certainly the authors of planned parenthood were bang into eugenics and 'racial betterment'.

Edit to correct name: It's  Candace not Candice.

[Buelligan]

I'm not in the least angry with you. 

Quite angry about the idea that a "white" baby only appears to be white if it's 100% white, which is bound to make it seem like more and more of the little darlings are not.  The colour of babies and how that relates to whether it's OK to terminate them.  Fuck me what a lovely piece of moral high ground to pitch a tent on, Candice or Candace.

[greenman]

It's a good question. It's easy to say it's a political bargaining chip to throw a bone at some of the more conservative members to keep them on side, but who the fuck would they be voting for otherwise?

Probably more to make sure they(or at least people on the milder end less involved politically) vote at all and maybe to get a few more donations?

[Lord Mandrake]

I'm not in the least angry with you. 

Quite angry about the idea that a "white" baby only appears to be white if it's 100% white, which is bound to make it seem like more and more of the little darlings are not.

Bi-racial or those with more mixed heritage are classified seperatley and are an even smaller percentage of Alabama's racial demographic.

[Buelligan]

I think you may be missing my point.

[Lord Mandrake]

I took it as: these figures are fudged to make it seem that minority groups form a disproportionate amount of aborted fetuses?

[Buelligan]

I think what I was trying to say, obviously clumsily, was that arguing the toss over the ethnicity of unborn children (as a reason not to abort them) rather than addressing racism directly and in every sphere, seems a truly hateful way of using these (arguably inaccurate) figures.

[Lord Mandrake]

Ok, sorry of course. It certainly is a novel way of looking at it.

[phantom_power]

According to Candice Owens;

In Alabama, 60% of abortions are performed on African Americans, they are 23% of the female population and in fact, the racist architects of planned parenthood are committing genocide to over 800,000 black babies a year in the U.S.

Candace Owens is a terrible human being

[Lord Mandrake]

Candace Owens is a terrible human being

I think, and this goes way back to one of the original point in this thread, I think by hummingofevil: That she genuinely believes that a fetus is a human life that needs protecting and that, however deluded you or I or anyone thinks this position is. She is ultimately coming from a place of good intentions. Otherwise, I dunno.. You call her a terrible human being. Do you think she is doing all this out of pure malice?


Edit for spelling

[Buelligan]

If she was so concerned about the right to life, she'd be up there fighting the death penalty (as has already been mentioned).

In my opinion, she's either out and out evil and sees this behaviour as code for give me votes and power or someone brainwashed by religion/patriarchy/conservative social mores, call it what you will, into being a hateful cunt. 

I used to know a woman who was married, with a slew of children and conducting an affair with a married man, she posted regularly online about when our Saviour returns and the Love of Jesus witnessed in our daily lives, she took her kids to Veterans parades and was a racist and an American.  I think all things are possible, given the correct growing medium.

[a duncandisorderly]

Yeah but it sorts itself out, if said baby grows up and murders someone black, they can be legally killed in Alabama.

ftfy

[Lord Mandrake]

If she was so concerned about the right to life, she'd be up there fighting the death penalty (as has already been mentioned).

She would probably say that if you take a life ,you forfeit your  right to life,  I imagine and that it's a false equivalence because all babies are innocent.

Ok, so she is just plain evil or a stupid supplicant to an opressive regime.

[Jumblegraws]

I think, and this goes way back to one of the original point in this thread, I think by hummingofevil: That she genuinely believes that a fetus is a human life that needs protecting and that, however deluded you or I or anyone thinks this position is. She is ultimately coming from a place of good intentions. Otherwise, I dunno.. You call her a terrible human being. Do you think she is doing all this out of pure malice?

Edit for spelling

Yes. On the best evidence we have, Candace Owens gets a kick out of maligning people whose lives are less comfortable and more vulnerable to prejudice than her own, and that she will not be moved from this predilection by countervailing facts, let alone appeals to compassion.

[Paul Calf]

Have we seen this yet?

[Lord Mandrake]

Yes. On the best evidence we have, Candace Owens gets a kick out of maligning people whose lives are less comfortable and more vulnerable to prejudice than her own,

How many groups in the U.S are more vunerable to predjudice than African American Women?